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Renandpat · 08-03-2019 02:44 AM

(08-02-2019 08:04 PM)TexanMark Wrote:
(08-02-2019 07:43 PM)Renandpat Wrote:
(08-02-2019 07:26 PM)TexanMark Wrote: I wanted to shout out to the Top 5 schools in increases in attendance. All are considered national programs in hoops. Memphis had floundered under Pastner...glad to see them back up where they were 10 years ago.

1. Memphis 14,065 6,225 7,840
2. Marquette 15,611 12,323 3,288
3. Cincinnati 11,256 8,081 3,175
4. Tennessee 19,034 16,210 2,824
5. Pittsburgh 6,749 4,117 2,632

Memphis declined under Pastner, but they hit bottom in Tubby Smith's two seasons.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/co...story.html

Also note that for the 2017-18 season, Cincinnati played home games across the river and state lines at Northern Kentucky's BB&T Arena

True...but it was worth the wait. The redo on the arena is magnificant.

Screw the renovation, Penny Hardaway sold selling tickets.

Stugray2 · 08-03-2019 05:28 AM

Ohio State is 21st, 13,495; Michigan 34th at 10,871

Since you stopped at 19th, I'll take you out to 93rd to cover most of the majors, schools with 6,000 or more attendance, I also give their NET and budgets. Obviously big public schools do better. I had planed to stop at 7,000 (70th), but that would leave 16 of the 75 major conference members off the list, as well as Memphis and Gonzaga (they sell out but capacity is only 6,000), two of the three high major budget and resource level "Mid-Majors" (in MBB they qualify as majors); Dayton being the 3rd.

If I took it out 32 more to 124 (4,000-5,999 attendance), only Washington State would not be in the list. (BC, Oregon St, Rutgers, Stanford, USC, and Pitt in that range). But at the point the list is almost all mid-majors (26 of 32). As it was pushing 23 to 93rd added 14 mid-majors, although mostly higher mid-majors. 71-93 is the 50-50 mixing point.

PHP Code:

Rank  School       Ave Attend    NET    MBB Budget    Budget Rank 
1     Kentucky          21,874    4     $18,571,056     4
2     Syrcasue          21,462    50    $14,742,445     7
3     North Carolina    18,378    8     $9,728,533      33
4     Wisconsin         17,272    20    $10,636,714     23
5     Creighton         17,000    54    $9,017,209      42
6     Louisville        16,883    22    $21,817,723     1
7     Kansas            16,344    17    $11,859,953     15
8     Tennessee         16,209    9     $8,386,526      52
9     Arkansas          16,181    60    $9,195,260      37
10    Indiana           15,590    56    $13,693,497     10
11    Nebraska          15,492    51    $7,771,106      61
12    NC State          15,253    36    $9,902,049      31
13    Missouri          15,061    74    $8,387,295      50
14    Michigan State    14,797    5     $11,745,452     17
15    Maryland          14,675    25    $8,375,834      53
16    Arizona           14,434    92    $9,827,381      32
17    Purdue            14,343    11    $8,410,571      49
18    Brigham Young     14,230    89    $7,468,917      67
19    Minnesota         11,850    55    $8,765,442      44
19    Iowa State        14,121    19    $6,851,315      73
20    Virginia          13,923    1     $10,501,454     24
21    Ohio State        13,495    52    $20,653,121     3
22    Alabama           13,390    61    $10,276,123     26
23    Dayton            12,996    70    $14,201,764     9
24    South Carolina    12,617    79    $9,969,479      30
25    Illinois          12,613    105   $10,703,916     22
26    Marquette         12,323    29    $12,094,572     14
27    West Virginia     12,303    106   $10,196,409     28
28    Iowa              12,026    40    $8,113,263      58
30    Villanova         11,828    28    $14,791,481     6
31    Utah              11,710    97    $8,808,011      43
32    San Diego State   11,344    116   $6,207,228      83
33    New Mexico        10,883    191   $4,390,791      100
34    Michigan          10,871    10    $9,982,947      29
35    Wichita State     10,787    63    $7,513,193      65
36    Texas Tech        10,739    7     $9,020,201      40
37    Arizona State     10,603    62    $7,972,900      60
38    Texas             10,601    33    $11,357,338     19
39    Xavier            10,475    64    $8,062,088      59
40    Oklahoma          10,253    32    $10,205,245     27
41    UNLV              10,093    159   $5,763,010      88
42    Florida            9,732    30    $9,018,168      41
43    Providence         9,547    77    $10,768,267     21
44    Duke               9,314    3     $20,826,848     2
45    Vanderbilt         9,158    155   $7,761,696      62
46    St. Johns          9,134    75    $8,321,657      55
47    Texas A&M          9,127    80    $10,391,815     25
48    Nevada             9,048    27    $4,746,053      98
49    Louisiana State    9,029    16    $8,618,878      47
50    Kansas State       8,711    23    $7,591,505      64
51    UCLA               8,619    114   $9,334,174      35
52    Butler             8,554    66    $5,507,238      89
53    Florida State      8,512    15    $11,422,894     18
54    Seton Hall         8,456    59    $6,301,138      82
55    Wake Forest        8,425    187   $8,296,973      56
56    Oregon             8,348    41    $9,287,092      36
57    Auburn             8,221    13    $9,446,382      34
58    Georgia            8,213    115   $8,539,387      48
59    Cincinnati         8,081    24    $7,465,979      68
60    Connecticut        7,829    91    $8,386,802      51
61    Notre Dame         7,777    111   $6,876,483      71
62    Clemson            7,743    45    $7,737,387      63
63    Virginia Tech      7,678    12    $11,294,240     20
64    VCU                7,637    38    $6,148,859      85
65    Georgetown         7,531    84    $12,849,462     11
66    Colorado           7,448    65    $6,325,662      81
67    California         7,375    225   $6,444,068      78
68    Penn State         7,197    49    $7,180,241      69
69    Miami              7,117    95    $8,240,615      57
70    Oklahoma State     7,010    72    $6,087,462      86

