(07-22-2019 06:55 PM)herdfan129 Wrote:  Marshall and the CUSA East teams are most upset with the focus of this conference being so centered around Texas more than we are upset with sharing a conference with teams from Texas.

The best fan bases for basketball are in the East and/or used to be in the East (UAB/So Miss).

For some reason our conference thinks its a good idea to host the basketball tournament in Texas. Such a joke to say the least. You have Marshall, ODU, WKU all averaging 6k+ per game. MTSU, UAB, Charlotte all have solid fan bases in terms of basketball, especially if they are winning. Yet we have the basketball tournament in friggin Texas where most of the teams average like 2,500/game in basketball. Absolutely ridiculous and the Eastern based teams (the stronger overall programs) are getting fed up with it.

that is a legit concern one of the main issues is in the DFW area so many of those smaller cities are aggressive about pulling away sports and sporting events from the horribly run city of dallas proper that they even get hyper aggressive to land other events outside of the ones they pull from the city of dallas proper

you have to wonder how aggressive CUSA was about talking to other areas be it Shreveport, Nashville, Charlotte, or any other about what they would be willing to do

the other issue is wanting a "neutral" site.....but yet are you willing to go to Atlanta, Memphis or some similar area that has a team or teams from some other conference there (of course DFW has two and three if you count UTA when talking about mens BB)

from there do you try and make members (and their cities) bid to host the tournament if you are willing to forgo the "neutral site"......sadly at all levels of the NCAA most college towns are content to ride the coat tails of their university and not bid aggressively for things like conference tournaments

I think you raise a legit issue though and one has to wonder what the financial trade off is vs getting money from Frisco to be there vs any additional tickets that might be sold at a different venue closer to the CUSA basketball schools

plus you have to calculate the exposure from larger fan support even if it is lesser straight dollars

I am not sure how the money would all work out (especially with the exposure and general good will of more fans calculated in), but I would suspect the bigger issue is the CUSA has really not run any analysis on any of that and took the most simple way out and that is "this place offered us money so we went there" and that was the lump sum of the cost benefit analysis

one can actually look at the D1-AA football final game in Frisco as an example.....a lot wondered how well that would go, but they got lucky that North Dakota has played there so much with their large fan support and the fact that it is ButtA cold in ND at that time and DFW is a tropical paradise to them

so on the back of that fan support the event is considered a success even to other teams fans because they now want to go there too

but the CUSA is not getting close to the same response with the basketball tournament (even considering it is a conference mens BB tournament not a national championship game) so you have to wonder if some other location could get that fan support and become a bigger overall event

(07-22-2019 09:15 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 06:55 PM)herdfan129 Wrote:  Marshall and the CUSA East teams are most upset with the focus of this conference being so centered around Texas more than we are upset with sharing a conference with teams from Texas.

The best fan bases for basketball are in the East and/or used to be in the East (UAB/So Miss).

For some reason our conference thinks its a good idea to host the basketball tournament in Texas. Such a joke to say the least. You have Marshall, ODU, WKU all averaging 6k+ per game. MTSU, UAB, Charlotte all have solid fan bases in terms of basketball, especially if they are winning. Yet we have the basketball tournament in friggin Texas where most of the teams average like 2,500/game in basketball. Absolutely ridiculous and the Eastern based teams (the stronger overall programs) are getting fed up with it.

that is a legit concern one of the main issues is in the DFW area so many of those smaller cities are aggressive about pulling away sports and sporting events from the horribly run city of dallas proper than they even get hyper aggressive to land other events outside of the ones they pull from the city of dallas proper

you have to wonder how aggressive CUSA was about talking to other areas be it Shreveport, Nashville, Charlotte, or any other about what they would be willing to do

the other issue is wanting a "neutral" site.....but yet are you willing to go to Atlanta, Memphis or some similar area that has a team or teams from some other conference there (of course DFW has two and three if you count UTA when talking about mens BB)

from there do you try and make members (and their cities) bid to host the tournament if you are willing to forgo the "neutral site"......sadly at all levels of the NCAA most college towns are content to ride the coat tails of their university and not bid aggressively for things like conference tournaments

