(03-09-2019 04:36 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  The SEC is in the same boat as The ACC. Clemson, Georgia Tech, Louisville and Florida State all have a 9th game already scheduled every season with their opposite number SEC program. If The SEC adds a 9th conference that means South Carolina, Georgia, Kentucky and Florida would have 10 games scheduled every season. That leaves two games for marquee out of conference matchups on the schedule. One would think it would also eliminate The SEC’s annual “get well” game that lets SEC rest their starters during the regular season.

Before The SEC or The ACC adds a 9th conference game the season will be stretched to 13 regular season games. Media partners are going to demand it.

Well, if the SEC were to add Clemson and FSU, that only leaves two schools in each conference in this situation, which is not enough to block a move to 9 conference games.

(03-08-2019 09:10 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  An 8-game schedule is certainly possible with a 16-team SEC. The use of rotating pods would permit a full conference playthrough in 3 years, and a full home-and-away playthrough in 6 (vs. an appalling 12 years with the current 14-team SEC). The overall structure I came up with for the divisions and schedule is nearly the same as JR's above, but it also specifies an alternate crossover, which is required for years in which a team shares a division with its protected crossover.


Here's a scenario for 2025ish, wherein the Oklahomas join the SEC.

School: Protected crossover (play annually), Alternate crossover (play 2 years out of 3)

East Pod
Florida: Oklahoma State, LSU
Georgia: Georgia, Texas A&M
Kentucky: Tennessee, Mississippi State
South Carolina: Missouri, Ole Miss

North Pod
Arkansas: Mississippi State, Tennessee
Missouri: South Carolina, Vanderbilt
Oklahoma: Texas A&M, Auburn
Oklahoma State: Florida, Alabama

South Pod
Alabama: LSU, Oklahoma State
Auburn: Georgia, Oklahoma
Tennessee: Kentucky, Arkansas
Vanderbilt: Ole Miss, Missouri

West Pod
LSU: Alabama, Florida
Mississippi State: Arkansas, Kentucky
Ole Miss: Vanderbilt, South Carolina
Texas A&M: Oklahoma, Georgia


And here's one wherein the SEC does not expand until the 2030s, around the time the ACC GoR is running out.

School: Protected crossover (play annually), Alternate crossover (play 2 years out of 3)

East Pod
Florida: LSU, Tennessee
Georgia: Auburn, Texas A&M
NC State: Mississippi State, Missouri
South Carolina: Arkansas, Vanderbilt

North Pod
Kentucky: Missouri, Mississippi State
Tennessee: Alabama, Florida
Vanderbilt: Ole Miss, South Carolina
Virginia Tech: Texas A&M, Auburn

South Pod
Alabama: Tennessee, LSU
Auburn: Georgia, Virginia Tech
Mississippi State: NC State, Kentucky
Ole Miss: Vanderbilt, Arkansas

West Pod
Arkansas: South Carolina, Ole Miss
LSU: Florida, Alabama
Missouri: Kentucky, NC State
Texas A&M: Virginia Tech, Georgia


As for the division names, how about Dixie and Gulf? Dixie and Southern? Dixie and Trixie? Better than Legends and Leaders, anyway.

The "9" game Conference schedule is the basic number of in-conference games based on the 16 member conference. You play the 3 other teams in your conference annually and two of the four members of the other three conferences each year making a total of "9" conference games. The two games from the other divisions played each year could be a cycle of home and home with the same two teams form each division for two years and then switch to the other two teams the next two years. This creates a revolving cycle in which a team plays every other team in it's conference home and away every 4 years. The pods reduce travel costs and create regional rivalries while allowing teams to play the entire conference to create familiarity among the rest of the conference.

Positives for the pod system;

1, Regional Divisions.
2, Creating/supporting fan interest by giving them regional teams to play as rivals.
3, Reduces over all travel costs.
4, Gives the conference more inventory to sell by providing a 9th conference game for each team.
4, Provides for 4 Divisional Champions thus enabling 4 teams to possibly make the playoffs instead of just 2.

Negatives for the pod system;

1, Creates a 9 game conference schedule thus reducing OOC games by one.
2, Gives 4 Divisional champions and forces a tie breaker system to be used more often then not.
3, Conferences may play less other conferences less often.

Add teams? The SEC needs to kick mizzou and Arkansas out. Maybe kick USCe out too.

Add Gatech (back), Clemson and FSU.

(03-09-2019 12:54 PM)shere khan Wrote:  Add teams? The SEC needs to kick mizzou and Arkansas out. Maybe kick USCe out too.

Add Gatech (back), Clemson and FSU.

Another old school guy talking. Sadly 2 of those 3 are being withheld so Mickey Mouse can protect his investment and get them cheap.

