(05-19-2019 06:17 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(05-19-2019 05:46 PM)Sparty84 Wrote:  As a physician, my viewpoint on the Ohio State doctor and the Michigan State doctor is different than most people.

Nassar, the MSU doctor, pled guilty to multiple charges of criminal sexual conduct and possession of child pornography.

And your Sparty just paid $500 million to a Victim's Fund for the survivors of his abuse. That's about 10 year's worth of Big Ten conference revenue disbursements. I don't think they do that if they didn't have to.

I think you are off your rocker.

He legitimately defended Nassar and never read the Strauss investigation.

(05-19-2019 12:08 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(05-18-2019 11:36 PM)sierrajip Wrote:  

(05-18-2019 08:03 AM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  Oh for crying out loud! The schools run the NCAA, if they disbanded the NCAA and set up a new governing body the same damn folks who make up the rules now would be making up the rules then. The power schools have all the say now and would have all the say in any new organization. People need to stop thinking it's some independent organization holding these schools and athletes down. Everything the NCAA does is at the approval of the P5. EVERYTHING!

This.

+2

I think the NCAA was founded as a legal structure to divorce the economic income from the people generating it under an elaborate PR campaign known as the "student athlete". And while the NCAA's commercials might be true for a typical athlete competing in swimming and diving in Division 2, we all know they're utterly divorced from reality when it comes to the people paying for everything (men's hoops, and until recently football). Without that money there is no commercial and there is no Division 2 swimming and diving. There is absolutely truth in the P5 having a great deal of control over how the NCAA behaves. The NCAA accepted being neutered as an organization when the P5 took the football money away in exchange for survival. But that arrangement is a self-defeating one. You can't police people you have no authority over. That never works. But they don't have outright control. They are beholden to the lie of a business model the NCAA represents. If you start from scratch you're going to have to pay people above and beyond tuition. In football maybe even considerably so. That's such an expensive proposition you're severing yourself from 99% of the rest of the schools that have athletic programs. The world would become considerably more NAIA-ish, and maybe that's good and healthy in the long run. If you kill the NCAA, you probably uncork the genie. And if you play that out, there may not be enough "lesser" programs hanging around for you to buy paycheck wins from to pad your record to look more successful to keep your fans happy. If you turn just the top programs against just the top programs you're going to create new bottom programs and bleed them out and further thin out the ranks. Things could get ugly in that brave new world not just for the Kent States and Akrons ... but the Wake Forests and Vanderbilts and Northwesterns and Kansas States too.

The NCAA was founded because multiple people were dying or getting seriously injured playing college football and this is when only the wealthy and well connected went to college.

If you kill the NCAA you ruin actual amateur athletics for an extra zero in Texas and OSU's yearly checks. You allow schools to pretty much drop every sport but the 2 big money makers and let every other actual student athlete lose any hope of athletic scholarship or decent coaching and facilities. Intramural and club sports without any school funds would be what we'd go back to in a decade. All the folks who ***** about the NCAA because of the handful of college athletes not getting paid (yes, in the whole pool of college athletes FB and BBall players that would actually get paid are a handful) don't even think about the tens of thousands of real student athletes who live their lives like those NCAA commercials would be sacrificed on the alter of big time college football. The cross country runners, volley ball players, lacrosse players and all the other non revenue sports athletes who pretty much are the back bone of our international athletics would either give up their sports to go to school or never go to school because they can't afford it.

No organization will be able to police these schools since they would have to answer to the schools themselves. So killing the NCAA strips actual student athletes of the possibility of getting an education and competing in the sport they love for nothing more than the love of the game and wouldn't change anything the power conferences do except make a few more bucks.

It's just asinine to complain about the NCAA when no one blames the actual power behind the organization.