I think you raise a legit issue though and one has to wonder what the financial trade off is vs getting money from Frisco to be there vs any additional tickets that might be sold at a different venue closer to the CUSA basketball schools

plus you have to calculate the exposure from larger fan support even if it is lesser straight dollars

I am not sure how the money would all work out (especially with the exposure and general good will of more fans calculated in), but I would suspect the bigger issue is the CUSA has really not run any analysis on any of that and took the most simple way out and that is "this place offered us money so we went there" and that was the lump sum of the cost benefit analysis

CUSA has a requirement that the same city host the men's and women's basketball tournament simultaneously, which limits the number of cities that can bid. If you want the CUSA tournament, you need two facilities (or just one big one that you cut in half with a curtain, as they're doing at The Star).

It's not a popular rule (at least on the boards; no idea if anyone else especially cares), but it is what it is.

(07-22-2019 09:20 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 09:15 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 06:55 PM)herdfan129 Wrote:  Marshall and the CUSA East teams are most upset with the focus of this conference being so centered around Texas more than we are upset with sharing a conference with teams from Texas.

The best fan bases for basketball are in the East and/or used to be in the East (UAB/So Miss).

For some reason our conference thinks its a good idea to host the basketball tournament in Texas. Such a joke to say the least. You have Marshall, ODU, WKU all averaging 6k+ per game. MTSU, UAB, Charlotte all have solid fan bases in terms of basketball, especially if they are winning. Yet we have the basketball tournament in friggin Texas where most of the teams average like 2,500/game in basketball. Absolutely ridiculous and the Eastern based teams (the stronger overall programs) are getting fed up with it.

that is a legit concern one of the main issues is in the DFW area so many of those smaller cities are aggressive about pulling away sports and sporting events from the horribly run city of dallas proper than they even get hyper aggressive to land other events outside of the ones they pull from the city of dallas proper

you have to wonder how aggressive CUSA was about talking to other areas be it Shreveport, Nashville, Charlotte, or any other about what they would be willing to do

the other issue is wanting a "neutral" site.....but yet are you willing to go to Atlanta, Memphis or some similar area that has a team or teams from some other conference there (of course DFW has two and three if you count UTA when talking about mens BB)

from there do you try and make members (and their cities) bid to host the tournament if you are willing to forgo the "neutral site"......sadly at all levels of the NCAA most college towns are content to ride the coat tails of their university and not bid aggressively for things like conference tournaments

I think you raise a legit issue though and one has to wonder what the financial trade off is vs getting money from Frisco to be there vs any additional tickets that might be sold at a different venue closer to the CUSA basketball schools

plus you have to calculate the exposure from larger fan support even if it is lesser straight dollars

I am not sure how the money would all work out (especially with the exposure and general good will of more fans calculated in), but I would suspect the bigger issue is the CUSA has really not run any analysis on any of that and took the most simple way out and that is "this place offered us money so we went there" and that was the lump sum of the cost benefit analysis

CUSA has a requirement that the same city host the men's and women's basketball tournament simultaneously, which limits the number of cities that can bid. If you want the CUSA tournament, you need two facilities (or just one big one that you cut in half with a curtain, as they're doing at The Star).

It's not a popular rule (at least on the boards; no idea if anyone else especially cares), but it is what it is.

interesting

I was not doubting you, but I was looking to see if other conferences have the same rule (not really finding any info yet) and I saw this

https://carolinanewsandreporter.org/home...asketball/

the NCAA actually prohibits a school from hosting both the mens and womens tournaments at the same time

that seems like a pretty idiotic (and costly) rule, but if the CUSA has that rule you stated (I am not doubting you) that means combined with the NCAA rule the CUSA will never be able to have their tournaments on campus anywhere because the two rules conflict

I understand the desire for a "neutral site" but at the same time sometimes you have to suck it up and do what is best for the fans and the conference and sometimes that is not straight cash from a site

I had forgotten about the split court and the curtain, but your post reminded me of that fun fact......not that fun or desirable

(07-22-2019 10:10 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 09:20 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 09:15 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 06:55 PM)herdfan129 Wrote:  Marshall and the CUSA East teams are most upset with the focus of this conference being so centered around Texas more than we are upset with sharing a conference with teams from Texas.

