(04-15-2019 08:35 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(04-14-2019 05:51 AM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-13-2019 10:59 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(04-13-2019 09:35 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  My point was that getting vaccinations does not make you "healthier". They don't give you lifelong immunity (only waning) and you can still get the diseases (although rare) even if vaccinated. They can negatively affect your health. Catching a dealy disease is what harms your health, not the failure to get the vaccine. You have to consider the risk of getting the disease and the risks of the vaccine and decide if it is worth it. For example, if your kid got encephalopathy, paralysis, or died from a vaccine would you feel it was worth it considering your risk of catching polio in the US is virtually nil? Notice that you had to use photos from the 50s to show the dangers of polio. I recognize that vaccines generally wiped out the disease, but you've got to consider the risk-benefit analysis of it now. Polio is not ravaging America now. And even if it was, it would be harmless for most people who caught it. If an epidemic flairs up, they risk analysis changes.

I'm not pro or anti vaccine. I fall into whats called "vaccine friendly" which is a category of people who believe that individuals parents should decide whats best medically for their child. I generally am concerned about the number of vaccines that are given to children at a very young age and that there are costs to that. I also recognize the benefits of vaccination and think it is good to get most vaccines, but on an alternative or delayed schedule. I think we tend to fear some diseases too much. I had chickenpox as a kid, does every kid need a chicken pox vaccine? My dad had the measles and mumps as a kid and describes it like having the chiken pox. Annoying, but not especially dangerous for the vast majority of people. We act like any kid who gets the measles will die when the odds of dying from measles in the US are closer to 1-in-a-billion.

Not true. The actual number is about 1 in 1000. The actual number of deaths has been so trivial due to the high vaccination rate so that very few people get it, and outbreaks are extremely suppressed. But when you have larger groups refusing to vaccinate, and you get an outbreak, you will have a larger number of deaths from a disease that was essentially eradicated.

I guarantee you that the death rate from measles is magnitudes greater than death or even issues caused by vaccination. And thats just one disease that the vaccination is fighting against.

If you have a child who died from measles, that was truly a death that never had to happen.

In addition, about 1 in 20 children who get measles also gets pneumonia.

The 1 in 1000 number is the risk of getting a serious complication once you've caught the measles. The 1 in a billion number I quoted is your risk of catching the disease and dying from the disease in the US.

Again, thats not true.

Between 1985 and 1992, death from measles was reported in approximately 2 out of every 1,000 US measles cases, with pneumonia accounting for about 60% of these deaths, according to the CDC

The number of deaths from measels is somewhere between 1 and 3 out of 1000. Even in the US, with great medical care and technology, the last major outbreak saw 2 out of 1000 deaths.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/05/health/ho...index.html

We are miscommunicating I think. I am saying your risk of dying from the measles in the US is 1 in a billion in general (meaning as an average member of society who hasnt yet caught the disease). The 1 in 1000 death rate you cite is the risk of death once you are INFECTED with the disease. I dont dispute that number. Just pointing out that your risk of contracting the disease AND dying from it is microscopic. Like winning the lotto and getting struck by lightning on the same day microscopic.

(04-14-2019 07:47 PM)king king Wrote:  How many of us know someone that has died or had serious complications from a vaccine?

A guy a grew up with had a kid who had severe seizures from a vaccine. I think it was MMR. Kid had a genetic condition. Doctor didnt read packaging insert and kid got hurt. The parents will have to be very discerning about which vaccines they give, if any.

My own child had a scary reaction to the rotovirus oral vaccine. She started violently throwing up halfway through administration of the vaccine and have projectile vomit for about a week. It was a scary week. We were afraid she might have to be hospitalized for dehydration and we were very worried about her choking on vomit while sleeping. We lost a lot of sleep. She was about 2-4 months at the time. She is fine now though.

A friend of my mom had a son who has autism. The mother is convinced vaccines gave the child autism. I know the majority of physicians say they cant cause autism. There are some vaccine experts who say it can cause autism in a small subset of children with genetic conditions. One was recently featured on Sheryl Atkissions Full Measure because he had previously been a major government witness in vaccine autism cases and now supported the conclusion that vaccines can cause autism in rare cases.

(04-15-2019 06:34 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-14-2019 07:47 PM)king king Wrote:  How many of us know someone that has died or had serious complications from a vaccine?

A guy a grew up with had a kid who had severe seizures from a vaccine. I think it was MMR. Kid had a genetic condition. Doctor didnt read packaging insert and kid got hurt. The parents will have to be very discerning about which vaccines they give, if any.

My own child had a scary reaction to the rotovirus oral vaccine. She started violently throwing up halfway through administration of the vaccine and have projectile vomit for about a week. It was a scary week. We were afraid she might have to be hospitalized for dehydration and we were very worried about her choking on vomit while sleeping. We lost a lot of sleep. She was about 2-4 months at the time. She is fine now though.

