(07-20-2019 10:35 AM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 10:32 AM)zoocrew Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 09:47 AM)Bogg Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 06:46 AM)tnzazz Wrote:  

(07-19-2019 10:25 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  They will, let's see hard ur laughing when Conn in B-12

You’re kidding right? They just flushed that dream down the toilet.


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That dream got flushed down the toilet for the entire AAC about two years ago when ESPN and Fox were exceedingly clear regarding their thoughts on further expansion of the big-money conferences. I think everyone needs to be honest about "Big 12 expansion" meaning certain AAC teams getting called up by Baylor, TCU, KSU, and ISU. Maybe WVU is still there.

For every team in the AAC except Temple that’d be the best conference they’d have been in for over 20 years.

Unfortunately that wouldn't be an exciting conference and those teams would likely slide back without big money.

I think you've nailed it. But, that reconstituted BigXII would basically be the AAC with KSU, WVU, Baylor, TCU, and ISU replacing Tulane and Tulsa. Yeah, they'd all slide back without UT and OU propping them up, but WVU, KSU and ISU, as large state schools, could always compete with the top of the AAC schools. TCU would eventually fall to the level of SMU. Only Baylor would be destined to be a celler dweller.

(07-20-2019 01:10 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 11:38 AM)TripleA Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 10:06 AM)Bogg Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 09:55 AM)TripleA Wrote:  2. They killed football to make essentially a lateral move or slightly better in basketball, for less money, and the lesser travel boils down to 3 closer schools: Seton Hall, St. John's and Providence. The rest are a wash.

I mean, setting aside the conference v. conference metrics in basketball, this is just false. UConn goes from having 1 out of the 11 conference opponents drivable for fans to a full half of the league, and they swap out a conference tournament in Fort Worth for one you can get to via commuter rail. It's a much better setup for basketball.

It isn't false. I posted this for you before. You're swapping Wichita for Creighton, Xavier for Cincinnati, Temple for Villanova, and Navy for Georgetown. And you still have to travel to Milwaukee, Chicago and Indianapolis, too.

So all you are gaining for close travel is 3 schools: Seton Hall, Providence and St. John's. And MSG for the BE Tourney once a year. And you had to kill football to gain that.

Navy is an associate that plays in the opposite football division only, and has none of the history UConn-Georgetown does. Temple is the only full member of the AAC within reasonable driving distance of Connecticut, the Big East has five of those schools. The travel is much better for fans, however you want to spin it.

(07-20-2019 12:22 PM)tnzazz Wrote:  For basketball, which does nothing for the P5. It’s football, you moron. Why is that so hard to understand?

1) Basketball is UConn's signature sport, the one at which they win National Championships, and the one that's most popular. Pointing out that UConn's best-situated their top priority isn't exactly a counterpoint.

2) Nobody here does anything for the P5, the networks made that perfectly clear when they threatened the Big 12 out of expanding. The best case scenario is contraction into a P4 and some percentage of the AAC schools climbing the ladder to the next "first conference out" conference.

(07-20-2019 12:22 PM)tnzazz Wrote:  Yeah, good luck b-ball only in the B12 or ACC.

See, this is what's being missed - UConn can happily exist in the Big East long-term. If ACC or B1G or Big 12 (as it's currently constituted) money for football isn't happening, and it isn't, then just focusing on basketball in the most Northeast-centered of the major basketball conferences works for the school.

We agree


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(07-20-2019 02:26 PM)TeleCoog Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 10:35 AM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 10:32 AM)zoocrew Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 09:47 AM)Bogg Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 06:46 AM)tnzazz Wrote:  You’re kidding right? They just flushed that dream down the toilet.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That dream got flushed down the toilet for the entire AAC about two years ago when ESPN and Fox were exceedingly clear regarding their thoughts on further expansion of the big-money conferences. I think everyone needs to be honest about "Big 12 expansion" meaning certain AAC teams getting called up by Baylor, TCU, KSU, and ISU. Maybe WVU is still there.

