Sonny Smith's Buccaneer teams were great at running the secondary break. After a rebound, Cat Watson or B.J. Johnson would push the ball all the way to the basket, then kick it back out to a trailing player. Scott Place got a lot of wide open shots and scored a lot of points from the head of the key that way.

(05-03-2019 12:47 AM)squeak Wrote:  At this moment do we have the players who can bring it home?

Well, it's no longer "at this moment", but we certainly have a lot more information now than we did back in May. I'm not gonna wax all poetic here and now, but this will be a good Buccaneer team. In fact, it will be a very good Buccaneer team. It seems Forbes has again done a masterful job of putting the pieces together. Will it be a "great" ETSU team? Obviously too early to tell, but if Jeromy and Good are all healed up by, say, November, then it could be.

What are the biggest weaknesses? Hmmm..... I can think of three (or four) things right off, which are really just generic things that could apply to most teams that aren't in the NBA:

1) Once again having cold streaks shooting from outside. We know they *can* shoot; sometimes things just don't fall and it becomes contagious. But with Good and Boyd both being of the unconscious mindset, hopefully any lapses will be short. It would be awesome and a significant advantage if Charlie Webber can continue to demonstrate that pretty outside stroke he has shown in Europe. And we know Hugley has that capability, too. Remains to be seen if Patterson, Williamson (he should), or Monsanto can put up some numbers every once in a while. But still........Boyd and/or Good will need to be "on" more than "off".

2) Bigs getting in foul trouble, especially N'Guessan. After watching his action in Europe, I see some improvement on offense. As I stated on another thread, he's now showing the promise from the Stillwater highlight tapes. But I also see his propensity to "reach in" (and reach over, too) is still there. His footwork seemed ok, but hard to tell against players whose foot speed wasn't quite what the top SoCon and American bigs will have. The good news there is Corley should be able to take some of the "foul weight" off, and also add rim protection abilities. Not to mention, Rodriguez should (hopefully) be his old reliable self on the boards. As a thought experiment, a la Einstein, imagine if we would be facing someone like Cameron Jackson? Can our guys handle that? While he is gone, there are so many new faces in the paint on other teams, there most likely will be a couple of good ones. Open question.

3 (maybe)) I'll throw this in, too, but it's rather nebulous. Inability to get to ball inside as needed, in the correct positions, to the bigs. This has been a chronic problem thru the years, off and on. It's been awhile since we've had someone who truly excelled at that (and yet wasn't too aggressive). But..........with the emergence of Boyd's penetrative abilities, and Williamson's further progress on pushing the ball, and possibly even another surprise like Bo doing some dealing with the expanded role Forbes mentioned (altho I have a hard time thinking that will be a major 'thing'). Will Good be healed up enough to take part in that? Will Hugley, who's a smart player, create some of that inside passing we love? Will Monsanto flash some of that? (I'm thinking not likely as of now.) Don't be shocked to see Corley have an assist or two per game. He's clever like that.

4) Are our guards big and strong enough to man up with big guards they'll see on other strong teams? Tisdale won't back down, we know that, and Bo won't back down, either, but there *may* be an occasional mismatch there.

All this is just some off-the-cuff observations. Not in any way meant to be a comprehensive overview. Just a bit of a Sun Tzu gander at potential downsides. Much easier to tout the upsides, of which there are a bunch. At the end of the year, the level of the team's success will likely be a product more of it's (lack of?) losses than it's wins, notwithstanding beating a Kansas or something like that. Avoiding losses is key to having any shot of an at-large bid, as we all know. This may be even more true this year.

p.s. -- This doesn't apply to the above, but I love the basketball savvy of Hugley. Very smart pick-up. Lots of tools and competent in almost all phases of the game, without being flashy in any. Good hands and instincts. Reminds me a little of Scott Place, mentioned earlier in this thread (or maybe even Pelphrey), altho he won't be required to wear nearly as many hats as they did.

(08-20-2019 10:07 AM)posterformerlyknownasthedoctor Wrote:  

(05-03-2019 12:47 AM)squeak Wrote:  At this moment do we have the players who can bring it home?

Well, it's no longer "at this moment", but we certainly have a lot more information now than we did back in May. I'm not gonna wax all poetic here and now, but this will be a good Buccaneer team. In fact, it will be a very good Buccaneer team. It seems Forbes has again done a masterful job of putting the pieces together. Will it be a "great" ETSU team? Obviously too early to tell, but if Jeromy and Good are all healed up by, say, November, then it could be.

