Caught the last few minutes of his show. Had Jerry Calhoun on and showing footage of Jerry against Ric Flair on saturday morning wrestling.

(03-30-2019 03:28 PM)Hernando Hills Tiger Wrote:  Caught the last few minutes of his show. Had Jerry Calhoun on and showing footage of Jerry against Ric Flair on saturday morning wrestling.

Saw That one a few times.

He tried to feed the fans a bunch of bullcrap by trying to make them think that the WWE rules applied back then and you could not lose the title on a count out.

Which you could do in the NWA. Remember a match between Lawler and Bockwinkle where the "wrestling Press" made a big deal about Bockwinkle barely beating the count in the match and almost losing the title.

Believe the story behind the Lawler/Flair match when it happened was that the NWA governing body did not recognize the match as an official title match.

He may have been the biggest star in the modern era. But he is also a major reason for the failure of Memphis wrestling. EVERY star before him moved on when their time was over. Billy Wicks stepped aside for Sputnik Monroe and then Sputnik moved aside for Jackie Fargo and then Fargo moved aside when it came time for Lawler to carry the area. Lawler's ego would not allow for the development of another local star to carry the local promotion.

Lawler is the GoaT

(03-30-2019 04:54 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 03:28 PM)Hernando Hills Tiger Wrote:  Caught the last few minutes of his show. Had Jerry Calhoun on and showing footage of Jerry against Ric Flair on saturday morning wrestling.

Saw That one a few times.

He tried to feed the fans a bunch of bullcrap by trying to make them think that the WWE rules applied back then and you could not lose the title on a count out.

Which you could do in the NWA. Remember a match between Lawler and Bockwinkle where the "wrestling Press" made a big deal about Bockwinkle barely beating the count in the match and almost losing the title.

Believe the story behind the Lawler/Flair match when it happened was that the NWA governing body did not recognize the match as an official title match.

He may have been the biggest star in the modern era. But he is also a major reason for the failure of Memphis wrestling. EVERY star before him moved on when their time was over. Billy Wicks stepped aside for Sputnik Monroe and then Sputnik moved aside for Jackie Fargo and then Fargo moved aside when it came time for Lawler to carry the area. Lawler's ego would not allow for the development of another local star to carry the local promotion.

by the time Lawler would have had to move memphis wrestling was DEAD

(03-30-2019 05:11 PM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 04:54 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 03:28 PM)Hernando Hills Tiger Wrote:  Caught the last few minutes of his show. Had Jerry Calhoun on and showing footage of Jerry against Ric Flair on saturday morning wrestling.

Saw That one a few times.

He tried to feed the fans a bunch of bullcrap by trying to make them think that the WWE rules applied back then and you could not lose the title on a count out.

Which you could do in the NWA. Remember a match between Lawler and Bockwinkle where the "wrestling Press" made a big deal about Bockwinkle barely beating the count in the match and almost losing the title.

Believe the story behind the Lawler/Flair match when it happened was that the NWA governing body did not recognize the match as an official title match.

He may have been the biggest star in the modern era. But he is also a major reason for the failure of Memphis wrestling. EVERY star before him moved on when their time was over. Billy Wicks stepped aside for Sputnik Monroe and then Sputnik moved aside for Jackie Fargo and then Fargo moved aside when it came time for Lawler to carry the area. Lawler's ego would not allow for the development of another local star to carry the local promotion.

by the time Lawler would have had to move memphis wrestling was DEAD

It died when they stopped selling beer at the MSC.

(03-30-2019 03:28 PM)Hernando Hills Tiger Wrote:  Caught the last few minutes of his show. Had Jerry Calhoun on and showing footage of Jerry against Ric Flair on saturday morning wrestling.

I have it set on my dvr, and it's been recording the same 10 shows over and over for about a year.

(03-30-2019 05:11 PM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 04:54 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 03:28 PM)Hernando Hills Tiger Wrote:  Caught the last few minutes of his show. Had Jerry Calhoun on and showing footage of Jerry against Ric Flair on saturday morning wrestling.

Saw That one a few times.

He tried to feed the fans a bunch of bullcrap by trying to make them think that the WWE rules applied back then and you could not lose the title on a count out.

Which you could do in the NWA. Remember a match between Lawler and Bockwinkle where the "wrestling Press" made a big deal about Bockwinkle barely beating the count in the match and almost losing the title.

Believe the story behind the Lawler/Flair match when it happened was that the NWA governing body did not recognize the match as an official title match.

He may have been the biggest star in the modern era. But he is also a major reason for the failure of Memphis wrestling. EVERY star before him moved on when their time was over. Billy Wicks stepped aside for Sputnik Monroe and then Sputnik moved aside for Jackie Fargo and then Fargo moved aside when it came time for Lawler to carry the area. Lawler's ego would not allow for the development of another local star to carry the local promotion.

by the time Lawler would have had to move memphis wrestling was DEAD

Lawler was in his mid-40s before the Monday night wars occurred. And the USWA remained fairly competitive for a couple of years before finally succumbing to the battle for Monday night. By this time the USWA had become a feeder promotion for the WWF. Lawler had signed his personal contract with the WWF and destroyed the image of the USWA by acting like a total buffoon on national tv and then tried to act like the badass face of the promotion when he was back in town.

(03-30-2019 07:42 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 05:11 PM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 04:54 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 03:28 PM)Hernando Hills Tiger Wrote:  Caught the last few minutes of his show. Had Jerry Calhoun on and showing footage of Jerry against Ric Flair on saturday morning wrestling.

Saw That one a few times.

