(06-29-2019 03:39 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 08:22 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 01:11 AM)esayem Wrote:  I think location matters quite a bit here. Yes, being on an island is not ideal (UConn just left and they were an island), but the candidate shouldn’t encroach on a member program and cause a bit too much competition. Unless, that team doesn’t recruit the same type of student athlete. For instance, having North Texas or UTSA would be more detrimental to Houston than Rice.

UAB, Southern Miss, and Rice stand out to me mainly due to their central location and history with current members. Rice has unlimited potential if they agree to spend a certain amount on their major sports. The football coach already makes a mil/year. They have three legit trophy games within the conference, plus Navy and Tulane would support them.

ODU and Marshall are interesting, but I wonder how ECU feels about ODU and Cincinnati about Marshall.

Although Marshall wins a lot it seems, small town small airport.
Virginia Beach, Newport, Hampton that is a metro area of 1.7 Million. And is a gold mine for football recruiting. Everyone around there has players from there on their team, UVA, UNC, ECU, NC State, VTech etc., everyone recruits there. ODU would have to get better, more consistent within the program. Lots of upside.

I think the AAC stays at 11, if they get the waiver or whatever is required to play a CCG.

Right. Cincinnati has never shared a conference with Marshall, as far as I know. I just don’t see that happening. I would place ODU over Marshall.

On another note, there is a giant naval base in Norfolk. I imagine Navy games would be standing room only.

Excellent points.

(06-29-2019 03:50 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 03:39 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 08:22 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 01:11 AM)esayem Wrote:  I think location matters quite a bit here. Yes, being on an island is not ideal (UConn just left and they were an island), but the candidate shouldn’t encroach on a member program and cause a bit too much competition. Unless, that team doesn’t recruit the same type of student athlete. For instance, having North Texas or UTSA would be more detrimental to Houston than Rice.

UAB, Southern Miss, and Rice stand out to me mainly due to their central location and history with current members. Rice has unlimited potential if they agree to spend a certain amount on their major sports. The football coach already makes a mil/year. They have three legit trophy games within the conference, plus Navy and Tulane would support them.

ODU and Marshall are interesting, but I wonder how ECU feels about ODU and Cincinnati about Marshall.

Although Marshall wins a lot it seems, small town small airport.
Virginia Beach, Newport, Hampton that is a metro area of 1.7 Million. And is a gold mine for football recruiting. Everyone around there has players from there on their team, UVA, UNC, ECU, NC State, VTech etc., everyone recruits there. ODU would have to get better, more consistent within the program. Lots of upside.

I think the AAC stays at 11, if they get the waiver or whatever is required to play a CCG.

Right. Cincinnati has never shared a conference with Marshall, as far as I know. I just don’t see that happening. I would place ODU over Marshall.

On another note, there is a giant naval base in Norfolk. I imagine Navy games would be standing room only.

Excellent points.

ODU v Navy would be our biggest home game in any season IMO. Somehow that needs to happen soon.

(06-29-2019 03:57 PM)odusteeler Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 03:50 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 03:39 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 08:22 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 01:11 AM)esayem Wrote:  I think location matters quite a bit here. Yes, being on an island is not ideal (UConn just left and they were an island), but the candidate shouldn’t encroach on a member program and cause a bit too much competition. Unless, that team doesn’t recruit the same type of student athlete. For instance, having North Texas or UTSA would be more detrimental to Houston than Rice.

UAB, Southern Miss, and Rice stand out to me mainly due to their central location and history with current members. Rice has unlimited potential if they agree to spend a certain amount on their major sports. The football coach already makes a mil/year. They have three legit trophy games within the conference, plus Navy and Tulane would support them.

ODU and Marshall are interesting, but I wonder how ECU feels about ODU and Cincinnati about Marshall.

Although Marshall wins a lot it seems, small town small airport.
Virginia Beach, Newport, Hampton that is a metro area of 1.7 Million. And is a gold mine for football recruiting. Everyone around there has players from there on their team, UVA, UNC, ECU, NC State, VTech etc., everyone recruits there. ODU would have to get better, more consistent within the program. Lots of upside.

