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ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
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Jjoey52 Offline
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Post: #61
ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-07-2019 03:13 PM)TerryD Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 02:55 PM)OrangeDude Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 02:00 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 11:36 AM)OrangeDude Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 06:33 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  I felt the same way about the ACC’s intentions. For a twofer, no less, with figuring out a way to get ND into ACC championship eligibility (and de facto football membership) and for the semi-final; getting to fourteen games.

Delany is an annoying gatekeeper. Ironically, though, thirteen games is something the B1G and ND were for. But, I guess the Big Ten must have a say in all FBS functions.

Again, as an outsider looking in and as simply a fan of college athletics, that viewpoint may seem plausible. Let's carry this out to its logical conclusion. The ACC would have 15 teams, 5 teams in each division. Each team not named ND plays both the four other members of their division as well as two teams each from the other two divisions. Think the teams in the other two divisions aren't going to complain and gripe about that? Also think about the optics to power brokers and media from outside the conference and how their view of the ACC will be colored by this "favoritism" toward ND. Right now the vast majority of the vitriol (where it exists) is pointed directly at ND, with this maneuver the ACC would get a nearly equal share of it as well. Those are just two of the negatives.

Let's talk about the positives ND has brought to ACC football. Cycling through two games with the Irish every six years has helped in terms of ratings, exposure (especially for those from the Coastal who don't get to play FSU and Clemson annually), attendance at those home games, etc. These are the reasons why the ACC fought to get 5 instead of 4 games from ND and fought to ensure that they would play everyone in the conference. Three divisions and giving ND 4 annual opponents and one other team from the other two divisions to get to 5 games honors the words of the agreement between ND and the ACC but not its spirit. It would take 20 years for the other 10 teams to get an ND home and away game, more than three times what it takes now for 10 of those teams.

I believe that if Swofford recommended to the ACC presidents this action, they would call for his head on a platter. But that is just me. Oh WAIT! Maybe this isn't such a bad idea after all?

I keed, I keed.

Cheers,
Neil

The ACC could simply put ND in a 7 team division, require them to play all 6 and only count division games for the division title. Maybe even flip them between divisions every couple of years so everyone gets to play them (couple others would have to flip also). ND is sometimes playing 6 ACC games now. Others could play cross-division games that don't count in the standings. The ACC doesn't need to do anything exotic like 3 divisions.

They could do that, but the point of my post was to keep things basically to what ND has already agreed to - 5 games annually against the ACC. And yes the first two years had ND facing 4 and then 6 due to what ND had already on the books at that time. Every year since has had five and the games through 2037 (yes, that is not a typo through 2037) have already been mapped out.

Cheers,
Neil

ND doesn't want any of this. It doesn't want to join the ACC in football or be eligible for the ACC championship game.


Then make only conference teams eligible for CFP. They still can continue as is or be eligible for playoffs, their choice.


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01-07-2019 06:28 PM
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AllTideUp Online
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Post: #62
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-07-2019 03:20 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 02:10 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  
(01-06-2019 09:47 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Or, the committee could just consider only each team's W-L record vs. FBS teams, similar to the basketball committee only considering a team's games vs. D-I teams.

That way, almost every CCG participant would have 12 games including the CCG considered, which would be the same number of games as Notre Dame and every other team that doesn't play FCS opponents.

However, quite a few FBS squads are of FCS quality. At least, their competitiveness doesn't demonstrate otherwise even when you account for that fact they have additional scholarships.

Playing a random FCS team is not even close to playing a random FBS team.

Let's look at Sagarin ratings, because he combines FBS and FCS teams in one ranking.

If you're saying that some FBS teams are at or below the quality of the median FCS team -- no, they're not. More than half of FCS is below the lowest-ranked FBS team in Sagarin's ranking. Only 10 percent of FCS is at or above the very lowest-ranked P5 team.

If you're saying that playing FCS teams that are as good as many FBS teams should count... maybe an FBS team playing NDSU or EWU can make that argument, but almost no one else can. Very few FBS teams schedule the best FCS teams. Nobody in FBS scheduled NDSU this season. Alabama's FCS opponent this year was The Citadel, who wasn't anywhere near the best FCS teams and, according to Sagarin, was as good or better as only the 7 worst FBS teams.

I'm not talking about picking any random team from either classification. The Citadel, a low level FCS squad, appears to be on the same level as the bottom rung of FBS squads. That's actually my point.

I'm not sure what Sagarin's process is, but the typical low-level FBS squad gets blown out about as often as the typical FCS squad.

Leagues like the American and Mountain West tend to have solid performances and even some upsets. You drop down to CUSA, the Sun Belt, and the MAC though and the games tend to be a rout. Regardless of the average margin of victory(which is probably greater when you're playing an FCS squad, admittedly), the effective result of the game is the same.

