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Revival of Memphis Football
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bbqtiger Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-02-2019 10:13 AM)TripleA Wrote:  
(07-02-2019 09:28 AM)cmt Wrote:  
(07-01-2019 08:36 PM)EarthBoundMisfit Wrote:  
(07-01-2019 12:48 PM)cmt Wrote:  Before West we did have some good seasons under Stobart and Bailey and even before them, but all in all, we were one of the very worst football programs in the history of the sport. Memphis, Rice and Temple were all three considered awful over the decades, losses, lack of bowl appearances, etc. I remember being ranked in the bottom ten football programs over time more than once.

These days, that seems to be behind us with several new teams in "D1" and the fact that we've been good for more a decade. I'm just glad those days are over and when the next round of expansion happens, I now feel like we are one of the very first to be added.

don't forget Baylor and Kansas State, and Northwestern.
Until Art Briles, and Bill Snyder....those two schools were perennial losers....as was Northwestern.

We were rarely the worst team, but we had never been great, ever, the Burley Bowl (1956) and Pasadena Bowl (1971) were our only claims to fame. We won the MVC in 1968, 69 and 71. The problem was almost every other team had won something at some point.

Baylor has been to 24 bowl games, way back tho the Orange bowl in 1951, Gator in 1956 and 1960, Sugar in 1956, Cotton in 1974 and 80, etc, etc, etc.

Kansas State didn't do anything until the 1990's

Northwestern won the Rose bowl in 1948 and lost there in 1995 and had a few other brief moments of glory.

Even Tulane had been to the Sugar and Rose Bowls in the 1930's and the Liberty Bowl in 1970 and 79 and had the 12-0 season with a Liberty Bowl win in 1998.

We hadn't accomplished very much and are still looking for an AAC championship game victory.

We had never been great, ever? We were for 4 years, at least, from 1960-63. We went 8-2, 8-2, 8-1 and 9-0-1.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/schools/memphis/

In 1960, we had the 12th best record (8-2) out of 113 football schools. We were 2nd nationally in points per game (30.3), and 22nd in points allowed (8.5). Our only losses were to Ole Miss, who was great that year, and Miss State.

In 1961, our record (8-2) was 10th best out of 111. We were 3rd in the country in points scored per game (33.2), and 8th in defensive points allowed (7.5)

In 1962, our record (8-1) was 5th best out of 120 teams. We were 3rd in the country in scoring offense, and 10th in scoring defense.

In 1963, we had our best team ever (9-0-1). Second best record out of 120 teams. 27th in scoring offense, 2nd in scoring defense. Harry Schuh was a first team All American, and went on to play in the NFL for several years before injuries got him. IIRC, we had another All-American, and a couple others went on to the NFL.

And the capper, we finished 14th in the national poll that year. Our only blemish was a scoreless tie with Ole Miss, a game we should have won (I was there). Ole Miss was ranked #2 in the country at the time, and finished 3rd in the poll that year, IIRC.

We also beat Miss State, who was 7-2-2 that year, a team that beat Tennessee, Auburn and LSU, and tied Ole Miss and Florida.

Our only drawbacks were not being in a conference, thus not getting a bowl game each year (you had to be in a conference to make one, and there weren't many bowl games), and not having a great strength of schedule. But back then, there weren't that many great teams we could schedule.

At any rate, it's just not true that we were never great in football. It just happened so long ago that only really old Tiger fans remember it.

AAA, you and I are from the same era - I was born in 1950, and I started going to Crump Stadium in 1961. I was at the tie with Ole Miss, selling Cokes to my older brother's fraternity brothers (mainly). Very lucrative.

I appreciate all of past insight into Tiger Athletics.
(This post was last modified: 07-03-2019 01:16 PM by bbqtiger.)
07-03-2019 01:14 PM
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southpaw1 Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-03-2019 01:10 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  
(07-03-2019 12:43 PM)3601 Wrote:  
(07-03-2019 10:29 AM)slktigers Wrote:  
(07-02-2019 10:13 AM)TripleA Wrote:  
(07-02-2019 09:28 AM)cmt Wrote:  We were rarely the worst team, but we had never been great, ever, the Burley Bowl (1956) and Pasadena Bowl (1971) were our only claims to fame. We won the MVC in 1968, 69 and 71. The problem was almost every other team had won something at some point.