I think the AAC stays at 11, if they get the waiver or whatever is required to play a CCG.

Right. Cincinnati has never shared a conference with Marshall, as far as I know. I just don’t see that happening. I would place ODU over Marshall.

On another note, there is a giant naval base in Norfolk. I imagine Navy games would be standing room only.

Excellent points.

ODU v Navy would be our biggest home game in any season IMO. Somehow that needs to happen soon.

ODU has zero chance.

The AAC isn't going to add a school who just added football. They have no connection with them. Most football fans have never heard of ODU.

There is no candidate out there that is willing to come that is worth $6m to $7m a year to ESPN, so the AAC will not be adding anyone.

The ratings depend on football, men's basketball and some money sports.

ODU's men's basketball is one of the better that could bring ratings if they move to the AAC. They are winning every year. They are not getting the exposure on CBSsports Network. Less households. Moving to ESPN might help in recruiting better football players.

(06-29-2019 04:23 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 03:57 PM)odusteeler Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 03:50 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 03:39 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 08:22 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Although Marshall wins a lot it seems, small town small airport.
Virginia Beach, Newport, Hampton that is a metro area of 1.7 Million. And is a gold mine for football recruiting. Everyone around there has players from there on their team, UVA, UNC, ECU, NC State, VTech etc., everyone recruits there. ODU would have to get better, more consistent within the program. Lots of upside.

I think the AAC stays at 11, if they get the waiver or whatever is required to play a CCG.

Right. Cincinnati has never shared a conference with Marshall, as far as I know. I just don’t see that happening. I would place ODU over Marshall.

On another note, there is a giant naval base in Norfolk. I imagine Navy games would be standing room only.

Excellent points.

ODU v Navy would be our biggest home game in any season IMO. Somehow that needs to happen soon.

ODU has zero chance.

The AAC isn't going to add a school who just added football. They have no connection with them. Most football fans have never heard of ODU.

I don't disagree about the "most fans have never heard of ODU", but for football.

In basketball VCU was able to separate themselves this past decade or so, but they used to be neck and neck, with ODU having an advantage at certain points in history. Odell Hodge? IDK if that's even how to spell his name, but I remember him, and Petey Sessoms I think.

Anyway, if one wanted to argue, ODU has an old school connection with South FLA in the Sun Belt.

(06-29-2019 03:50 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 03:39 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 08:22 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 01:11 AM)esayem Wrote:  I think location matters quite a bit here. Yes, being on an island is not ideal (UConn just left and they were an island), but the candidate shouldn’t encroach on a member program and cause a bit too much competition. Unless, that team doesn’t recruit the same type of student athlete. For instance, having North Texas or UTSA would be more detrimental to Houston than Rice.

UAB, Southern Miss, and Rice stand out to me mainly due to their central location and history with current members. Rice has unlimited potential if they agree to spend a certain amount on their major sports. The football coach already makes a mil/year. They have three legit trophy games within the conference, plus Navy and Tulane would support them.

ODU and Marshall are interesting, but I wonder how ECU feels about ODU and Cincinnati about Marshall.

Although Marshall wins a lot it seems, small town small airport.
Virginia Beach, Newport, Hampton that is a metro area of 1.7 Million. And is a gold mine for football recruiting. Everyone around there has players from there on their team, UVA, UNC, ECU, NC State, VTech etc., everyone recruits there. ODU would have to get better, more consistent within the program. Lots of upside.

I think the AAC stays at 11, if they get the waiver or whatever is required to play a CCG.

Right. Cincinnati has never shared a conference with Marshall, as far as I know. I just don’t see that happening. I would place ODU over Marshall.

On another note, there is a giant naval base in Norfolk. I imagine Navy games would be standing room only.

Excellent points.

Cincinnati is definitely a level up from the MAC, and Marshall has the optics of a Southern MAC program. They almost shook it, but it's back.

Consider that ECU was one of the masterminds and sponsor for ODU in CUSA. I doubt that support is gone. Temple will likely push for UMass but may also try other former running mates or nearby places. I could see them pushing hard for a football-only school and an A10 member for hoops.

