Buffalo's Nate Oats accepted the head basketball job at Alabama.

No loyalty in the MAC. MAC schools can spend more and more on coaches but in the end it's not going to keep them from leaving.

It sucks but if we hire Hodgson and the recruits stay then maybe we could keep the continuity going.

Hodgson was the one who recruited a lot of the guys yet for some reason some of them are already looking to go elsewhere.

4* Raymond Hawkins was going to choose UB in a few days but now Oats and Alabama just offered him.

I'm sure there's going to be more.

I've always wondered what it would be like if a MAC coach just stayed and didnt leave. I would imagine a MAC school would end up like a Penn State. For me, it would be so much more rewarding to build something from nothing.

Perhaps KSU's Golf coach Herb Page is a great example of building something amazing out of nothing

It's a big risk for a coach to stay forever in a revenue sport. Too much money on the table, and there is no guarantee of future success. Even at MAC schools it only takes a 2 or 3 year downturn and people start turning on you.

(03-27-2019 06:18 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  It's a big risk for a coach to stay forever in a revenue sport. Too much money on the table, and there is no guarantee of future success. Even at MAC schools it only takes a 2 or 3 year downturn and people start turning on you.

Guess its a matter of what you value.

No one else in the MAC is gonna feel sorry for UB. I get that. But man, what a gut punch. I mean the guy signs the extension, talks about loyalty, family, loving the area and University, unwavering support, Gonzaga of the East, blah, blah, blah. Then within 5 minutes of this coming out, Nate’s Twitter profile is switched to Alabama logos and a high profile recruit who was set to announce his choice (Bulls being one) is suddenly offered by Alabama. Ugh. Some other recruits I’m sure will be reconsidering as well.

(03-27-2019 06:15 PM)thanksjim Wrote:  I've always wondered what it would be like if a MAC coach just stayed and didnt leave. I would imagine a MAC school would end up like a Penn State. For me, it would be so much more rewarding to build something from nothing.

Perhaps KSU's Golf coach Herb Page is a great example of building something amazing out of nothing

See Carolyn Condit.

(03-27-2019 06:18 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  It's a big risk for a coach to stay forever in a revenue sport. Too much money on the table, and there is no guarantee of future success. Even at MAC schools it only takes a 2 or 3 year downturn and people start turning on you.

See Rico Blasi.

(03-27-2019 06:24 PM)thanksjim Wrote:  

(03-27-2019 06:18 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  It's a big risk for a coach to stay forever in a revenue sport. Too much money on the table, and there is no guarantee of future success. Even at MAC schools it only takes a 2 or 3 year downturn and people start turning on you.

Guess its a matter of what you value.

I like living in northeast Ohio because I value the friends and family that I have in the area. That being said if a competitor of my current employer called me up tomorrow and offered me 3x my current pay to do the same exact job in Alabama, I'd be there tomorrow. I'm guessing 90%+ of Americans would do the same.

If Blasi wins the one title that slipped through MU’s fingers, would he be welcome for life? Or would he have been hired away like BG’s York?

OU football has the sweet spot. Older guy who’d been run out of Nebraska despite decent success. Built a consistent winner; not gonna get you to a New Year’s Bowl, but he’s not “sexy” enough to get hired away.

If your a mid-major that is consistently losing coaches to deep pocketed P5 schools, that means you're doing something right. The problem comes when you're cycling through coaches quickly because everyone you hire sucks or you hold onto guys that need to be fired.

Just the reality of the situation.

I mean, NIU has lost its last 3 football coaches. Granted, the last one hired away I'm grateful for but I always found it odd when NIU fans say we should pay our head coach more. What for? They already get paid a good living and it's not going to stop them from going to another school for more money. Coaching salaries have gotten way out of hand because the P5 schools have too much money to spend.

Hurley left and the Bulls just got better. Maybe they can do it again. It's hard to build a dynasty, though, when you have to hire a new coach every few years. Hurley took a few players to Arizona State, where he has a team that is inferior to Buffalo. Oats undoubtedly will take a few to Alabama. I don't know if this makes sense or not, but when coaches leave the MAC for greener pastures, I always hope that they fail.

The only way a MAC team keeps a successful coach long-term is if the coach has some kind of albatross around his neck. Bob Nichols and Keith Dambrot both had racial issues (real or perceived). Curt Miller (former BG women's coach) is gay. (Not that being gay should be a problem in getting hired, but I think it was for him.) Dambrot and Miller finally moved up. Nichols, after a great career, was fired after two down years.

(03-27-2019 08:02 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  I mean, NIU has lost its last 3 football coaches. Granted, the last one hired away I'm grateful for but I always found it odd when NIU fans say we should pay our head coach more. What for? They already get paid a good living and it's not going to stop them from going to another school for more money. Coaching salaries have gotten way out of hand because the P5 schools have too much money to spend.

