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Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
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RutgersGuy Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
Just so we are all clear, there will be no negotiations like some have suggested here. ESPN will tell them what they are willing to do and the AAC will do just that. If ESPN wants a certain team that team will be added, if ESPN wants 7 million back and make the AAC stay at 11 then they will do that. The AAC has no say over what will happen. ESPN holds all the cards.
07-09-2019 12:34 PM
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Attackcoog Online
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Post: #42
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 12:34 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  Just so we are all clear, there will be no negotiations like some have suggested here. ESPN will tell them what they are willing to do and the AAC will do just that. If ESPN wants a certain team that team will be added, if ESPN wants 7 million back and make the AAC stay at 11 then they will do that. The AAC has no say over what will happen. ESPN holds all the cards.

Nah. It’s not quite that bad. More like ESPN will explain their position and give the AAC several options ESPN finds acceptable. It’s not like ESPN is going to say add Liberty or else and the AAC will instantly add the school. It’s more nuanced than that.
07-09-2019 12:41 PM
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RutgersGuy Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 12:41 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 12:34 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  Just so we are all clear, there will be no negotiations like some have suggested here. ESPN will tell them what they are willing to do and the AAC will do just that. If ESPN wants a certain team that team will be added, if ESPN wants 7 million back and make the AAC stay at 11 then they will do that. The AAC has no say over what will happen. ESPN holds all the cards.

Nah. It’s not quite that bad. More like ESPN will explain their position and give the AAC several options ESPN finds acceptable. It’s not like ESPN is going to say add Liberty or else and the AAC will instantly add the school. It’s more nuanced than that.

Yes, but the point was that whatever gets decided will be what ESPN has decided is best for them. The AAC wont stay at 11 if ESPN doesn't want them to. Like those saying BYU, Army or stay at 11. Well thats not really an option. If ESPN wants them at 12 and those 2 don't want to join then the AAC will still go to 12.
07-09-2019 12:44 PM
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Post: #44
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
We don’t have to do anything,” Aresco said. “But I think we’re going to have a pretty good idea by media day in Newport.” (July 15-16)

They are not going to do anything, not going to add anyone. This statement is deeper than it appears, because it means they have discussed the matter with ESPN and both sides are comfortable with 11 and the likely adjustments to the payouts (I have always expected they would be revenue neutral on payouts per school; no advantage to having 12, no disadvantage to having 11).
07-09-2019 12:53 PM
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b0ndsj0ns Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 11:01 AM)Wedge Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 09:20 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 09:10 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 08:53 AM)NBPirate Wrote:  The AAC doesn't need a rust belt school

It’s not what you want. It’s what ESPN wants. The AAC will add what ESPN tells them to add. Just ask the ACC.

They will, but does ESPN want to go from paying for every bit of Buffalo's content at the MAC price to paying the AAC price for it? Buffalo probably makes as much if not the most sense of any likely yes candidates, except for the fact that ESPN already owns 100% of their content for very little. What does ESPN gain by changing the patches on their jersey and paying multiple millions more a year to do it? Everyone keeps taking the statement of "there's a very short list of teams the AAC will add" as saying that's fully the AAC's decision. What I suspect is the actual truth is there's a very short list of teams that ESPN feel is worth the AAC adding.

Conferences have made moves like this in the past, and ESPN has approved despite the monetary point you mentioned.

Not saying that Buffalo is "the one", but you could have just as easily said the following a few years ago:

"They will, but does ESPN want to go from paying for every bit of Buffalo's Louisville's content at the MAC AAC price to paying the AAC ACC price for it? Buffalo Louisville probably makes as much if not the most sense of any likely yes candidates, except for the fact that ESPN already owns 100% of their content for very little. What does ESPN gain by changing the patches on their jersey and paying multiple millions more a year to do it?"

That is true, but that one also provided them the benefit of crippling a league who's TV deal was expiring and was hoping to get a brand new deal on the open market. Taking Louisville (along with the rest of the Big East defections to the ACC) did make them have to pay more for Louisville, but they also valued Louisville very highly and allowed them to be able to pay the remainder of the Big East/new AAC essentially nothing. So I'd say financially paying Louisville $25 million a year (or whatever the exact number was just guessing) but getting the entire AAC for like $25 million a year was probably on the whole a financial savings for them as well as prevented them from potentially losing content they valued to another network. They own the MAC and the AAC for I believe all of the 2020's (or at least close I don't know the exact end date of the MAC's deal). The content isn't going anywhere unlike the Big East/American that wanted to shop on the open market. What would be a comparable situation to moving Louisville to the ACC would be if ESPN facilitated a move of a MWC team to the AAC. The MWC deal is expiring and there's some grumblings they want to leave ESPN. If they wanted to make it worth it to the AAC to take whatever properties they value from the MWC that would follow the playbook perfectly. The Buffalo to the AAC situation is much more like the everyone whoring themselves to the B12 a while back. ESPN could have made it worth it to the B12 to add teams, but they owned all the properties that would say yes for pennies on the dollar and instead just figured out a way to get the B12 to stay where they were.
07-09-2019 12:59 PM
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b0ndsj0ns Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 12:44 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 12:41 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 12:34 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  Just so we are all clear, there will be no negotiations like some have suggested here. ESPN will tell them what they are willing to do and the AAC will do just that. If ESPN wants a certain team that team will be added, if ESPN wants 7 million back and make the AAC stay at 11 then they will do that. The AAC has no say over what will happen. ESPN holds all the cards.

