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Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
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Post: #41
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 03:45 PM)bearcatlawjd2 Wrote:  I think closest you will get to a G5 playoff is after the 5-1-2 format conference champions 7,8,9, and 10 all play each other on New Years as part of CFP TV package. Maybe those games are ESPN2 slotted games.

My proposal is 5-1-2, 4 BCS level games, 2 G5 champions bowl games. Traditional tie-ins for playoff round 1. So for example Rose always host B1G and PAC, Sugar the SEC. The four other new years games are 8 at-large bids with conference preferences. So Peach can select an SEC and ACC if available. Detroit gets one G5 Bowl and I would put the other one in Nashville.

I would add the Outback Bowl and Alamo Bowl to the CFP rotation for a NY8. The top 3 G5 champions get an access bowl.

Then 2 more "access" bowls (Liberty & Sun) for the bottom 2 G5 champs against a Top 20 P5 opponent. They would not be part of the NY8 rotation but be part of the TV contract with a nice payout.
08-02-2019 06:30 PM
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Post: #42
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 03:56 PM)esayem Wrote:  If you want to argue a 5-1-2, then you have to include Independents with the G5.

The playoff slot reserved for them should be a "non-P5" slot. Independents other than Notre Dame should be eligible to be chosen, along with any team in an G5 conference.
08-02-2019 06:32 PM
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Post: #43
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 06:32 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 03:56 PM)esayem Wrote:  If you want to argue a 5-1-2, then you have to include Independents with the G5.

The playoff slot reserved for them should be a "non-P5" slot. Independents other than Notre Dame should be eligible to be chosen, along with any team in an G5 conference.

Does anyone seriously think a system will be adopted in which Notre Dame can compete for only two playoff spots, but UAB and San Jose State can compete for three?

That's what a 5-1-2 amounts to, folks.
08-02-2019 06:37 PM
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Post: #44
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 06:32 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 03:56 PM)esayem Wrote:  If you want to argue a 5-1-2, then you have to include Independents with the G5.

The playoff slot reserved for them should be a "non-P5" slot. Independents other than Notre Dame should be eligible to be chosen, along with any team in an G5 conference.

Why?
08-02-2019 06:38 PM
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Post: #45
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 06:30 PM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 03:45 PM)bearcatlawjd2 Wrote:  I think closest you will get to a G5 playoff is after the 5-1-2 format conference champions 7,8,9, and 10 all play each other on New Years as part of CFP TV package. Maybe those games are ESPN2 slotted games.

My proposal is 5-1-2, 4 BCS level games, 2 G5 champions bowl games. Traditional tie-ins for playoff round 1. So for example Rose always host B1G and PAC, Sugar the SEC. The four other new years games are 8 at-large bids with conference preferences. So Peach can select an SEC and ACC if available. Detroit gets one G5 Bowl and I would put the other one in Nashville.

I would add the Outback Bowl and Alamo Bowl to the CFP rotation for a NY8. The top 3 G5 champions get an access bowl.

Then 2 more "access" bowls (Liberty & Sun) for the bottom 2 G5 champs against a Top 20 P5 opponent. They would not be part of the NY8 rotation but be part of the TV contract with a nice payout.

And where is this "nice payout" money going to come from?

You realize that in 2012, a "seventh NY6 bowl" that would have featured a G5 team was rejected by the networks as not worth the money, right?

Any "access bowl" that features multiple G5 teams will be so in name only. It will not attract any network money.
08-02-2019 06:40 PM
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Post: #46
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 06:40 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 06:30 PM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 03:45 PM)bearcatlawjd2 Wrote:  I think closest you will get to a G5 playoff is after the 5-1-2 format conference champions 7,8,9, and 10 all play each other on New Years as part of CFP TV package. Maybe those games are ESPN2 slotted games.

My proposal is 5-1-2, 4 BCS level games, 2 G5 champions bowl games. Traditional tie-ins for playoff round 1. So for example Rose always host B1G and PAC, Sugar the SEC. The four other new years games are 8 at-large bids with conference preferences. So Peach can select an SEC and ACC if available. Detroit gets one G5 Bowl and I would put the other one in Nashville.