Baylor has been to 24 bowl games, way back tho the Orange bowl in 1951, Gator in 1956 and 1960, Sugar in 1956, Cotton in 1974 and 80, etc, etc, etc.

Kansas State didn't do anything until the 1990's

Northwestern won the Rose bowl in 1948 and lost there in 1995 and had a few other brief moments of glory.

Even Tulane had been to the Sugar and Rose Bowls in the 1930's and the Liberty Bowl in 1970 and 79 and had the 12-0 season with a Liberty Bowl win in 1998.

We hadn't accomplished very much and are still looking for an AAC championship game victory.

We had never been great, ever? We were for 4 years, at least, from 1960-63. We went 8-2, 8-2, 8-1 and 9-0-1.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/schools/memphis/

In 1960, we had the 12th best record (8-2) out of 113 football schools. We were 2nd nationally in points per game (30.3), and 22nd in points allowed (8.5). Our only losses were to Ole Miss, who was great that year, and Miss State.

In 1961, our record (8-2) was 10th best out of 111. We were 3rd in the country in points scored per game (33.2), and 8th in defensive points allowed (7.5)

In 1962, our record (8-1) was 5th best out of 120 teams. We were 3rd in the country in scoring offense, and 10th in scoring defense.

In 1963, we had our best team ever (9-0-1). Second best record out of 120 teams. 27th in scoring offense, 2nd in scoring defense. Harry Schuh was a first team All American, and went on to play in the NFL for several years before injuries got him. IIRC, we had another All-American, and a couple others went on to the NFL.

And the capper, we finished 14th in the national poll that year. Our only blemish was a scoreless tie with Ole Miss, a game we should have won (I was there). Ole Miss was ranked #2 in the country at the time, and finished 3rd in the poll that year, IIRC.

We also beat Miss State, who was 7-2-2 that year, a team that beat Tennessee, Auburn and LSU, and tied Ole Miss and Florida.

Our only drawbacks were not being in a conference, thus not getting a bowl game each year (you had to be in a conference to make one, and there weren't many bowl games), and not having a great strength of schedule. But back then, there weren't that many great teams we could schedule.

At any rate, it's just not true that we were never great in football. It just happened so long ago that only really old Tiger fans remember it.

What is the actual story about why Memphis was an Independent during those year?

There were tons of independents until SC joined the SEC and FSU joined the ACC. It is not accurate that you had to be in a conference to get a bowl bid. That just isn't true at all.

Right. It's just that weren't but 8 or 10 bowls back then.

When going to a bowl game actually meant something?
07-03-2019 02:37 PM
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3601 Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
9 bowls in 1960
11 bowls in 1970
15 in 1980
19 in 1990
25 in 2000
35 in 2010
07-03-2019 03:28 PM
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tigernole79 Online
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Post: #64
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-02-2019 06:00 PM)memphisike Wrote:  Tommy West took Ripp's recruits and won with them, Ripp recruited a tough OOC schedule, Tommy played
Cupcakes.
I best remember him for sitting DeAngelo against utk and costing us the game

First, you are wrong... shockingly. While Rip played 2, sometimes 3 P5 teams a year, he didn't beat but two teams with a winning record for his final 5 years at Memphis. Coach West played 2 P5s almost every season he coached. The OOC schedule wasn't that dramatically different.
While you are partially correct on the recruits, in 2007 we still won 7 games without a single Rip recruit. Played a weaker schedule because of the teams that left C-USA, but still only lost to ole miss by 2. He still took us to bowl games in 2007 and 2008. Both would've been the first in three decades without a single Rip recruit.

The sitting DeAngelo thing, that's not completely true. From every player I talked with, DeAngelo didn't feel 100% and wasn't wanting to play, still felt tight in warmups. Coach West didn't just bench him.
07-03-2019 03:43 PM
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aardWolf Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-03-2019 03:28 PM)3601 Wrote:  9 bowls in 1960
11 bowls in 1970
15 in 1980
19 in 1990
25 in 2000
35 in 2010

And now it's like: "Oh, you only won 5 games this year? It's OK, your players did good in school so you get a bowl game too!"
07-03-2019 03:45 PM
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AlonsoWDC Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
No one is forcing you to watch bowl games you don't want to watch.