Very FCS squads are good teams and they're not scheduled often, I get that, but I'm looking at the typical result of a Power school against an FCS or low-level FBS squad.
01-08-2019 08:44 AM
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micahandme Offline
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Post: #63
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-06-2019 08:35 PM)BePcr07 Wrote:  Perhaps every school gets a 13th. With divisions: division winners play for conference championship, division runners up play, 3rd teams play, etc. Or go divisionless - 1 plays 2 for championship, 3 plays 4, etc. Make bowl requirement 7-6 (over .500) or if you play in conference championship.

This actually makes me think of something else that could help CFB's "too many games" problem for CFB. Personally, I don't think it IS a problem...very few actually play more than 13 right now. What, like 20 teams play 14...two play 15 usually...about 60 others play 13...and about 50 only play 12???

If the "schedule" went down to 11...and then they played 1v2, 3v4, 5v6, etc...for the 12th game (at the higher seeds' home stadiums), that would mean that even the team that made the championship game would only play 15 still, four teams would play 14, and everybody else would be 13 or less.
01-08-2019 10:35 AM
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megadrone Offline
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Post: #64
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-06-2019 10:04 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(01-06-2019 09:57 PM)JRsec Wrote:  It's a non issue and the NCAA doesn't have to approve. N.D. just has to play Hawaii.

of course they can, but that's not what Notre Dame is wanting.

But it's the ultimate in barnstorming!
01-08-2019 01:04 PM
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ohio1317 Offline
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Post: #65
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
I don't really think a 13th game in and of itself necessarily makes huge difference on schedule, but people are looking really closely at late season match-ups which hurts the Irish the last week. I don't think a 13th game matters quite as much as getting a quality opponent the championship weekend which isn't really feasible without being scheduled late.

I don't think there are any legs on this, but still smart of the school to mention. It at least gives them ammunition to say only reason a 13th datapoint is not there is because the NCAA won't allow regardless of record at end of season.
01-09-2019 12:04 AM
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Kaplony Offline
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Post: #66
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
It's just typical Notre Dame arrogance, expecting everyone to give them special consideration because of some long dead excellence.

The 13th data point comes from a conference championship game. Primarily, to get in a conference championship game you have to join a conference. If you don't want to join a conference then play @ Hawaii every single year and get the Hawaii exception. If that doesn't suit you then tough. This isn't the 1950's and you aren't any more special than anybody else.
01-09-2019 03:01 PM
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stever20 Offline
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Post: #67
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-09-2019 12:04 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  I don't really think a 13th game in and of itself necessarily makes huge difference on schedule, but people are looking really closely at late season match-ups which hurts the Irish the last week. I don't think a 13th game matters quite as much as getting a quality opponent the championship weekend which isn't really feasible without being scheduled late.

I don't think there are any legs on this, but still smart of the school to mention. It at least gives them ammunition to say only reason a 13th datapoint is not there is because the NCAA won't allow regardless of record at end of season.

they can say it until they're blue in the face but it doesn't matter.... Don't like it either play at Hawaii or Join a conference. Either one. If not, shut up.
01-09-2019 03:18 PM
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whittx Offline
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Post: #68
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-07-2019 01:56 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 09:44 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  It goes without saying, but Notre Dame will not be forced to join a conference. Notre Dame provides incredible value as an independent. Forcing them to join the ACC would be forcing them to lose their value playing a national schedule (which is better for the NCAA for popularity reasons). As long as there is a conceivable pathway for ND to earn a playoff spot (much like this season), then there really is no problem with the current landscape. It would be akin to forcing the SEC to relinquish their FCS buy-games, which offer tremendous value as additional home games for revenue, in favor of equal home/away games with other conferences. You cannot force a program, which already has established and considerable value, to give that up because it better aligns the structural system. Not all programs are created equal, as shown in college football.

I will say, however, that since Notre Dame (and others) choose to remain independent, they should not be given special privileges to have an additional 13th game in order to compete against teams that have a conference championship opportunity. Doing so would open up Pandora's Box and allow all schools not in a CCG to schedule a 13th game during that open week as well, which would (conceivably) take away the platforms of the Conference Championships.

Notre Dame has absolutely zero value as an independent to anyone other than Notre Dame. I think their independence isn't really of value to them either, but that's hard to quantify.

As long as they have the NBC deal (or something similar), they are in no hurry to move. The second this goes away and nobody else bids on their games, they would be the 15th team in the ACC within a month.
01-09-2019 04:54 PM
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Fighting Muskie Offline
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Post: #69
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
ND is an independent by choice not be necessity. All ten FBS conferences would gladly take them--half would let them play all their conference games at home with the ND coaching staff refereeing the game.

They should get no special treatment and their should be no exemption that might encourage others, like Texas, to go the independent route.

ND needs to do the best they can with the 12 data points they do have. The fact that they don't play FCS schools is a step in the right direction. The Irish need to be playing 10 P5 opponents at a minimum and at least a few of them need to be contenders for a conference crown.