I would add the Outback Bowl and Alamo Bowl to the CFP rotation for a NY8. The top 3 G5 champions get an access bowl.

Then 2 more "access" bowls (Liberty & Sun) for the bottom 2 G5 champs against a Top 20 P5 opponent. They would not be part of the NY8 rotation but be part of the TV contract with a nice payout.

And where is this "nice payout" money going to come from?

You realize that in 2012, a "seventh NY6 bowl" that would have featured a G5 team was rejected by the networks as not worth the money, right?

Any "access bowl" that features multiple G5 teams will be so in name only. It will not attract any network money.

Let's say the TV value of the Liberty and Sun as second tier P5 games is about 5 million each.

As extra games as part of the CFP contract with Top 20 P5 teams playing on one half of the equation maybe their worth 10 million by 2025.

That increased profit can go to the whole system while the G5 maintains its 21% cut.
08-02-2019 06:43 PM
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Post: #47
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 06:37 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 06:32 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 03:56 PM)esayem Wrote:  If you want to argue a 5-1-2, then you have to include Independents with the G5.

The playoff slot reserved for them should be a "non-P5" slot. Independents other than Notre Dame should be eligible to be chosen, along with any team in an G5 conference.

Does anyone seriously think a system will be adopted in which Notre Dame can compete for only two playoff spots, but UAB and San Jose State can compete for three?

That's what a 5-1-2 amounts to, folks.

Are you seriously suggesting Notre Dame would either

A) make the playoff less than UAB

or

B) Be left out of the playoff by the Selection Committee when they deserved to be in

However-----even if you believe both points are likely (which they are not)---Notre Dame can alleviate that issue by joining any conference it wishes. Nobody would tell them no.

You cannot continue to call a playoff a "playoff" when everyone acknowledges nearly half of the field has no chance at the playoff even if they win every game they play. The next playoff will have to do a better job of providing a legitimate pathway for every team to enter the playoff. I think the best model is the NCAA tournament where there are two pathways. With one pathway, any team can "win" their way into the playoff. This rewards play on the field and winning key games and key moments. It recognizes that there are differences in conferences and schedules and it is virtually impossible to accurately compare teams from the two groups playing different competition. It solves it by creating a path of accomplishment. Basically---either win a power conference---or be the best champ of the non-power conferences.

The other pathway is the Selection Committee's two wildcard slots--which offer a second chance for 2 deserving teams that excelled against a high quality schedule---but fell short of winning their conference (or have no conference to win). Im not saying its perfect or that it addresses every issue---but it addresses the vast majority of the issues and provides a structure that the vast majority of fans would view as reasonable and acceptable.

If your going to have a selection committee drive the whole thing---then we may as well just go back to the the poll driven mythical championship. If your just going to ignore half of college football, all the conference championships, and key head to head games----then why place so much importance on a few post season head-to-head games played in December and January just because we have slapped a CFP label on them?
(This post was last modified: 08-02-2019 07:50 PM by Attackcoog.)
08-02-2019 07:24 PM
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Post: #48
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 02:09 PM)JHS55 Wrote:  Iam all for a A5 32 team exclusive, really I hope this happens so that the other 96 teams can just get on with playing real football playoffs and a real national championship, you know one that is decided on the grid iron then let’s see which one the fans like the most

You and I both know who America would rather watch. 2 schools that put 80-100k in the stands or 2 schools who struggle to get 30K?
08-02-2019 07:37 PM
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Post: #49
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 07:37 PM)P5PACSEC Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 02:09 PM)JHS55 Wrote:  Iam all for a A5 32 team exclusive, really I hope this happens so that the other 96 teams can just get on with playing real football playoffs and a real national championship, you know one that is decided on the grid iron then let’s see which one the fans like the most

You and I both know who America would rather watch. 2 schools that put 80-100k in the stands or 2 schools who struggle to get 30K?

