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gobaseline Offline
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Tax the rich
03-09-2019 11:16 AM
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GullLake Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
Whoa!

Good stuff.

Ultimately, money goes where it is treated well.

And so do jobs.

The way AOC and her pack of "progressives" ran off Amazon and several thousand jobs that AVERAGED $150,000 was disturbing, naive and narcissistic.

The "progressives" are to the Democrats, what the "tea party" is to the GOP - ideological-absolutist nut-jobs.
03-09-2019 03:41 PM
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brovol Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
(03-09-2019 03:41 PM)GullLake Wrote:  Whoa!

Good stuff.

Ultimately, money goes where it is treated well.

And so do jobs.

The way AOC and her pack of "progressives" ran off Amazon and several thousand jobs that AVERAGED $150,000 was disturbing, naive and narcissistic.

The "progressives" are to the Democrats, what the "tea party" is to the GOP - ideological-absolutist nut-jobs.

The tea party movement was healthy for the country as, born out of frustration, it established a voice for a group who was producing for those who were not. "Progressives" (which is the most deliberately misleading title in the history of the English language) hate the concept of true freedom, liberty and equality. They describe anything resembling those things as immoral, when in fact progressive Democratic policies are immoral to the core. Americans should be able to do what they wish with what they earn. They should be able to like who they like and dislike who they want too. Republicans lose sight of these concepts as well. Their social ideas fly in the face of liberty and free choice. America was not built on Christian values. The colonists fled their countries of origin to rid themselves from oppression. This country wasn't established by the pilgrims though, it was established by our founding fathers in the 1770s, and while most of them were indeed Christian,the principles which were memorialized both in the declaration of Independence and in our constitution were based on liberty, or in other words, allowing American citizens to be who they wanted to be, pray to who they wanted to pray to, support themselves and their families how they wanted to support them, as long as it did not infringe on the rights of others.

Progressives want to completely eliminate those concepts. Those are the values that we need to protect. They need to be protected from both the Democrats and the Republicans. Mostly the Democrats though. LOL.

Unfortunately, the extreme hardcore left is not at all a fringe within the Democratic party. The Democratic party has become the party of hardcore extreme left-wingers who describe themselves now as progressive, which is a positive sounding word translating to "anti-American". John F Kennedy would be appalled at these concepts, and most assuredly wood separate himself from any of what is being pitched by virtually every Democratic politician in federal government for sure.

The schools and the media have brainwashed Americans in a way perhaps most akin to the Chinese re-education camps. It may take Venezuela like reality to change things. Unfortunately, is history has proven too many times already, that is too late.
(This post was last modified: 03-09-2019 05:20 PM by brovol.)
03-09-2019 05:15 PM
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Aimless1 Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
This is why I seldom venture into this area of the board. A lot of political sound bites spewed already.

If you look at the two major parties and their political drift over the past 70 or so years, the Repubs have drifted from conservative to arch right extremism and the Dems have drifted from democratic socialism to become what most considered moderates 70 years ago.

At least Brovo and I can agree the country was never founded on Christianity nor Christian principles. We can also agree that the Tea Party and current crop of progressives are fringe elements in both parties. The tparty had it's run and the progressives will have theirs.

I grudgingly respect the coup pulled off by Republicans with Fox. Truly amazing to me how successful they are and were at getting average people to vote against their own best interest. I am truly impressed.
03-09-2019 07:53 PM
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brovol Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
The Republicans are doing very little, if anything, to help themselves. It is the Democrats who continuously help the Republicans, and will unify Republicans, based on the Democrats strong desire to turn America into a socialistic nightmare
03-09-2019 09:21 PM
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BroncoPhilly Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
(03-09-2019 05:15 PM)brovol Wrote:  
(03-09-2019 03:41 PM)GullLake Wrote:  Whoa!

Good stuff.

Ultimately, money goes where it is treated well.

And so do jobs.

The way AOC and her pack of "progressives" ran off Amazon and several thousand jobs that AVERAGED $150,000 was disturbing, naive and narcissistic.

The "progressives" are to the Democrats, what the "tea party" is to the GOP - ideological-absolutist nut-jobs.