The best fan bases for basketball are in the East and/or used to be in the East (UAB/So Miss).

For some reason our conference thinks its a good idea to host the basketball tournament in Texas. Such a joke to say the least. You have Marshall, ODU, WKU all averaging 6k+ per game. MTSU, UAB, Charlotte all have solid fan bases in terms of basketball, especially if they are winning. Yet we have the basketball tournament in friggin Texas where most of the teams average like 2,500/game in basketball. Absolutely ridiculous and the Eastern based teams (the stronger overall programs) are getting fed up with it.

that is a legit concern one of the main issues is in the DFW area so many of those smaller cities are aggressive about pulling away sports and sporting events from the horribly run city of dallas proper than they even get hyper aggressive to land other events outside of the ones they pull from the city of dallas proper

you have to wonder how aggressive CUSA was about talking to other areas be it Shreveport, Nashville, Charlotte, or any other about what they would be willing to do

the other issue is wanting a "neutral" site.....but yet are you willing to go to Atlanta, Memphis or some similar area that has a team or teams from some other conference there (of course DFW has two and three if you count UTA when talking about mens BB)

from there do you try and make members (and their cities) bid to host the tournament if you are willing to forgo the "neutral site"......sadly at all levels of the NCAA most college towns are content to ride the coat tails of their university and not bid aggressively for things like conference tournaments

I think you raise a legit issue though and one has to wonder what the financial trade off is vs getting money from Frisco to be there vs any additional tickets that might be sold at a different venue closer to the CUSA basketball schools

plus you have to calculate the exposure from larger fan support even if it is lesser straight dollars

I am not sure how the money would all work out (especially with the exposure and general good will of more fans calculated in), but I would suspect the bigger issue is the CUSA has really not run any analysis on any of that and took the most simple way out and that is "this place offered us money so we went there" and that was the lump sum of the cost benefit analysis

CUSA has a requirement that the same city host the men's and women's basketball tournament simultaneously, which limits the number of cities that can bid. If you want the CUSA tournament, you need two facilities (or just one big one that you cut in half with a curtain, as they're doing at The Star).

It's not a popular rule (at least on the boards; no idea if anyone else especially cares), but it is what it is.

interesting

I was not doubting you, but I was looking to see if other conferences have the same rule (not really finding any info yet) and I saw this

https://carolinanewsandreporter.org/home...asketball/

the NCAA actually prohibits a school from hosting both the mens and womens tournaments at the same time

that seems like a pretty idiotic (and costly) rule, but if the CUSA has that rule you stated (I am not doubting you) that means combined with the NCAA rule the CUSA will never be able to have their tournaments on campus anywhere because the two rules conflict

I understand the desire for a "neutral site" but at the same time sometimes you have to suck it up and do what is best for the fans and the conference and sometimes that is not straight cash from a site

I had forgotten about the split court and the curtain, but your post reminded me of that fun fact......not that fun or desirable

That’s a rule about the NCAAs, not conference tourneys.

CUSA should either do home sites or find another way to pick a champ; it’s just too big an area to allow for a good crowd no matter where they put it if the local team is out.

(07-21-2019 11:29 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  I think these would be the best option for the members of these 2 leagues.
In my world UAB becomes the AAC's 12th team.

So I’m not for a realignment between C-USA and the Sunbelt, I like the conference we’re in. I like being in a conference with GS, App State, coastal and Troy. With that being said if these conferences are forced I’m not a fan of being in a conference with UTEP and NMST, they are just as far as traveling to App State. I also do understand that they are kinda on an island and would have no choice but to join this new conference. Another thing to consider is let pretend UAB goes to the American (Not gonna happen) I think troy should be in the western conference and C-USA could add Liberty and to not have 13 members in the “New Sunbelt/Southwest” could just drop the team with the lowest athletic budget in the picture.

