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Texas Southern Considering Southland?
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GreenHornet33 Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
(06-13-2019 02:17 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  The SWAC is restarting it's Football Championship game, and moving from 7 to 8 conference Football games.

https://fbschedules.com/swac-continue-ch...-schedule/

The SWAC title game never went away to restart in the first place.
06-13-2019 01:38 PM
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GreenHornet33 Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
(06-11-2019 10:43 AM)_C2_ Wrote:  
(06-11-2019 09:34 AM)michael.stevens.3110 Wrote:  This is a NO brainer .... Less travel time .. Less travel cost .. Less time away from class .. Less Racial issues .. We live in a color blind era .. It’s high time for Colleges to face reality ..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Hardly a no-brainer, the other schools would use the HBCU status against TSU in recruiting, they probably have better funding (though TSU's basketball and football facilities are top notch and they can borrow facilities throughout the city, especially from UH right down the street) and TSU would sink because it's harder to compete at a higher level. They do well but don't dominate the SWAC. *Finally, many of their hardcore fans like games against SWAC schools because they are also HBCU's or, if you want to be lazy in speech/racially insensitive (many are), all-black schools.

There's a whole culture of SWAC pride among all the schools that goes beyond the games, especially in football from the spirit teams/pep squads, to the fraternity steppers to, of course, the bands. They'd even lose recruiting territory for both prospective students and athletes. A school like Hampton is very progressive and kinda outgrew the MEAC. I can't say the same about many HBCU's. That said, TSU is in easily the most cosmopolitan city in all the SWAC but then again, that'd be true in the Southland as well. I can't say for certain it's any more than a lateral move.

*Disclaimer: I'm black making that comment.

Hampton didn't outgrow the MEAC. The MEAC got tired of Hampton's b*tching like the Big 12 got tired of Texas and the 326th time Hampton threatened to leave for not getting their way the member schools said "ya know what? GTFO".
06-13-2019 01:41 PM
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GreenHornet33 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
(06-10-2019 07:32 PM)TexasTerror Wrote:  Ralph Cooper - a longtime African American sports talk host in Houston reported the following...

Rumor from reliable source
You read it here first
TEXAS SOUTHERN UNIVERSITY
RESEARCHING A MOVE TO
SOUTHLAND CONFERENCE .WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR A POSSIBLE TSU TIGER MOVE OUT OF THE SWAC
SOUTHWESTERN ATHLETIC CONFERENCE.
BOARD OF REGENTS OR TSU OFFICIALS?


This "rumor" was debunked within 24 hours of it being put out.
06-13-2019 01:42 PM
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_C2_ Online
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Post: #44
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
(06-12-2019 08:39 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I'd like to see the stronger HBCUs from the MEAC and SWAC band together to form a "Black SEC". The rest should go to DII. Culture and Heritage are what define these programs but at the same time the weak ones are pulling the strong down with them. Programs like NC A&T, FAMU, and Texas Southern need separation from schools like Delaware St and Ark-PB.

Overall I think each HBCU needs to look at their individual situation and decide whether they can continue in the niche of providing a unique liberal arts style education to a predominantly black student body or if they are better off shedding that image and diversifying their student body.

Texas Southern is barely a stand alone school. Both corruption and fiscal irresponsibility have nearly cost them accreditation and for certain credibility. Their saving grace is that they are in one of the more progressive, cosmopolitan cities in the country as opposed to the Deep South like much of the SWAC.
06-13-2019 03:35 PM
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_C2_ Online
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Post: #45
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
(06-13-2019 01:41 PM)GreenHornet33 Wrote:  
(06-11-2019 10:43 AM)_C2_ Wrote:  
(06-11-2019 09:34 AM)michael.stevens.3110 Wrote:  This is a NO brainer .... Less travel time .. Less travel cost .. Less time away from class .. Less Racial issues .. We live in a color blind era .. It’s high time for Colleges to face reality ..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Hardly a no-brainer, the other schools would use the HBCU status against TSU in recruiting, they probably have better funding (though TSU's basketball and football facilities are top notch and they can borrow facilities throughout the city, especially from UH right down the street) and TSU would sink because it's harder to compete at a higher level. They do well but don't dominate the SWAC. *Finally, many of their hardcore fans like games against SWAC schools because they are also HBCU's or, if you want to be lazy in speech/racially insensitive (many are), all-black schools.