The tea party movement was healthy for the country as, born out of frustration, it established a voice for a group who was producing for those who were not. "Progressives" (which is the most deliberately misleading title in the history of the English language) hate the concept of true freedom, liberty and equality. They describe anything resembling those things as immoral, when in fact progressive Democratic policies are immoral to the core. Americans should be able to do what they wish with what they earn. They should be able to like who they like and dislike who they want too. Republicans lose sight of these concepts as well. Their social ideas fly in the face of liberty and free choice. America was not built on Christian values. The colonists fled their countries of origin to rid themselves from oppression. This country wasn't established by the pilgrims though, it was established by our founding fathers in the 1770s, and while most of them were indeed Christian,the principles which were memorialized both in the declaration of Independence and in our constitution were based on liberty, or in other words, allowing American citizens to be who they wanted to be, pray to who they wanted to pray to, support themselves and their families how they wanted to support them, as long as it did not infringe on the rights of others.

Progressives want to completely eliminate those concepts. Those are the values that we need to protect. They need to be protected from both the Democrats and the Republicans. Mostly the Democrats though. LOL.

Unfortunately, the extreme hardcore left is not at all a fringe within the Democratic party. The Democratic party has become the party of hardcore extreme left-wingers who describe themselves now as progressive, which is a positive sounding word translating to "anti-American". John F Kennedy would be appalled at these concepts, and most assuredly wood separate himself from any of what is being pitched by virtually every Democratic politician in federal government for sure.

The schools and the media have brainwashed Americans in a way perhaps most akin to the Chinese re-education camps. It may take Venezuela like reality to change things. Unfortunately, is history has proven too many times already, that is too late.

What brovol said. I don't equate the Tea Party with the far Left which controls the Democrat Party now. And the GOP is broad based, we have no wing of extremists controlling the dialogue.
03-10-2019 12:46 AM
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BroncoPhilly Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
(03-09-2019 07:53 PM)Aimless1 Wrote:  This is why I seldom venture into this area of the board. A lot of political sound bites spewed already.

If you look at the two major parties and their political drift over the past 70 or so years, the Repubs have drifted from conservative to arch right extremism and the Dems have drifted from democratic socialism to become what most considered moderates 70 years ago.

At least Brovo and I can agree the country was never founded on Christianity nor Christian principles. We can also agree that the Tea Party and current crop of progressives are fringe elements in both parties. The tparty had it's run and the progressives will have theirs.

I grudgingly respect the coup pulled off by Republicans with Fox. Truly amazing to me how successful they are and were at getting average people to vote against their own best interest. I am truly impressed.

Conservatives have ONE major news channel focusing on their philosophy, the Dems have ALL the rest of the networks kowtowing to them. Every time I hear Democrats whine about FOX I have to laugh-the MSM is a wing of the DNC for all intents and purposes. The Dems idea of 'balance' is to silence the only network that gives the GOP even a scintilla of coverage-that's not going to happen.
03-10-2019 12:50 AM
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Aimless1 Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
(03-10-2019 12:50 AM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  Conservatives have ONE major news channel focusing on their philosophy, the Dems have ALL the rest of the networks kowtowing to them. Every time I hear Democrats whine about FOX I have to laugh-the MSM is a wing of the DNC for all intents and purposes. The Dems idea of 'balance' is to silence the only network that gives the GOP even a scintilla of coverage-that's not going to happen.

All news sources have bias. That is why I carefully choose what I read. I don't watch TV news. Oh, I will watch local news for the weather or for information about my community but never for national news or local politics. It is all drivel to me.

Us vs Them. No, conservatives have been claiming they are martyrs to the news forever. Strictly political spin. Not reporting the news the way you want does not make it liberal, nor does it make it conservative. Ignoring inconvenient facts does not give it political spin. You can choose your slant which is what most folks do. Some of us do our best to seek out fairly neutral news sources so we can think for ourselves and form our own opinions. I'm open to all POV, but form my own opinions.