Nah. It’s not quite that bad. More like ESPN will explain their position and give the AAC several options ESPN finds acceptable. It’s not like ESPN is going to say add Liberty or else and the AAC will instantly add the school. It’s more nuanced than that.

Yes, but the point was that whatever gets decided will be what ESPN has decided is best for them. The AAC wont stay at 11 if ESPN doesn't want them to. Like those saying BYU, Army or stay at 11. Well thats not really an option. If ESPN wants them at 12 and those 2 don't want to join then the AAC will still go to 12.

We are really just getting into semantics here. ESPN can not force the AAC to add a team that makes the league less valuable, just the same as the AAC can not force ESPN to pay them the exact same for adding a team they don't value. The only thing anyone reasonable on the subject is saying is that the only teams that ESPN is likely to value high enough to be worth adding probably won't say yes. Do you think ESPN wants to pay on average roughly 7 million dollars a year for insert MAC/Sun Belt/C-USA team or just pro rate the deal down for the loss of a member? I mean if I'm wrong and ESPN just wants a 12th bad enough to keep the deal they same if they add anyone then you'd be hearing an announcement very quickly.
(This post was last modified: 07-09-2019 01:08 PM by b0ndsj0ns.)
07-09-2019 01:08 PM
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Post: #47
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 12:20 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 11:38 AM)herdfan129 Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 11:35 AM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 08:49 AM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 08:30 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Hoping this happens. Assuming Marshall would decline, I'd love the MAC to go down to 11, play the Ohio teams annually instead of biannually, and make the league even more geographically tight-knit. Round robin in FB+BB please!

I've thought if Buffalo were to go the MAC could take another bite out of the Midwest somewhere like Illinois St.

Weaken "The Valley" even more.

MAC loses a team and they try to peel off WKU or Marshall. If that doesn't work, they go for a football only UConn, UMass or Liberty. They don't move into FBS and ISU can't afford it now or they would have already moved up.

Marshall will not join the MAC unless we got a waiver to not play mid week games at home. We are not going to kill our fan base for that.

CUSA doesn't have mid-week games? Really?

Nope. The MAC and Sun Belt own mid-week games.
07-09-2019 01:10 PM
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RutgersGuy Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 01:08 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 12:44 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 12:41 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 12:34 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  Just so we are all clear, there will be no negotiations like some have suggested here. ESPN will tell them what they are willing to do and the AAC will do just that. If ESPN wants a certain team that team will be added, if ESPN wants 7 million back and make the AAC stay at 11 then they will do that. The AAC has no say over what will happen. ESPN holds all the cards.

Nah. It’s not quite that bad. More like ESPN will explain their position and give the AAC several options ESPN finds acceptable. It’s not like ESPN is going to say add Liberty or else and the AAC will instantly add the school. It’s more nuanced than that.

Yes, but the point was that whatever gets decided will be what ESPN has decided is best for them. The AAC wont stay at 11 if ESPN doesn't want them to. Like those saying BYU, Army or stay at 11. Well thats not really an option. If ESPN wants them at 12 and those 2 don't want to join then the AAC will still go to 12.

We are really just getting into semantics here. ESPN can not force the AAC to add a team that makes the league less valuable, just the same as the AAC can not force ESPN to pay them the exact same for adding a team they don't value. The only thing anyone reasonable on the subject is saying is that the only teams that ESPN is likely to value high enough to be worth adding probably won't say yes. Do you think ESPN wants to pay on average roughly 7 million dollars a year for insert MAC/Sun Belt/C-USA team or just pro rate the deal down for the loss of a member? I mean if I'm wrong and ESPN just wants a 12th bad enough to keep the deal they same if they add anyone then you'd be hearing an announcement very quickly.