The G5 really need to bite the bullet with getting less money for tv deals. Why not break into more regional conferences? This would have to be done with Top FCS and D2 schools that are FBS ready. Getting into regional could drive up ticket sales which could lead out of the hole in debt, and then spend money to upgrade their facilities. Still, the two conferences are still spread apart. There are way too many egos right now who are not thinking straight. The cost of spending for football is way too to travel. You could spend cheaper by busing the football teams, and fans of both teams could drive to the game which could be a day trip for some. Basketball is fine being spread out like the Big East or WCC who do not sponsor football.

There's no Sun Belt institution that complains about travel. It's not destroying the budgets of the Sun Belt schools. Every team got a higher payout for the latest media deal. All the schools are similar institutions with no real sore thumb sticking out. I don't see the Sun Belt Squad breaking apart for anything less than an attempt to get in a conference that would be a clear #2 G5 league. Which doesn't seem like that will be the case any time soon.

(07-22-2019 07:14 PM)Cardiff Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 06:55 PM)herdfan129 Wrote:  Marshall and the CUSA East teams are most upset with the focus of this conference being so centered around Texas more than we are upset with sharing a conference with teams from Texas.

The best fan bases for basketball are in the East and/or used to be in the East (UAB/So Miss).

For some reason our conference thinks its a good idea to host the basketball tournament in Texas. Such a joke to say the least. You have Marshall, ODU, WKU all averaging 6k+ per game. MTSU, UAB, Charlotte all have solid fan bases in terms of basketball, especially if they are winning. Yet we have the basketball tournament in friggin Texas where most of the teams average like 2,500/game in basketball. Absolutely ridiculous and the Eastern based teams (the stronger overall programs) are getting fed up with it.

I’m not connected to the people who make these decisions. But the way I’ve heard it is, the BB tournament in Frisco TX is a purely financial decision. If that’s true, I’m fine with it staying there. If that’s not true then I’d have a huge problem with it.

Yeah supposedly Frisco put in the best bid, maybe the only bid and FWIW by most accounts its well put together with lots to do and convenient and an overall good experience for fans. The curtain is bush league and it looks awful on TV. I can't imagine the money being good enough to justify it being in Frisco indefinitely though. Split up the men's and women's and you'll have a lot more cities bidding. Or cut the field down so they can be played on the same floor. There are a lot of solutions.

(07-23-2019 08:17 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 07:14 PM)Cardiff Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 06:55 PM)herdfan129 Wrote:  Marshall and the CUSA East teams are most upset with the focus of this conference being so centered around Texas more than we are upset with sharing a conference with teams from Texas.

The best fan bases for basketball are in the East and/or used to be in the East (UAB/So Miss).

For some reason our conference thinks its a good idea to host the basketball tournament in Texas. Such a joke to say the least. You have Marshall, ODU, WKU all averaging 6k+ per game. MTSU, UAB, Charlotte all have solid fan bases in terms of basketball, especially if they are winning. Yet we have the basketball tournament in friggin Texas where most of the teams average like 2,500/game in basketball. Absolutely ridiculous and the Eastern based teams (the stronger overall programs) are getting fed up with it.

I’m not connected to the people who make these decisions. But the way I’ve heard it is, the BB tournament in Frisco TX is a purely financial decision. If that’s true, I’m fine with it staying there. If that’s not true then I’d have a huge problem with it.

Yeah supposedly Frisco put in the best bid, maybe the only bid and FWIW by most accounts its well put together with lots to do and convenient and an overall good experience for fans. The curtain is bush league and it looks awful on TV. I can't imagine the money being good enough to justify it being in Frisco indefinitely though. Split up the men's and women's and you'll have a lot more cities bidding. Or cut the field down so they can be played on the same floor. There are a lot of solutions.

Or if you have it in say Charlotte, have the Men's in the Charlotte Coliseum or Bojangles' Coliseum and the Women's in UNCC's facility.

Same with Nasheville or Atlanta or Birmingham. They can be in the same city just different arenas with one being on the campus of a CUSA member.

(07-23-2019 08:29 AM)Yosef Himself Wrote:  

(07-23-2019 08:17 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 07:14 PM)Cardiff Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 06:55 PM)herdfan129 Wrote:  Marshall and the CUSA East teams are most upset with the focus of this conference being so centered around Texas more than we are upset with sharing a conference with teams from Texas.

