Thought someone might be interested, since some/much of NIU sports are behind the ESPN+ paywall.

https://www.sbnation.com/college-footbal...ealignment

Refresh my memory, someone ... isn't the AAC the wannabe "Power6th" that got po'd at STF and his idea for a G5 football playoff?

If the disparity between the MAC and AAC wasn’t clear before, this makes it so obvious that it should smack you right in the face. $7 million a year per school for a tv deal is huge. Imagine where we’d be. No more worries about the travel costs for Olympic sports. Coaches salaries, as Carey’s contract showed, are already s huge difference between the leagues. 4 teams in the NCAA tournament instead of a one bid league. More players drafted in the nfl. So many advantages in the AAC.

Yep, I did see this and thanks for posting pvk75.

The archives are full of threads with discussion of what conferences were worthy of NIU after the Orange Bowl year.

A frequent poster was adamant that the AAC would be a “lateral” move. The $$$$$$$$$$$ noted in this article prove that comparing the AAC and MAC is the proverbial “apples and oranges “.

This is a longshot notion, but instead of dreaming about the Big 12, maybe Northern should look at the AAC as a move-up.

Northern getting the Chicago market is another dream. But maybe all Northern needs is a chunk of it. With some "hard way" marketing, Northern might be able to attract some of the Western Suburbs/Fox Valley. Already, Rich Harvest Farms supports NIU golf with use of its national top-100 course in Sugar Grove. And THammock & Co. have (honestly) done more promo in Chicagoland in the last two months than the rest of the ADept. does in a year. There has to be half a million population in the FV, most without a big hassle drive to DeKalb.

That might fit the AAC profile, which factors in market size. Look at a small school like Tulsa in the AAC. The region has almost 1 million population. Wichita State got in because of their stellar basketball program; would that have happened without the market? Maybe, maybe not, but it sure didn't hurt with a Wichita metro population over 650,000.

Maybe dreaming as much as the NIU-in-the-Big12 crowd. But Northern needs to be ready for something when the expected conference shift comes in the mid-2020s.

(03-21-2019 09:36 PM)pvk75 Wrote:  This is a longshot notion, but instead of dreaming about the Big 12, maybe Northern should look at the AAC as a move-up.

Northern getting the Chicago market is another dream. But maybe all Northern needs is a chunk of it. With some "hard way" marketing, Northern might be able to attract some of the Western Suburbs/Fox Valley. Already, Rich Harvest Farms supports NIU golf with use of its national top-100 course in Sugar Grove. And THammock & Co. have (honestly) done more promo in Chicagoland in the last two months than the rest of the ADept. does in a year. There has to be half a million population in the FV, most without a big hassle drive to DeKalb.

That might fit the AAC profile, which factors in market size. Look at a small school like Tulsa in the AAC. The region has almost 1 million population. Wichita State got in because of their stellar basketball program; would that have happened without the market? Maybe, maybe not, but it sure didn't hurt with a Wichita metro population over 650,000.

Maybe dreaming as much as the NIU-in-the-Big12 crowd. But Northern needs to be ready for something when the expected conference shift comes in the mid-2020s.

NIU is closer to Rockford (147,000) and still can't include that city in it's "market" even though it may try. People up there have virtually zero interest in NIU.

Thinking that NIU could just market itself and pull in either Chicago or the western suburbs in any kind of substantial way (without moving the campus to Naperville) is a pipe dream.

(03-21-2019 09:36 PM)pvk75 Wrote:  This is a longshot notion, but instead of dreaming about the Big 12, maybe Northern should look at the AAC as a move-up.

Northern getting the Chicago market is another dream. But maybe all Northern needs is a chunk of it. With some "hard way" marketing, Northern might be able to attract some of the Western Suburbs/Fox Valley. Already, Rich Harvest Farms supports NIU golf with use of its national top-100 course in Sugar Grove. And THammock & Co. have (honestly) done more promo in Chicagoland in the last two months than the rest of the ADept. does in a year. There has to be half a million population in the FV, most without a big hassle drive to DeKalb.