He tried to feed the fans a bunch of bullcrap by trying to make them think that the WWE rules applied back then and you could not lose the title on a count out.

Which you could do in the NWA. Remember a match between Lawler and Bockwinkle where the "wrestling Press" made a big deal about Bockwinkle barely beating the count in the match and almost losing the title.

Believe the story behind the Lawler/Flair match when it happened was that the NWA governing body did not recognize the match as an official title match.

He may have been the biggest star in the modern era. But he is also a major reason for the failure of Memphis wrestling. EVERY star before him moved on when their time was over. Billy Wicks stepped aside for Sputnik Monroe and then Sputnik moved aside for Jackie Fargo and then Fargo moved aside when it came time for Lawler to carry the area. Lawler's ego would not allow for the development of another local star to carry the local promotion.

by the time Lawler would have had to move memphis wrestling was DEAD

Lawler was in his mid-40s before the Monday night wars occurred. And the USWA remained fairly competitive for a couple of years before finally succumbing to the battle for Monday night. By this time the USWA had become a feeder promotion for the WWF. Lawler had signed his personal contract with the WWF and destroyed the image of the USWA by acting like a total buffoon on national tv and then tried to act like the badass face of the promotion when he was back in town.

USWA wasn't fairly competitive after 1987. The only reason it lasted until 97 was because Vince needed somewhere to send out of shape guys to wrestle.

(03-31-2019 06:05 AM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 07:42 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 05:11 PM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 04:54 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 03:28 PM)Hernando Hills Tiger Wrote:  Caught the last few minutes of his show. Had Jerry Calhoun on and showing footage of Jerry against Ric Flair on saturday morning wrestling.

Saw That one a few times.

He tried to feed the fans a bunch of bullcrap by trying to make them think that the WWE rules applied back then and you could not lose the title on a count out.

Which you could do in the NWA. Remember a match between Lawler and Bockwinkle where the "wrestling Press" made a big deal about Bockwinkle barely beating the count in the match and almost losing the title.

Believe the story behind the Lawler/Flair match when it happened was that the NWA governing body did not recognize the match as an official title match.

He may have been the biggest star in the modern era. But he is also a major reason for the failure of Memphis wrestling. EVERY star before him moved on when their time was over. Billy Wicks stepped aside for Sputnik Monroe and then Sputnik moved aside for Jackie Fargo and then Fargo moved aside when it came time for Lawler to carry the area. Lawler's ego would not allow for the development of another local star to carry the local promotion.

by the time Lawler would have had to move memphis wrestling was DEAD

Lawler was in his mid-40s before the Monday night wars occurred. And the USWA remained fairly competitive for a couple of years before finally succumbing to the battle for Monday night. By this time the USWA had become a feeder promotion for the WWF. Lawler had signed his personal contract with the WWF and destroyed the image of the USWA by acting like a total buffoon on national tv and then tried to act like the badass face of the promotion when he was back in town.

USWA wasn't fairly competitive after 1987. The only reason it lasted until 97 was because Vince needed somewhere to send out of shape guys to wrestle.

Dude the USWA wasn't formed until 1989. It was the CWA in 1987. Raw did not debut until 1993

(04-02-2019 01:45 AM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-31-2019 06:05 AM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 07:42 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 05:11 PM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 04:54 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  Saw That one a few times.

He tried to feed the fans a bunch of bullcrap by trying to make them think that the WWE rules applied back then and you could not lose the title on a count out.

Which you could do in the NWA. Remember a match between Lawler and Bockwinkle where the "wrestling Press" made a big deal about Bockwinkle barely beating the count in the match and almost losing the title.

Believe the story behind the Lawler/Flair match when it happened was that the NWA governing body did not recognize the match as an official title match.

He may have been the biggest star in the modern era. But he is also a major reason for the failure of Memphis wrestling. EVERY star before him moved on when their time was over. Billy Wicks stepped aside for Sputnik Monroe and then Sputnik moved aside for Jackie Fargo and then Fargo moved aside when it came time for Lawler to carry the area. Lawler's ego would not allow for the development of another local star to carry the local promotion.

by the time Lawler would have had to move memphis wrestling was DEAD

Lawler was in his mid-40s before the Monday night wars occurred. And the USWA remained fairly competitive for a couple of years before finally succumbing to the battle for Monday night. By this time the USWA had become a feeder promotion for the WWF. Lawler had signed his personal contract with the WWF and destroyed the image of the USWA by acting like a total buffoon on national tv and then tried to act like the badass face of the promotion when he was back in town.

USWA wasn't fairly competitive after 1987. The only reason it lasted until 97 was because Vince needed somewhere to send out of shape guys to wrestle.

Dude the USWA wasn't formed until 1989. It was the CWA in 1987. Raw did not debut until 1993

Regardless what it was called Memphis was DEAD by 87 attendance was awful and both the big promotions were out drawing it. Even if Lawler stepped aside the next guy would have jumped to WWF or WCW.

It didn't matter if Lawler stepped aside or not. Memphis was the last true territory, and the ending was going to be the same as every other territory. Nobody was going to compete with Vince McMahon. If anything, Lawler was the one who kept Memphis going as long as it did. It didn't matter if it was USWA, CWA, or whatever. It was all the same thing, and the ending was inevitable.

A bit of history returns to Memphis TV later this year. Here is a hint. "you'll see American's favorite sport on W.H.B.Q. television"

(04-02-2019 09:14 AM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 01:45 AM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-31-2019 06:05 AM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 07:42 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 05:11 PM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  by the time Lawler would have had to move memphis wrestling was DEAD

Lawler was in his mid-40s before the Monday night wars occurred. And the USWA remained fairly competitive for a couple of years before finally succumbing to the battle for Monday night. By this time the USWA had become a feeder promotion for the WWF. Lawler had signed his personal contract with the WWF and destroyed the image of the USWA by acting like a total buffoon on national tv and then tried to act like the badass face of the promotion when he was back in town.