 *** planned to stop here since 

71    Grand Canyon       6,973    104   $5,337,280      92
72    Mississippi State  6,965    21    $6,835,070      74
73    Utah State         6,943    31    $3,451,734      115
74    Mississippi        6,882    42    $12,547,833     12
75    Washington         6,794    44    $8,656,133      45
76    Weber State        6,778    182   $1,930,140      223
77    Middle Tennessee   6,774    248   $3,263,120      124
78    Boise State        6,747    149   $2,649,924      164
79    Southern Methodist 6,659    94    $7,497,541      66
80    Texas Christian    6,561    47    $17,007,743     5
81    Georgia Tech       6,518    127   $8,627,469      46
82    Richmond           6,491    196   $4,746,842      97
83    Northwestern       6,488    88    $9,049,494      39
84    Old Dominion       6,346    101   $3,348,329      120
85    Baylor             6,331    34    $9,185,513      38
86    Temple             6,324    57    $6,533,015      76
87    Saint Louis        6,235    107   $6,876,215      72
88    Memphis            6,225    48    $11,859,500     16
89    Rhode Island       6,216    138   $5,459,313      90
90    Texas El-Paso      6,155    290   $4,166,643     105
91    DePaul             6,147    109   $7,080,194      70
92    Fresno State       6,032    82    $3,352,520      119
93    Gonzaga            6,000    2     $14,723,219      8 

TexanMark · 08-03-2019 06:02 AM

(08-03-2019 02:44 AM)Renandpat Wrote:
(08-02-2019 08:04 PM)TexanMark Wrote:
(08-02-2019 07:43 PM)Renandpat Wrote:
(08-02-2019 07:26 PM)TexanMark Wrote: I wanted to shout out to the Top 5 schools in increases in attendance. All are considered national programs in hoops. Memphis had floundered under Pastner...glad to see them back up where they were 10 years ago.

1. Memphis 14,065 6,225 7,840
2. Marquette 15,611 12,323 3,288
3. Cincinnati 11,256 8,081 3,175
4. Tennessee 19,034 16,210 2,824
5. Pittsburgh 6,749 4,117 2,632

Memphis declined under Pastner, but they hit bottom in Tubby Smith's two seasons.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/co...story.html

Also note that for the 2017-18 season, Cincinnati played home games across the river and state lines at Northern Kentucky's BB&T Arena

True...but it was worth the wait. The redo on the arena is magnificant.

Screw the renovation, Penny Hardaway sold selling tickets.

Huh? I was talking about the renovation at Cincy.