HCs get fired all the time for making bowls but never getting past being a 7-5, 6-6 team.
07-03-2019 03:48 PM
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TIGERBUDDY Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-01-2019 12:33 PM)holyterror Wrote:  
(07-01-2019 09:55 AM)gusrob Wrote:  
(07-01-2019 09:38 AM)uskjtc02 Wrote:  
(07-01-2019 07:53 AM)gulfcoastgal Wrote:  

Thanks Tommy West!!!

It can't be stated enough. Those were tough times for MEMPHIS football fans!

“Man, we were so bad, if we won one game we had to call it a streak.”
02-13-banana We beat Peyton and Eli Manning.
07-05-2019 07:35 AM
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Tiger87 Offline
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Post: #68
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
I mean, we've been bad. No need to try to tilt it any other way. Sure if you add the current 5-year streak to the stats, our recent history doesn't look so bad. That's the "revival" part of the story. Prior to Fuerte, our last coach with a career winning record was Pancoast in the early 70's. Only 7 of our 24 HC's had a winning record (and that count's Norvell). Prior to Fuerte, our record since 1980 is 130-218-6. That's an average record of 4-7. Probably not the worst, but certainly not good.

Now I personally had high hopes for Rex and also for Charlie Bailey during this era, they just didn't get enough time. Otherwise, most of those coaches were mediocre-bad.

I think "revival" is a pretty good description.
07-05-2019 03:50 PM
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memphisike Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
Although I never saw him play, we had a Dude named John Bramlett who played in the early sixties
And I've been told he may have been the BADDEST Tiger ever.
The Dude played 10 yrs in the AFL, was runner up to Joey Namath for rookie of yr.
He played for the Spook and the Spook was a tough coach
07-05-2019 04:48 PM
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Post: #70
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
Looking back, Spook was a great coach for our Tigers. Especially considering he took Tiger FB to a whole new level (don't recall what the labels were in the early 60s). He got our first wins against the SEC, held winning records against South Carolina, Louisville, Cincy, VT, & FSU & others. Played a defense first style & tough running game but it led to a lot of nice wins in that era.
07-06-2019 07:29 AM
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memphisike Offline
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Post: #71
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
Spook definitely liked to run
He had a q.b. who Lombardi drafted and a a receiver who played 3 yrs for San Francisco, but
He didn't throw much, three yds and a cloud of dust, but he had some tough players on his teams
07-06-2019 11:22 AM
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AlonsoWDC Offline
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Post: #72
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
But what does any of this have to do with our future football OOC scheduling?
07-06-2019 11:52 AM
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Post: #73
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-02-2019 06:00 PM)memphisike Wrote:  Tommy West took Ripp's recruits and won with them, Ripp recruited a tough OOC schedule, Tommy played
Cupcakes.
I best remember him for sitting DeAngelo against utk and costing us the game

Tommy's Tigers played teams like Ole Miss, Miss State, Tennessee, Louisville (after they left for the BE) Arky State, and MTSU...not exactly cupcakes
07-06-2019 12:31 PM
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shirley temple Offline
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Post: #74
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
I played in the late 80s and except for the porter years ( almost the worst team in the country) we were never bad. Not always good ; but never non competitive. Tired of hearing that stuff.
07-06-2019 01:47 PM
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geosnooker2000 Offline
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Post: #75
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-06-2019 12:31 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  
(07-02-2019 06:00 PM)memphisike Wrote:  Tommy West took Ripp's recruits and won with them, Ripp recruited a tough OOC schedule, Tommy played
Cupcakes.
I best remember him for sitting DeAngelo against utk and costing us the game

Tommy's Tigers played teams like Ole Miss, Miss State, Tennessee, Louisville (after they left for the BE) Arky State, and MTSU...not exactly cupcakes

The one complaint I had against Tommy was he never came through with a h&h with Clemson. He may have tried, but he never got it done.
07-06-2019 03:00 PM
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tigernole79 Online
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Post: #76
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-06-2019 03:00 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  
(07-06-2019 12:31 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  
(07-02-2019 06:00 PM)memphisike Wrote:  Tommy West took Ripp's recruits and won with them, Ripp recruited a tough OOC schedule, Tommy played
Cupcakes.
I best remember him for sitting DeAngelo against utk and costing us the game

Tommy's Tigers played teams like Ole Miss, Miss State, Tennessee, Louisville (after they left for the BE) Arky State, and MTSU...not exactly cupcakes

The one complaint I had against Tommy was he never came through with a h&h with Clemson. He may have tried, but he never got it done.