(03-09-2019 08:20 AM)Mestophalies Wrote:  The "9" game Conference schedule is the basic number of in-conference games based on the 16 member conference. You play the 3 other teams in your conference annually and two of the four members of the other three conferences each year making a total of "9" conference games. The two games from the other divisions played each year could be a cycle of home and home with the same two teams form each division for two years and then switch to the other two teams the next two years. This creates a revolving cycle in which a team plays every other team in it's conference home and away every 4 years. The pods reduce travel costs and create regional rivalries while allowing teams to play the entire conference to create familiarity among the rest of the conference.

Positives for the pod system;

1, Regional Divisions.
2, Creating/supporting fan interest by giving them regional teams to play as rivals.
3, Reduces over all travel costs.
4, Gives the conference more inventory to sell by providing a 9th conference game for each team.
4, Provides for 4 Divisional Champions thus enabling 4 teams to possibly make the playoffs instead of just 2.

Negatives for the pod system;

1, Creates a 9 game conference schedule thus reducing OOC games by one.
2, Gives 4 Divisional champions and forces a tie breaker system to be used more often then not.
3, Conferences may play less other conferences less often.

You're preaching to the choir.

A 9-game conference schedule for a 16-team conference is better IMO than an 8-game one because you can play all teams in the conference at least once in just 2 years (or at least twice in 4) rather than 3 (or at least twice in 6). However, the SEC has been resistant to increasing its conference schedule to 9 games, so I was discussing how it was possible to have an 8-game schedule.

Additionally, having all 4 pods act as separate divisions has advantages over alternating the pods between two 8-team divisions, but the former is currently not possible under NCAA rules, while the latter is. And you don't technically have to have 4 divisions to put 4 teams in the conference championship. You just need an NCAA rule change to permit wild cards.

No one is going anywhere. Expansion is for all practical purposes is dead. Texas and Oklahoma can effectively bury it for the next decade plus by re-upping with The Big 12.

(03-09-2019 06:06 AM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(03-09-2019 04:36 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  The SEC is in the same boat as The ACC. Clemson, Georgia Tech, Louisville and Florida State all have a 9th game already scheduled every season with their opposite number SEC program. If The SEC adds a 9th conference that means South Carolina, Georgia, Kentucky and Florida would have 10 games scheduled every season. That leaves two games for marquee out of conference matchups on the schedule. One would think it would also eliminate The SEC’s annual “get well” game that lets SEC rest their starters during the regular season.

Before The SEC or The ACC adds a 9th conference game the season will be stretched to 13 regular season games. Media partners are going to demand it.

Well, if the SEC were to add Clemson and FSU, that only leaves two schools in each conference in this situation, which is not enough to block a move to 9 conference games.

Why would ESPN, that owns the broadcast rights for both conferences, sign off on that deal? Effectively agreeing to pay more for properties they already have.
Never mind that The ACC is locked down until 2036.
If Texas and Oklahoma stay in The Big 12, conference expansion is dead.

(03-10-2019 11:15 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  

(03-09-2019 06:06 AM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(03-09-2019 04:36 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  The SEC is in the same boat as The ACC. Clemson, Georgia Tech, Louisville and Florida State all have a 9th game already scheduled every season with their opposite number SEC program. If The SEC adds a 9th conference that means South Carolina, Georgia, Kentucky and Florida would have 10 games scheduled every season. That leaves two games for marquee out of conference matchups on the schedule. One would think it would also eliminate The SEC’s annual “get well” game that lets SEC rest their starters during the regular season.

Before The SEC or The ACC adds a 9th conference game the season will be stretched to 13 regular season games. Media partners are going to demand it.

Well, if the SEC were to add Clemson and FSU, that only leaves two schools in each conference in this situation, which is not enough to block a move to 9 conference games.

Why would ESPN, that owns the broadcast rights for both conferences, sign off on that deal? Effectively agreeing to pay more for properties they already have.
Never mind that The ACC is locked down until 2036.
If Texas and Oklahoma stay in The Big 12, conference expansion is dead.

I was just posing a hypothetical and discussing the internal politics within the conferences. I didn't say it was likely or could happen any time soon.

In such a scenario, I suppose ESPN might just pay the SEC more and the ACC less, so it balances out.

(03-10-2019 10:44 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  No one is going anywhere. Expansion is for all practical purposes is dead. Texas and Oklahoma can effectively bury it for the next decade plus by re-upping with The Big 12.

There are many in the industry that believe the SEC will get a renewal from CBS that will be in the neighborhood of 250 million on the low end and over 300 million on the high end for their T1 rights. That will put the SEC TV revenue at over 60 million per school. And CBS has said they would like to get this deal done early.

There are others who are certain that Oklahoma no longer desires to remain tied to the Big 12.

Put those two together and I'd say the possibility of realignment in 2022-5 is relatively high.

The issue isn't that the Big 12 isn't stable. It is that the Big 12 revenue is static and Texas and Oklahoma fans yearn for better competition on their home schedules.

Edit: And it won't be just the SEC that will be tempting those schools, and it won't just be those schools either. Perhaps the most precariously positioned Big 12 school is Kansas. They have to worry about a future where Oklahoma and/or Texas moves for one reason or another and they get left out. Kansas too holds out value for the right suitor. Kansas could well be the lynchpin to the well being of the Big 12.