The best fan bases for basketball are in the East and/or used to be in the East (UAB/So Miss).

For some reason our conference thinks its a good idea to host the basketball tournament in Texas. Such a joke to say the least. You have Marshall, ODU, WKU all averaging 6k+ per game. MTSU, UAB, Charlotte all have solid fan bases in terms of basketball, especially if they are winning. Yet we have the basketball tournament in friggin Texas where most of the teams average like 2,500/game in basketball. Absolutely ridiculous and the Eastern based teams (the stronger overall programs) are getting fed up with it.

I’m not connected to the people who make these decisions. But the way I’ve heard it is, the BB tournament in Frisco TX is a purely financial decision. If that’s true, I’m fine with it staying there. If that’s not true then I’d have a huge problem with it.

Yeah supposedly Frisco put in the best bid, maybe the only bid and FWIW by most accounts its well put together with lots to do and convenient and an overall good experience for fans. The curtain is bush league and it looks awful on TV. I can't imagine the money being good enough to justify it being in Frisco indefinitely though. Split up the men's and women's and you'll have a lot more cities bidding. Or cut the field down so they can be played on the same floor. There are a lot of solutions.

Or if you have it in say Charlotte, have the Men's in the Charlotte Coliseum or Bojangles' Coliseum and the Women's in UNCC's facility.

Same with Nasheville or Atlanta or Birmingham. They can be in the same city just different arenas with one being on the campus of a CUSA member.

I think the issue with Charlotte is they’ve been hosting the CIAA tournament, and between that and the Hornets and the occasional ACC tourney, they don’t have the available facilities when they want them. The CIAA is going to Baltimore though, so that might give Charlotte a chance to bid when the Frisco contract runs out.

(07-23-2019 08:29 AM)Yosef Himself Wrote:  

(07-23-2019 08:17 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 07:14 PM)Cardiff Wrote:  

(07-22-2019 06:55 PM)herdfan129 Wrote:  Marshall and the CUSA East teams are most upset with the focus of this conference being so centered around Texas more than we are upset with sharing a conference with teams from Texas.

The best fan bases for basketball are in the East and/or used to be in the East (UAB/So Miss).

For some reason our conference thinks its a good idea to host the basketball tournament in Texas. Such a joke to say the least. You have Marshall, ODU, WKU all averaging 6k+ per game. MTSU, UAB, Charlotte all have solid fan bases in terms of basketball, especially if they are winning. Yet we have the basketball tournament in friggin Texas where most of the teams average like 2,500/game in basketball. Absolutely ridiculous and the Eastern based teams (the stronger overall programs) are getting fed up with it.

I’m not connected to the people who make these decisions. But the way I’ve heard it is, the BB tournament in Frisco TX is a purely financial decision. If that’s true, I’m fine with it staying there. If that’s not true then I’d have a huge problem with it.

Yeah supposedly Frisco put in the best bid, maybe the only bid and FWIW by most accounts its well put together with lots to do and convenient and an overall good experience for fans. The curtain is bush league and it looks awful on TV. I can't imagine the money being good enough to justify it being in Frisco indefinitely though. Split up the men's and women's and you'll have a lot more cities bidding. Or cut the field down so they can be played on the same floor. There are a lot of solutions.

Or if you have it in say Charlotte, have the Men's in the Charlotte Coliseum or Bojangles' Coliseum and the Women's in UNCC's facility.

Same with Nasheville or Atlanta or Birmingham. They can be in the same city just different arenas with one being on the campus of a CUSA member.

That's typically the way it's been. It does limit the cities eligible though. I'd love Charlotte, makes a ton of sense (even though they failed to make the tourney last year, we'll assume that they'll get better). I don't have a problem with it being in Frisco or even El Paso, who hosted a few years ago. I do have a problem with Frisco seemingly becoming the permanent home of our tourney.