That might fit the AAC profile, which factors in market size. Look at a small school like Tulsa in the AAC. The region has almost 1 million population. Wichita State got in because of their stellar basketball program; would that have happened without the market? Maybe, maybe not, but it sure didn't hurt with a Wichita metro population over 650,000.

Maybe dreaming as much as the NIU-in-the-Big12 crowd. But Northern needs to be ready for something when the expected conference shift comes in the mid-2020s.

Niu would have jumped to the AAC in a heartbeat in recent history if they’d been given the opportunity. Rumor was that we could have jumped there years ago but I don’t know that for a fact. Basketball was a hang up I believe. Unfortunately the AAC ship sailed for now. Things might get interesting in 5 years from now when tv contracts are renewed but I agree that AAC is the best option we might get. For now AAC won’t add and have to share the money they’ll be getting.

I was referring to whatever piece of the Chicago market is gettable, with geography being important. I know it needs more than just simple marketing. And I know the connections to Rockford are weak. But we can't keep saying "oh, that won't work," and "that won't work" and "that won't work" and expect anything to change. Northern has to start doing something, because running in place accomplishes nothing.

I mentioned the Fox Valley because Northern already has connections there. I mentioned the Harvest Farms golf program support. The Victor E. Huskie Ball is held at the Naperville campus on Diehl Road. Northern has a strong academic/research connection to Fermilab in Batavia. It does NOT have those kinds of connections to Rockford. It does NOT have those connections throughout Chicagoland.

But, hey, let's wait for someone to drop dead and leave Northern a legacy of $7 million a year. Then Northern doesn't have to try to do a damn thing to help itself.

(03-21-2019 10:31 PM)pvk75 Wrote:  I was referring to whatever piece of the Chicago market is gettable, with geography being important. I know it needs more than just simple marketing. And I know the connections to Rockford are weak. But we can't keep saying "oh, that won't work," and "that won't work" and "that won't work" and expect anything to change. Northern has to start doing something, because running in place accomplishes nothing.

I mentioned the Fox Valley because Northern already has connections there. I mentioned the Harvest Farms golf program support. The Victor E. Huskie Ball is held at the Naperville campus on Diehl Road. Northern has a strong academic/research connection to Fermilab in Batavia. It does NOT have those kinds of connections to Rockford. It does NOT have those connections throughout Chicagoland.

But, hey, let's wait for someone to drop dead and leave Northern a legacy of $7 million a year. Then Northern doesn't have to try to do a damn thing to help itself.

All good points. Niu does have the Rockford campus but I don’t believe it is as utilized as Naperville.

(03-21-2019 10:31 PM)pvk75 Wrote:  I was referring to whatever piece of the Chicago market is gettable, with geography being important. I know it needs more than just simple marketing. And I know the connections to Rockford are weak. But we can't keep saying "oh, that won't work," and "that won't work" and "that won't work" and expect anything to change. Northern has to start doing something, because running in place accomplishes nothing.

I mentioned the Fox Valley because Northern already has connections there. I mentioned the Harvest Farms golf program support. The Victor E. Huskie Ball is held at the Naperville campus on Diehl Road. Northern has a strong academic/research connection to Fermilab in Batavia. It does NOT have those kinds of connections to Rockford. It does NOT have those connections throughout Chicagoland.

But, hey, let's wait for someone to drop dead and leave Northern a legacy of $7 million a year. Then Northern doesn't have to try to do a damn thing to help itself.

That's all fine and good, but "doing something" is not always the answer. First of all, I admire your dedication and conviction on this, so please understand my pushback is not an attempt to tear down, but to push forward. I simply don't see it the way you do, which is why my conviction in the other direction is as pointed as it is.

With that said, how many alumni are in the Naperville/Fox Valley area? And, with that said, the area where the NIU campus is located, isn't exactly the heart of Naperville. Many people don't even ever go over in that area.