Rice probably gets nixed by Houston and SMU, and while Buffalo seems trendy, does a mostly southern conference want late fall and winter trips up to Buffalo?

(06-29-2019 06:21 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  Consider that ECU was one of the masterminds and sponsor for ODU in CUSA. I doubt that support is gone. Temple will likely push for UMass but may also try other former running mates or nearby places. I could see them pushing hard for a football-only school and an A10 member for hoops.

Rice probably gets nixed by Houston and SMU, and while Buffalo seems trendy, does a mostly southern conference want late fall and winter trips up to Buffalo?

I think Temple would settle for ODU. ODU would get more support from AAC schools than UMass. The school pushing for UMass as number 13 was UConn.

(06-29-2019 06:21 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  Consider that ECU was one of the masterminds and sponsor for ODU in CUSA. I doubt that support is gone. Temple will likely push for UMass but may also try other former running mates or nearby places. I could see them pushing hard for a football-only school and an A10 member for hoops.

Rice probably gets nixed by Houston and SMU, and while Buffalo seems trendy, does a mostly southern conference want late fall and winter trips up to Buffalo?

I'm not so sure. Houston welcomed TCU, Rice, SMU, and UTEP to C-USA in the past. I think the school profiles are so totally different that it doesn't matter, plus it helps with travel cost.

I could see Tulane, SMU, Tulsa, and Navy (whatever that is worth) going to bat for Rice. Houston is a wildcard. But why would Houston want another large, public university in Tejas to share that unique position with?

I am struggling to find a larger block of schools for one single university. Of course, I am not considering BYU and Army, which are both not realistic at this point.

(06-29-2019 07:02 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 06:21 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  Consider that ECU was one of the masterminds and sponsor for ODU in CUSA. I doubt that support is gone. Temple will likely push for UMass but may also try other former running mates or nearby places. I could see them pushing hard for a football-only school and an A10 member for hoops.

Rice probably gets nixed by Houston and SMU, and while Buffalo seems trendy, does a mostly southern conference want late fall and winter trips up to Buffalo?

I'm not so sure. Houston welcomed TCU, Rice, SMU, and UTEP to C-USA in the past. I think the school profiles are so totally different that it doesn't matter, plus it helps with travel cost.

I could see Tulane, SMU, Tulsa, and Navy (whatever that is worth) going to bat for Rice. Houston is a wildcard. But why would Houston want another large, public university in Tejas to share that unique position with?

I am struggling to find a larger block of schools for one single university. Of course, I am not considering BYU and Army, which are both not realistic at this point.

I know for a fact we sponsored Rice. I honestly dont know about the other Texas CUSA additions, but I suspect we supported them.

Actual Criteria

1. ESPN suggests they consider
2. The school is willing to join (an All Sports invitation is more likely to be accepted than a FB only)
3. ESPN approves their invitation
4. ESPN agrees to pay full share for that school

Schools should have a budget north of $40M a year for Athletics, preferably $50M. They should have reasonably competitive Football and Basketball. 3 Bowl games, an NCAA and 2 NIT appearances would be a fair minimum for an All Sport candidate.

BYU, Army and Boise State have the name cache.

BYU and Colorado State have budgets at or very near the top of the AAC (from DoE Equity in Athletics ... the one accurate source)

FIU ODU Fresno State and Rice have budgets not far from AAC. Everyone else simply has too far to climb to be in the picture.

I would add that a public school needs an undergraduate enrollment of at least 15,000 (use DoE Equity in Athletics numbers, as most schools use an inflated number that includes part time, non-traditional and even graduate students to advertise a larger number). For a private school much harder to say, but the evidence suggests they can be 1/3rd the size of a public school to compete head up.

I don't see a candidate that satisfies all the conditions. Army and BYU would be slam dunks if they said yes, and that is not going to happen. Same for Boise State since they need a better home for Olympics than the options available. Colorado State would have to be All Sports to accept which I doubt the AAC would offer them, and you are getting borderline on ESPN approval. Air Force would not move without Colorado State, and the also need a better Olympics home option.