For every team in the AAC except Temple that’d be the best conference they’d have been in for over 20 years.

Unfortunately that wouldn't be an exciting conference and those teams would likely slide back without big money.

I think you've nailed it. But, that reconstituted BigXII would basically be the AAC with KSU, WVU, Baylor, TCU, and ISU replacing Tulane and Tulsa. Yeah, they'd all slide back without UT and OU propping them up, but WVU, KSU and ISU, as large state schools, could always compete with the top of the AAC schools. TCU would eventually fall to the level of SMU. Only Baylor would be destined to be a celler dweller.

Even Baylor would probably be ok. It’s not like Rhule hasn’t done well in the AAC before.

(07-20-2019 02:29 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 02:26 PM)TeleCoog Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 10:35 AM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 10:32 AM)zoocrew Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 09:47 AM)Bogg Wrote:  That dream got flushed down the toilet for the entire AAC about two years ago when ESPN and Fox were exceedingly clear regarding their thoughts on further expansion of the big-money conferences. I think everyone needs to be honest about "Big 12 expansion" meaning certain AAC teams getting called up by Baylor, TCU, KSU, and ISU. Maybe WVU is still there.

For every team in the AAC except Temple that’d be the best conference they’d have been in for over 20 years.

Unfortunately that wouldn't be an exciting conference and those teams would likely slide back without big money.

I think you've nailed it. But, that reconstituted BigXII would basically be the AAC with KSU, WVU, Baylor, TCU, and ISU replacing Tulane and Tulsa. Yeah, they'd all slide back without UT and OU propping them up, but WVU, KSU and ISU, as large state schools, could always compete with the top of the AAC schools. TCU would eventually fall to the level of SMU. Only Baylor would be destined to be a celler dweller.

Even Baylor would probably be ok. It’s not like Rhule hasn’t done well in the AAC before.

Yea, I mean, that's not a bad theoretical conference, and it makes all sorts of sense for the Western AAC teams. Just pointing out that wagering the next half decade on that Big 12 is very different math for UConn. They wouldn't even be guaranteed a spot because the geography is still really bad, particularly if West Virginia finds a home elsewhere.

OU and Texas are likely not leaving the Big 12. They can't get the same deal elsewhere, and they get to play their regional schedule. And I think UT's Longhorn Network deal runs through 2031, already.

(07-20-2019 07:44 PM)TripleA Wrote:  OU and Texas are likely not leaving the Big 12. They can't get the same deal elsewhere, and they get to play their regional schedule. And I think UT's Longhorn Network deal runs through 2031, already.

There's a good chance that this is true as well, which is even more to the point.

(07-20-2019 07:44 PM)TripleA Wrote:  OU and Texas are likely not leaving the Big 12. They can't get the same deal elsewhere, and they get to play their regional schedule. And I think UT's Longhorn Network deal runs through 2031, already.

Texas gets to double dip on revenue. LHN plus Big 12 revenue. Not sure what Oklahoma is gaining from the big 12.

(07-20-2019 11:38 AM)TripleA Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 10:06 AM)Bogg Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 09:55 AM)TripleA Wrote:  2. They killed football to make essentially a lateral move or slightly better in basketball, for less money, and the lesser travel boils down to 3 closer schools: Seton Hall, St. John's and Providence. The rest are a wash.

I mean, setting aside the conference v. conference metrics in basketball, this is just false. UConn goes from having 1 out of the 11 conference opponents drivable for fans to a full half of the league, and they swap out a conference tournament in Fort Worth for one you can get to via commuter rail. It's a much better setup for basketball.

It isn't false. I posted this for you before. You're swapping Wichita for Creighton, Xavier for Cincinnati, Temple for Villanova, and Navy for Georgetown. And you still have to travel to Milwaukee, Chicago and Indianapolis, too.