Texas and Oklahoma hold the expansion key. I see Kansas as moving only as a last resort. If Texas and Oklahoma leave The Big 12 for other conferences, Kansas would try to head to The Big Ten.

(03-10-2019 10:44 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  No one is going anywhere. Expansion is for all practical purposes is dead. Texas and Oklahoma can effectively bury it for the next decade plus by re-upping with The Big 12.

They will.

(03-10-2019 01:51 PM)CardinalJim Wrote:  Texas and Oklahoma hold the expansion key. I see Kansas as moving only as a last resort. If Texas and Oklahoma leave The Big 12 for other conferences, Kansas would try to head to The Big Ten.

Possibly, but if you are Kansas and either the SEC or Big 10 gave you a firm offer around 2022-3 what would you do? 210 million on football renovations isn't a project required for Big 12 membership. It's not a sum that a school undertakes unless is has to.

I'm guess I'm pointing out that the girl doesn't get dressed up if she has no place to go and is expecting to go slumming with her pals.

Texas is the one least likely to move first. Oklahoma might need a prod, but has definitely been checking out their options extraneous the Big 12. Kansas would be the easiest excuse for OU to take since the Big 12 has taken great pains to illustrate to its members that there are no suitable future members, or replacement candidates, who can add value. So if either the SEC or Big 10 are interested in Oklahoma (and they both are) then Kansas is the best first move to make.

(03-10-2019 03:10 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(03-10-2019 01:51 PM)CardinalJim Wrote:  Texas and Oklahoma hold the expansion key. I see Kansas as moving only as a last resort. If Texas and Oklahoma leave The Big 12 for other conferences, Kansas would try to head to The Big Ten.

Possibly, but if you are Kansas and either the SEC or Big 10 gave you a firm offer around 2022-3 what would you do? 210 million on football renovations isn't a project required for Big 12 membership. It's not a sum that a school undertakes unless is has to.

I'm guess I'm pointing out that the girl doesn't get dressed up if she has no place to go and is expecting to go slumming with her pals.

Texas is the one least likely to move first. Oklahoma might need a prod, but has definitely been checking out their options extraneous the Big 12. Kansas would be the easiest excuse for OU to take since the Big 12 has taken great pains to illustrate to its members that there are no suitable future members, or replacement candidates, who can add value. So if either the SEC or Big 10 are interested in Oklahoma (and they both are) then Kansas is the best first move to make.

That seems risky though. What if you take Kansas but neither OU nor UT follows? Also, if you take Kansas first, you may be giving up on getting both OU and UT.

(03-10-2019 03:15 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(03-10-2019 03:10 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(03-10-2019 01:51 PM)CardinalJim Wrote:  Texas and Oklahoma hold the expansion key. I see Kansas as moving only as a last resort. If Texas and Oklahoma leave The Big 12 for other conferences, Kansas would try to head to The Big Ten.

Possibly, but if you are Kansas and either the SEC or Big 10 gave you a firm offer around 2022-3 what would you do? 210 million on football renovations isn't a project required for Big 12 membership. It's not a sum that a school undertakes unless is has to.

I'm guess I'm pointing out that the girl doesn't get dressed up if she has no place to go and is expecting to go slumming with her pals.

Texas is the one least likely to move first. Oklahoma might need a prod, but has definitely been checking out their options extraneous the Big 12. Kansas would be the easiest excuse for OU to take since the Big 12 has taken great pains to illustrate to its members that there are no suitable future members, or replacement candidates, who can add value. So if either the SEC or Big 10 are interested in Oklahoma (and they both are) then Kansas is the best first move to make.

That seems risky though. What if you take Kansas but neither OU nor UT follows?

It's not that risky at all. If you are the SEC or Big 10 you can accomplish your purpose with another school by just waiting. And for Texas, if Kansas leaves the only remaining AAU buddy you have left is Iowa State, and they aren't really a UT bud. I think the only real whiff that could happen would be if the Big 10 offered Kansas and OU and UT headed Southeast. The SEC really wants a much larger % of the DFW market. It wouldn't be a home run but if we offered Kansas and OU and UT headed North we could cover DFW with T.C.U. who is the 5th largest revenue producer in the Big 12.

I don't consider that scenario being very likely however because Texas is never going to head to a conference where there are no other Texas schools.

Clay Travis lays it out in the simplest terms Here

The second school in Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, Kentucky and now Texas will never get enough votes to join.

Of course we’ll hear this isn’t true, and we’re not likely to ever find out either way

If the SEC is already getting a deal like that, then why do they need to add Oklahoma or Kansas?

(03-10-2019 07:05 PM)esayem Wrote:  If the SEC is already getting a deal like that, then why do they need to add Oklahoma or Kansas?

Roughly a 2.5 to 3 million greater payout per school if either of OU or UT join. Roughly 5 million per member school for the pair. Kansas might pass the Mendoza line if we hit 60.