Anyway, I don't want to come off as a "don't do anything because nothing can change" but I do see the situation as, "well....its been a long time and there are some really strong roots in a lot of these areas by other programs not named NIU, so.....".

I kind of see NIU as needing to just embrace who it is and not trying to become something it isn't. NIU just doesn't fit in with the AAC. It's DeKalb. You can't fake it into encompassing Chicago or Elgin or Naperville/Elgin, etc. It's too far away to just absorb those places and it doesn't have the allure of being the main university in the state. I just don't see how they could compete (or fit in) with schools (some private schools) in larger metro areas like Cincinnati, Orlando, Wichita, New Orleans (even though Tulane is dreadful and the AAC probably regrets including them...which isn't a good thing for NIU's prospects), Houston, Philadelphia, Memphis, Dallas, Tulsa, Greenville, etc. They're just completely different animals.

Honestly, the idea of NIU in the AAC seems like such a bad fit to me, its not even worth thinking about especially when the only way to make any type of sense of it is to do some high level mental gymnastics of trying to gerrymander regional footprints so it looks like NIU sits/possesses a much larger population than it actually does.

The horse has no pulse, give it up.

GO HUSKIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Actually, Big Red, I agree with most of what you said. The reason I write (and sometimes delete) long posts of mine is because I use too many words to make a point. Maybe I should have simply said "I don't know what the answer is, but Northern has to do something." I was not advocating the AAC, only latching onto it as an example.

I have been an almost-fanatical but hopefully (somewhat) realistic Huskie fan for almost five decades (though only a recent Dog Pound poster). That's a long time to wait for something, anything.

Maybe you're right. Northern needs to get better, stronger, more focused on what it is and where it is. Maybe the answers are more internal than external. I just think it needs to be smarter about reaching for a little more.

One thing cannot be denied. The people who post on the Dog Pound are real Huskie fans, a little crazy and off-the-wall and sometimes way out there, but passionate and supportive and dedicated.

And I'll try to keep my posts shorter. Consider this a start.

(03-22-2019 09:56 AM)pvk75 Wrote:  Actually, Big Red, I agree with most of what you said. The reason I write (and sometimes delete) long posts of mine is because I use too many words to make a point. Maybe I should have simply said "I don't know what the answer is, but Northern has to do something." I was not advocating the AAC, only latching onto it as an example.

I have been an almost-fanatical but hopefully (somewhat) realistic Huskie fan for almost five decades (though only a recent Dog Pound poster). That's a long time to wait for something, anything.

Maybe you're right. Northern needs to get better, stronger, more focused on what it is and where it is. Maybe the answers are more internal than external. I just think it needs to be smarter about reaching for a little more.

One thing cannot be denied. The people who post on the Dog Pound are real Huskie fans, a little crazy and off-the-wall and sometimes way out there, but passionate and supportive and dedicated.

And I'll try to keep my posts shorter. Consider this a start.

For one, I don't think short posts are better (probably because I tend to be quite verbose as well) as long as the content is good.

Also, I agree that the small number who post here are part of the base of a NIU fanbase. Solid, committed and loyal fans. That's good. It's small, but it's good. NIU athletics matter to us and we might not have a lot of us, but it matters to us.

And, tbh, I agree with the rest of what you said. I just wonder, when people think of NIU "moving up" or leaving the MAC for greener pastures, I don't know what they have in mind. The MAC fits so well in so may ways, it doesn't make sense to move. Obviously, from a geographical and travel perspective, the Big Ten and Big 12 fit well too, but neither of those are realistic on a resource plain or in the ol' "butts in seats" category. So, after that, you have the AAC, which would be a terrible travel arrangement and, as I pointed out before, NIU/DeKalb simply doesn't fit with those schools/cities. C-USA and the Sun Belt work fine from a competition angle, but the travel and footprint make no sense. After that, who's left that has FBS football?

The MAC.