Exactly. We dont even really need a playoff or a committee. Just have Michigan, Penn State, Ohio St, Alabama, LSU, Texas A&M, Texas, and Tennessee have a 8 team tournament every post season. I mean, why would anyone want sub-60K teams like Texas Tech when you could have a tournament of all teams that draw 92K or more? I know what America would rather see---schools with lots and lots of fans!! 05-stirthepot

I think the reality is that fans like to watch good football and enjoy a good story. A playoff that has sub-90K attendance teams or a G5 team in it would do just fine. I believe the ratings for the Butler-Duke NCAA final scored the highest rating in the prior 5 years and was 31% higher than the North Carolina-Michigan final from the previous year.
(This post was last modified: 08-02-2019 08:10 PM by Attackcoog.)
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Post: #50
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 07:37 PM)P5PACSEC Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 02:09 PM)JHS55 Wrote:  Iam all for a A5 32 team exclusive, really I hope this happens so that the other 96 teams can just get on with playing real football playoffs and a real national championship, you know one that is decided on the grid iron then let’s see which one the fans like the most

You and I both know who America would rather watch. 2 schools that put 80-100k in the stands or 2 schools who struggle to get 30K?

Exactly. We dont even really need a playoff or a committee. Just have Michigan, Penn State, Ohio St, Alabama, LSU, Texas A&M, Texas, and Tennessee have a 8 team tournament every post season. I mean, why would anyone want sub-60K teams like Texas Tech when you could have a tournament of all teams that draw 92K or more? I know what America would rather see---schools with lots and lots of fans!! 05-stirthepot

I wouldn't include aggy because they haven't been relevant in 100 years despite having 100k fans in the stands and all the money in the world.04-cheers

If Matt Wells can win as well as he talks, the Jones will need to be expanded to 70k very soon.04-rock
08-02-2019 08:06 PM
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Post: #51
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 08:06 PM)P5PACSEC Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 07:37 PM)P5PACSEC Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 02:09 PM)JHS55 Wrote:  Iam all for a A5 32 team exclusive, really I hope this happens so that the other 96 teams can just get on with playing real football playoffs and a real national championship, you know one that is decided on the grid iron then let’s see which one the fans like the most

You and I both know who America would rather watch. 2 schools that put 80-100k in the stands or 2 schools who struggle to get 30K?

Exactly. We dont even really need a playoff or a committee. Just have Michigan, Penn State, Ohio St, Alabama, LSU, Texas A&M, Texas, and Tennessee have a 8 team tournament every post season. I mean, why would anyone want sub-60K teams like Texas Tech when you could have a tournament of all teams that draw 92K or more? I know what America would rather see---schools with lots and lots of fans!! 05-stirthepot

I wouldn't include aggy because they haven't been relevant in 100 years despite having 100k fans in the stands and all the money in the world.04-cheers

If Matt Wells can win as well as he talks, the Jones will need to be expanded to 70k very soon.04-rock

lol. FYI---I think Matt Wells is going to do really well there. 04-cheers
(This post was last modified: 08-02-2019 08:09 PM by Attackcoog.)
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Post: #52
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
That would be two FBS leagues
One with 96 teams
The other with 32 teams, and Mac wants these 32 teams to play only each orher
(This post was last modified: 08-02-2019 08:14 PM by JHS55.)
08-02-2019 08:11 PM
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Post: #53
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 07:37 PM)P5PACSEC Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 02:09 PM)JHS55 Wrote:  Iam all for a A5 32 team exclusive, really I hope this happens so that the other 96 teams can just get on with playing real football playoffs and a real national championship, you know one that is decided on the grid iron then let’s see which one the fans like the most

You and I both know who America would rather watch. 2 schools that put 80-100k in the stands or 2 schools who struggle to get 30K?
Marketing is not your strong suit but hey, you and I both know you post with many many different names
08-02-2019 08:18 PM
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Post: #54
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 01:22 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  The 5-1-2 will be pushed for hard by the American, possibly with some support from the MWC. But I don't think it'll happen, to rather if it does, it will require the G5 school be in the top 10.