There's a whole culture of SWAC pride among all the schools that goes beyond the games, especially in football from the spirit teams/pep squads, to the fraternity steppers to, of course, the bands. They'd even lose recruiting territory for both prospective students and athletes. A school like Hampton is very progressive and kinda outgrew the MEAC. I can't say the same about many HBCU's. That said, TSU is in easily the most cosmopolitan city in all the SWAC but then again, that'd be true in the Southland as well. I can't say for certain it's any more than a lateral move.

*Disclaimer: I'm black making that comment.

Hampton didn't outgrow the MEAC. The MEAC got tired of Hampton's b*tching like the Big 12 got tired of Texas and the 326th time Hampton threatened to leave for not getting their way the member schools said "ya know what? GTFO".

Hampton is still one of the more progressive HBCU's. Your story probably confirms that (as they were likely trying to make changes to those who had bullish attitudes).

That said, I'm surprised they moved. The MEAC is traditionally much stronger than the SWAC and while not perfect, was a great home that made total sense. Unless they live Steve Merfeld's dream and gain admission to the A-10, there's no better conference expect maybe the SWAC or OVC (because of Tennessee State).
06-13-2019 03:38 PM
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GreenHornet33 Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
(06-13-2019 03:38 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  
(06-13-2019 01:41 PM)GreenHornet33 Wrote:  
(06-11-2019 10:43 AM)_C2_ Wrote:  
(06-11-2019 09:34 AM)michael.stevens.3110 Wrote:  This is a NO brainer .... Less travel time .. Less travel cost .. Less time away from class .. Less Racial issues .. We live in a color blind era .. It’s high time for Colleges to face reality ..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Hardly a no-brainer, the other schools would use the HBCU status against TSU in recruiting, they probably have better funding (though TSU's basketball and football facilities are top notch and they can borrow facilities throughout the city, especially from UH right down the street) and TSU would sink because it's harder to compete at a higher level. They do well but don't dominate the SWAC. *Finally, many of their hardcore fans like games against SWAC schools because they are also HBCU's or, if you want to be lazy in speech/racially insensitive (many are), all-black schools.

There's a whole culture of SWAC pride among all the schools that goes beyond the games, especially in football from the spirit teams/pep squads, to the fraternity steppers to, of course, the bands. They'd even lose recruiting territory for both prospective students and athletes. A school like Hampton is very progressive and kinda outgrew the MEAC. I can't say the same about many HBCU's. That said, TSU is in easily the most cosmopolitan city in all the SWAC but then again, that'd be true in the Southland as well. I can't say for certain it's any more than a lateral move.

*Disclaimer: I'm black making that comment.

Hampton didn't outgrow the MEAC. The MEAC got tired of Hampton's b*tching like the Big 12 got tired of Texas and the 326th time Hampton threatened to leave for not getting their way the member schools said "ya know what? GTFO".

Hampton is still one of the more progressive HBCU's. Your story probably confirms that (as they were likely trying to make changes to those who had bullish attitudes).

That said, I'm surprised they moved. The MEAC is traditionally much stronger than the SWAC and while not perfect, was a great home that made total sense. Unless they live Steve Merfeld's dream and gain admission to the A-10, there's no better conference expect maybe the SWAC or OVC (because of Tennessee State).

Now I'm questioning your HBCU knowledge now(you've said questionable things in the past too), you're saying that Hampton University headed by Dr.William R. Harvey is one of the most progressive HBCUs? Let me get this totally correct we move forward.
06-13-2019 05:05 PM
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_C2_ Online
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Post: #47
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
If something has changed in recent years, I stand corrected. But all of the people I've met from Hampton were stand up, intelligent and seemed to have bright futures. Their leadership in the past has been an issue (including racially, perhaps, chasing off Steve Merfeld) but they are one of the better ones.

