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For the time being, these programs are our conference mates. With the bottom feeder UConn out after this season, we have one less carp in the pond. Do you see any of the four - Tulane, Tulsa, SMU, ECU - improving to get consistently better? If one of these programs could get its house in order [in the absence of a strong 12th member] that would do wonders for the strength of our conference overall. When these teams were added I honestly thought SMU and ECU would've performed better than they have. I do believe the hiring of Scottie Montgomery may have been a program killing hire worse than Granpappy Snubbs. Here are the last 5 seasons for each program:

Tulane [22 Wins]
2018 7-6 [Won Cure Bowl]
2017 5-7
2016 4-8
2015 3-9
2014 3-9

Tulsa [23 Wins]
2018 3-9
2017 2-10
2016 10-3 [Won Miami Beach Bowl]
2015 6-7 [Lost Independence Bowl]
2014 2-10

SMU [20 Wins]
2018 5-7
2017 7-6 [Lost Frisco Bowl]
2016 5-7
2015 2-10
2014 1-11

ECU [22 Wins]
2018 3-9
2017 3-9
2016 3-9
2015 5-7
2014 8-5 [Lost Birmingham Bowl]

I like ECU’s new hire. They probably have the best shot at getting back to where they compete for conference title. The other three are private schools with no fans. Tulsa has been better in recent years, SMU has been underwhelming, Tulane can’t sustain success. Any one of those three can have a good season but are no where close to the top five programs in terms fans and commitment to football.

ECU has fan support. That’s more than the rest. I dislike their posters, but I think their football has a chance.

All 4 have been horrible at football since they joined the league aside from Tulsa's one 10-win season. ECU has the fan base and SMU has the market. New Orleans is a fun place to visit. Tulsa has... ???

(06-30-2019 10:50 PM)robertfoshizzle Wrote:  All 4 have been horrible at football since they joined the league aside from Tulsa's one 10-win season. ECU has the fan base and SMU has the market. New Orleans is a fun place to visit. Tulsa has... ???

Tulsa has won 10 games five times since 2007. Four times before joining the American. On the field they looked a solid addition but have struggled in the American.

I believe their coaching hires, the rise of Memphis, and increases competition hurts.

Schools like Houston, Memphis, Cincinnati, UCF, USF, Navy and Temple have received the best TV exposure which I believe also has hurt the leagues three private schools.

Tulane will not be at or near the bottom the next few years. This fall they return most of the talent from a 7-6 team. Willie Fritz is an excellent coach and they have recruited pretty well the past few classes.

SMU will also be decent going forward. As mentioned they are in the right market. Not only have they recruited well the past two classes, the school appears to be a magnet for Texas and Texas A&M transfers.

Tulsa will continue to be at the bottom IMHO. The school announced recently that they will not be using any of the additional money from the new media deal for athletics, it will go towards the academic side. The school has some money issues, as enrollment has dropped.

Tulane has been improving. They have invested some in the infrastructure of of the football program when they built their stadium, and Fritz has them improving each of his first 3 seasons. I am not sure if Tulane can ever be a player in the AAC championship picture, but if they can manage to win 8-9 games a year and go to a bowl they will be a boon to the conference.

Being a small private school hurts them, but there is enough talent in the south they should be able to be competitive with the right coaches.

ECU has great support and they showed flashes of being a great team over the past 20 years, but have never really put it all together. Even when they were making noise with Skip Holtz they were only a 9 win team, and never had an "elite" G5/non BCS season.

Tulsa was actually the more impressive team in C-USA than ECU. They had quite a few 10 win seasons and feel like they can find that success again. It may take awhile, and I don't think their current staff can do it.

SMU is a program who I don't think will ever recover from the death penalty.

(07-01-2019 06:39 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Tulane will not be at or near the bottom the next few years. This fall they return most of the talent from a 7-6 team. Willie Fritz is an excellent coach and they have recruited pretty well the past few classes.

SMU will also be decent going forward. As mentioned they are in the right market. Not only have they recruited well the past two classes, the school appears to be a magnet for Texas and Texas A&M transfers.

Tulsa will continue to be at the bottom IMHO. The school announced recently that they will not be using any of the additional money from the new media deal for athletics, it will go towards the academic side. The school has some money issues, as enrollment has dropped.

Tulsa is my view was picked based on performance but is a really bad fit for the conference.

The issue with most of those programs is that any Head Coach/Staff that reels off a 9-10 win season will probably end up taking the first P5 gig they can get. ECU's program history is up and down all over the place. They are surrounded by Duke, UNC, NC State, Wake, VTech, etc. Tulane and SMU are in good recruiting areas.