What are the biggest weaknesses? Hmmm..... I can think of three (or four) things right off, which are really just generic things that could apply to most teams that aren't in the NBA:

1) Once again having cold streaks shooting from outside. We know they *can* shoot; sometimes things just don't fall and it becomes contagious. But with Good and Boyd both being of the unconscious mindset, hopefully any lapses will be short. It would be awesome and a significant advantage if Charlie Webber can continue to demonstrate that pretty outside stroke he has shown in Europe. And we know Hugley has that capability, too. Remains to be seen if Patterson, Williamson (he should), or Monsanto can put up some numbers every once in a while. But still........Boyd and/or Good will need to be "on" more than "off".

2) Bigs getting in foul trouble, especially N'Guessan. After watching his action in Europe, I see some improvement on offense. As I stated on another thread, he's now showing the promise from the Stillwater highlight tapes. But I also see his propensity to "reach in" (and reach over, too) is still there. His footwork seemed ok, but hard to tell against players whose foot speed wasn't quite what the top SoCon and American bigs will have. The good news there is Corley should be able to take some of the "foul weight" off, and also add rim protection abilities. Not to mention, Rodriguez should (hopefully) be his old reliable self on the boards. As a thought experiment, a la Einstein, imagine if we would be facing someone like Cameron Jackson? Can our guys handle that? While he is gone, there are so many new faces in the paint on other teams, there most likely will be a couple of good ones. Open question.

3 (maybe)) I'll throw this in, too, but it's rather nebulous. Inability to get to ball inside as needed, in the correct positions, to the bigs. This has been a chronic problem thru the years, off and on. It's been awhile since we've had someone who truly excelled at that (and yet wasn't too aggressive). But..........with the emergence of Boyd's penetrative abilities, and Williamson's further progress on pushing the ball, and possibly even another surprise like Bo doing some dealing with the expanded role Forbes mentioned (altho I have a hard time thinking that will be a major 'thing'). Will Good be healed up enough to take part in that? Will Hugley, who's a smart player, create some of that inside passing we love? Will Monsanto flash some of that? (I'm thinking not likely as of now.) Don't be shocked to see Corley have an assist or two per game. He's clever like that.

4) Are our guards big and strong enough to man up with big guards they'll see on other strong teams? Tisdale won't back down, we know that, and Bo won't back down, either, but there *may* be an occasional mismatch there.

All this is just some off-the-cuff observations. Not in any way meant to be a comprehensive overview. Just a bit of a Sun Tzu gander at potential downsides. Much easier to tout the upsides, of which there are a bunch. At the end of the year, the level of the team's success will likely be a product more of it's (lack of?) losses than it's wins, notwithstanding beating a Kansas or something like that. Avoiding losses is key to having any shot of an at-large bid, as we all know. This may be even more true this year.

p.s. -- This doesn't apply to the above, but I love the basketball savvy of Hugley. Very smart pick-up. Lots of tools and competent in almost all phases of the game, without being flashy in any. Good hands and instincts. Reminds me a little of Scott Place, mentioned earlier in this thread (or maybe even Pelphrey), altho he won't be required to wear nearly as many hats as they did.

Do you think we are a better basketball without Mladen?

(08-20-2019 10:45 AM)squeak Wrote:  Do you think we are a better basketball without Mladen?

I'm going to chime in and say yes. Don't get me wrong I like Mladen and wish he had stayed, as I want all of all players to stay, but after watching yesterdays game and highlights of the other games in Europe I think we have upgraded in Charlie Webber and Joe Hugley.

Both Joe and Charlie showed they can shoot the three and both seem to have better post moves as well. Mladen might be a better rebounder and of course he is taller but I think we will be better off offensively without Mladen. Remember how often Mladen would get blocked or the ball stolen from him whenever he had the ball in the post? I just have a feeling those turnovers won't happen nearly as often with Charlie and Joe after seeing them play.

(08-20-2019 10:07 AM)posterformerlyknownasthedoctor Wrote:  I'm not gonna wax all poetic here and now, but this will be a good Buccaneer team. In fact, it will be a very good Buccaneer team. It seems Forbes has again done a masterful job of putting the pieces together. Will it be a "great" ETSU team? Obviously too early to tell, but if Jeromy and Good are all healed up by, say, November, then it could be.