(05-19-2019 05:46 PM)Sparty84 Wrote:  As a physician, my viewpoint on the Ohio State doctor and the Michigan State doctor is different than most people. I accept that both doctors may have been sexually abusing their respective patients. Where i have a hard time with both of these cases is who, how or when you can determine that a licensed physician examining patients and/or providing treatment to their patients within their medical professions scope of practice is sexual assault or sexual abuse. In the case of the Michigan State doc it is well documented in medical literature by Janet Travell MD of Duke University and her book on Myofascial Pain Syndromes that intravaginal and intrarectal examination and treatment are used for pelvic floor Myofascial Pain Syndromes. I would expect that it is highly possible that female gymnasts performing splits and other gymnastics manuervers would be prone to repetitive stress injuries that may if not most likely include pelvic floor dysfunction. In the case of the Ohio State doc, it is well within the scope of a doc to examine a guys genitals for hernia or testicular injury etc. I am not aware that either of these docs made the patients do sexual acts or did sexual acts to them. I read that one of the michigan state docs patients said he got a hard on during an examination. Last time i checked getting aroused is not a crime. The Ohio State thing seems like it was mostly a joke at the time amonst the players joking about the guy grabbing their junk. I also read that the Ohio State guy watched them in the shower. Once again looking is not a crime. I am a gay man... I check out hot and not so hot guys all of the time in public or private venues. Most of them just give me a wink and a knowing smile when they see that im checking them out. My experience is that most straight guys are flattered that a gay guy is checking them out even they would never consider an encounter of any kind.

I guess my concern is that if the docs were doing something within the scope of their practice and there was no police intervention years back when it occurred, then why is it acceptable for these guys/girls to make accusations now that treatment within the scope of practice is somehow not acceptable now. Did time and social media suddenly make legitimate treatment illegitimate? Should i never examine or treat another patient now in fear that 30 years from now someone will say "He touched my shoulder". Where does this end. For the most part the patients at ohio state were adult men. If they did not object at the time of examination then by default they must have consented. I think the michigan state scenario is more complicated when you have the under age gymnasts, but in many or those cases the parents were in the room during treatment and by default consented examination and treatment.

Im sure most of you will not share my opinion and that is fine. It just concerns me when we are changing the rules of the game decades after it is said and done and over with.

Yup, im sure their are lots of medical studies that find the best way to work on a sprained ankle is with your fingers in their....

(05-18-2019 04:21 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(05-18-2019 08:52 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(05-18-2019 07:52 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(05-17-2019 05:22 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  And one of the people that covered it up sits in Congress.

I wonder if Republican Jim Jordan would get arrested and sent to prison like the leaders at Penn. State got for covering up the crime and not notifying the law? I think he should be removed from office.

Co-sign. He is a despicable slug.

Yeah because you are a leftist. You are a despicable slug, and David for suggesting Jordan covered up anything. Back it up. Hundreds of people knew about the guy if any of you even glanced at the report.

You can thank leftists for your saturdays off watching college sports dummy.

(05-20-2019 05:00 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  

(05-19-2019 12:08 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(05-18-2019 11:36 PM)sierrajip Wrote:  

(05-18-2019 08:03 AM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  Oh for crying out loud! The schools run the NCAA, if they disbanded the NCAA and set up a new governing body the same damn folks who make up the rules now would be making up the rules then. The power schools have all the say now and would have all the say in any new organization. People need to stop thinking it's some independent organization holding these schools and athletes down. Everything the NCAA does is at the approval of the P5. EVERYTHING!

This.