They can lower it to the point that everyone makes less money as well if AAC plays hardball. I've seen first hand what happens if you don't do what ESPN wants. Trust me you don't win. ESPN OWNS 100% of the AAC's TV contract where most of their money comes from. Now the old deal had a clause that the contract could be renegotiated if certain teams leave. If i'm not mistaken UConn was one of them. If they still kept that clause in place like I assume they would ESPN could say now that the Huskies are gone you're all only worth 6 million each a year or we are going to take away more nationally televised games because those were with UConn in mind. Thats on top of all the issues they will now have with only 11 members and no CCG which ESPN also paid for. The AAC could probably get a waiver to hold one for a year or two to get their membership straightened out but they wont be able to just sit at 11 forever and have a CCG unless the rules are changed and all attempts at changing those rules by P5 conferences like the ACC have failed.
(This post was last modified: 07-09-2019 01:44 PM by RutgersGuy.)
07-09-2019 01:39 PM
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Post: #49
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 12:21 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  You're right Niagara Falls is worth the trip every yr.
When Ralf Wilson died, I was stunned new owner did not move them

New owner's wife has local roots (From Rochester) and already owned the Sabres, so they were seen as the white knights saving the team.
07-09-2019 01:46 PM
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Post: #50
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 01:46 PM)whittx Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 12:21 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  You're right Niagara Falls is worth the trip every yr.
When Ralf Wilson died, I was stunned new owner did not move them

New owner's wife has local roots (From Rochester) and already owned the Sabres, so they were seen as the white knights saving the team.

They need to move the Bills to Toronto
07-09-2019 01:47 PM
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Wedge Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 12:59 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 11:01 AM)Wedge Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 09:20 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 09:10 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 08:53 AM)NBPirate Wrote:  The AAC doesn't need a rust belt school

It’s not what you want. It’s what ESPN wants. The AAC will add what ESPN tells them to add. Just ask the ACC.

They will, but does ESPN want to go from paying for every bit of Buffalo's content at the MAC price to paying the AAC price for it? Buffalo probably makes as much if not the most sense of any likely yes candidates, except for the fact that ESPN already owns 100% of their content for very little. What does ESPN gain by changing the patches on their jersey and paying multiple millions more a year to do it? Everyone keeps taking the statement of "there's a very short list of teams the AAC will add" as saying that's fully the AAC's decision. What I suspect is the actual truth is there's a very short list of teams that ESPN feel is worth the AAC adding.

Conferences have made moves like this in the past, and ESPN has approved despite the monetary point you mentioned.

Not saying that Buffalo is "the one", but you could have just as easily said the following a few years ago:

"They will, but does ESPN want to go from paying for every bit of Buffalo's Louisville's content at the MAC AAC price to paying the AAC ACC price for it? Buffalo Louisville probably makes as much if not the most sense of any likely yes candidates, except for the fact that ESPN already owns 100% of their content for very little. What does ESPN gain by changing the patches on their jersey and paying multiple millions more a year to do it?"

That is true, but that one also provided them the benefit of crippling a league who's TV deal was expiring and was hoping to get a brand new deal on the open market. Taking Louisville (along with the rest of the Big East defections to the ACC) did make them have to pay more for Louisville, but they also valued Louisville very highly and allowed them to be able to pay the remainder of the Big East/new AAC essentially nothing. So I'd say financially paying Louisville $25 million a year (or whatever the exact number was just guessing) but getting the entire AAC for like $25 million a year was probably on the whole a financial savings for them as well as prevented them from potentially losing content they valued to another network. They own the MAC and the AAC for I believe all of the 2020's (or at least close I don't know the exact end date of the MAC's deal). The content isn't going anywhere unlike the Big East/American that wanted to shop on the open market. What would be a comparable situation to moving Louisville to the ACC would be if ESPN facilitated a move of a MWC team to the AAC. The MWC deal is expiring and there's some grumblings they want to leave ESPN. If they wanted to make it worth it to the AAC to take whatever properties they value from the MWC that would follow the playbook perfectly. The Buffalo to the AAC situation is much more like the everyone whoring themselves to the B12 a while back. ESPN could have made it worth it to the B12 to add teams, but they owned all the properties that would say yes for pennies on the dollar and instead just figured out a way to get the B12 to stay where they were.

You think the ACC added Louisville because ESPN wanted to spite the AAC.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on that one.
07-09-2019 01:55 PM
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Chappy Online
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Post: #52
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
As a Miami Dolphins fan and a Carolina Hurricanes fan, hating on Buffalo is already in my blood, so it would be fun to have their fine university in the conference from that standpoint, but I just don't think the fan support is there.
07-09-2019 02:25 PM
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RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 02:25 PM)Chappy Wrote:  As a Miami Dolphins fan and a Carolina Hurricanes fan, hating on Buffalo is already in my blood, so it would be fun to have their fine university in the conference from that standpoint, but I just don't think the fan support is there.