The MAC is what it is and there is a reason it has been largely unaffected by conference realignment. And I'm pretty cool with it.

If we want to stay FBS in football we need to probably leave the MAC. The discrepancy in money is just too great, and getting bigger. The MAC will probably be 1-AA in 5 years

(03-22-2019 01:36 PM)golf4501 Wrote:  If we want to stay FBS in football we need to probably leave the MAC. The discrepancy in money is just too great, and getting bigger. The MAC will probably be 1-AA in 5 years

That ship has sailed. Our stadium is not big enough, our fan base is too small. We don't have enough big donors, Mens basketball sucks. Might as well ride it out as long as we can.

(03-22-2019 02:26 PM)klake87 Wrote:  

(03-22-2019 01:36 PM)golf4501 Wrote:  If we want to stay FBS in football we need to probably leave the MAC. The discrepancy in money is just too great, and getting bigger. The MAC will probably be 1-AA in 5 years

That ship has sailed. Our stadium is not big enough, our fan base is too small. We don't have enough big donors, Mens basketball sucks. Might as well ride it out as long as we can.

I totally disagree just need to have the right people, the right vision and some luck. Rutgers was one of the worst football teams in the country now in the Big 10, Creighton MVC to Big East, Butler from Horizon to Big East, Plenty of other examples out there as well.

It's going to be sink or swim and it's going to get harder, but it's not out of the possibility. I know this much we go to 1-AA in football and my season tickets and donations will go as well.

(03-22-2019 03:43 PM)golf4501 Wrote:  

(03-22-2019 02:26 PM)klake87 Wrote:  

(03-22-2019 01:36 PM)golf4501 Wrote:  If we want to stay FBS in football we need to probably leave the MAC. The discrepancy in money is just too great, and getting bigger. The MAC will probably be 1-AA in 5 years

That ship has sailed. Our stadium is not big enough, our fan base is too small. We don't have enough big donors, Mens basketball sucks. Might as well ride it out as long as we can.

I totally disagree just need to have the right people, the right vision and some luck. Rutgers was one of the worst football teams in the country now in the Big 10, Creighton MVC to Big East, Butler from Horizon to Big East, Plenty of other examples out there as well.

It's going to be sink or swim and it's going to get harder, but it's not out of the possibility. I know this much we go to 1-AA in football and my season tickets and donations will go as well.

Rutgers owns New Jersey (and NY City). Grapefruit and grapes.


GO HUSKIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(03-22-2019 04:08 PM)pantone1935 Wrote:  

(03-22-2019 03:43 PM)golf4501 Wrote:  

(03-22-2019 02:26 PM)klake87 Wrote:  

(03-22-2019 01:36 PM)golf4501 Wrote:  If we want to stay FBS in football we need to probably leave the MAC. The discrepancy in money is just too great, and getting bigger. The MAC will probably be 1-AA in 5 years

That ship has sailed. Our stadium is not big enough, our fan base is too small. We don't have enough big donors, Mens basketball sucks. Might as well ride it out as long as we can.

I totally disagree just need to have the right people, the right vision and some luck. Rutgers was one of the worst football teams in the country now in the Big 10, Creighton MVC to Big East, Butler from Horizon to Big East, Plenty of other examples out there as well.

It's going to be sink or swim and it's going to get harder, but it's not out of the possibility. I know this much we go to 1-AA in football and my season tickets and donations will go as well.

Rutgers owns New Jersey (and NY City). Grapefruit and grapes.


GO HUSKIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not only what you said (especially when it was always clear the only reason Rutgers got in was because the B1G wanted to sell itself and it's tv station in New York City), but....are we really using the Big East of examples of how NIU can move up in conferences? Are they supposed to drop the football program?

And in those Big East examples, Creighton was perenially drawing top 5 attendance and Butler went to back-to-back national title games. Doesn’t matter if you have “the right people” - that isn’t attainable here. Heck, we’ve had an AD who’s now considered a frontrunner for B1G commissioner.