That's pretty much how I'm feeling about this team at this point. Partly from the skill of the guys on the floor. Partly from the spirit that's being shown, including from guys who were not always leaders in that department last year. Should be a very good team. Has a chance to become a great one. One that can get together 25 years from now and still love to be together and bask in the love from the fans. Some good first steps have been taken. But there's lots of work to be done before that dream can come true.

In the "matching up with big guards" department. I think that Vonnie Patterson will help in that regard, particularly on the defensive end. He looks and plays bigger than his 6-4 189 listing. He seems to have a nose for tough defensive work, and the athleticism to match up with quality D1 guards.

So many guys seem to have raised and expanded their games: Bo most of all, but also Pun, Tray, Lucas and Daivien. Octavion Corley is still capable of losing his way - but he's also capable of the big defensive move and the clever score. Charlie Weber is more than I thought we were getting, as is Damari.

We lose muscle with Mladen, and we will miss that against some teams. But the broad shouldered Joe Hugley is such a smooth offensive player, and not small. And Lucas is showing us so much more than last year. We should be better scoring inside, with fewer turnovers.

(08-20-2019 10:45 AM)squeak Wrote:  Do you think we are a better basketball without Mladen?

Too early to say. I think it's been a trade-off (duh). I think some here have been selling Mladen short. He was a huge asset. IF Corley, Hugely, Webber, et al, fulfill their promise, then yes. Just too early to say that. Mladen was very dependable. Had some faults, sure; but more than outweighed by his skills. Also, as we know, at time Armus and Rodriguez made a supreme combination. It may depend on how well our bigs "blend".

Rodriguez is a really good "blender". If he gets back fully healthy, it will be fun to see how he "blends" with Hugley and Lucas. And with Weber and Corley.

And yes, some folks are selling Mladen short. There are reasons that Forbes gave Mladen, and not N'Guessan or Corley, the major minutes last year. Rebounding and tough, physical defense really improved for him. He was always a hard worker.

Still, this year's front court COULD be better.

1. I almost mentioned Patterson in what I wrote, but had to draw the line somewhere. While he *appears* to be physical and capable, it's just too early to say. He may have some quite substantial upside - but it may to tough to get PT. And I totally agree he's bigger than his listing. He looks 6'5", 195-200 to me. And strong.

2. As to the trade-off of losing Armus, vs. gaining who we've gained........"as of this moment"..............my hunch is that the loss of Armus will hurt us sometimes when muscle is needed. And muscle will be needed. Yes, Hugely will help replace him, but so far he's shown more of a proclivity to be a tweener. A lot of how he actually plays will likely be what's in Forbes's mind, and how others are performing. But dig this - he *will* get PT. Against some teams, the combo of Corley, Hugely, and N'Guessan will be better than an Armus. In some cases, against some teams, we'll be thinking, "Gee, it'd have been nice to have ol' Mladen in there tonight." That will be considerably opponent-dependent. And again, that is only my hunch.

p.s. - insight: Corley and Bo like to team up, and will look for each other as the opportunity arises.

Mladen's biggest weakness was he could only go to the hoop with his left hand, and this is why he had so many shots blocked. Hugley can use both, and it appears Corley can go to the rim with both. It's a big issue, because you know every scout said "he always shoots with his left." It made him much easier to defend. Armus other weakness was he had no range. I think we will be fine without him based on what I've seen thus far.

I doubt that you will see much, if any, of NGuessen, Corley and Hugely playing together. To many negatives.

To me, the loss of Mladen is a wash. He was a very good defender and an excellent rebounder. On the other hand, he was a poor free throw shooter with very limited offensive skills — with a strong propensity for turning the ball over or getting his shot blocked.

I'm still surprised he decided to transfer. But, if the staff at his new school can "coach him up" on offense, he may be better off.

(08-21-2019 06:45 PM)Buc76 Wrote:  I doubt that you will see much, if any, of NGuessen, Corley and Hugely playing together. To many negatives.

N'Guessan and Corley on the court together will be an extreme rarity, most likely, but that will not be true for Hugely. He'll be on the court with either of them - and a lot of the time. In no way will they somehow get in each other's way. Not sure what you mean by "To[sic] many negatives.".