USWA wasn't fairly competitive after 1987. The only reason it lasted until 97 was because Vince needed somewhere to send out of shape guys to wrestle.

Dude the USWA wasn't formed until 1989. It was the CWA in 1987. Raw did not debut until 1993

Regardless what it was called Memphis was DEAD by 87 attendance was awful and both the big promotions were out drawing it. Even if Lawler stepped aside the next guy would have jumped to WWF or WCW.

Dude again WCW did not exist until 1988. And the WWF was not drawing big crowds in the southeast until the early 90s. They played to an almost empty house in Memphis in the late 80s.

There were no Monday night wars. Although the WWF did have a recorded replay of house shows hosted by a studio host then showing taped matches. IN 1992 Lawler would be on the panel on WWF Prime Time Wrestling on the USA network at the same time he was wrestling live at the MSC.

Even when the USWA was sold the Evansville and Louisville shows were still drawing big crowds. But Beth Wade had driven everyone out of the MSC and the fans lost interest locally.

2/16/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 9,000)
Alan West defeated Tojo Yamamoto.
Jerry Bryant & Lou Winston defeated Keith Roberson & Roy Lee Welch.
Boy Tony defeated Pat Tanaka.
Soul Train Jones defeated The Hunter.
Jimmy Snuka & King Cobra defeated Tarzan Goto & Mr. Rising Sun (Akio Sato) via DQ.
Jeff Jarrett & Billy Joe Travis defeated Big Bubba & Goliath.
Jerry Lawler & Nick Bockwinkel defeated Austin Idol & Tommy Rich via DQ.
The Fabulous Ones & Paul Diamond defeated The Sheepherders & Jonathon Boyd in a “barbed wire cage” match.

3/9/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,000)
Brickhouse Brown defeated Jonathon Boyd.
Mark Starr defeated Boy Tony via DQ.
Alan West double count out with The Hunter.
Mr. Rising Sun defeated Tarzan Goto in a “loser leaves town” match.
CWA International Champ Soul Train Jones defeated Lord Humongous.
Jeff Jarrett defeated Pat Tanaka via DQ.
AWA Tag Champs Shawn Michaels & Marty Jannetty defeated Big Bubba & Goliath.
Jerry Lawler & Bam Bam Bigelow defeated Austin Idol & Tommy Rich.

4/27/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,500)
Bambi & The Hunter defeated Emily Arthur & Alan Martin when Bambi defeated Arthur.
Mark Starr & Steve Keirn defeated The Mercenaries to win the CWA International Tag Title when Starr made the pin.
Mr. Shima & Mr. Helo defeated John Paul & JT Southern.
Chick Donovan & Jack Hart defeated Soul Train Jones & Rocky Johnson when Donovan defeated Jones.
Paul Diamond defeated Billy Joe Travis in a “no DQ” match.
Jeff Jarrett defeated Pat Tanaka in a “steel cage” match.
Austin Idol defeated Jerry Lawler in a “hair vs. hair loser leaves town” match.


5/4/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 9,000)
Shawn Michaels & Marty Jannetty defeated Pat Tanaka & Paul Diamond via DQ.
Chick Donovan & Jack Hart defeated Rocky Johnson & Soul Train Jones to win the Southern Tag Title after Jones was piledriven on the floor.
Nick Bockwinkel defeated Jeff Jarrett.
Bill Dundee & Rocky Johnson defeated Tommy Rich & Austin Idol via DQ due to interference. Paul Diamond, Pat Tanaka & Downtown Bruno ran in and attacked Dundee & Rocky. They attempted to cut the hair of Dundee when a masked man (Jerry Lawler) made the save. Bruno wound up getting his hair cut, and the scissors stuck in his head causing massive blood loss. (Johnson subbed for Bam Bam Bigelow, who didn’t return as planned following his tour of Japan.)
* Note: We still need undercard results for this event.

5/25/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,500)
Mr. Helo & Mr. Shima defeated Bucky Siegler & Bob Cook.
Jack Hart defeated John Paul.
CWA International Champ Chic Donovan defeated Alan West.
Tony Burton defeated Tojo Yamamoto via DQ.
CWA International Tag Champs Paul Diamond & Pat Tanaka defeated Big Bubba & Bill Travis.
Mid-America Champ Jeff Jarrett defeated Moondog Spot via DQ.
Southern Champ Bill Dundee defeated Austin Idol via DQ.
Tommy Rich defeated Jerry Lawler via DQ.

(04-02-2019 09:25 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 09:14 AM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 01:45 AM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-31-2019 06:05 AM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(03-30-2019 07:42 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  Lawler was in his mid-40s before the Monday night wars occurred. And the USWA remained fairly competitive for a couple of years before finally succumbing to the battle for Monday night. By this time the USWA had become a feeder promotion for the WWF. Lawler had signed his personal contract with the WWF and destroyed the image of the USWA by acting like a total buffoon on national tv and then tried to act like the badass face of the promotion when he was back in town.

USWA wasn't fairly competitive after 1987. The only reason it lasted until 97 was because Vince needed somewhere to send out of shape guys to wrestle.

Dude the USWA wasn't formed until 1989. It was the CWA in 1987. Raw did not debut until 1993

Regardless what it was called Memphis was DEAD by 87 attendance was awful and both the big promotions were out drawing it. Even if Lawler stepped aside the next guy would have jumped to WWF or WCW.