A friend of my mom had a son who has autism. The mother is convinced vaccines gave the child autism. I know the majority of physicians say they cant cause autism. There are some vaccine experts who say it can cause autism in a small subset of children with genetic conditions. One was recently featured on Sheryl Atkissions Full Measure because he had previously been a major government witness in vaccine autism cases and now supported the conclusion that vaccines can cause autism in rare cases.

What makes that mom think a vaccine caused her son's autism. Does she refer to that debunked study from that doctor that has his medical license revoked? Does she think her son was one of those rare cases? BTW, not trying to get you to speak for her but I am genuinely curious.

(04-16-2019 07:45 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(04-15-2019 06:34 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-14-2019 07:47 PM)king king Wrote:  How many of us know someone that has died or had serious complications from a vaccine?

A guy a grew up with had a kid who had severe seizures from a vaccine. I think it was MMR. Kid had a genetic condition. Doctor didnt read packaging insert and kid got hurt. The parents will have to be very discerning about which vaccines they give, if any.

My own child had a scary reaction to the rotovirus oral vaccine. She started violently throwing up halfway through administration of the vaccine and have projectile vomit for about a week. It was a scary week. We were afraid she might have to be hospitalized for dehydration and we were very worried about her choking on vomit while sleeping. We lost a lot of sleep. She was about 2-4 months at the time. She is fine now though.

A friend of my mom had a son who has autism. The mother is convinced vaccines gave the child autism. I know the majority of physicians say they cant cause autism. There are some vaccine experts who say it can cause autism in a small subset of children with genetic conditions. One was recently featured on Sheryl Atkissions Full Measure because he had previously been a major government witness in vaccine autism cases and now supported the conclusion that vaccines can cause autism in rare cases.

What makes that mom think a vaccine caused her son's autism. Does she refer to that debunked study from that doctor that has his medical license revoked? Does she think her son was one of those rare cases? BTW, not trying to get you to speak for her but I am genuinely curious.

I honestly dont know for sure. I believe it was that he was developing normally, but he showed signs of autism in close proximity to getting some vaccines.

(04-16-2019 07:33 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-16-2019 07:45 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(04-15-2019 06:34 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-14-2019 07:47 PM)king king Wrote:  How many of us know someone that has died or had serious complications from a vaccine?

A guy a grew up with had a kid who had severe seizures from a vaccine. I think it was MMR. Kid had a genetic condition. Doctor didnt read packaging insert and kid got hurt. The parents will have to be very discerning about which vaccines they give, if any.

My own child had a scary reaction to the rotovirus oral vaccine. She started violently throwing up halfway through administration of the vaccine and have projectile vomit for about a week. It was a scary week. We were afraid she might have to be hospitalized for dehydration and we were very worried about her choking on vomit while sleeping. We lost a lot of sleep. She was about 2-4 months at the time. She is fine now though.

A friend of my mom had a son who has autism. The mother is convinced vaccines gave the child autism. I know the majority of physicians say they cant cause autism. There are some vaccine experts who say it can cause autism in a small subset of children with genetic conditions. One was recently featured on Sheryl Atkissions Full Measure because he had previously been a major government witness in vaccine autism cases and now supported the conclusion that vaccines can cause autism in rare cases.

What makes that mom think a vaccine caused her son's autism. Does she refer to that debunked study from that doctor that has his medical license revoked? Does she think her son was one of those rare cases? BTW, not trying to get you to speak for her but I am genuinely curious.

I honestly dont know for sure. I believe it was that he was developing normally, but he showed signs of autism in close proximity to getting some vaccines.

That happens all the time.

Kids are happy, healthy, normal. They get the MMR shot (specifically) and within 24 hours, they have seizures, regress with walking & talking, etc.

There are countless parents in the US that tell this same story.

There is something about the combination of the 3 vaccines that isn’t right... but big pharma has way too much invested in the combo vaccine to allow people to take it in 3 separate doses. One for measels, one for mumps, and one for rubella.

(04-16-2019 07:33 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-16-2019 07:45 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(04-15-2019 06:34 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-14-2019 07:47 PM)king king Wrote:  How many of us know someone that has died or had serious complications from a vaccine?

A guy a grew up with had a kid who had severe seizures from a vaccine. I think it was MMR. Kid had a genetic condition. Doctor didnt read packaging insert and kid got hurt. The parents will have to be very discerning about which vaccines they give, if any.

My own child had a scary reaction to the rotovirus oral vaccine. She started violently throwing up halfway through administration of the vaccine and have projectile vomit for about a week. It was a scary week. We were afraid she might have to be hospitalized for dehydration and we were very worried about her choking on vomit while sleeping. We lost a lot of sleep. She was about 2-4 months at the time. She is fine now though.

A friend of my mom had a son who has autism. The mother is convinced vaccines gave the child autism. I know the majority of physicians say they cant cause autism. There are some vaccine experts who say it can cause autism in a small subset of children with genetic conditions. One was recently featured on Sheryl Atkissions Full Measure because he had previously been a major government witness in vaccine autism cases and now supported the conclusion that vaccines can cause autism in rare cases.