However, as someone who does not watch the news it is my view that Fox and the Sinclair group have an agenda and spew propaganda, not news. MSN clearly has a liberal bias. So if you want to hear "news" that makes you feel good about your personal views or if you drank from the propaganda machine and are a true believer, you have several choices to boost your ego.
03-10-2019 08:29 AM
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BroncoPhilly Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
(03-10-2019 08:29 AM)Aimless1 Wrote:  
(03-10-2019 12:50 AM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  Conservatives have ONE major news channel focusing on their philosophy, the Dems have ALL the rest of the networks kowtowing to them. Every time I hear Democrats whine about FOX I have to laugh-the MSM is a wing of the DNC for all intents and purposes. The Dems idea of 'balance' is to silence the only network that gives the GOP even a scintilla of coverage-that's not going to happen.

All news sources have bias. That is why I carefully choose what I read. I don't watch TV news. Oh, I will watch local news for the weather or for information about my community but never for national news or local politics. It is all drivel to me.

Us vs Them. No, conservatives have been claiming they are martyrs to the news forever. Strictly political spin. Not reporting the news the way you want does not make it liberal, nor does it make it conservative. Ignoring inconvenient facts does not give it political spin. You can choose your slant which is what most folks do. Some of us do our best to seek out fairly neutral news sources so we can think for ourselves and form our own opinions. I'm open to all POV, but form my own opinions.

However, as someone who does not watch the news it is my view that Fox and the Sinclair group have an agenda and spew propaganda, not news. MSN clearly has a liberal bias. So if you want to hear "news" that makes you feel good about your personal views or if you drank from the propaganda machine and are a true believer, you have several choices to boost your ego.

The Mainstream News Media has been biased to the Left for as long as I've been following news, since the 1964 Goldwater/Johnson campaigns. They were bad back then, but at least they used to try to convey the image of fairness and even-handedness, today they've given up all pretense of even pretending to be fair.

In recent years FOX has filled in the total vacuum of conservative viewpoint among the networks, not that they are completely conservative biased. Certainly Shepherd Smith is no friend of Donald Trump and he makes that plain every day. But in the balance FOX news portrays thing from a conservative viewpoint. All the other major news networks without exception are biased to the Political Left.

The 2016 election demonstrated what we conservatives can expect from the major media. They had a bias for the Democrat Party to start with and the belief was Hillary Clinton was as sure a win as you can get in politics. So the networks did everything they could be support the 'winning team' and that included giving Team Hillary the debate questions ahead of time and working with the DNC to respond to her queues during Debates when she wanted to make a point. They don't even deny this took place, such is their arrogance and bias.

I get all my news from trusted sources on the internet, occasionally I'll watch FOX but not often-and mostly it's Fox Business News, not the political news. I have not watched ANY of the MSM news programs in over 25 years. I got tired of their bias and just turned them off one day. I have a lot of company in that, because their viewership ratings are WAY down. CNN in particular has atrocious ratings, but CEO Jeff Zucker is such a partisan he accepts abysmal ratings as a cost of doing business-promoting the Democrat political agenda. I'll never watch them again.
03-10-2019 02:27 PM
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Ken Barna Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
Dear Bronco's of the right,
Most of what you have spewed here is pure crap. Democrats are not anti-American. Just because they espouse a different philosophy then what you on the right want, does not make them bad, terrible, or as already said anti-American.
We already have many forms of socialism in this country. Social Security, Medicare, G.I. Bill of Rights, Welfare Programs, etc. So, stop acting like we as a nation are simon pure capitalists, and somehow someway, if we go down that socialistic path we are all doomed.
03-11-2019 08:17 PM
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BroncoPhilly Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
(03-11-2019 08:17 PM)Ken Barna Wrote:  Dear Bronco's of the right,
Most of what you have spewed here is pure crap. Democrats are not anti-American. Just because they espouse a different philosophy then what you on the right want, does not make them bad, terrible, or as already said anti-American.
We already have many forms of socialism in this country. Social Security, Medicare, G.I. Bill of Rights, Welfare Programs, etc. So, stop acting like we as a nation are simon pure capitalists, and somehow someway, if we go down that socialistic path we are all doomed.

I never said Democrats are 'anti American', but I implied they're stupid. ANYBODY who would promote socialism for this country doesn't have the brains that God gave geese. Dress it up anyway you want to Ken Barna, it's a losing strategy.