TexanMark · 08-03-2019 06:05 AM

(08-03-2019 05:28 AM)Stugray2 Wrote: Ohio State is 21st, 13,495; Michigan 34th at 10,871

Since you stopped at 19th, I'll take you out to 93rd to cover most of the majors, schools with 6,000 or more attendance, I also give their NET and budgets. Obviously big public schools do better. I had planed to stop at 7,000 (70th), but that would leave 16 of the 75 major conference members off the list, as well as Memphis and Gonzaga (they sell out but capacity is only 6,000), two of the three high major budget and resource level "Mid-Majors" (in MBB they qualify as majors); Dayton being the 3rd.

If I took it out 32 more to 124 (4,000-5,999 attendance), only Washington State would not be in the list. (BC, Oregon St, Rutgers, Stanford, USC, and Pitt in that range). But at the point the list is almost all mid-majors (26 of 32). As it was pushing 23 to 93rd added 14 mid-majors, although mostly higher mid-majors. 71-93 is the 50-50 mixing point.

PHP Code:

Rank School Ave Attend NET MBB Budget Budget Rank 1 Kentucky 21,874 4 $18,571,056 4 2 Syrcasue 21,462 50 $14,742,445 7 3 North Carolina 18,378 8 $9,728,533 33 4 Wisconsin 17,272 20 $10,636,714 23 5 Creighton 17,000 54 $9,017,209 42 6 Louisville 16,883 22 $21,817,723 1 7 Kansas 16,344 17 $11,859,953 15 8 Tennessee 16,209 9 $8,386,526 52 9 Arkansas 16,181 60 $9,195,260 37 10 Indiana 15,590 56 $13,693,497 10 11 Nebraska 15,492 51 $7,771,106 61 12 NC State 15,253 36 $9,902,049 31 13 Missouri 15,061 74 $8,387,295 50 14 Michigan State 14,797 5 $11,745,452 17 15 Maryland 14,675 25 $8,375,834 53 16 Arizona 14,434 92 $9,827,381 32 17 Purdue 14,343 11 $8,410,571 49 18 Brigham Young 14,230 89 $7,468,917 67 19 Minnesota 11,850 55 $8,765,442 44 19 Iowa State 14,121 19 $6,851,315 73 20 Virginia 13,923 1 $10,501,454 24 21 Ohio State 13,495 52 $20,653,121 3 22 Alabama 13,390 61 $10,276,123 26 23 Dayton 12,996 70 $14,201,764 9 24 South Carolina 12,617 79 $9,969,479 30 25 Illinois 12,613 105 $10,703,916 22 26 Marquette 12,323 29 $12,094,572 14 27 West Virginia 12,303 106 $10,196,409 28 28 Iowa 12,026 40 $8,113,263 58 30 Villanova 11,828 28 $14,791,481 6 31 Utah 11,710 97 $8,808,011 43 32 San Diego State 11,344 116 $6,207,228 83 33 New Mexico 10,883 191 $4,390,791 100 34 Michigan 10,871 10 $9,982,947 29 35 Wichita State 10,787 63 $7,513,193 65 36 Texas Tech 10,739 7 $9,020,201 40 37 Arizona State 10,603 62 $7,972,900 60 38 Texas 10,601 33 $11,357,338 19 39 Xavier 10,475 64 $8,062,088 59 40 Oklahoma 10,253 32 $10,205,245 27 41 UNLV 10,093 159 $5,763,010 88 42 Florida 9,732 30 $9,018,168 41 43 Providence 9,547 77 $10,768,267 21 44 Duke 9,314 3 $20,826,848 2 45 Vanderbilt 9,158 155 $7,761,696 62 46 St. Johns 9,134 75 $8,321,657 55 47 Texas A&M 9,127 80 $10,391,815 25 48 Nevada 9,048 27 $4,746,053 98 49 Louisiana State 9,029 16 $8,618,878 47 50 Kansas State 8,711 23 $7,591,505 64 51 UCLA 8,619 114 $9,334,174 35 52 Butler 8,554 66 $5,507,238 89 53 Florida State 8,512 15 $11,422,894 18 54 Seton Hall 8,456 59 $6,301,138 82 55 Wake Forest 8,425 187 $8,296,973 56 56 Oregon 8,348 41 $9,287,092 36 57 Auburn 8,221 13 $9,446,382 34 58 Georgia 8,213 115 $8,539,387 48 59 Cincinnati 8,081 24 $7,465,979 68 60 Connecticut 7,829 91 $8,386,802 51 61 Notre Dame 7,777 111 $6,876,483 71 62 Clemson 7,743 45 $7,737,387 63 63 Virginia Tech 7,678 12 $11,294,240 20 64 VCU 7,637 38 $6,148,859 85 65 Georgetown 7,531 84 $12,849,462 11 66 Colorado 7,448 65 $6,325,662 81 67 California 7,375 225 $6,444,068 78 68 Penn State 7,197 49 $7,180,241 69 69 Miami 7,117 95 $8,240,615 57 70 Oklahoma State 7,010 72 $6,087,462 86 *** planned to stop here since 71 Grand Canyon 6,973 104 $5,337,280 92 72 Mississippi State 6,965 21 $6,835,070 74 73 Utah State 6,943 31 $3,451,734 115 74 Mississippi 6,882 42 $12,547,833 12 75 Washington 6,794 44 $8,656,133 45 76 Weber State 6,778 182 $1,930,140 223 77 Middle Tennessee 6,774 248 $3,263,120 124 78 Boise State 6,747 149 $2,649,924 164 79 Southern Methodist 6,659 94 $7,497,541 66 80 Texas Christian 6,561 47 $17,007,743 5 81 Georgia Tech 6,518 127 $8,627,469 46 82 Richmond 6,491 196 $4,746,842 97 83 Northwestern 6,488 88 $9,049,494 39 84 Old Dominion 6,346 101 $3,348,329 120 85 Baylor 6,331 34 $9,185,513 38 86 Temple 6,324 57 $6,533,015 76 87 Saint Louis 6,235 107 $6,876,215 72 88 Memphis 6,225 48 $11,859,500 16 89 Rhode Island 6,216 138 $5,459,313 90 90 Texas El-Paso 6,155 290 $4,166,643 105 91 DePaul 6,147 109 $7,080,194 70 92 Fresno State 6,032 82 $3,352,520 119 93 Gonzaga 6,000 2 $14,723,219 8