What he said.

I like the move for Oates simply because the SEC outside of Kentucky and maybe Tennessee is an open slate.

He could quickly have Alabama as a 3rd or 4th power in the conference.

A much better situation than UNLV and a 1.6 million dollar dead end wad of cash IMO.

(03-27-2019 07:19 PM)MacLord Wrote:  OU football has the sweet spot. Older guy who’d been run out of Nebraska despite decent success. Built a consistent winner; not gonna get you to a New Year’s Bowl, but he’s not “sexy” enough to get hired away.

Solich is also from Ohio which motivates his continued tenure.

Buffalo though made the smart move signing Oates before the tourney at an A10 level salary with a nice buyout. Ohio should have done the same with Groce.

(03-27-2019 06:29 PM)zrb2 Wrote:  No one else in the MAC is gonna feel sorry for UB. I get that. But man, what a gut punch. I mean the guy signs the extension, talks about loyalty, family, loving the area and University, unwavering support, Gonzaga of the East, blah, blah, blah. Then within 5 minutes of this coming out, Nate’s Twitter profile is switched to Alabama logos and a high profile recruit who was set to announce his choice (Bulls being one) is suddenly offered by Alabama. Ugh. Some other recruits I’m sure will be reconsidering as well.

SOP for MAC coaches.

You can't blame Oats for taking a massive raise and going to a multibid P5 league and a school with incredibly deep pockets. And he's at least doubling the salaries of all of his assistants and staff.

Good MAC programs in just about any sport will almost never have stability. If they excel, coaches will get lured away by P5s. If they are mediocre or worse, the coaches will be canned due to high expectations. The longest-tenured coaches in this league are guys like Hawkins, who does just enough to keep getting renewed but has won zero NCAA games and is now trending downward. Or Murphy at EMU, who cobbles together a decent program but has so little support that his .500 MAC record looks like a minor miracle. Dambrot was the closest thing this basketball league had to sustained excellence... and he never won an NCAA game and was still hired away by a program with deeper pockets.

Buffalo will have to keep its commitment in terms of money and fan interest (and hope like hell that the new hire is great) to sustain what they had. As an Ohio fan, I can tell you it's not easy.

(03-28-2019 07:31 AM)Copy Cat Wrote:  You can't blame Oats for taking a massive raise and going to a multibid P5 league and a school with incredibly deep pockets. And he's at least doubling the salaries of all of his assistants and staff.

Good MAC programs in just about any sport will almost never have stability. If they excel, coaches will get lured away by P5s. If they are mediocre or worse, the coaches will be canned due to high expectations. The longest-tenured coaches in this league are guys like Hawkins, who does just enough to keep getting renewed but has won zero NCAA games and is now trending downward. Or Murphy at EMU, who cobbles together a decent program but has so little support that his .500 MAC record looks like a minor miracle. Dambrot was the closest thing this basketball league had to sustained excellence... and he never won an NCAA game and was still hired away by a program with deeper pockets.

Buffalo will have to keep its commitment in terms of money and fan interest (and hope like hell that the new hire is great) to sustain what they had. As an Ohio fan, I can tell you it's not easy.

This bold part only applies if the university cares about having success in a sport. Mark Montgomery has been at NIU for 8 years and has a 52-88 (.371) MAC regular season record. This is mostly prevalent in non-revenue sports.

(03-28-2019 08:00 AM)kreed5120 Wrote:  

(03-28-2019 07:31 AM)Copy Cat Wrote:  You can't blame Oats for taking a massive raise and going to a multibid P5 league and a school with incredibly deep pockets. And he's at least doubling the salaries of all of his assistants and staff.

Good MAC programs in just about any sport will almost never have stability. If they excel, coaches will get lured away by P5s. If they are mediocre or worse, the coaches will be canned due to high expectations. The longest-tenured coaches in this league are guys like Hawkins, who does just enough to keep getting renewed but has won zero NCAA games and is now trending downward. Or Murphy at EMU, who cobbles together a decent program but has so little support that his .500 MAC record looks like a minor miracle. Dambrot was the closest thing this basketball league had to sustained excellence... and he never won an NCAA game and was still hired away by a program with deeper pockets.

Buffalo will have to keep its commitment in terms of money and fan interest (and hope like hell that the new hire is great) to sustain what they had. As an Ohio fan, I can tell you it's not easy.

This bold part only applies if the university cares about having success in a sport. Mark Montgomery has been at NIU for 8 years and has a 52-88 (.371) MAC regular season record. This is mostly prevalent in non-revenue sports.

And our attendance is so bad that basketball is pretty much a non-revenue sport at NIU. But yes, Monty is a great example of somebody that has done just enough to meet the low expectations of our AD.

After the first 3 seasons Monty's record has been not quite as bad but still consistently below .500.