So all you are gaining for close travel is 3 schools: Seton Hall, Providence and St. John's. And MSG for the BE Tourney once a year. And you had to kill football to gain that.

....and the Fball program and perhaps P5 access, is DEAD.
Uconn admin gave up. Maybe that is for the best.

(07-20-2019 10:17 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 07:44 PM)TripleA Wrote:  OU and Texas are likely not leaving the Big 12. They can't get the same deal elsewhere, and they get to play their regional schedule. And I think UT's Longhorn Network deal runs through 2031, already.

Texas gets to double dip on revenue. LHN plus Big 12 revenue. Not sure what Oklahoma is gaining from the big 12.

$39mm is a good start for OK

(07-20-2019 10:17 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 07:44 PM)TripleA Wrote:  OU and Texas are likely not leaving the Big 12. They can't get the same deal elsewhere, and they get to play their regional schedule. And I think UT's Longhorn Network deal runs through 2031, already.

Texas gets to double dip on revenue. LHN plus Big 12 revenue. Not sure what Oklahoma is gaining from the big 12.

OU has its own side deals. And some type of special treatment with the Tier 3 games, too, but I forget the details. Not as huge as Texas', but bigger than any other B12 team, iirc.

(07-20-2019 10:26 PM)wavefan12 Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 11:38 AM)TripleA Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 10:06 AM)Bogg Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 09:55 AM)TripleA Wrote:  2. They killed football to make essentially a lateral move or slightly better in basketball, for less money, and the lesser travel boils down to 3 closer schools: Seton Hall, St. John's and Providence. The rest are a wash.

I mean, setting aside the conference v. conference metrics in basketball, this is just false. UConn goes from having 1 out of the 11 conference opponents drivable for fans to a full half of the league, and they swap out a conference tournament in Fort Worth for one you can get to via commuter rail. It's a much better setup for basketball.

It isn't false. I posted this for you before. You're swapping Wichita for Creighton, Xavier for Cincinnati, Temple for Villanova, and Navy for Georgetown. And you still have to travel to Milwaukee, Chicago and Indianapolis, too.

So all you are gaining for close travel is 3 schools: Seton Hall, Providence and St. John's. And MSG for the BE Tourney once a year. And you had to kill football to gain that.

....and the Fball program and perhaps P5 access, is DEAD.
Uconn admin gave up. Maybe that is for the best.

I think their plan just to keep it in FBS until 2025. If nothing swings their way in realignment then they'll get the gun and walk it out to the backyard.

(07-21-2019 01:10 AM)TripleA Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 10:17 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 07:44 PM)TripleA Wrote:  OU and Texas are likely not leaving the Big 12. They can't get the same deal elsewhere, and they get to play their regional schedule. And I think UT's Longhorn Network deal runs through 2031, already.

Texas gets to double dip on revenue. LHN plus Big 12 revenue. Not sure what Oklahoma is gaining from the big 12.

OU has its own side deals. And some type of special treatment with the Tier 3 games, too, but I forget the details. Not as huge as Texas', but bigger than any other B12 team, iirc.

Also an easier path to the playoffs. The SEC and B10 are much tougher conferences and the PAC is not a fit geographically or otherwise for OK.

Funny how every thread turns into a Big 12 expansion debate, but here we are, lol. Everyone here would jump at a Big 12 invite if it happened, and that's the cold hard truth. So... with that said... I am amazed the number of people that think Texas would leave the Big 12. They were the big fish in the SWC, the big fish in the Big 12, and LOVE being the center of attention, power, and control, plus who else has their own TV network like the longhorn network (which really should eventually evolved into the Big 12 network). Truth be told, that Texas would NEVER go to the PAC-12 as they'd be a geographic outlier and wouldn't be a cultural fit. Similar can be said about them going to the SEC (plus would TAMU really want to do that again?). ACC doesn't have much room (if 16 is the max and ND is #15), besides they aren't a cultural fit at all. Big Ten I don't think will ever go outside their contiguous setup, and again Texas isn't a cultural fit their either. I guess they could go Independent if they really wanted to, but I think they like some of their long established rivals they've been playing forever in Texas Tech, TCU, and Baylor. In the end, I think the Big 12 will continue and Texas will be at the helm just as they are now and have been for 100+ yrs. They would bring back a modern day version of the SWC before going truly independent (which wouldn't be that hard with Houston, Rice, and SMU all lingering out there, plus the option to add Texas St potentially). What I think would happen if the non-Texas Big 12 schools were raided by the B1G, SEC, or PAC would just be more back-fill from the AAC (eastern expansion) while possibly bringing BYU (football only) into the mix.