Outside of an economic collapse between now and election day, the only way Dems can regain the White House in 2020 is to employ 'Ballot Harvesting' on a major scale. Which knowing the Dems is exactly what they are going to try, but the majority of the American electorate will not accept voting corruption to that degree. It will set us up for a Constitutional crisis such as we've not had for a century, but the Dems don't believe the rules apply to them so I'm sure they'll try it.

I've worked in campaigns several times including the 2016 Trump Presidential Campaign and they've been getting uglier and uglier (campaigns I've worked in have never lost!). 2020 is going to be a ugly one, I can see that right now. Team Trump will be ready for any dirty tricks by the Dems or their allies in the Mainstream Media, I promise you that.
(This post was last modified: 03-11-2019 10:43 PM by BroncoPhilly.)
03-11-2019 10:27 PM
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Aimless1 Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Tax the rich
Ah yes. Another member of the arch right. Democratic socialism works for so many of our allies .... Canada, Sweden, Norway, Great Britain. Surely they don't have the brains God gave geese Bronco Philly? Surely Dwight Eisenhower was stupid implementing the Interstate road system, another form of Democratic socialism? No, Democratic socialism is not a losing strategy. It is simply another POV of how capitalism should work.

We all should be open to competing ideas. We all should be open to compromise. Narrow minds do not make for good government nor for good society.

As to the 2020 election it is the Democrats to lose. Based on the way too early to call view of the candidates and their approach, the Dems seem hell bent on giving the election to the Repubs. Your candidate has locked in his base, approximately 34% of US voters according to most sources. However, he has alienated the vast majority of Americans. His budget proposal just released cuts Social Security and Medicare. I wonder how many that are not the base will applaud that move.

Most would argue that voter suppression by the Republicans is a larger concern than unproven ballot tampering by Dems. Perhaps why the Gerrymandering ballot proposal passed so easily here in Michigan.

However, if you are like every other maga. supporter it is pointless to talk. I don't know you Bronco Philly and I am not accusing you of anything, but all the trumpettes I have talked to over the past 3 years harbor a great deal of hate and/or fear. Not that they would admit it or even recognize they have it. Can't have a reasonable discussion with someone who harbors either. This includes other fellow Broncos.

From my POV we could use more Eisenhowers and Nelson Rockefeller's and fewer trump or mcconnells.
03-12-2019 06:02 AM
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GullLake Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
(03-12-2019 06:02 AM)Aimless1 Wrote:  Ah yes. Another member of the arch right. Democratic socialism works for so many of our allies .... Canada, Sweden, Norway, Great Britain. Surely they don't have the brains God gave geese Bronco Philly? Surely Dwight Eisenhower was stupid implementing the Interstate road system, another form of Democratic socialism? No, Democratic socialism is not a losing strategy. It is simply another POV of how capitalism should work.

We all should be open to competing ideas. We all should be open to compromise. Narrow minds do not make for good government nor for good society.

As to the 2020 election it is the Democrats to lose. Based on the way too early to call view of the candidates and their approach, the Dems seem hell bent on giving the election to the Repubs. Your candidate has locked in his base, approximately 34% of US voters according to most sources. However, he has alienated the vast majority of Americans. His budget proposal just released cuts Social Security and Medicare. I wonder how many that are not the base will applaud that move.

Most would argue that voter suppression by the Republicans is a larger concern than unproven ballot tampering by Dems. Perhaps why the Gerrymandering ballot proposal passed so easily here in Michigan.

However, if you are like every other maga. supporter it is pointless to talk. I don't know you Bronco Philly and I am not accusing you of anything, but all the trumpettes I have talked to over the past 3 years harbor a great deal of hate and/or fear. Not that they would admit it or even recognize they have it. Can't have a reasonable discussion with someone who harbors either. This includes other fellow Broncos.

From my POV we could use more Eisenhowers and Nelson Rockefeller's and fewer trump or mcconnells.

Good points, Aimless!

Both parties need more centrists who are not ideological absolutists or unethical trolls (Trump/Clintons/Kennedys).

I do not like or support Trump, but he is a Dem creation based on the feeble, highly-unethical (yes, even compared to Trump) candidate they ran in 2016 (Biden would have beaten Trump badly and should have been the nominee). And I agree the Dems seem determined to reelect Trump with a collection of nut-job, Socialist, candidates who will never be able to get to 50 percent +1.