Rice adds nothing, and Houston sits on that market. That FIU makes a couple criteria is amazing, but I think we can forget them too. Fresno State would be insanity for all parties. That leaves ODU. Basketball is similar level as Colorado State. But football is start up and below average, not worth picking up. And if it's Basketball then VCU makes more sense. But the AAC doesn't need a 12th basketball school.

Process of elimination: stand at 11. Of course offer BYU, Army and Boise State the spot, but expect a thanks but no thanks response.

(06-29-2019 07:02 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 06:21 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  Consider that ECU was one of the masterminds and sponsor for ODU in CUSA. I doubt that support is gone. Temple will likely push for UMass but may also try other former running mates or nearby places. I could see them pushing hard for a football-only school and an A10 member for hoops.

Rice probably gets nixed by Houston and SMU, and while Buffalo seems trendy, does a mostly southern conference want late fall and winter trips up to Buffalo?

I'm not so sure. Houston welcomed TCU, Rice, SMU, and UTEP to C-USA in the past. I think the school profiles are so totally different that it doesn't matter, plus it helps with travel cost.

I could see Tulane, SMU, Tulsa, and Navy (whatever that is worth) going to bat for Rice. Houston is a wildcard. But why would Houston want another large, public university in Tejas to share that unique position with?

I am struggling to find a larger block of schools for one single university. Of course, I am not considering BYU and Army, which are both not realistic at this point.

they did not have a choice in CUSA

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conference_USA

they were a wallflower when TCU joined and no one cared what they thought and when the others came they were losing Cincy, Louisville, USF, Army and TCU plus a number of basketball members......no one was worrying about what they thought then either they were looking for warm bodies

if people cared what they thought back then they would have been able to leave to the BE or the MWC like the rest were doing

(06-29-2019 08:11 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 07:02 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 06:21 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  Consider that ECU was one of the masterminds and sponsor for ODU in CUSA. I doubt that support is gone. Temple will likely push for UMass but may also try other former running mates or nearby places. I could see them pushing hard for a football-only school and an A10 member for hoops.

Rice probably gets nixed by Houston and SMU, and while Buffalo seems trendy, does a mostly southern conference want late fall and winter trips up to Buffalo?

I'm not so sure. Houston welcomed TCU, Rice, SMU, and UTEP to C-USA in the past. I think the school profiles are so totally different that it doesn't matter, plus it helps with travel cost.

I could see Tulane, SMU, Tulsa, and Navy (whatever that is worth) going to bat for Rice. Houston is a wildcard. But why would Houston want another large, public university in Tejas to share that unique position with?

I am struggling to find a larger block of schools for one single university. Of course, I am not considering BYU and Army, which are both not realistic at this point.

they did not have a choice in CUSA

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conference_USA

they were a wallflower when TCU joined and no one cared what they thought and when the others came they were losing Cincy, Louisville, USF, Army and TCU plus a number of basketball members......no one was worrying about what they thought then either they were looking for warm bodies

if people cared what they thought back then they would have been able to leave to the BE or the MWC like the rest were doing

So what's your point? I still don't see a reason Houston would be opposed to Rice. It seems they compliment each other and reduce travel costs for the entire league.

Granted, Rice only makes sense if they make a contractual commitment to spending some geld on athletics. That would require some hefty, monopoly man donors stepping up to the plate; this is their time to shine.

(06-29-2019 07:07 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Actual Criteria

1. ESPN suggests they consider
2. The school is willing to join (an All Sports invitation is more likely to be accepted than a FB only)
3. ESPN approves their invitation
4. ESPN agrees to pay full share for that school

Schools should have a budget north of $40M a year for Athletics, preferably $50M. They should have reasonably competitive Football and Basketball. 3 Bowl games, an NCAA and 2 NIT appearances would be a fair minimum for an All Sport candidate.

BYU, Army and Boise State have the name cache.