Dude again WCW did not exist until 1988. And the WWF was not drawing big crowds in the southeast until the early 90s. They played to an almost empty house in Memphis in the late 80s.

There were no Monday night wars. Although the WWF did have a recorded replay of house shows hosted by a studio host then showing taped matches. IN 1992 Lawler would be on the panel on WWF Prime Time Wrestling on the USA network at the same time he was wrestling live at the MSC.

Even when the USWA was sold the Evansville and Louisville shows were still drawing big crowds. But Beth Wade had driven everyone out of the MSC and the fans lost interest locally.

2/16/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 9,000)
Alan West defeated Tojo Yamamoto.
Jerry Bryant & Lou Winston defeated Keith Roberson & Roy Lee Welch.
Boy Tony defeated Pat Tanaka.
Soul Train Jones defeated The Hunter.
Jimmy Snuka & King Cobra defeated Tarzan Goto & Mr. Rising Sun (Akio Sato) via DQ.
Jeff Jarrett & Billy Joe Travis defeated Big Bubba & Goliath.
Jerry Lawler & Nick Bockwinkel defeated Austin Idol & Tommy Rich via DQ.
The Fabulous Ones & Paul Diamond defeated The Sheepherders & Jonathon Boyd in a “barbed wire cage” match.

3/9/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,000)
Brickhouse Brown defeated Jonathon Boyd.
Mark Starr defeated Boy Tony via DQ.
Alan West double count out with The Hunter.
Mr. Rising Sun defeated Tarzan Goto in a “loser leaves town” match.
CWA International Champ Soul Train Jones defeated Lord Humongous.
Jeff Jarrett defeated Pat Tanaka via DQ.
AWA Tag Champs Shawn Michaels & Marty Jannetty defeated Big Bubba & Goliath.
Jerry Lawler & Bam Bam Bigelow defeated Austin Idol & Tommy Rich.

4/27/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,500)
Bambi & The Hunter defeated Emily Arthur & Alan Martin when Bambi defeated Arthur.
Mark Starr & Steve Keirn defeated The Mercenaries to win the CWA International Tag Title when Starr made the pin.
Mr. Shima & Mr. Helo defeated John Paul & JT Southern.
Chick Donovan & Jack Hart defeated Soul Train Jones & Rocky Johnson when Donovan defeated Jones.
Paul Diamond defeated Billy Joe Travis in a “no DQ” match.
Jeff Jarrett defeated Pat Tanaka in a “steel cage” match.
Austin Idol defeated Jerry Lawler in a “hair vs. hair loser leaves town” match.


5/4/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 9,000)
Shawn Michaels & Marty Jannetty defeated Pat Tanaka & Paul Diamond via DQ.
Chick Donovan & Jack Hart defeated Rocky Johnson & Soul Train Jones to win the Southern Tag Title after Jones was piledriven on the floor.
Nick Bockwinkel defeated Jeff Jarrett.
Bill Dundee & Rocky Johnson defeated Tommy Rich & Austin Idol via DQ due to interference. Paul Diamond, Pat Tanaka & Downtown Bruno ran in and attacked Dundee & Rocky. They attempted to cut the hair of Dundee when a masked man (Jerry Lawler) made the save. Bruno wound up getting his hair cut, and the scissors stuck in his head causing massive blood loss. (Johnson subbed for Bam Bam Bigelow, who didn’t return as planned following his tour of Japan.)
* Note: We still need undercard results for this event.

5/25/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,500)
Mr. Helo & Mr. Shima defeated Bucky Siegler & Bob Cook.
Jack Hart defeated John Paul.
CWA International Champ Chic Donovan defeated Alan West.
Tony Burton defeated Tojo Yamamoto via DQ.
CWA International Tag Champs Paul Diamond & Pat Tanaka defeated Big Bubba & Bill Travis.
Mid-America Champ Jeff Jarrett defeated Moondog Spot via DQ.
Southern Champ Bill Dundee defeated Austin Idol via DQ.
Tommy Rich defeated Jerry Lawler via DQ.

Ok so exactly when did Lawler need to step aside if he drawing like that in 87

(04-02-2019 09:50 PM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 09:25 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 09:14 AM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 01:45 AM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(03-31-2019 06:05 AM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  USWA wasn't fairly competitive after 1987. The only reason it lasted until 97 was because Vince needed somewhere to send out of shape guys to wrestle.

Dude the USWA wasn't formed until 1989. It was the CWA in 1987. Raw did not debut until 1993

Regardless what it was called Memphis was DEAD by 87 attendance was awful and both the big promotions were out drawing it. Even if Lawler stepped aside the next guy would have jumped to WWF or WCW.

Dude again WCW did not exist until 1988. And the WWF was not drawing big crowds in the southeast until the early 90s. They played to an almost empty house in Memphis in the late 80s.

There were no Monday night wars. Although the WWF did have a recorded replay of house shows hosted by a studio host then showing taped matches. IN 1992 Lawler would be on the panel on WWF Prime Time Wrestling on the USA network at the same time he was wrestling live at the MSC.

Even when the USWA was sold the Evansville and Louisville shows were still drawing big crowds. But Beth Wade had driven everyone out of the MSC and the fans lost interest locally.