For sake of argument if say...

OU and OSU went to SEC
KU and KSU to B1G

Then you'd be left with...

Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Iowa St, and WVU (if WVU wasn't team #16 for the ACC and stayed in the Big 12 you'd probably see something like follows...

Texas
Texas Tech
TCU
Baylor
Iowa St

WVU
Cincinnati
Memphis
UCF
USF

Who knows maybe they take that opportunity to kick out Baylor and add Houston, SMU, or Rice.

In that scenario, I would see Texas go indy as an equal to Notre Dame with MBB and Olys aligned with the Big 12. With (2) possible additions.
BIG 12
BYU-football only
Texas Tech
TCU
SMU
Baylor
Houston
(Tulane)

Iowa State
WVU
Cincinnati
Memphis
UCF
USF
(Temple)

(07-23-2019 03:38 PM)AusTxPony Wrote:  In that scenario, I would see Texas go indy as an equal to Notre Dame with MBB and Olys aligned with the Big 12. With (2) possible additions.
BIG 12
BYU-football only
Texas Tech
TCU
SMU
Baylor
Houston
(Tulane)

Iowa State
WVU
Cincinnati
Memphis
UCF
USF
(Temple)

I could see that as well, Texas going Indy, honestly would think they'd be 50/50 on staying/leaving at that point.

(07-21-2019 01:10 AM)TripleA Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 10:17 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-20-2019 07:44 PM)TripleA Wrote:  OU and Texas are likely not leaving the Big 12. They can't get the same deal elsewhere, and they get to play their regional schedule. And I think UT's Longhorn Network deal runs through 2031, already.

Texas gets to double dip on revenue. LHN plus Big 12 revenue. Not sure what Oklahoma is gaining from the big 12.

OU has its own side deals. And some type of special treatment with the Tier 3 games, too, but I forget the details. Not as huge as Texas', but bigger than any other B12 team, iirc.

OU has made the playoff multiple times already. They have an easier path out of the Big12. You think they want to play an SEC schedule? Goodbye playoffs. They won’t leave. Neither will Texas. So the B12 isn’t expanding.

Let’s make the AAC great and get better access to the playoff and NY6 in the future. P6 campaign has set us up for that.

People who say Texas wont leave the Big 12 I think underestimate all the people involved.

ESPN is losing money on the LHN and didnt get as much of the Big 10 deal as they wanted. If Texas wants to leave and go to teh B12 (which is MUCH more aligned academically than with the Big 12 since they are AAU) then ESPN would gladly let them out of their LHN in order to get a bigger slice of the Big 12 deal. Its not like the LHN investment cant be used to produce part of the BTN and now ESPN would be making a profit.

Second, the projections for a Big 10 with Texas and OU is insane. Some are reporting over $60 million a year, which is well above where they are now.

Third, you really think ESPN likes paying ISU, KSU, Baylor, Tech, WVU and all of them higher money just to keep it together. If they can move Texas over and get a piece of the Big 10, and then pay all of the leftover Big 12 less, its a win win win for them.

ESPN was very strategic to make the LHN longer than the B12 contract. They are playing advance level chess.