BYU and Colorado State have budgets at or very near the top of the AAC (from DoE Equity in Athletics ... the one accurate source)

FIU ODU Fresno State and Rice have budgets not far from AAC. Everyone else simply has too far to climb to be in the picture.

I would add that a public school needs an undergraduate enrollment of at least 15,000 (use DoE Equity in Athletics numbers, as most schools use an inflated number that includes part time, non-traditional and even graduate students to advertise a larger number). For a private school much harder to say, but the evidence suggests they can be 1/3rd the size of a public school to compete head up.

I don't see a candidate that satisfies all the conditions. Army and BYU would be slam dunks if they said yes, and that is not going to happen. Same for Boise State since they need a better home for Olympics than the options available. Colorado State would have to be All Sports to accept which I doubt the AAC would offer them, and you are getting borderline on ESPN approval. Air Force would not move without Colorado State, and the also need a better Olympics home option.

1) Rice adds nothing, and Houston sits on that market. 2) That FIU makes a couple criteria is amazing, but I think we can forget them too. Fresno State would be insanity for all parties. That leaves ODU. Basketball is similar level as Colorado State. But football is start up and below average, not worth picking up. And if it's Basketball then VCU makes more sense. But the AAC doesn't need a 12th basketball school.

Process of elimination: stand at 11. Of course offer BYU, Army and Boise State the spot, but expect a thanks but no thanks response.

1) Totally disagree

2) FAU is ESPN ready with Lane Biff'n and Charlie Whopper Jr.

(06-28-2019 11:30 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  From the AAC's (Big East Football's) first go-around, markets were deemed the priority (even over on-field success). After UConn's departure, and the assumed continued goal of an eventual guaranteed NY6 bowl access, the AAC needs to find the right football candidate that can slide in and continue building the football brand of the American. Thankfully, geography is not a huge importance - since the AAC already spans half the country, and Memphis can easily slide into the East if another western member is added. Additionally, academics has never been a huge requirement for the current membership of schools.

Since there are no slam-dunk candidates, and assuming Air Force, Army, Boise State, BYU, Colorado State and San Diego State are all off the table, the AAC can afford to call-up a member that can check several candidate boxes, but can acquire (or elevate) more of them with the additional AAC TV payouts under the duration of the next ESPN deal. Finally, no candidate can demonstrate that they have "written off" basketball, ala ECU/Tulane. Any new member needs to be football-first, but capable of having a competitive men's basketball program every now and then.

1. Football Market
2. Football Attendance
3. Football Success
4. Football Stadium Size
5. Market
6. Enrollment
7. Athletic Budget
8. Men's Basketball Success
9. Men's Basketball Attendance
10. Men's Basketball Arena Size

From those requirements, I would rank the candidates as follows:

1. UAB (new football stadium, commitment to football, solid men's basketball history and huge football market/recruiting area)
2. Marshall (steady and continued success in football; decent men's basketball with solid fan support)
3. Old Dominion (largest non-AAC/MWC athletic budget; strong men's basketball resume; rising football program)
Wild Cards: Georgia State and Southern Mississippi (both huge football recruiting areas that would immensely benefit from AAC revenue and exposure).

Are you confusing futbol and football, all of your post are either poor trolling or you know nothing about the big boy sport

(06-29-2019 07:07 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Actual Criteria

1. ESPN suggests they consider
2. The school is willing to join (an All Sports invitation is more likely to be accepted than a FB only)
3. ESPN approves their invitation
4. ESPN agrees to pay full share for that school

Schools should have a budget north of $40M a year for Athletics, preferably $50M. They should have reasonably competitive Football and Basketball. 3 Bowl games, an NCAA and 2 NIT appearances would be a fair minimum for an All Sport candidate.

BYU, Army and Boise State have the name cache.

BYU and Colorado State have budgets at or very near the top of the AAC (from DoE Equity in Athletics ... the one accurate source)

FIU ODU Fresno State and Rice have budgets not far from AAC. Everyone else simply has too far to climb to be in the picture.