(08-21-2019 11:07 AM)GoBucsGo Wrote:  Mladen's biggest weakness was he could only go to the hoop with his left hand, and this is why he had so many shots blocked. Hugley can use both, and it appears Corley can go to the rim with both. It's a big issue, because you know every scout said "he always shoots with his left." It made him much easier to defend. Armus other weakness was he had no range. I think we will be fine without him based on what I've seen thus far.

I hesitate to post this, but I finally will. I believe I was the first person to post about Mladen's left-hand tendencies at the very beginning, and back at that time it was considered a good thing. He developed that proclivity because he was most often on the right side of the goal, and used the goal to protect the shot. It worked *very* well for him and ETSU until the other teams finally updated their "book" on him by about mid-season last year. Only *then* did he start getting his shot blocked. And to be clear, he did not *always* shoot with the left - only maybe 70-80% of the time. He went with that when the odds were higher (in his mind) his right would get blocked because of the positioning of his defender. Clearly he stayed with the left too long after he got found out. But as I've said several times on this board, its SOOO hard for bigs to break habits inside. That's why so many want to take that "safety dribble". This would be another example.

And of course Armus had no range, that's why Forbes stated they were working with him last off-season to add that weapon. From all accounts, he got pretty decent at in practice, but (as we know all too well) couldn't reproduce that in games, the few times he tried it. The last of which led to Forbes going off on him. I don't know for a fact that that had anything to do with him leaving, but I'm betting it did.

Armus took up space in the paint like Corley and N'Guessan can't really do. He was hard to move, hard to move past, and hard to move around. If you look closely at the Europe games, the Hungarian teams especially rebounded very well against the Bucs considering their height disadvantage. There are other teams we'll play that will do likewise - and moreso because of Armus's absence. Hugely will help some there, but it's too soon to know how much.

To be clear......I'm *not* saying Armus's absence will hurt us more than the presence of the others will help us. Not saying that at all. I'm just saying Armus was an entity that we won't be exactly replacing. And at times that could be telling. Hopefully, the upside of the others will more than offset his loss. We're tall in the middle - taller than I think we've ever been in history. But, other than Rodriguez, we're not thick. Maybe Monsanto to an extent, but that's a different thing, as best as we know now.

"Tall" is good. "Thick" is good, too. We've got plenty of the former, less of the latter, but we can't yet know if that will truly hurt us or not. Our speed will still "kill", but that's not as valuable underneath.

Forbes is going to be on the Morning Monster talking to Bobby about the trip at 9:10

(08-23-2019 07:40 AM)RodShaw2 Wrote:  Forbes is going to be on the Morning Monster talking to Bobby about the trip at 9:10

Thanks. That will be great to hear Coach talk about a trip like that. It seems it had a very positive effect on the team.

(05-03-2019 12:47 AM)squeak Wrote:  At this moment do we have the players who can bring it home?

Again, altho it's been a long, up-and-down ride since you asked that, Dortch thinks so:

Chris Dortch tabs Bucs

Not surprising.

Kenny Hawkins's take on it:

Hawkins tells it

(09-20-2019 01:26 PM)posterformerlyknownasthedoctor Wrote:  

(05-03-2019 12:47 AM)squeak Wrote:  At this moment do we have the players who can bring it home?

Again, altho it's been a long, up-and-down ride since you asked that, Dortch thinks so:

Chris Dortch tabs Bucs

Not surprising.

Kenny Hawkins's take on it:

Hawkins tells it

Blue Ribbon, the best source for preseason Mid Major rankings, makes the intelligent pick thanks to Chris Dortch. Clearly ETSU is the SoCon team with the most proven performers coming back. (What, no Wofford?) Official practice should start next week. Could an open practice be far behind?? We'll soon see how things actually play out.

Order is apparently:
ETSU
Furman
UNCG
Wofford
Samford
Chattanooga
Western Carolina
Mercer
The Citadel
VMI

Preseason POY: Jeromy Rodriguez, joined on 1st team all conference by Bo Hodges, James Dickey and Isaiah Miller of UNCG and Jordan Lyons of Furman. Chattanooga's transfer Matt Ryan gets newcomer of the year. He might not be even the best newcomer in Chattanooga with the arrival of 6-3 athletic marvel Trey Doomes.
http://www.etsubucs.com/mbasketball/news...-yearbook/

Go Bucs!

Bump - just for discussion or reflection....

Joe>>>Mladen

I predict we will in the conference championship this season.

Brought to you by Procrastinators anonymous.