(07-23-2019 08:00 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  The G5 really need to bite the bullet with getting less money for tv deals. Why not break into more regional conferences? This would have to be done with Top FCS and D2 schools that are FBS ready. Getting into regional could drive up ticket sales which could lead out of the hole in debt, and then spend money to upgrade their facilities. Still, the two conferences are still spread apart. There are way too many egos right now who are not thinking straight. The cost of spending for football is way too to travel. You could spend cheaper by busing the football teams, and fans of both teams could drive to the game which could be a day trip for some. Basketball is fine being spread out like the Big East or WCC who do not sponsor football.

You obviously have seen majority of some of these schools facilities, all of UL athletic facilities are second to none and are better then most power 5 (besides our football stadium), so what ever you are smoking you need to put it away.

(07-23-2019 07:45 AM)Cajuns1252 Wrote:  

(07-21-2019 11:29 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  I think these would be the best option for the members of these 2 leagues.
In my world UAB becomes the AAC's 12th team.

So I’m not for a realignment between C-USA and the Sunbelt, I like the conference we’re in. I like being in a conference with GS, App State, coastal and Troy. With that being said if these conferences are forced I’m not a fan of being in a conference with UTEP and NMST, they are just as far as traveling to App State. I also do understand that they are kinda on an island and would have no choice but to join this new conference. Another thing to consider is let pretend UAB goes to the American (Not gonna happen) I think troy should be in the western conference and C-USA could add Liberty and to not have 13 members in the “New Sunbelt/Southwest” could just drop the team with the lowest athletic budget in the picture.

Hm, gee, I wonder which school that would be. Not that I'm opposed to ditching your rival, though.

(07-23-2019 11:51 AM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(07-23-2019 07:45 AM)Cajuns1252 Wrote:  

(07-21-2019 11:29 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  I think these would be the best option for the members of these 2 leagues.
In my world UAB becomes the AAC's 12th team.

So I’m not for a realignment between C-USA and the Sunbelt, I like the conference we’re in. I like being in a conference with GS, App State, coastal and Troy. With that being said if these conferences are forced I’m not a fan of being in a conference with UTEP and NMST, they are just as far as traveling to App State. I also do understand that they are kinda on an island and would have no choice but to join this new conference. Another thing to consider is let pretend UAB goes to the American (Not gonna happen) I think troy should be in the western conference and C-USA could add Liberty and to not have 13 members in the “New Sunbelt/Southwest” could just drop the team with the lowest athletic budget in the picture.

Hm, gee, I wonder which school that would be. Not that I'm opposed to ditching your rival, though.

Arkansas State is more of a rival to us than ULM, the “rivalry” is something the Sunbelt has pushed on us and hasn’t taken off on our side.

(07-23-2019 12:05 PM)Cajuns1252 Wrote:  

(07-23-2019 11:51 AM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(07-23-2019 07:45 AM)Cajuns1252 Wrote:  

(07-21-2019 11:29 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  I think these would be the best option for the members of these 2 leagues.
In my world UAB becomes the AAC's 12th team.

So I’m not for a realignment between C-USA and the Sunbelt, I like the conference we’re in. I like being in a conference with GS, App State, coastal and Troy. With that being said if these conferences are forced I’m not a fan of being in a conference with UTEP and NMST, they are just as far as traveling to App State. I also do understand that they are kinda on an island and would have no choice but to join this new conference. Another thing to consider is let pretend UAB goes to the American (Not gonna happen) I think troy should be in the western conference and C-USA could add Liberty and to not have 13 members in the “New Sunbelt/Southwest” could just drop the team with the lowest athletic budget in the picture.

Hm, gee, I wonder which school that would be. Not that I'm opposed to ditching your rival, though.

Arkansas State is more of a rival to us than ULM, the “rivalry” is something the Sunbelt has pushed on us and hasn’t taken off on our side.

I think AState-ULM is bigger than UL-ULM and the gap would be larger but for ULM and UL having had so many close games plus each spoiling the other's chance to be outright league champions opening the door to AState each time (2005 and 2013).

The main reason AState-ULM is bigger is Central Arkansas AState fans. Far and away easiest road trip for the alums around Little Rock in years we aren't playing Memphis and get south of Little Rock and you start running into people who can get to Monroe faster than LR.