Nice work but can you use the 2018-19?

gulfcoastgal · 08-05-2019 08:16 AM

(08-03-2019 02:44 AM)Renandpat Wrote:
(08-02-2019 08:04 PM)TexanMark Wrote:
(08-02-2019 07:43 PM)Renandpat Wrote:
(08-02-2019 07:26 PM)TexanMark Wrote: I wanted to shout out to the Top 5 schools in increases in attendance. All are considered national programs in hoops. Memphis had floundered under Pastner...glad to see them back up where they were 10 years ago.

1. Memphis 14,065 6,225 7,840
2. Marquette 15,611 12,323 3,288
3. Cincinnati 11,256 8,081 3,175
4. Tennessee 19,034 16,210 2,824
5. Pittsburgh 6,749 4,117 2,632

Memphis declined under Pastner, but they hit bottom in Tubby Smith's two seasons.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/co...story.html

Also note that for the 2017-18 season, Cincinnati played home games across the river and state lines at Northern Kentucky's BB&T Arena

True...but it was worth the wait. The redo on the arena is magnificant.

Screw the renovation, Penny Hardaway sold selling tickets.

A poster on the Memphis board mentioned this being the largest increase since they started keeping track of the stat...20+ years. The next closest two are over 6k and were in years of capacity expansion...either reno or new arena. It really is a remarkable turnaround.

herdfan129 · 08-05-2019 09:34 AM

I didn't realize Arkansas had that kind of basketball support!

ChrisLords · 08-05-2019 10:14 AM

(08-05-2019 09:34 AM)herdfan129 Wrote: I didn't realize Arkansas had that kind of basketball support!

I didn't realize Nebraska had that strong basketball support. I also didn't know they had never won an NCAA tournament game.

MU88 · 08-05-2019 10:20 AM

How many of these schools compete with a NBA franchise for attendance? I see 2. Marquette and Memphis. I guess you can add Maryland, and maybe Purdue, too. Drawing fans when there is nothing else to do in a town is one thing. Frankly, there is nothing to do in most of the towns on the list, but for going to the game of the local team. Drawing fans when you have to compete with the NBA is is a big challenge. Marquette and Memphis each drew more than UCLA and USC combined. The DC metro area has the Wizards, Terrapins and Hoyas. For those teams to draw as well as they do, shows DC has huge bball fan support.