Pretty sure that would be like Tubby coming through with a game against Memphis in basketball.
He didn't leave Clemson on good terms and why would they care to play Memphis?
07-06-2019 04:54 PM
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Post: #77
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-06-2019 03:00 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  
(07-06-2019 12:31 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  
(07-02-2019 06:00 PM)memphisike Wrote:  Tommy West took Ripp's recruits and won with them, Ripp recruited a tough OOC schedule, Tommy played
Cupcakes.
I best remember him for sitting DeAngelo against utk and costing us the game

Tommy's Tigers played teams like Ole Miss, Miss State, Tennessee, Louisville (after they left for the BE) Arky State, and MTSU...not exactly cupcakes

The one complaint I had against Tommy was he never came through with a h&h with Clemson. He may have tried, but he never got it done.

West loved to play cupcakes OOC - my complaint.
07-06-2019 07:03 PM
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dan o Offline
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Post: #78
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-06-2019 07:03 PM)Atlanta Wrote:  
(07-06-2019 03:00 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  
(07-06-2019 12:31 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  
(07-02-2019 06:00 PM)memphisike Wrote:  Tommy West took Ripp's recruits and won with them, Ripp recruited a tough OOC schedule, Tommy played
Cupcakes.
I best remember him for sitting DeAngelo against utk and costing us the game

Tommy's Tigers played teams like Ole Miss, Miss State, Tennessee, Louisville (after they left for the BE) Arky State, and MTSU...not exactly cupcakes

The one complaint I had against Tommy was he never came through with a h&h with Clemson. He may have tried, but he never got it done.

West loved to play cupcakes OOC - my complaint.

Nothing has changed in that regard
07-06-2019 07:35 PM
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geosnooker2000 Offline
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Post: #79
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-06-2019 04:54 PM)tigernole79 Wrote:  
(07-06-2019 03:00 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  
(07-06-2019 12:31 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  
(07-02-2019 06:00 PM)memphisike Wrote:  Tommy West took Ripp's recruits and won with them, Ripp recruited a tough OOC schedule, Tommy played
Cupcakes.
I best remember him for sitting DeAngelo against utk and costing us the game

Tommy's Tigers played teams like Ole Miss, Miss State, Tennessee, Louisville (after they left for the BE) Arky State, and MTSU...not exactly cupcakes

The one complaint I had against Tommy was he never came through with a h&h with Clemson. He may have tried, but he never got it done.

Pretty sure that would be like Tubby coming through with a game against Memphis in basketball.
He didn't leave Clemson on good terms and why would they care to play Memphis?

Oh, I thought he did. I mean, not like he got fired for anything but poor performance. Right?
07-07-2019 01:30 AM
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Post: #80
RE: Revival of Memphis Football
(07-03-2019 03:43 PM)tigernole79 Wrote:  
(07-02-2019 06:00 PM)memphisike Wrote:  Tommy West took Ripp's recruits and won with them, Ripp recruited a tough OOC schedule, Tommy played
Cupcakes.
I best remember him for sitting DeAngelo against utk and costing us the game

First, you are wrong... shockingly. While Rip played 2, sometimes 3 P5 teams a year, he didn't beat but two teams with a winning record for his final 5 years at Memphis. Coach West played 2 P5s almost every season he coached. The OOC schedule wasn't that dramatically different.
While you are partially correct on the recruits, in 2007 we still won 7 games without a single Rip recruit. Played a weaker schedule because of the teams that left C-USA, but still only lost to ole miss by 2. He still took us to bowl games in 2007 and 2008. Both would've been the first in three decades without a single Rip recruit.

The sitting DeAngelo thing, that's not completely true. From every player I talked with, DeAngelo didn't feel 100% and wasn't wanting to play, still felt tight in warmups. Coach West didn't just bench him.

West's demeanor was kinda disgusted.
Williams could have played...he was nicked up...and he asked if he could come off the bench.
De was worried about getting hurt...NFL stock...etc. UT's defense was still pretty stout.
West sat him out that game.
07-07-2019 02:02 AM
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