What makes that mom think a vaccine caused her son's autism. Does she refer to that debunked study from that doctor that has his medical license revoked? Does she think her son was one of those rare cases? BTW, not trying to get you to speak for her but I am genuinely curious.

I honestly dont know for sure. I believe it was that he was developing normally, but he showed signs of autism in close proximity to getting some vaccines.

One of the problems in figuring it out is that the ages kids are given vaccines as well as the age when signs of Autism starting to become apparent happen around the same age. So there's a bit of 'correlation = causation' in a lot of peoples minds.

(04-16-2019 09:28 PM)ECUGrad07 Wrote:  

(04-16-2019 07:33 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-16-2019 07:45 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(04-15-2019 06:34 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-14-2019 07:47 PM)king king Wrote:  How many of us know someone that has died or had serious complications from a vaccine?

A guy a grew up with had a kid who had severe seizures from a vaccine. I think it was MMR. Kid had a genetic condition. Doctor didnt read packaging insert and kid got hurt. The parents will have to be very discerning about which vaccines they give, if any.

My own child had a scary reaction to the rotovirus oral vaccine. She started violently throwing up halfway through administration of the vaccine and have projectile vomit for about a week. It was a scary week. We were afraid she might have to be hospitalized for dehydration and we were very worried about her choking on vomit while sleeping. We lost a lot of sleep. She was about 2-4 months at the time. She is fine now though.

A friend of my mom had a son who has autism. The mother is convinced vaccines gave the child autism. I know the majority of physicians say they cant cause autism. There are some vaccine experts who say it can cause autism in a small subset of children with genetic conditions. One was recently featured on Sheryl Atkissions Full Measure because he had previously been a major government witness in vaccine autism cases and now supported the conclusion that vaccines can cause autism in rare cases.

What makes that mom think a vaccine caused her son's autism. Does she refer to that debunked study from that doctor that has his medical license revoked? Does she think her son was one of those rare cases? BTW, not trying to get you to speak for her but I am genuinely curious.

I honestly dont know for sure. I believe it was that he was developing normally, but he showed signs of autism in close proximity to getting some vaccines.

That happens all the time.

Kids are happy, healthy, normal. They get the MMR shot (specifically) and within 24 hours, they have seizures, regress with walking & talking, etc.

There are countless parents in the US that tell this same story.

There is something about the combination of the 3 vaccines that isn’t right... but big pharma has way too much invested in the combo vaccine to allow people to take it in 3 separate doses. One for measels, one for mumps, and one for rubella.

My wife refuses to have that particular vaccine given to our child due to the countless powerful stories you mention. I wanted to wait until the child was 3 or 4 to give it because at that point the child is already mentally developed and far less likely to have regression (according to a doctor I respect). I defintely view MMR as the most dangerous vaccine out there for children. I've often wondered if the medical community is misdiagnosising encephalopathy from a vaccine injury and brain damage from that as autism.

Mom groups on Facebook are a scourge on society.

(04-17-2019 06:42 AM)ArmyBlazer Wrote:  Mom groups on Facebook are a scourge on society.

Facebook is a scourge on society.

FTFY.

(04-16-2019 10:30 PM)q5sys Wrote:  

(04-16-2019 07:33 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-16-2019 07:45 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(04-15-2019 06:34 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(04-14-2019 07:47 PM)king king Wrote:  How many of us know someone that has died or had serious complications from a vaccine?

A guy a grew up with had a kid who had severe seizures from a vaccine. I think it was MMR. Kid had a genetic condition. Doctor didnt read packaging insert and kid got hurt. The parents will have to be very discerning about which vaccines they give, if any.

My own child had a scary reaction to the rotovirus oral vaccine. She started violently throwing up halfway through administration of the vaccine and have projectile vomit for about a week. It was a scary week. We were afraid she might have to be hospitalized for dehydration and we were very worried about her choking on vomit while sleeping. We lost a lot of sleep. She was about 2-4 months at the time. She is fine now though.

A friend of my mom had a son who has autism. The mother is convinced vaccines gave the child autism. I know the majority of physicians say they cant cause autism. There are some vaccine experts who say it can cause autism in a small subset of children with genetic conditions. One was recently featured on Sheryl Atkissions Full Measure because he had previously been a major government witness in vaccine autism cases and now supported the conclusion that vaccines can cause autism in rare cases.

What makes that mom think a vaccine caused her son's autism. Does she refer to that debunked study from that doctor that has his medical license revoked? Does she think her son was one of those rare cases? BTW, not trying to get you to speak for her but I am genuinely curious.

I honestly dont know for sure. I believe it was that he was developing normally, but he showed signs of autism in close proximity to getting some vaccines.

One of the problems in figuring it out is that the ages kids are given vaccines as well as the age when signs of Autism starting to become apparent happen around the same age. So there's a bit of 'correlation = causation' in a lot of peoples minds.

I'm thinking that may be it and most of the stories may just come down to coincidence.