3 12/5 upsets..... only 2nd time ever this has happened.....

Double digit seeds are 3-0 in San Jose so far today.

Remaining game is #13 Saint Louis vs. #4 Virginia Tech.

Iona 35 ..... Carolina 27, late first half.

Won't last but there it is.

Tim Cluess always wins the conference tournament and his teams play a fun as hell style. Wondered for years why an upper mid major never hired him.

Roy Williams is 28-0 in Round 1. Today he trails Iona at halftime.

UNC pulls away kind of for an unconvincing win.

UCF is walloping VCU. Good evening for the AAC, 2-1 today.

VT crushes whoever they were playing - ACC goes 3-0 at night with their top seeds.

Ohio State and Iowa State only undecided game left.

Of the top 20 teams in the final NET rankings, only #17 Wisconsin and #19 Mississippi State fail to advance to the Round of 32.

(03-22-2019 10:36 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  UNC pulls away kind of for an unconvincing win.

UCF is walloping VCU. Good evening for the AAC, 2-1 today.

VT crushes whoever they were playing - ACC goes 3-0 at night with their top seeds.

Ohio State and Iowa State only undecided game left.

Oh it was decided in the final 4 minutes with a phantom foul, a no call charge, and a whistle for a kicked ball when there was none. Combine that with an Iowa State possession earlier that was called a foot on the line when the video showed it never happened and Ohio State was gifted a total of 8 points in the game by the Zebras. Now I have nothing against the Buckeyes and don't have a dog in this hunt but the officiating easily decided what was otherwise a very close game.

It was the worst officiating of the day. Second runner up were the officials who made phantom calls in the Mississippi State / Liberty game. While there seemed not to be so quite an obvious bias in the bad calls in that game it was two very light touch fouls in an otherwise rough game that sidelined both of State's top scorers in the final 4 minutes of play.

Between the commercials, the replays that are not needed, the obvious bad calls that can't be reversed by replay, there is no reason for any of the spreads to have a high degree of likelihood to exceed 10 points. There's no rhythm, no real chance of a team making a sustained run, and no way to keep momentum. Today was the worst of the first two but this isn't championship basketball because the kids can't continue play.

Big Ten 7-1 in rd 1. Only 3 conferences ever to send 7 teams to the rd of 32(other 2 times Big East in 2008 and 2011).

teams left
Big Ten 7
ACC 5
SEC 5
Big 12 4
AAC 2
Pac 12 2
A-Sun 1
Big East 1
Big West 1
MAC 1
OVC 1
Southern 1
WCC 1

(03-22-2019 09:04 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Double digit seeds are 3-0 in San Jose so far today.

Remaining game is #13 Saint Louis vs. #4 Virginia Tech.

Virginia Tech won to stop the sweep of double digit seeds at one site in the first round. It happened once before, but not this time.

(03-22-2019 10:39 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Of the top 20 teams in the final NET rankings, only #17 Wisconsin and #19 Mississippi State fail to advance to the Round of 32.

so looking overall at the NET- only 10 top 32 teams are out after first round....

2 of the 10 got knocked out by other top 32 teams.

so updated seed results historically....
The No. 1 seed is 139–1 against the No. 16 seed (.993)
The No. 2 seed is 132–8 against the No. 15 seed (.943)
The No. 3 seed is 119–21 against the No. 14 seed (.850)
The No. 4 seed is 111–29 against the No. 13 seed (.793)
The No. 5 seed is 90–50 against the No. 12 seed (.643)
The No. 6 seed is 88–52 against the No. 11 seed (.629)
The No. 7 seed is 85–55 against the No. 10 seed (.607)
The No. 8 seed is 68–72 against the No. 9 seed (.486)

Amazing how different being a 4 seed is to being a 5 seed. Not much of a difference between a 5-7 seed quite frankly historically in rd 1... Now, where it does get different is in rd 2.... going into this year-
4 seeds- 64 times 5 seeds- 46 times to sweet 16, 6 seeds- 42 times, 7 seeds 27 times.

(03-23-2019 12:34 AM)Wedge Wrote:  

FWIW, I have mixed feelings about big upsets, so a day filled with them is IMO not necessarily great. The trade-off is that while yes, it is exciting to see a #15 beat the #2, the downside is that later on, instead of getting a matchup of two heavyweights, like #1 Duke vs #2 Kansas, we get #1 Duke vs #15 Sienna, and usually lightning doesn't strike twice and the #1 crushes the #15.