And no, I don't know every last detail about every HBCU and the nitty gritty in every area but I know enough to know Hampton is one of the better HBCU's out there.
06-13-2019 06:14 PM
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GreenHornet33 Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
(06-13-2019 06:14 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  If something has changed in recent years, I stand corrected. But all of the people I've met from Hampton were stand up, intelligent and seemed to have bright futures. Their leadership in the past has been an issue (including racially, perhaps, chasing off Steve Merfeld) but they are one of the better ones.

And no, I don't know every last detail about every HBCU and the nitty gritty in every area but I know enough to know Hampton is one of the better HBCU's out there.

Hampton is old and traditional. Hampton's issues with the MEAC have been WELL and I do mean WELL documented since 2005. Dr.Harvey for as old and traditional as he is did create the idea for revamping the Heritage Bowl which lead to the Celebration Bowl. Hampton wanted a few things from the MEAC and most of it has to do with what was beneficial to Hampton and not the entire conference. Spats over conference tournament sites and stuff like that were small but what really drove Hampton to leave is the Dr.Harvey felt like Hampton should get a larger slice of the Celebration Bowl money and that the few schools that voted against it shouldn't receive any payout for 2 years. Plus the MEAC did invited Tennessee State like Hampton and the botched invites to Alabama State and Alabama A&M a few years back.

Over the years Hampton has been pissed about a lot and have ALWAYS threatened to leave when ANY little thing didn't go their way. After about 10+ of this the MEAC members got tired of it. At the end of the day Hampton felt like Norfolk State and Howard would leave if that wasn't the case. Now in typical Hampton fashion Dr.Harvey has proposed a BCS-type formula for Celebration Bowl Selections in which Hampton and Tennessee State could be invited.
(This post was last modified: 06-13-2019 06:35 PM by GreenHornet33.)
06-13-2019 06:35 PM
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FloridaJag Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
The best thing that can happen is for some of the MEAC and SWAC teams form a new FCS conference and let the rest drop down to NCAA DII.

Example: 14 team conference

HBCC East

Alabama A&M
Alabama State
Bethune Cookman
Florida A&M
North Carolina A&T
North Carolina Central
South Carolina State

HBCC West

Alcorn State
Grambling State
Jackson State
Prairie View A&M
Texas Southern
Southern University


Dropping to DII

Arkansas Pine Bluff
Deleware State
Howard
Mississippi Valley
Morgan State
Norfolk State
Savannah State *

The DII folks can merge or schedule games against the SIAC or Gulf South Conference.

* https://theundefeated.com/features/savan...vision-ii/
06-14-2019 10:22 AM
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Post: #50
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
It's an interesting idea to strengthen the stronger programs in 1 "super conference" for HBCU's. I wonder if there would be greater marketing and corporate sponsorship opportunities for this super conference. Would it increase interest and television viewing (and potential TV dollars)? Maybe. Of course it crashes on the rocks of only 1 autobid and 1 NCAA tourney unit, already existing contracts, etc.

I'm not super knowledgeable, but Howard is probably the richest of all the schools with $700 million in endowment and around 10,000 students. They should stay in the superconference. Oddly, I couldn't find their athletic website from their school website (I had to do a google search to find it). Even though they seem OK in sports, it might not be a high priority in the school's culture.
06-14-2019 12:34 PM
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Cyniclone Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
(06-14-2019 10:22 AM)FloridaJag Wrote:  The best thing that can happen is for some of the MEAC and SWAC teams form a new FCS conference and let the rest drop down to NCAA DII.

Example: 14 team conference

HBCC East

Alabama A&M
Alabama State
Bethune Cookman
Florida A&M
North Carolina A&T
North Carolina Central
South Carolina State

HBCC West

Alcorn State
Grambling State
Jackson State
Prairie View A&M
Texas Southern
Southern University


Dropping to DII

Arkansas Pine Bluff
Deleware State
Howard
Mississippi Valley
Morgan State
Norfolk State
Savannah State *

The DII folks can merge or schedule games against the SIAC or Gulf South Conference.