+2

I think the NCAA was founded as a legal structure to divorce the economic income from the people generating it under an elaborate PR campaign known as the "student athlete". And while the NCAA's commercials might be true for a typical athlete competing in swimming and diving in Division 2, we all know they're utterly divorced from reality when it comes to the people paying for everything (men's hoops, and until recently football). Without that money there is no commercial and there is no Division 2 swimming and diving. There is absolutely truth in the P5 having a great deal of control over how the NCAA behaves. The NCAA accepted being neutered as an organization when the P5 took the football money away in exchange for survival. But that arrangement is a self-defeating one. You can't police people you have no authority over. That never works. But they don't have outright control. They are beholden to the lie of a business model the NCAA represents. If you start from scratch you're going to have to pay people above and beyond tuition. In football maybe even considerably so. That's such an expensive proposition you're severing yourself from 99% of the rest of the schools that have athletic programs. The world would become considerably more NAIA-ish, and maybe that's good and healthy in the long run. If you kill the NCAA, you probably uncork the genie. And if you play that out, there may not be enough "lesser" programs hanging around for you to buy paycheck wins from to pad your record to look more successful to keep your fans happy. If you turn just the top programs against just the top programs you're going to create new bottom programs and bleed them out and further thin out the ranks. Things could get ugly in that brave new world not just for the Kent States and Akrons ... but the Wake Forests and Vanderbilts and Northwesterns and Kansas States too.

The NCAA was founded because multiple people were dying or getting seriously injured playing college football and this is when only the wealthy and well connected went to college.

If you kill the NCAA you ruin actual amateur athletics for an extra zero in Texas and OSU's yearly checks. You allow schools to pretty much drop every sport but the 2 big money makers and let every other actual student athlete lose any hope of athletic scholarship or decent coaching and facilities. Intramural and club sports without any school funds would be what we'd go back to in a decade. All the folks who ***** about the NCAA because of the handful of college athletes not getting paid (yes, in the whole pool of college athletes FB and BBall players that would actually get paid are a handful) don't even think about the tens of thousands of real student athletes who live their lives like those NCAA commercials would be sacrificed on the alter of big time college football. The cross country runners, volley ball players, lacrosse players and all the other non revenue sports athletes who pretty much are the back bone of our international athletics would either give up their sports to go to school or never go to school because they can't afford it.

No organization will be able to police these schools since they would have to answer to the schools themselves. So killing the NCAA strips actual student athletes of the possibility of getting an education and competing in the sport they love for nothing more than the love of the game and wouldn't change anything the power conferences do except make a few more bucks.

It's just asinine to complain about the NCAA when no one blames the actual power behind the organization.

What a crock. Title IX and non profit status insures most non revenue sports and when guys were getting killed playing football it was a Teddy Roosevelt who convened a panel of coaches that took up looking into whether it should continue and if so how to make it safer. Rules changes helped curtail some of the injuries. Even from the beginning, which was supposedly over rowing competitions, rules were the main emphasis of the organization that would become the NCAA.

Today the need for it has passed. It is ineffectual in governing recruitment, antiquated with regard to compensation, and skims way too much of the revenue to perpetuate itself via endowment. It has ceased to be a rules and enforcement agency for college athletics and has become a self sustaining bureaucracy.

OU/UGA in 1981 put an end to the gleaning of cash for the sale of college football rights by the NCAA and the money started to flow in. What we have today is directly attributable to Oklahoma and Georgia's Federal lawsuit and the subsequent ruling.

It's past time for basketball to be able to call its own shots as well. The conferences need to own the tournament and its proceeds, not the NCAA. If you want to help smaller schools them give them their earnings each year without gleaning a fat amount from the tourney first.

I raised Title IX because government now mandates many women's sports by ratio and most of those happen to be non revenue.

The schools can offset minor sports with scholarships because of the revenue sports and that's how they keep their non profit status whether stipends are paid to athletes or not.

Club level sports are covered by the athletes and keeping your non profit status is what funds minor or non revenue sports.

I would argue that this governmental/tax arrangement is far more important than anything the NCAA does and that if all of the revenue from the tournament was distributed that more non revenue sports would be the beneficiary of that extra income if non profit status is to be kept.

So the leftist had not one damned thing to do with this, the NCAA is an obstacle to its original intended purpose in the world we have today, and it is wastes money and because of that curtails non revenue sports opportunities. It needs to go.

The NCAA ruined the NCAA Football games. The NCAA is bad. I rest my case.