2/16/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 9,000)
Alan West defeated Tojo Yamamoto.
Jerry Bryant & Lou Winston defeated Keith Roberson & Roy Lee Welch.
Boy Tony defeated Pat Tanaka.
Soul Train Jones defeated The Hunter.
Jimmy Snuka & King Cobra defeated Tarzan Goto & Mr. Rising Sun (Akio Sato) via DQ.
Jeff Jarrett & Billy Joe Travis defeated Big Bubba & Goliath.
Jerry Lawler & Nick Bockwinkel defeated Austin Idol & Tommy Rich via DQ.
The Fabulous Ones & Paul Diamond defeated The Sheepherders & Jonathon Boyd in a “barbed wire cage” match.

3/9/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,000)
Brickhouse Brown defeated Jonathon Boyd.
Mark Starr defeated Boy Tony via DQ.
Alan West double count out with The Hunter.
Mr. Rising Sun defeated Tarzan Goto in a “loser leaves town” match.
CWA International Champ Soul Train Jones defeated Lord Humongous.
Jeff Jarrett defeated Pat Tanaka via DQ.
AWA Tag Champs Shawn Michaels & Marty Jannetty defeated Big Bubba & Goliath.
Jerry Lawler & Bam Bam Bigelow defeated Austin Idol & Tommy Rich.

4/27/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,500)
Bambi & The Hunter defeated Emily Arthur & Alan Martin when Bambi defeated Arthur.
Mark Starr & Steve Keirn defeated The Mercenaries to win the CWA International Tag Title when Starr made the pin.
Mr. Shima & Mr. Helo defeated John Paul & JT Southern.
Chick Donovan & Jack Hart defeated Soul Train Jones & Rocky Johnson when Donovan defeated Jones.
Paul Diamond defeated Billy Joe Travis in a “no DQ” match.
Jeff Jarrett defeated Pat Tanaka in a “steel cage” match.
Austin Idol defeated Jerry Lawler in a “hair vs. hair loser leaves town” match.


5/4/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 9,000)
Shawn Michaels & Marty Jannetty defeated Pat Tanaka & Paul Diamond via DQ.
Chick Donovan & Jack Hart defeated Rocky Johnson & Soul Train Jones to win the Southern Tag Title after Jones was piledriven on the floor.
Nick Bockwinkel defeated Jeff Jarrett.
Bill Dundee & Rocky Johnson defeated Tommy Rich & Austin Idol via DQ due to interference. Paul Diamond, Pat Tanaka & Downtown Bruno ran in and attacked Dundee & Rocky. They attempted to cut the hair of Dundee when a masked man (Jerry Lawler) made the save. Bruno wound up getting his hair cut, and the scissors stuck in his head causing massive blood loss. (Johnson subbed for Bam Bam Bigelow, who didn’t return as planned following his tour of Japan.)
* Note: We still need undercard results for this event.

5/25/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,500)
Mr. Helo & Mr. Shima defeated Bucky Siegler & Bob Cook.
Jack Hart defeated John Paul.
CWA International Champ Chic Donovan defeated Alan West.
Tony Burton defeated Tojo Yamamoto via DQ.
CWA International Tag Champs Paul Diamond & Pat Tanaka defeated Big Bubba & Bill Travis.
Mid-America Champ Jeff Jarrett defeated Moondog Spot via DQ.
Southern Champ Bill Dundee defeated Austin Idol via DQ.
Tommy Rich defeated Jerry Lawler via DQ.

Ok so exactly when did Lawler need to step aside if he drawing like that in 87

He was in his 30s in 87 this was pre-USWA days. It was a good 6 years before the attendance began to drop off. Although he had originally planned to retire at 35.

(04-03-2019 03:08 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 09:50 PM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 09:25 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 09:14 AM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 01:45 AM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  Dude the USWA wasn't formed until 1989. It was the CWA in 1987. Raw did not debut until 1993

Regardless what it was called Memphis was DEAD by 87 attendance was awful and both the big promotions were out drawing it. Even if Lawler stepped aside the next guy would have jumped to WWF or WCW.

Dude again WCW did not exist until 1988. And the WWF was not drawing big crowds in the southeast until the early 90s. They played to an almost empty house in Memphis in the late 80s.

There were no Monday night wars. Although the WWF did have a recorded replay of house shows hosted by a studio host then showing taped matches. IN 1992 Lawler would be on the panel on WWF Prime Time Wrestling on the USA network at the same time he was wrestling live at the MSC.

Even when the USWA was sold the Evansville and Louisville shows were still drawing big crowds. But Beth Wade had driven everyone out of the MSC and the fans lost interest locally.

2/16/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 9,000)
Alan West defeated Tojo Yamamoto.
Jerry Bryant & Lou Winston defeated Keith Roberson & Roy Lee Welch.
Boy Tony defeated Pat Tanaka.
Soul Train Jones defeated The Hunter.
Jimmy Snuka & King Cobra defeated Tarzan Goto & Mr. Rising Sun (Akio Sato) via DQ.
Jeff Jarrett & Billy Joe Travis defeated Big Bubba & Goliath.
Jerry Lawler & Nick Bockwinkel defeated Austin Idol & Tommy Rich via DQ.
The Fabulous Ones & Paul Diamond defeated The Sheepherders & Jonathon Boyd in a “barbed wire cage” match.

3/9/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,000)
Brickhouse Brown defeated Jonathon Boyd.
Mark Starr defeated Boy Tony via DQ.
Alan West double count out with The Hunter.
Mr. Rising Sun defeated Tarzan Goto in a “loser leaves town” match.
CWA International Champ Soul Train Jones defeated Lord Humongous.
Jeff Jarrett defeated Pat Tanaka via DQ.
AWA Tag Champs Shawn Michaels & Marty Jannetty defeated Big Bubba & Goliath.
Jerry Lawler & Bam Bam Bigelow defeated Austin Idol & Tommy Rich.