* https://theundefeated.com/features/savan...vision-ii/

As logical as it would be for some of these schools to at least consider D2, the only full D1 member to do so is Savannah State, which has never been consistently competitive in the major sports and were probably hanging on for dear life most if not all of their D1 existence. Nobody else has moved down, and there's a reason for that. Most of these schools were moveups from the CIAA and SIAC, and most likely they'd be welcomed back with open arms. But they obviously prefer the financial and optics benefit of playing at the highest level, and if they can so do even barely, there's no reason to fall back to D2 unless there's no other way to keep the athletic program afloat.

Forcing them down by NCAA writ would be problematic even if they weren't HBCUs; but they are, and that adds another layer of dubiousness to the equation. So that's not a reasonable option.

Plus a merged MEAC-SWAC would have to benefit the schools involved in some way, and I don't know how larger travel expenses, fewer regional/traditional rivals, the loss of the Celebration Bowl (unless it became a game against the CIAA/SIAC champion) and one fewer NCAA bid helps them.

So until enough schools move to another conference or down to D2 of their own volition to make one or both conferences unviable, or someone proposes something radical like the HBCU schools leaving the NCAA and creating their own system (which is theoretically possible but highly unlikely), the MEAC and SWAC will remain.
06-14-2019 12:54 PM
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DoubleRSU Online
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Post: #52
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
How would forming a big HBCU conference be good for anyone? Instead of 2 HBCU auto bids, there would only be 1. Why would they even consider this?
06-14-2019 03:19 PM
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Yosef Himself Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
(06-14-2019 03:19 PM)DoubleRSU Wrote:  How would forming a big HBCU conference be good for anyone? Instead of 2 HBCU auto bids, there would only be 1. Why would they even consider this?


They wouldn't.
06-14-2019 03:44 PM
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DavidSt Online
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RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
They could split into 3 conferences.
06-14-2019 04:51 PM
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texassouthern1992 Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
As a Texas Southern UNIVERSITY Alumnus, I am thrilled we are being discussed on this board. I don't believe moving to the Southland Conference would be in our best interest. Prairie View is our archrival and to me if they're staying in the SWAC so should we. I don't want us to have the Tennessee State issue. Their fans turn out for Jackson State and that really is it. The OVC is their home but fans want to see them play historical rivals.
06-14-2019 06:14 PM
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Yosef Himself Offline
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RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
(06-14-2019 06:14 PM)texassouthern1992 Wrote:  As a Texas Southern UNIVERSITY Alumnus, I am thrilled we are being discussed on this board. I don't believe moving to the Southland Conference would be in our best interest. Prairie View is our archrival and to me if they're staying in the SWAC so should we. I don't want us to have the Tennessee State issue. Their fans turn out for Jackson State and that really is it. The OVC is their home but fans want to see them play historical rivals.
Coming from a fan base that would have revolted by moving to FBS without our rival GaSo I completely understand.
06-14-2019 08:04 PM
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DavidSt Online
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RE: Texas Southern Considering Southland?
History of the SWAC.

Bishop 1920-1956 founding member, closed
Paul Quinn 1920-1929 founding member, now NAIA
Prairie View 1920-now founding member
Samuel-Huston 1920-1959 founding member, now Huston Tilotson NAIA
Texas College 1920-1961 founding member, now NAIA
Wiley 1920-1958 founding member, now NAIA
Langston 1931-1957 conference champs in football, now NAIA
Southern U. 1934-now
UAPB 1936-1969, 1997 to now
Texas Southern 1964-now
Grambling State 1958-now
Jackson State 1958-now
Alcorn State 1962-now
Mississippi Valley State 1968-now
Alabama State 1982-now
Alabama A&M 1999-now

This would be a good alternative thread if Langston, Texas College and Wiley stayed with the SWAC to this day.
06-15-2019 02:19 PM
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