Speaking of Socialism, here is an interesting video from Prager U:

https://www.prageru.com/video/capitalism-vs-socialism/

Cheers!
(This post was last modified: 03-12-2019 08:06 AM by GullLake.)
03-12-2019 08:05 AM
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HaymondAtThe4 Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
Quote:If you look at the two major parties and their political drift over the past 70 or so years, the Repubs have drifted from conservative to arch right extremism and the Dems have drifted from democratic socialism to become what most considered moderates 70 years ago.

This is definitely true on economic questions (unions, gov spending, safety net, taxation, etc.). Because it was hugely popular, the New Deal set the foundations of US economic policy from FDR-Nixon. The country (and a lot of Western Europe) moved right beginning really with Reagan, but also continuing through Carter, Clinton, and Obama. Laissez-faire economics came back into vogue and ended up having the same effects it did during the Gilded Age, a lot of poverty and suffering, and a lot of discontent with the political status quo. The newly rising left says to blame the wealthy, corporations, and the economic/political system that allows them to rig the economy to their benefit. Trump says to blame immigrants and campus feminism and your nephew who tells you you can't say stuff is gay anymore.

I think a lot of these new Democrats (Omar, AOC, Tlaib, and the presidential candidates moving left) are really trying to move the country's economic foundations back to the New Deal consensus and away from the neoliberal consensus. This is viewed as radical because, in comparison with Obama's or Clinton's platforms, it is! But so was the New Deal a radical break from the Gilded Age Laissez-faire corporate economics that led to the Great Depression.

My big hope is that, when faced with massive crises (global warming, bloated healthcare costs and the scourge of preventable death in our health system, student loan debt, etc.) and big, bold policy proposals (Green New Deal, Medicare for All, and tuition free public college) people will quit asking "Is this radically different? Will this result in a political backlash" and instead start asking "Is this policy proposal adequate to respond to the crises we face? Does the scale of the proposed solutions offered match the scale of the problems we face?"
03-12-2019 09:09 AM
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BroncoPhilly Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
(03-12-2019 06:02 AM)Aimless1 Wrote:  Ah yes. Another member of the arch right. Democratic socialism works for so many of our allies .... Canada, Sweden, Norway, Great Britain. Surely they don't have the brains God gave geese Bronco Philly? Surely Dwight Eisenhower was stupid implementing the Interstate road system, another form of Democratic socialism? No, Democratic socialism is not a losing strategy. It is simply another POV of how capitalism should work.

We all should be open to competing ideas. We all should be open to compromise. Narrow minds do not make for good government nor for good society.

As to the 2020 election it is the Democrats to lose. Based on the way too early to call view of the candidates and their approach, the Dems seem hell bent on giving the election to the Repubs. Your candidate has locked in his base, approximately 34% of US voters according to most sources. However, he has alienated the vast majority of Americans. His budget proposal just released cuts Social Security and Medicare. I wonder how many that are not the base will applaud that move.

Most would argue that voter suppression by the Republicans is a larger concern than unproven ballot tampering by Dems. Perhaps why the Gerrymandering ballot proposal passed so easily here in Michigan.

However, if you are like every other maga. supporter it is pointless to talk. I don't know you Bronco Philly and I am not accusing you of anything, but all the trumpettes I have talked to over the past 3 years harbor a great deal of hate and/or fear. Not that they would admit it or even recognize they have it. Can't have a reasonable discussion with someone who harbors either. This includes other fellow Broncos.

From my POV we could use more Eisenhowers and Nelson Rockefeller's and fewer trump or mcconnells.


So now I'm 'arch right'? Incredible. My political philosophy is the same as the one I use to guide my life-personal responsibility. If we had more folks embrace that instead of looking for someone else to pay for their wants and needs it'd be a far better country. Unfortunately-and what the Democrats rely on-is we have an entitlement mentality with a lot of folks feeling the wealthy/accomplished persons need to pay for their needs. Gimme, gimme, gimme.

The Democrats have broken new ground in playing dirty politics. We have had several top level bureaucrats attempt sedition against a duly elected US President-and they WILL be held accountable for their crimes, on that you can depend. Including the folks who paid for the salacious document used to justify the FISA request. Equal dispensation of Justice for everyone, or nobody has justice.