4/27/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,500)
Bambi & The Hunter defeated Emily Arthur & Alan Martin when Bambi defeated Arthur.
Mark Starr & Steve Keirn defeated The Mercenaries to win the CWA International Tag Title when Starr made the pin.
Mr. Shima & Mr. Helo defeated John Paul & JT Southern.
Chick Donovan & Jack Hart defeated Soul Train Jones & Rocky Johnson when Donovan defeated Jones.
Paul Diamond defeated Billy Joe Travis in a “no DQ” match.
Jeff Jarrett defeated Pat Tanaka in a “steel cage” match.
Austin Idol defeated Jerry Lawler in a “hair vs. hair loser leaves town” match.


5/4/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 9,000)
Shawn Michaels & Marty Jannetty defeated Pat Tanaka & Paul Diamond via DQ.
Chick Donovan & Jack Hart defeated Rocky Johnson & Soul Train Jones to win the Southern Tag Title after Jones was piledriven on the floor.
Nick Bockwinkel defeated Jeff Jarrett.
Bill Dundee & Rocky Johnson defeated Tommy Rich & Austin Idol via DQ due to interference. Paul Diamond, Pat Tanaka & Downtown Bruno ran in and attacked Dundee & Rocky. They attempted to cut the hair of Dundee when a masked man (Jerry Lawler) made the save. Bruno wound up getting his hair cut, and the scissors stuck in his head causing massive blood loss. (Johnson subbed for Bam Bam Bigelow, who didn’t return as planned following his tour of Japan.)
* Note: We still need undercard results for this event.

5/25/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,500)
Mr. Helo & Mr. Shima defeated Bucky Siegler & Bob Cook.
Jack Hart defeated John Paul.
CWA International Champ Chic Donovan defeated Alan West.
Tony Burton defeated Tojo Yamamoto via DQ.
CWA International Tag Champs Paul Diamond & Pat Tanaka defeated Big Bubba & Bill Travis.
Mid-America Champ Jeff Jarrett defeated Moondog Spot via DQ.
Southern Champ Bill Dundee defeated Austin Idol via DQ.
Tommy Rich defeated Jerry Lawler via DQ.

Ok so exactly when did Lawler need to step aside if he drawing like that in 87

He was in his 30s in 87 this was pre-USWA days. It was a good 6 years before the attendance began to drop off. Although he had originally planned to retire at 35.

BS it wasnt 6 years befeore attendance started to drop
1987 Avg 5,567 1988 Avg 3,843 1989 Avg 1,467

http://www.prowrestlinghistory.com/memphis/

Bobby Heenan said that Memphis had potential but was poorly run and nobody made any money. In the early 80s, the AWA was making some money but it started to crumble when Vince started poaching talent. When Hulk Hogan left the AWA for the WWF, that was the first seed in Vince's consolidation of wrestling territories.

WCW starting in 1988. The issue at that time was that Vince's Wrestlemania was really starting to take off and Vince's gamble on Wrestlemania started to pay off. If the AWA (which was relatively healthy) was pretty much bankrupt by 1990, I am pretty sure Memphis wrestling would've been doomed to failure by 1990 as well. Dallas-based WCCW (with the Von Erichs) was really struggling as well. In other words, Memphis, Dallas and Minneapolis wrestling territories were in really bad shape by 1990 and at that time, Lawler would've been 41....which isn't horribly 'old' to still be a face.

Even at his peak, Lawler was OK as a 'face'. His issue was that he didn't have the physique or size to really make a great draw. The other problem was that Memphis roster wasn't particularly deep. How many Memphis based wrestlers were even poached by the WWF or WCW?

I know Jimmy Hart went to the WWF, but that listing of talent for the late 80s cards pretty much shows you how barren the cupboard was.

Jimmy Snuka went to the WWF, Sean Michaels and Marty Jannetty were actually AWA properties originally, Jeff Jarrett did well, Nick Bockwinkle was an AWA property.

In other words, Yamamoto, Shima, Tommy Rich, Austin Idol and the majority of the Memphis roster went nowhere after 1990.

(04-03-2019 03:26 PM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(04-03-2019 03:08 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 09:50 PM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 09:25 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(04-02-2019 09:14 AM)MemphisFan95 Wrote:  Regardless what it was called Memphis was DEAD by 87 attendance was awful and both the big promotions were out drawing it. Even if Lawler stepped aside the next guy would have jumped to WWF or WCW.

Dude again WCW did not exist until 1988. And the WWF was not drawing big crowds in the southeast until the early 90s. They played to an almost empty house in Memphis in the late 80s.

There were no Monday night wars. Although the WWF did have a recorded replay of house shows hosted by a studio host then showing taped matches. IN 1992 Lawler would be on the panel on WWF Prime Time Wrestling on the USA network at the same time he was wrestling live at the MSC.

Even when the USWA was sold the Evansville and Louisville shows were still drawing big crowds. But Beth Wade had driven everyone out of the MSC and the fans lost interest locally.

2/16/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 9,000)
Alan West defeated Tojo Yamamoto.
Jerry Bryant & Lou Winston defeated Keith Roberson & Roy Lee Welch.
Boy Tony defeated Pat Tanaka.
Soul Train Jones defeated The Hunter.
Jimmy Snuka & King Cobra defeated Tarzan Goto & Mr. Rising Sun (Akio Sato) via DQ.
Jeff Jarrett & Billy Joe Travis defeated Big Bubba & Goliath.
Jerry Lawler & Nick Bockwinkel defeated Austin Idol & Tommy Rich via DQ.
The Fabulous Ones & Paul Diamond defeated The Sheepherders & Jonathon Boyd in a “barbed wire cage” match.