Yes, every once in a while, like George Mason 13 years ago, VCU in 2011, and last year with Loyola-Chicago, the Giant Killer keeps on killing giants all the way to the Final 4 and that is what dreams are made of. But usually, they just end up giving another giant an easy game.

(03-22-2019 11:16 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(03-22-2019 10:36 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  UNC pulls away kind of for an unconvincing win.

UCF is walloping VCU. Good evening for the AAC, 2-1 today.

VT crushes whoever they were playing - ACC goes 3-0 at night with their top seeds.

Ohio State and Iowa State only undecided game left.

Oh it was decided in the final 4 minutes with a phantom foul, a no call charge, and a whistle for a kicked ball when there was none. Combine that with an Iowa State possession earlier that was called a foot on the line when the video showed it never happened and Ohio State was gifted a total of 8 points in the game by the Zebras. Now I have nothing against the Buckeyes and don't have a dog in this hunt but the officiating easily decided what was otherwise a very close game.

It was the worst officiating of the day. Second runner up were the officials who made phantom calls in the Mississippi State / Liberty game. While there seemed not to be so quite an obvious bias in the bad calls in that game it was two very light touch fouls in an otherwise rough game that sidelined both of State's top scorers in the final 4 minutes of play.

Between the commercials, the replays that are not needed, the obvious bad calls that can't be reversed by replay, there is no reason for any of the spreads to have a high degree of likelihood to exceed 10 points. There's no rhythm, no real chance of a team making a sustained run, and no way to keep momentum. Today was the worst of the first two but this isn't championship basketball because the kids can't continue play.

Early on in the VCU-UCF game, there was that VCU player falling really hard on his shoulder. That was a common foul. And now, I simply resign my understanding of this game, because flagrants have been called for so much softer stuff than that.

Ten teams are ranked outside of the NET top 32 that are in the Round of 32:

37 Oklahoma

39 Baylor

43 Iowa

44 Murray State

45 Washington

51 Oregon

55 Ohio State

58 Liberty

61 Minnesota

68 UC-Irvine

There are three B1G teams and two Big 12 and two PAC teams, and then three mid-majors.

This shows the import of seeding. It's easy to win games when the committee gives you three #1 seeds, like the ACC got. These conferences are winning against tougher opponents.

The 2 Big 12 teams not really that impressive as they beat a team that was 1 spot ahead of them and then a team ranked below them.
#37 Oklahoma beat #36 Ole Miss
#39 Baylor beat #42 Syracuse
#43 Iowa beat #25 Cincy
#44 Murray St beat #28 Marquette
#45 Washington beat #29 Utah St
#51 Oregon beat #17 Wisconsin
#55 Ohio St beat #21 Iowa St
#58 Liberty beat #19 Mississippi St
#61 Minnesota beat #22 Louisville
#68 UC Irvine beat #24 Kansas St

The NET overall went 23-9 in rd 1. With 1 of the losses 37 beating 36. Overall thru 2 rounds, the NET is 27-9.

I'm going to my first significant playoff or tournament games in any sport today when I go to Hartford. As a Florida State fan in New York, Florida State rarely plays near me. I was hoping Hofstra would win the CAA Tournament and play in Hartford. I have relatives who went to Michigan. Florida State beat Michigan in the Orange Bowl on December 30, 2016. Florida State and Michigan will play in the West Regional Final if they make it.

(03-23-2019 06:49 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  This shows the import of seeding. It's easy to win games when the committee gives you three #1 seeds, like the ACC got. These conferences are winning against tougher opponents.

Did any of the three not deserve 1 seeds? None of Duke, UNC, and Virginia won by so little that they're lucky to have advanced.

(03-23-2019 07:54 AM)stever20 Wrote:  The NET overall went 23-9 in rd 1. With 1 of the losses 37 beating 36. Overall thru 2 rounds, the NET is 27-9.

I'm comparing the NET to the RPI, and the NET is 4-2 so far. The NET was 2-0 in the First Four and 2-2 in the First Round.