Frank the Tank · 08-05-2019 10:21 AM

(08-02-2019 09:01 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:
(08-01-2019 10:44 PM)TexanMark Wrote: These programs all averaged at least 14,000. Congrats to all of them

BTW, where is Michigan and Ohio State? Nebraska the furthest west program.

Glancing at NCAA attendance stats, OSU is a bandwagon school in BBall ... over 14K in 2010 (34-3), over 16K in '12/13 and '13/14, under 12.4K in '15/16 and '16/17, just shy of 13.5K in '17/18 (buoyed by over 18.7K in its two Feb '18 home games).

Seems like if there doesn't look to be a shot at the Big Ten title on the line or a big name star or two, some people might go to the Blue Jackets instead, or catch the game on BTN.

By that definition, though, 95%-plus of schools in Division I (or even just within the P5) are bandwagon schools. Schools like Kansas and UNC are the ones that are the outliers.

My overall point is that when you're comparing Ohio State and Michigan to its "peer" football power schools like Alabama, Florida (which has had quite a bit of basketball success this century), Texas, USC, etc., they generally have higher basketball support year-to-year. The Big Ten generally isn't a, "We're just going to ignore everything until spring football practice starts" type of a league even among the "football schools". The vast majority of the P5 athletic departments would be more than thrilled with Ohio State's basketball attendance.

Frank the Tank · 08-05-2019 10:36 AM

(08-05-2019 10:14 AM)ChrisLords Wrote:
(08-05-2019 09:34 AM)herdfan129 Wrote: I didn't realize Arkansas had that kind of basketball support!

I didn't realize Nebraska had that strong basketball support. I also didn't know they had never won an NCAA tournament game.

Nebraska fans really do show up for everything. I went to the opening night of the Big Ten Tournament in Chicago this past year - AKA games featuring the 4 worst teams in the league - and I was astounded by the number of Nebraska fans in attendance to watch a terrible matchup against Rutgers. Their football attendance is legendary, but they also sell out every men's basketball game, sell out every women's volleyball game (leading the nation in attendance with over 8,200 per game, which is 1,800 more than #2 Hawaii), and have top 10 baseball attendance despite being in a much colder environment than the SEC/ACC/Pac-12 schools. Those fans really are all-in on everything in every sport.

BruceMcF · 08-06-2019 07:47 PM

(08-05-2019 10:21 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:
(08-02-2019 09:01 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:
(08-01-2019 10:44 PM)TexanMark Wrote: These programs all averaged at least 14,000. Congrats to all of them

BTW, where is Michigan and Ohio State? Nebraska the furthest west program.

Glancing at NCAA attendance stats, OSU is a bandwagon school in BBall ... over 14K in 2010 (34-3), over 16K in '12/13 and '13/14, under 12.4K in '15/16 and '16/17, just shy of 13.5K in '17/18 (buoyed by over 18.7K in its two Feb '18 home games).

Seems like if there doesn't look to be a shot at the Big Ten title on the line or a big name star or two, some people might go to the Blue Jackets instead, or catch the game on BTN.

By that definition, though, 95%-plus of schools in Division I (or even just within the P5) are bandwagon schools. Schools like Kansas and UNC are the ones that are the outliers.

My overall point is that when you're comparing Ohio State and Michigan to its "peer" football power schools like Alabama, Florida (which has had quite a bit of basketball success this century), Texas, USC, etc., they generally have higher basketball support year-to-year.

Most programs goes through down periods some time in a twenty year span ... a reasonable metric for baseline support would be the minimum average annual attendance since the turn of the century. I haven't looked at every year back to 2000, but it seems like the Buckeyes would likely be somewhere around 12,000 ... right around the capacity of the arena of That School Up North, which seems to have focused more on selling season ticket packages over ability to get big numbers in during a good season.

bullet · 08-06-2019 08:33 PM

New Mexico had a tough year on the court (14-18) and only finished 30th in attendance, with 11,107, right behind Cincinnati.

They were top 10 every year but 1992 (#11) from 1970-2004, finishing 2nd several times, often drawing over 16k. I believe they were top 10 much of the 60s as well. They were still top 25 every year up until 2017.
http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketba...Ytop25.pdf

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