3/9/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,000)
Brickhouse Brown defeated Jonathon Boyd.
Mark Starr defeated Boy Tony via DQ.
Alan West double count out with The Hunter.
Mr. Rising Sun defeated Tarzan Goto in a “loser leaves town” match.
CWA International Champ Soul Train Jones defeated Lord Humongous.
Jeff Jarrett defeated Pat Tanaka via DQ.
AWA Tag Champs Shawn Michaels & Marty Jannetty defeated Big Bubba & Goliath.
Jerry Lawler & Bam Bam Bigelow defeated Austin Idol & Tommy Rich.

4/27/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,500)
Bambi & The Hunter defeated Emily Arthur & Alan Martin when Bambi defeated Arthur.
Mark Starr & Steve Keirn defeated The Mercenaries to win the CWA International Tag Title when Starr made the pin.
Mr. Shima & Mr. Helo defeated John Paul & JT Southern.
Chick Donovan & Jack Hart defeated Soul Train Jones & Rocky Johnson when Donovan defeated Jones.
Paul Diamond defeated Billy Joe Travis in a “no DQ” match.
Jeff Jarrett defeated Pat Tanaka in a “steel cage” match.
Austin Idol defeated Jerry Lawler in a “hair vs. hair loser leaves town” match.


5/4/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 9,000)
Shawn Michaels & Marty Jannetty defeated Pat Tanaka & Paul Diamond via DQ.
Chick Donovan & Jack Hart defeated Rocky Johnson & Soul Train Jones to win the Southern Tag Title after Jones was piledriven on the floor.
Nick Bockwinkel defeated Jeff Jarrett.
Bill Dundee & Rocky Johnson defeated Tommy Rich & Austin Idol via DQ due to interference. Paul Diamond, Pat Tanaka & Downtown Bruno ran in and attacked Dundee & Rocky. They attempted to cut the hair of Dundee when a masked man (Jerry Lawler) made the save. Bruno wound up getting his hair cut, and the scissors stuck in his head causing massive blood loss. (Johnson subbed for Bam Bam Bigelow, who didn’t return as planned following his tour of Japan.)
* Note: We still need undercard results for this event.

5/25/87 – Memphis, TN. @ The Mid-South Coliseum (Attendance: 8,500)
Mr. Helo & Mr. Shima defeated Bucky Siegler & Bob Cook.
Jack Hart defeated John Paul.
CWA International Champ Chic Donovan defeated Alan West.
Tony Burton defeated Tojo Yamamoto via DQ.
CWA International Tag Champs Paul Diamond & Pat Tanaka defeated Big Bubba & Bill Travis.
Mid-America Champ Jeff Jarrett defeated Moondog Spot via DQ.
Southern Champ Bill Dundee defeated Austin Idol via DQ.
Tommy Rich defeated Jerry Lawler via DQ.

Ok so exactly when did Lawler need to step aside if he drawing like that in 87

He was in his 30s in 87 this was pre-USWA days. It was a good 6 years before the attendance began to drop off. Although he had originally planned to retire at 35.

BS it wasnt 6 years befeore attendance started to drop
1987 Avg 5,567 1988 Avg 3,843 1989 Avg 1,467

http://www.prowrestlinghistory.com/memphis/

But you claimed over and over that in 1987 that attendance had ALREADY fallen

(04-03-2019 06:56 PM)ddramone Wrote:  Bobby Heenan said that Memphis had potential but was poorly run and nobody made any money. In the early 80s, the AWA was making some money but it started to crumble when Vince started poaching talent. When Hulk Hogan left the AWA for the WWF, that was the first seed in Vince's consolidation of wrestling territories.

WCW starting in 1988. The issue at that time was that Vince's Wrestlemania was really starting to take off and Vince's gamble on Wrestlemania started to pay off. If the AWA (which was relatively healthy) was pretty much bankrupt by 1990, I am pretty sure Memphis wrestling would've been doomed to failure by 1990 as well. Dallas-based WCCW (with the Von Erichs) was really struggling as well. In other words, Memphis, Dallas and Minneapolis wrestling territories were in really bad shape by 1990 and at that time, Lawler would've been 41....which isn't horribly 'old' to still be a face.

Even at his peak, Lawler was OK as a 'face'. His issue was that he didn't have the physique or size to really make a great draw. The other problem was that Memphis roster wasn't particularly deep. How many Memphis based wrestlers were even poached by the WWF or WCW?

I know Jimmy Hart went to the WWF, but that listing of talent for the late 80s cards pretty much shows you how barren the cupboard was.

Jimmy Snuka went to the WWF, Sean Michaels and Marty Jannetty were actually AWA properties originally, Jeff Jarrett did well, Nick Bockwinkle was an AWA property.

In other words, Yamamoto, Shima, Tommy Rich, Austin Idol and the majority of the Memphis roster went nowhere after 1990.

Vince was leveraged to the hilt in those days and if the territories had worked together to secure their talent instead of working against each other and trying to poach each other's talent. Then they could have sunk the WWF before it got off the ground nationally. Look at what happened in Atlanta when the WWF took over the time slot on WTBS. It failed badly and they ended up having to lease the time slot back to another promotion. Some of their house shows in the south had more arena workers than fans in the seats. Their product was too cartoonish for the liking of many in areas outside of the northeast.