(07-01-2019 08:00 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  The issue with most of those programs is that any Head Coach/Staff that reels off a 9-10 win season will probably end up taking the first P5 gig they can get. ECU's program history is up and down all over the place. They are surrounded by Duke, UNC, NC State, Wake, VTech, etc. Tulane and SMU are in good recruiting areas.

True, and if it is not the HC it is the assistant coaches, which disrupts recruiting. Remember Al Washington? UC was paying him around ~$200K/year and he moved over to Michigan to be the RB's coach making $750K/year. Due to the revenue gap even the bottom P5 schools can afford to pay their guys more.

(07-01-2019 08:07 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(07-01-2019 08:00 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  The issue with most of those programs is that any Head Coach/Staff that reels off a 9-10 win season will probably end up taking the first P5 gig they can get. ECU's program history is up and down all over the place. They are surrounded by Duke, UNC, NC State, Wake, VTech, etc. Tulane and SMU are in good recruiting areas.

True, and if it is not the HC it is the assistant coaches, which disrupts recruiting. Remember Al Washington? UC was paying him around ~$200K/year and he moved over to Michigan to be the RB's coach making $750K/year. Due to the revenue gap even the bottom P5 schools can afford to pay their guys more.

Good point. A bigger difference with UC, Houston, UCF, USF, Memphis etc is look where their former HCs ended up. Texas, Nebraska, Oregon/FSU, VTech, of course in our case ND, MSU, UT.

(07-01-2019 08:07 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(07-01-2019 08:00 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  The issue with most of those programs is that any Head Coach/Staff that reels off a 9-10 win season will probably end up taking the first P5 gig they can get. ECU's program history is up and down all over the place. They are surrounded by Duke, UNC, NC State, Wake, VTech, etc. Tulane and SMU are in good recruiting areas.

True, and if it is not the HC it is the assistant coaches, which disrupts recruiting. Remember Al Washington? UC was paying him around ~$200K/year and he moved over to Michigan to be the RB's coaches making $750K/year. Due to the revenue gap even the bottom P5 schools can afford to pay their guys more.

Probably just a typo but he was LB coach at Michigan. He is now DL coach at OSU after 1 year at UM.

In terms of facilities, financial support, and a strong fan base, ECU has the upper hand of the four mentioned. They just haven't been able to translate this to on field results. That said, they should be better than averaging 3 wins/season. Skip Holtz got them on a good run in CUSA and that spilled over to Ruff McNeill for a bit. I believe they still have a strong upside. Let's see what their new coach Mike Houston can do. He won a FCS Championship at James Madison and finished 37-6 overall in three seasons there.

I do like what Coach Fritz is building at Tulane but prior to him they've been dog doo. The jury is still out...

Tulane and SMU are in fertile recruiting areas. No reason they can't be all right as long as they make good coaching hires (which is pretty much true of every team.) ECU is more of a challenge but their loyal fanbase should allow them to also have the resources for success, again with good coaching hires. Tulsa is the biggest challenge imo. Geography works against them both in terms of the rest of the conference and in recruiting. They can win too but they'll really need to find the right coach for them. It might mean finding a guy plugged into the juco scene along with taking some risks on misfit recruits (e.g. coming back from injury or academic or legal or personal issues.)

(07-01-2019 09:52 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  Tulane and SMU are in fertile recruiting areas. No reason they can't be all right as long as they make good coaching hires (which is pretty much true of every team.) ECU is more of a challenge but their loyal fanbase should allow them to also have the resources for success, again with good coaching hires. Tulsa is the biggest challenge imo. Geography works against them both in terms of the rest of the conference and in recruiting. They can win too but they'll really need to find the right coach for them. It might mean finding a guy plugged into the juco scene along with taking some risks on misfit recruits (e.g. coming back from injury or academic or legal or personal issues.)

Tulsa is the enigma of the bunch. They went on quite a run from 2003 to 2012 finishing under .500 only twice and winning 9 or more games 5 times. That run included two 10 win seasons and two 11 win seasons. They also went to 8 bowls winning 5 of them. Like ECU, they haven't translated the success to the American. They do seem to be on an island both institutionally as well as geographically from the rest of the conference. I guess every league has to have a few bottom feeders so it may as well be them.

The ONLY thing Tulsa has that is a plus is academics and they do have an endowment that is over 1B.

All Tulsa is good for is getting mentioned in country songs.