5-1-2, 1 highest ranked Go5 conference champion or independents. That addresses the anti-trust challenge to the "5".

(08-02-2019 06:32 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 03:56 PM)esayem Wrote:  If you want to argue a 5-1-2, then you have to include Independents with the G5.

The playoff slot reserved for them should be a "non-P5" slot. Independents other than Notre Dame should be eligible to be chosen, along with any team in an G5 conference.

If there's a sixth reserved slot, it will be for every school not eligible for the first five. Notre Dame does have the 24th ranked Law School in the country, after all.

Maybe it "should be" for everyone outside the "de facto P5" (including Notre Dame) which provide the pool of actually eligible for the current 4 at-large CFP spots, but shoulda woulda coulda, if ifs and buts were candies and nuts, we'd all have a Merry Christmas.

(08-02-2019 06:37 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Does anyone seriously think a system will be adopted in which Notre Dame can compete for only two playoff spots, but UAB and San Jose State can compete for three?

That's what a 5-1-2 amounts to, folks.

What it actually amounts to is Notre Dame can compete for two and UAB and San Jose State can compete for one, since no Go5 school will ever be selected at-large, with the possible exception of an undefeated BYU with 6 middling P5 programs on its schedule. Anyone else would certainly get knocked to "n+1"th ranking, where "n" is the ranking of the last at-large school.

However, the "everyone not in the 5" 5-1-2 does open the door for the "Access Bowl" spot to be for the highest ranked non-actual-P5 school not in the CFP. That gives Notre Dame a soft NYD landing in the years it's passed by a Go5, and gives BYU the New Years Day bowl access it wants, so while it gives the Go5 less of what they want, it also brings with it a more powerful support coalition than the Go5 going it alone to push for more access.
(This post was last modified: 08-02-2019 09:24 PM by BruceMcF.)
08-02-2019 09:09 PM
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Post: #55
Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 08:09 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 08:06 PM)P5PACSEC Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 07:37 PM)P5PACSEC Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 02:09 PM)JHS55 Wrote:  Iam all for a A5 32 team exclusive, really I hope this happens so that the other 96 teams can just get on with playing real football playoffs and a real national championship, you know one that is decided on the grid iron then let’s see which one the fans like the most

You and I both know who America would rather watch. 2 schools that put 80-100k in the stands or 2 schools who struggle to get 30K?

Exactly. We dont even really need a playoff or a committee. Just have Michigan, Penn State, Ohio St, Alabama, LSU, Texas A&M, Texas, and Tennessee have a 8 team tournament every post season. I mean, why would anyone want sub-60K teams like Texas Tech when you could have a tournament of all teams that draw 92K or more? I know what America would rather see---schools with lots and lots of fans!! 05-stirthepot

I wouldn't include aggy because they haven't been relevant in 100 years despite having 100k fans in the stands and all the money in the world.04-cheers

If Matt Wells can win as well as he talks, the Jones will need to be expanded to 70k very soon.04-rock

lol. FYI---I think Matt Wells is going to do really well there. 04-cheers


Agree, his coaching really improved his last 2 years here in Logan.


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08-02-2019 09:15 PM
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Post: #56
Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 09:15 PM)Jjoey52 Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 08:09 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 08:06 PM)P5PACSEC Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 07:56 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 07:37 PM)P5PACSEC Wrote:  You and I both know who America would rather watch. 2 schools that put 80-100k in the stands or 2 schools who struggle to get 30K?