Tuesday- Belmont vs. Temple: Belmont was better in the NET and won
Tuesday- Fairleigh Dickinson vs. Prairie View A&M: Fairleigh Dickson was better in the NET and won
Thursday- Syracuse vs. Baylor: Baylor was better in the NET and won
Friday- Ole Miss vs. Oklahoma: Ole Miss was better in the NET and lost
Friday- VCU vs. Central Florida: Central Florida was better in the NET and won
Friday- Utah State vs. Washington: Utah State was better in the NET and lost

Round of 32:

Today- Purdue vs. Villanova with Purdue better in the NET
Today- Kansas vs. Auburn with Auburn better in the NET
Tomorrow- Texas Tech vs. Buffalo with Texas Tech better in the NET

In Kansas vs. Auburn, the 5 seed has a better NET than the 4 seed. In the other two, the 3 seed has a better NET than the 6 seed.

(03-23-2019 08:03 AM)EvanJ Wrote:  

(03-23-2019 06:49 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  This shows the import of seeding. It's easy to win games when the committee gives you three #1 seeds, like the ACC got. These conferences are winning against tougher opponents.

Did any of the three not deserve 1 seeds? None of Duke, UNC, and Virginia won by so little that they're lucky to have advanced.

Oftentimes, a #1 blows out a #16 by 30 or so. All of these ACC #1s struggled by comparison to most #1s.

Seeding is always subjective. E.g., had the three Big East teams that lost already had played the teams the three ACC teams played, they probably are 3-0.

So you have to look at seeding when evaluating conference records. Good luck to FSU, btw.

(03-23-2019 05:23 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(03-23-2019 12:34 AM)Wedge Wrote:  

FWIW, I have mixed feelings about big upsets, so a day filled with them is IMO not necessarily great. The trade-off is that while yes, it is exciting to see a #15 beat the #2, the downside is that later on, instead of getting a matchup of two heavyweights, like #1 Duke vs #2 Kansas, we get #1 Duke vs #15 Sienna, and usually lightning doesn't strike twice and the #1 crushes the #15.

Yes, every once in a while, like George Mason 13 years ago, VCU in 2011, and last year with Loyola-Chicago, the Giant Killer keeps on killing giants all the way to the Final 4 and that is what dreams are made of. But usually, they just end up giving another giant an easy game.

12 seeds are historically underrated. A lot of them are minor conference champs that the committee gives no respect. Many have won not just the first round, but they have done very well for a 12 in the 2nd.

This year:

8 seeds-wiped out 4 straight by 9 seeds
7 seeds-all but Wofford lost, 1-3 vs. 10 seeds
6 seeds-one fell, 3-1 vs. 11 seeds
5 seeds-all but Auburn lost and they needed 2 missed free throws by NMSU to survive, 1-3 vs. 12 seeds
4 seeds-one fell, 3-1 vs. 13 seeds.

(03-23-2019 09:17 AM)bullet Wrote:  12 seeds are historically underrated. A lot of them are minor conference champs that the committee gives no respect.

12s beat 5s so often that I think the committee occasionally purposely seeds teams that deserve a higher seed in the 12 slots so as to facilitate that, as it is something tournament fans have come to enjoy.

Seeds 11-13 probably see the most amount of tweeking by the committee, because you get those last-in at-large’s and mid-major conference tournament champions that, while not the strongest metrically, pose too much a threat on the highest seeds. You can subject a 6 or 5 to that. 4’s get it, too.

A few tournaments ago, Bucknell won the Patriot AQ. It wasn’t any team like the ones that beat Kansas and Arkansas, but they got a better seeding because the potential was there to knock off a 3 or 2 seed, and they were given a 13 and a very physical WVU team. And gave them a fight. Unlike previous seasons when Bucknell could beat a major, this team wasn’t all that special. But, sometimes you just never know.

The committee has done that a few times to certain teams. Bucknell, Vermont, Belmont, Montana...some years back, when Marshall was coaching Winthrop into the dance yearly, you saw that school getting better seeds, even if they didn’t have the quality wins to show for it.

I wasn’t surprised that Gardner Webb caused UVA fits. Had they ever been in the dance recently, them beating a few ACC schools would have moved them to the 15 or 14 line for sure. The committee dodged a bullet this year with that one.