GoldenWarrior11
Heisman
Posts: 5,679
Joined: Jul 2015
Reputation: 607
I Root For: Marquette, BE
Location: Chicago
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RE: FBS Split and if the Big East has to add FB to stay D1
(05-05-2019 08:06 AM)Kit-Cat Wrote: (05-03-2019 11:36 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote: (05-02-2019 10:36 PM)Kit-Cat Wrote: Nice geographic divisions. Ohio would have to go east as its located in the Alleghany Plateau
BE Atlantic
Georgetown $1.77b
Buffalo $725m
St. John's $716m
Villanova $711m
Ohio $569m
Massachusetts $326m
Seton Hall $242m
Old Dominion $240m
Providence $213m
BE Central
Marquette $668m
DePaul $595m
Creighton $568m
Miami $535m
Toledo $455m
Western Mich. $405m
Butler $174m
Xavier $169m
Northern Ill. $74m
It's not just Northern Illinois that would be a poor fit academically; it's a majority of the league.
Academic Rankings - Big East
Butler - #1, Regional Midwest (tied)
Creighton - #1, Regional Midwest (tied)*
DePaul - #119, National
Georgetown - #22, National
Marquette - #89, National
Providence - #2, Regional North
Seton Hall - #119, National
St. John's - #152, National
Villanova - #49, National
Xavier - #8, Regional Midwest
*Creighton just got elevated to a National University this week.
Academic Rankings - MAC
Akron - #230-301, National
Ball State - #171, National
Bowling Green - #215, National
Buffalo - #89, National
Central Michigan - #205, National
Eastern Michigan - #230-301, National
Kent State - #191, National
Miami - #96, National
Northern Illinois - #230-301, National
Ohio - #171, National
Toledo - #230-301, National
Western Michigan - #205, National
Seven of the Big East schools are national universities, each of whom are academically ranked higher than ten of the MAC schools. The only MAC institutions that would fall within the current Big East range would be Buffalo and Miami.
Disregarding the lack of institutional fit (and I am not even considering football programs, here - just metropolitan markets and private schools), these two leagues are listening to different music at completely different dances; they are hardly a good-fit as dance partners.
Georgetown is a top tier school. But the remainder of the BE has traditionally been regarded in the mid tier.
Included in the proposed BE callups are WMU (Kalamazoo), Toledo, Buffalo, UMass (statewide), Ohio (statewide), NIU (metro Chicago), ODU (Tidewater). Miami is metro Dayton/Cincinnati. These particular additions are metro oriented.
I'm not calling up CMU, EMU, Ball St, BG, Akron, Kent from the MAC to join the Big East. Its the upper half of the MAC I am talking about.
Its also important to think about academics from the standpoint of what programs these schools offer. Most of the proposed callups have a significant STEM component. Most of the BE schools to be honest don't and they can set the rigor as low as they want as private schools.
Taking this back to the idea the BE is a sacrosanct addition to the P5 in the event of a split that is a bunch of straight up BS. They are not on the level of the private schools of the ACC, a company the P5 likes to keep.
BE is mostly mid tier, regional universities. You can throw out the USWNR rankings designations. Designated national on that is meaningless. Its where a school is on the academic food chain. Some are excellent mid tier schools, others are poor excuses for them.
Don't use USNWR rankings. Got it. Want to use Forbes' rankings instead ( https://www.forbes.com/top-colleges/list/)? There is an even more glaring separation in academic rankings.
Butler - #237, National
Creighton - #222, National
DePaul - #243, National
Georgetown - #12, National
Marquette - #175, National
Providence - #162, National
Seton Hall - #287, National
St. John's - #215, National
Villanova - #70, National
Xavier - #272, National
Akron - Unlisted
Ball State - #503, National
Bowling Green - #604, National
Buffalo - #189, National
Central Michigan - #614, National
Eastern Michigan - Unlisted
Kent State - #633, National
Miami - #159, National
Northern Illinois - #603, National
Ohio - #416, National
Toledo - #619, National
Western Michigan - #577, National
As much as you wish to create a line of symmetry between the Big East and the MAC, very few common traits exist. The Big East, in its present form enjoys many positive and beneficial relationships with P5 conferences, and many of its member schools. You can continue to argue for hypothetical situations otherwise, but it does not change either conference's outlook moving forward.
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