And if you think things are so great in 'Canada, Sweden, Norway, Great Britain...' why don't you move there? You'll find high unemployment, confiscatory taxes, rampant immigration problems as they try and ram folks in to broaden their tax base, escalating violent crime and queues for anything but the most basic services at their Health Care Centers. Better yet, move to Venezuela or Cuba, those other bastions of Socialism-equality of poverty!

The members of my own family who are Leftist Democrats are typical-they are almost without exception the non-performers in the family who mooch off of everyone else. They are chronically unemployed, reliant on social safety nets to meet their needs. They've done virtually nothing to make themselves more employable over the decades, but can they bich about how the government needs to do more to help them out! Always looking for somebody or someone else to carry their share of the load-that's my view of most Dems. Pathetic and sad.
(This post was last modified: 03-12-2019 10:50 AM by BroncoPhilly.)
03-12-2019 10:44 AM
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Aimless1 Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
BP, you just demonstrated how arch right you are. Embrace it or change.

Great points GL & Haymondatthe4. If we all focus on solutions to our nations many issues and problems it will be easier to compromise and agree on what is best for America. Polarization no matter the political party is counter productive.
03-12-2019 10:58 AM
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BroncoPhilly Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Tax the rich
I'll change when I'm wrong, sure as hell not at the request of some short-pants pompadour.

You'll have to scratch one name off your Top Nation list, Finland's entire government resigned over escalating costs for their social safety nets-including Health Care. Whoopsidungle! Moron.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/08/world...signs.html
(This post was last modified: 03-12-2019 01:50 PM by BroncoPhilly.)
03-12-2019 11:16 AM
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HaymondAtThe4 Offline
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RE: Tax the rich
(03-12-2019 11:16 AM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  I'll change when I'm wrong.

You'll have to scratch one name off your Top Nation list, Finland's entire government resigned over escalating costs for their social safety nets-including Health Care. Whoopsidungle! Moron.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/08/world...signs.html

Finland has a parliamentary government. A center-right coalition was elected. The article says they resigned after "failing to push through an overhaul of social and health care programs." I feel like you're going from there to something like "Finland is in crisis because of their safety net." My takeaway is more like "Finnish politicians tried to mess with the safety net, and it failed because people really like having their basic needs guaranteed." So much of Europe would riot if a politician ran on "Let's implement US-style economic policy. Let's privatize healthcare and defund universities so tuition costs explode and people have to resort to massive amounts of debt in order to get a bachelor's degree, which also happens to be more or less a pre-requisite for managing to crack the middle class." The status quo is really bad!
03-12-2019 12:44 PM
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Boca Rocket Offline
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Post: #19
RE: Tax the rich
(03-11-2019 08:17 PM)Ken Barna Wrote:  Dear Bronco's of the right,
Most of what you have spewed here is pure crap. Democrats are not anti-American. Just because they espouse a different philosophy then what you on the right want, does not make them bad, terrible, or as already said anti-American.
We already have many forms of socialism in this country. Social Security, Medicare, G.I. Bill of Rights, Welfare Programs, etc. So, stop acting like we as a nation are simon pure capitalists, and somehow someway, if we go down that socialistic path we are all doomed.

And Medicare is doing very well.
03-12-2019 12:53 PM
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BroncoPhilly Offline
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Post: #20
RE: Tax the rich
(03-12-2019 12:53 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  
(03-11-2019 08:17 PM)Ken Barna Wrote:  Dear Bronco's of the right,
Most of what you have spewed here is pure crap. Democrats are not anti-American. Just because they espouse a different philosophy then what you on the right want, does not make them bad, terrible, or as already said anti-American.
We already have many forms of socialism in this country. Social Security, Medicare, G.I. Bill of Rights, Welfare Programs, etc. So, stop acting like we as a nation are simon pure capitalists, and somehow someway, if we go down that socialistic path we are all doomed.

And Medicare is doing very well.


All those programs are in demographic distress as the population ages and the number of working stiffs supporting retirees becomes less and less. When you folks going to learn that Ponzi schemes don't work long term? One born every minute, I guess. Dummies never learn. Ever.
03-12-2019 01:52 PM
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