Exactly. We dont even really need a playoff or a committee. Just have Michigan, Penn State, Ohio St, Alabama, LSU, Texas A&M, Texas, and Tennessee have a 8 team tournament every post season. I mean, why would anyone want sub-60K teams like Texas Tech when you could have a tournament of all teams that draw 92K or more? I know what America would rather see---schools with lots and lots of fans!! 05-stirthepot

I wouldn't include aggy because they haven't been relevant in 100 years despite having 100k fans in the stands and all the money in the world.04-cheers

If Matt Wells can win as well as he talks, the Jones will need to be expanded to 70k very soon.04-rock

lol. FYI---I think Matt Wells is going to do really well there. 04-cheers


Agree, his coaching really improved his last 2 years here in Logan.
Also, his OC Yost is amazing.

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Post: #57
Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 01:58 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 01:32 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  The ONLY way I think the G5 would ever sign-off on a G5 playoff is if the big boy playoff included a spot for the top ranked G5 champion.

Then they MIGHT agree but even then I think it would be a scuffle unless it was marketed as a football NIT and could get some P5's involved.

Bowl games would still be more appealing to everyone involved than a CFB NIT. As you said, there's no reason for the G5 champs to want it if it's a G5-only deal, and there's also no reason for a P5 team that narrowly missed a playoff spot to want to play in that NIT instead of a CFP bowl game.


I don’t see any playoff bubble team giving up the Rose, Sugar, Orange, Fiesta, Peach, Citrus to play in a football NIT.

If a bigger playoff erodes interest in the bowls further down the list then you see it.

If you are ESPN Events do you want to staff and sell the Birmingham Bowl or Tater Boel when instead you could have say Arizona State at Boise State, NIU at Purdue, Georgia Southern at NC State and Texas Tech at Southern Miss in the first round of football NIT.

Or maybe you don’t have one “NIT” but rather four with four teams each. The Pep Boys Invitational, Mt Dew Challenge, Continental Tires Tournament and AFLAC Clash. Games at campus sites at least first round.


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Post: #58
Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
In my opinion the “ideal” playoff is done like this.

The ten conference champions are rated 1-10.
The teams rated 1-4 get a first round bye and home field. Teams rated 5-8 get home field in the first round. We then add in the top two non-champion teams they and the two remaining conference champs are rated. The top team gets the 9 seed and bottom team the 12 seed.

Neutral sites for the semi finals and championship.


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Post: #59
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
Off topic but I really hope App State makes Mack eat his words. That G5 team will be a huge draw for UNC.
08-02-2019 10:19 PM
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Post: #60
RE: Mack Brown Proposes A New Playoff Format
(08-02-2019 06:43 PM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 06:40 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 06:30 PM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  
(08-02-2019 03:45 PM)bearcatlawjd2 Wrote:  I think closest you will get to a G5 playoff is after the 5-1-2 format conference champions 7,8,9, and 10 all play each other on New Years as part of CFP TV package. Maybe those games are ESPN2 slotted games.

My proposal is 5-1-2, 4 BCS level games, 2 G5 champions bowl games. Traditional tie-ins for playoff round 1. So for example Rose always host B1G and PAC, Sugar the SEC. The four other new years games are 8 at-large bids with conference preferences. So Peach can select an SEC and ACC if available. Detroit gets one G5 Bowl and I would put the other one in Nashville.

I would add the Outback Bowl and Alamo Bowl to the CFP rotation for a NY8. The top 3 G5 champions get an access bowl.

Then 2 more "access" bowls (Liberty & Sun) for the bottom 2 G5 champs against a Top 20 P5 opponent. They would not be part of the NY8 rotation but be part of the TV contract with a nice payout.

And where is this "nice payout" money going to come from?

You realize that in 2012, a "seventh NY6 bowl" that would have featured a G5 team was rejected by the networks as not worth the money, right?

Any "access bowl" that features multiple G5 teams will be so in name only. It will not attract any network money.

Let's say the TV value of the Liberty and Sun as second tier P5 games is about 5 million each.

As extra games as part of the CFP contract with Top 20 P5 teams playing on one half of the equation maybe their worth 10 million by 2025.

That increased profit can go to the whole system while the G5 maintains its 21% cut.

There are no top 20 P5 teams i can think of that want to be matched up with unranked G5 teams.
08-02-2019 10:20 PM
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