I would add that a public school needs an undergraduate enrollment of at least 15,000 (use DoE Equity in Athletics numbers, as most schools use an inflated number that includes part time, non-traditional and even graduate students to advertise a larger number). For a private school much harder to say, but the evidence suggests they can be 1/3rd the size of a public school to compete head up.

I don't see a candidate that satisfies all the conditions. Army and BYU would be slam dunks if they said yes, and that is not going to happen. Same for Boise State since they need a better home for Olympics than the options available. Colorado State would have to be All Sports to accept which I doubt the AAC would offer them, and you are getting borderline on ESPN approval. Air Force would not move without Colorado State, and the also need a better Olympics home option.

Rice adds nothing, and Houston sits on that market. That FIU makes a couple criteria is amazing, but I think we can forget them too. Fresno State would be insanity for all parties. That leaves ODU. Basketball is similar level as Colorado State. But football is start up and below average, not worth picking up. And if it's Basketball then VCU makes more sense. But the AAC doesn't need a 12th basketball school.

Process of elimination: stand at 11. Of course offer BYU, Army and Boise State the spot, but expect a thanks but no thanks response.

ODU is $40 million north at the AAC spending already. Upgrading their facilities including adding more seats. Basketball fits in with the NIT and NCAA tournament. ODU is not a recent startup since it is like 10 years since they restarted. Made a bowl game. Having games on CBSSports does not help them attract better players. ODU wouold be a good investment for AAC to add for a 12th all sports member.

(06-29-2019 06:21 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  ... while Buffalo seems trendy, does a mostly southern conference want late fall and winter trips up to Buffalo?

While I am more than a little skeptical about whether Buffalo would be considered ... in part for the above reason ...

... at the very least, if Buffalo was being considered on the back of the recent BBall success, you'd wait to see if the BBall success continues at the same level under the next coach.

(06-29-2019 08:25 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 08:11 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 07:02 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(06-29-2019 06:21 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  Consider that ECU was one of the masterminds and sponsor for ODU in CUSA. I doubt that support is gone. Temple will likely push for UMass but may also try other former running mates or nearby places. I could see them pushing hard for a football-only school and an A10 member for hoops.

Rice probably gets nixed by Houston and SMU, and while Buffalo seems trendy, does a mostly southern conference want late fall and winter trips up to Buffalo?

I'm not so sure. Houston welcomed TCU, Rice, SMU, and UTEP to C-USA in the past. I think the school profiles are so totally different that it doesn't matter, plus it helps with travel cost.

I could see Tulane, SMU, Tulsa, and Navy (whatever that is worth) going to bat for Rice. Houston is a wildcard. But why would Houston want another large, public university in Tejas to share that unique position with?

I am struggling to find a larger block of schools for one single university. Of course, I am not considering BYU and Army, which are both not realistic at this point.

they did not have a choice in CUSA

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conference_USA

they were a wallflower when TCU joined and no one cared what they thought and when the others came they were losing Cincy, Louisville, USF, Army and TCU plus a number of basketball members......no one was worrying about what they thought then either they were looking for warm bodies

if people cared what they thought back then they would have been able to leave to the BE or the MWC like the rest were doing

So what's your point? I still don't see a reason Houston would be opposed to Rice. It seems they compliment each other and reduce travel costs for the entire league.

Granted, Rice only makes sense if they make a contractual commitment to spending some geld on athletics. That would require some hefty, monopoly man donors stepping up to the plate; this is their time to shine.

my point is back when the CUSA was adding teams Houston was a wall flower that sat in the room and just voted like everyone else for whatever teams were offered up

now they think they are a big power player in a conference they hype as having significant advantages to other similar conferences and that they are helping to ruin (by trying to be a power player while having one foot kicking on the closed P5 elevator)

they are not interested in "travel partners" or "strengthening a market" or "getting an old conference mate back".......they are interested in trying to do the exact things they criticize the Big 12 for and especially some members of the Big 12

but of course the AAC is in a much different place than the Big 12 especially right now

Old Dominion fits the geography and rounds out your division but I don’t see the impetus at the moment. Going West doesn’t make sense unless it’s BYU. UMass makes no sense.