If not for the sale of Turner to Time Warner I have no doubt that WCW could have hurt the WWE badly. From May of 96 to April of 98 Nitro dominated the Monday night wars. But the so-called Attitude Era was actually an anything-goes era. The WWE storylines went into areas which Time Warner would not allow WCW to follow. Even hinting at incest angles in at least one storyline. This was also the time where many of the WWE divas began getting exposure in Playboy and many accidental wardrobe malfunctions occurred.

WWE also got a number of lucky breaks at times. Like when the AG in Kansas decided not to file charges in the accident which killed Owen Hart a week before the WWE's IPO offering. The Nailz behavior on the witness stand in Vince's steroid trial saved Vince's ass. The jury was leaning toward conviction until Nailz was painted as an out of control vengeance filled ex-employee. If that trial had gone the other way then Raw would have been DOA. And the WWE's move toward a national promotion would have been halted.

As far as the Memphis talent level not having much depth. This is exactly why I said Lawler hurt the promotion as there was some talent came through but none remained because they could not get any push due to Lawler's status of being top dog. You had the early career of Sting and the Ultimate Warrior in the Memphis market but they stayed for a short time then moved on when they really were not given the push. Both spent a year in UWF and then on to Atlanta where they exploded into major stars.

(04-03-2019 08:24 PM)ncrdbl1 Wrote:  

(04-03-2019 06:56 PM)ddramone Wrote:  Bobby Heenan said that Memphis had potential but was poorly run and nobody made any money. In the early 80s, the AWA was making some money but it started to crumble when Vince started poaching talent. When Hulk Hogan left the AWA for the WWF, that was the first seed in Vince's consolidation of wrestling territories.

WCW starting in 1988. The issue at that time was that Vince's Wrestlemania was really starting to take off and Vince's gamble on Wrestlemania started to pay off. If the AWA (which was relatively healthy) was pretty much bankrupt by 1990, I am pretty sure Memphis wrestling would've been doomed to failure by 1990 as well. Dallas-based WCCW (with the Von Erichs) was really struggling as well. In other words, Memphis, Dallas and Minneapolis wrestling territories were in really bad shape by 1990 and at that time, Lawler would've been 41....which isn't horribly 'old' to still be a face.

Even at his peak, Lawler was OK as a 'face'. His issue was that he didn't have the physique or size to really make a great draw. The other problem was that Memphis roster wasn't particularly deep. How many Memphis based wrestlers were even poached by the WWF or WCW?

I know Jimmy Hart went to the WWF, but that listing of talent for the late 80s cards pretty much shows you how barren the cupboard was.

Jimmy Snuka went to the WWF, Sean Michaels and Marty Jannetty were actually AWA properties originally, Jeff Jarrett did well, Nick Bockwinkle was an AWA property.

In other words, Yamamoto, Shima, Tommy Rich, Austin Idol and the majority of the Memphis roster went nowhere after 1990.

Vince was leveraged to the hilt in those days and if the territories had worked together to secure their talent instead of working against each other and trying to poach each other's talent. Then they could have sunk the WWF before it got off the ground nationally. Look at what happened in Atlanta when the WWF took over the time slot on WTBS. It failed badly and they ended up having to lease the time slot back to another promotion. Some of their house shows in the south had more arena workers than fans in the seats. Their product was too cartoonish for the liking of many in areas outside of the northeast.

If not for the sale of Turner to Time Warner I have no doubt that WCW could have hurt the WWE badly. From May of 96 to April of 98 Nitro dominated the Monday night wars. But the so-called Attitude Era was actually an anything-goes era. The WWE storylines went into areas which Time Warner would not allow WCW to follow. Even hinting at incest angles in at least one storyline. This was also the time where many of the WWE divas began getting exposure in Playboy and many accidental wardrobe malfunctions occurred.

WWE also got a number of lucky breaks at times. Like when the AG in Kansas decided not to file charges in the accident which killed Owen Hart a week before the WWE's IPO offering. The Nailz behavior on the witness stand in Vince's steroid trial saved Vince's ass. The jury was leaning toward conviction until Nailz was painted as an out of control vengeance filled ex-employee. If that trial had gone the other way then Raw would have been DOA. And the WWE's move toward a national promotion would have been halted.

As far as the Memphis talent level not having much depth. This is exactly why I said Lawler hurt the promotion as there was some talent came through but none remained because they could not get any push due to Lawler's status of being top dog. You had the early career of Sting and the Ultimate Warrior in the Memphis market but they stayed for a short time then moved on when they really were not given the push. Both spent a year in UWF and then on to Atlanta where they exploded into major stars.

But there's no way the other territories could've banded together to take on Vince.

WCCW was in dire straits in 1988, as was the AWA, as was Memphis wrestling.

The reason Vince's strategy worked is that there is a ridiculous number of people in the Eastern seaboard. Vince could poach talent since shows in NYC would play well in Boston, Philly and DC. He could negotiate a really good TV contract because of his reach and his PPVs did well because of the notoriety and population density of the Northeast.

If you notice, there was some 'talent sharing' between the AWA, WCCW and Memphis wrestling and all three were STILL losing money.

I agree that the only potential legitimate competitor to Vince was WCW, but that had the benefit of a nationwide Cable TV home. WCW appealed to Southerners and not to Yankees, whereas WWF appealed to Yankees and not Southerners.

Regardless of how good/bad/poor manager Lawler was, there was no way Memphis wrestling would have stayed relevant past 1990.

In fact, Ultimate Warrior was pretty lame in his WCCW days as the Dingo Warrior. If it wasn't for Vince, I am not sure the UWarrior would've made it big. He was horrible in the ring, his interviews were awful, but Vince gave him the big push.