(07-24-2019 08:05 AM)mtmedlin Wrote:  People who say Texas wont leave the Big 12 I think underestimate all the people involved.

ESPN is losing money on the LHN and didnt get as much of the Big 10 deal as they wanted. If Texas wants to leave and go to teh B12 (which is MUCH more aligned academically than with the Big 12 since they are AAU) then ESPN would gladly let them out of their LHN in order to get a bigger slice of the Big 12 deal. Its not like the LHN investment cant be used to produce part of the BTN and now ESPN would be making a profit.

Second, the projections for a Big 10 with Texas and OU is insane. Some are reporting over $60 million a year, which is well above where they are now.

Third, you really think ESPN likes paying ISU, KSU, Baylor, Tech, WVU and all of them higher money just to keep it together. If they can move Texas over and get a piece of the Big 10, and then pay all of the leftover Big 12 less, its a win win win for them.

ESPN was very strategic to make the LHN longer than the B12 contract. They are playing advance level chess.

I hear what you’re saying. Money may be more but let’s face it- UT and OU aren’t exactly poor right now. They are flush with cash. Another 10-20 mm on a tv deal is great but playing a much tougher schedule and against teams thousands of miles further away (Texas v Indiana??) in the Big 10. I just don’t see it happening.

Texas and OU control the big12. They are the big dogs and always will be. Now you move to the Big10 and you’re not in control. The regional games go away. I just do not see them doing that. ESPN deal or not. Texas and OU will do what they want not what ESPn tells them to do.

(07-24-2019 08:17 AM)First Mate Wrote:  

(07-24-2019 08:05 AM)mtmedlin Wrote:  People who say Texas wont leave the Big 12 I think underestimate all the people involved.

ESPN is losing money on the LHN and didnt get as much of the Big 10 deal as they wanted. If Texas wants to leave and go to teh B12 (which is MUCH more aligned academically than with the Big 12 since they are AAU) then ESPN would gladly let them out of their LHN in order to get a bigger slice of the Big 12 deal. Its not like the LHN investment cant be used to produce part of the BTN and now ESPN would be making a profit.

Second, the projections for a Big 10 with Texas and OU is insane. Some are reporting over $60 million a year, which is well above where they are now.

Third, you really think ESPN likes paying ISU, KSU, Baylor, Tech, WVU and all of them higher money just to keep it together. If they can move Texas over and get a piece of the Big 10, and then pay all of the leftover Big 12 less, its a win win win for them.

ESPN was very strategic to make the LHN longer than the B12 contract. They are playing advance level chess.

I hear what you’re saying. Money may be more but let’s face it- UT and OU aren’t exactly poor right now. They are flush with cash. Another 10-20 mm on a tv deal is great but playing a much tougher schedule and against teams thousands of miles further away (Texas v Indiana??) in the Big 10. I just don’t see it happening.

Texas and OU control the big12. They are the big dogs and always will be. Now you move to the Big10 and you’re not in control. The regional games go away. I just do not see them doing that. ESPN deal or not. Texas and OU will do what they want not what ESPn tells them to do.

Agree with First Mate here that Texas will do what they want to do and they are happy being where they are at collecting $ and bossing the little 8 around. IMHO IF there is a change it will more likely be a blow up of the entire conference structure to incorporate an NFL model of divisions based on geography. How that shakes down and how many teams are involved I do not know, but my guess is it will be more than the 64 teams that the fans of schools in P5 conferences today believe it will be.

Has UConn given a drop dead for leaving or are they dragging their feet now still trying to negotiate leaving their FB in the AAC even though they have already received a flat NO. Their initial leave date was after this 2019-2020 season. Are they contemplating staying another year (2020-2021) to protect their FB from a disastrous 2020 independent scheduling season. It appears to be easier on independent scheduling starting in 2021 since most schools and conferences have full slate through 2020 for FB. Staying a year longer would also reduce their exit fee. Also, are there any new exit numbers based on any potential exit dates.