Don't think Buffalo is on the AAC radar either. The new northern line will end in the Mid Atlantic States with Temple as the headquarters moves south to Texas in a southern majority based league. 07-coffee3
07-09-2019 02:41 PM
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templefootballfan Offline
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RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
Real estate prices & taxes is why the move to Texas
Has nothing to do with southern based conf
07-09-2019 02:52 PM
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RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 01:47 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 01:46 PM)whittx Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 12:21 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  You're right Niagara Falls is worth the trip every yr.
When Ralf Wilson died, I was stunned new owner did not move them

New owner's wife has local roots (From Rochester) and already owned the Sabres, so they were seen as the white knights saving the team.

They need to move the Bills to Toronto

Toronto won't build a stadium for them.
07-09-2019 03:12 PM
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Post: #56
RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 02:52 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  Real estate prices & taxes is why the move to Texas
Has nothing to do with southern based conf

Really? That's odd considering Aresco has pointed out the benefit of SMU being there and it being roughly the center point of the western division. The first because when even eastern teams come to play they can interact with the conference office and the second because it makes it easier for more conference officials to get to conference members.

That sounds a lot like location, location, location to me.
07-09-2019 03:17 PM
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RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 12:41 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 12:34 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  Just so we are all clear, there will be no negotiations like some have suggested here. ESPN will tell them what they are willing to do and the AAC will do just that. If ESPN wants a certain team that team will be added, if ESPN wants 7 million back and make the AAC stay at 11 then they will do that. The AAC has no say over what will happen. ESPN holds all the cards.

Nah. It’s not quite that bad. More like ESPN will explain their position and give the AAC several options ESPN finds acceptable. It’s not like ESPN is going to say add Liberty or else and the AAC will instantly add the school. It’s more nuanced than that.

More like they will both come up with lists and see what matches but neither side is trying to slap the other in the face here. It's a bit like a union corporation negotiation when some major unforeseen economic change occurs. Both have different views but will try and find a solution everyone can deal with, since its beneficial for both sides to feel good about the outcome and avoid major fights.
07-09-2019 03:20 PM
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RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 11:57 AM)zoocrew Wrote:  I still think it’s going to be a MWC team and we’re going to be told “tough nuts, you’re going to the East”.

Temple
Cincinnati
Navy
ECU
USF
UCF

is what literally every team in the East division wants to happen.

That's not happening especially if its BYU or an MWC team, particularly Air Force. Everyone knows the deal, Navy wants with the private schools because of similar restrictions and as varied a location as possible for games to maintain a national profile. Adding AFA means the benefit of eliminating an OOC game for each program so they can add a game vs someone else, which would be a huge benefit to the AAC profile.

Taking the conference to 14 fb and staying at eleven for the rest is an overlooked possibility on the boards.

Taking two/three MW teams who move to the WAC for olympics would eliminate much of the objection for front range schools since they would be going with a rival not just for football but to an all sports set up in the WAC as well. Travel would be roughly the same for Olympic sports and just a small increase in football. Media money would be much better. WAC is competitive with the mwc in most sports rankings, depending on who they take they could arguably move in front for some sports.
07-09-2019 03:29 PM
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CougarRed Offline
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RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 09:19 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  That’s not who I’d expect, but they do fit the academic profile—-which is more important to the decision makers than many fans think.

Did Boise fit the academic profile? Did Wichita St? Did Memphis? We invited them...

If a school has a strong brand or fan base in a certain sport, academic profile seems to be a secondary consideration. See also Louisville to the ACC, West Virginia to the Big 12.
07-09-2019 04:13 PM
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RE: Aresco discusses Buffalo to the AAC
(07-09-2019 04:13 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  
(07-09-2019 09:19 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  That’s not who I’d expect, but they do fit the academic profile—-which is more important to the decision makers than many fans think.

Did Boise fit the academic profile? Did Wichita St? Did Memphis? We invited them...

If a school has a strong brand or fan base in a certain sport, academic profile seems to be a secondary consideration. See also Louisville to the ACC, West Virginia to the Big 12.

SMU? Tulsa? Tulane? Clearly massive brands with huge fan bases. I never said that money, brand, or performance cant overcome academics. I said academics are far more important than most fans think to the decision makers. In fact, academics alone can even outweigh the other brand/athletic performance/value characteristics.

Here is the thing----among schools that would have an interest in the AAC---where is the school with such a massive brand, athletic success, and obvious TV value that would push the presidents to completely dismiss academics as a factor? I dont really see a Boise or Louisville type option for the AAC. The only posisble addition that obviously works on all levels (brand, athletic performance, TV value, and academics) is VCU. 04-cheers
(This post was last modified: 07-09-2019 04:38 PM by Attackcoog.)
07-09-2019 04:30 PM
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