If they want an easier path to the post season it's as simple as adding three more ACC opponents each year. The USC and Navy rivalries can probably stay but Stanford will no longer be able to be an annual event and they'd probably want to play a Big Ten school annually, rotating among their historic rivals. The ACC would probably even create a divisional structure where ND would be the annual favorite for their division each year.
01-10-2019 08:19 AM
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Wolfman Offline
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Post: #70
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
ND already has access to a 13th game, they just don't want to pay the price. ND made the choice to remain independent in football. Accept the consequences of your decision.

Granting an exception would open Pandora's Box. Michigan could argue that they should get a 13th game so they have equal comparison with Ohio State. FSU and Clemson are in the same division so one will always be out of the CCG. They could argue the same thing. The list is endless.
01-10-2019 09:09 AM
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panite Offline
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RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-10-2019 08:19 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  ND is an independent by choice not be necessity. All ten FBS conferences would gladly take them--half would let them play all their conference games at home with the ND coaching staff refereeing the game.

They should get no special treatment and their should be no exemption that might encourage others, like Texas, to go the independent route.

ND needs to do the best they can with the 12 data points they do have. The fact that they don't play FCS schools is a step in the right direction. The Irish need to be playing 10 P5 opponents at a minimum and at least a few of them need to be contenders for a conference crown.

If they want an easier path to the post season it's as simple as adding three more ACC opponents each year. The USC and Navy rivalries can probably stay but Stanford will no longer be able to be an annual event and they'd probably want to play a Big Ten school annually, rotating among their historic rivals. The ACC would probably even create a divisional structure where ND would be the annual favorite for their division each year.

Old BE Division plus UConn - Old ACC Division minus Maryland.

Old BE - ND, Cuse, VT, BC, L'Ville, Miami, Pitt, and bring in UConn for 16/8. Last game of the season "Convicts verses the Catholics".

Old ACC - Virginia, NCST, NC, Georgia Tech, Florida St, Wake Forest, Duke, Clemson.

02-13-banana 02-13-banana 04-jawdrop 04-jawdropCOGS COGS 04-cheers
01-10-2019 10:24 AM
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GoldenWarrior11 Online
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Post: #72
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-09-2019 04:54 PM)whittx Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 01:56 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 09:44 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  It goes without saying, but Notre Dame will not be forced to join a conference. Notre Dame provides incredible value as an independent. Forcing them to join the ACC would be forcing them to lose their value playing a national schedule (which is better for the NCAA for popularity reasons). As long as there is a conceivable pathway for ND to earn a playoff spot (much like this season), then there really is no problem with the current landscape. It would be akin to forcing the SEC to relinquish their FCS buy-games, which offer tremendous value as additional home games for revenue, in favor of equal home/away games with other conferences. You cannot force a program, which already has established and considerable value, to give that up because it better aligns the structural system. Not all programs are created equal, as shown in college football.

I will say, however, that since Notre Dame (and others) choose to remain independent, they should not be given special privileges to have an additional 13th game in order to compete against teams that have a conference championship opportunity. Doing so would open up Pandora's Box and allow all schools not in a CCG to schedule a 13th game during that open week as well, which would (conceivably) take away the platforms of the Conference Championships.

Notre Dame has absolutely zero value as an independent to anyone other than Notre Dame. I think their independence isn't really of value to them either, but that's hard to quantify.

As long as they have the NBC deal (or something similar), they are in no hurry to move. The second this goes away and nobody else bids on their games, they would be the 15th team in the ACC within a month.

That's the thing though: ND has concrete value as an Independent. Networks (NBC) pay them a determined amount to broadcast their games (and, conversely, major college programs schedule them as an Independent because of the exposure and value they provide). If they didn't provide value, big programs like Alabama, Texas, Oklahoma, Ohio State, Michigan, Texas A&M and Georgia would not have scheduled Notre Dame to play them - either in the past ten years or in the future - nor would other big programs like USC and Stanford continue scheduling them annually.

The people that get frustrated by Notre Dame's independence are either frustrated that their program cannot receive the same considerations, or are ignorant of what Notre Dame brings to the table. Either way, Notre Dame's status is not changing - and the P5 will continue to make accommodations for them because there remains value in the current construction. 07-coffee3
(This post was last modified: 01-10-2019 10:41 AM by GoldenWarrior11.)
01-10-2019 10:41 AM
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stever20 Offline
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Post: #73
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-10-2019 10:41 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  
(01-09-2019 04:54 PM)whittx Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 01:56 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 09:44 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  It goes without saying, but Notre Dame will not be forced to join a conference. Notre Dame provides incredible value as an independent. Forcing them to join the ACC would be forcing them to lose their value playing a national schedule (which is better for the NCAA for popularity reasons). As long as there is a conceivable pathway for ND to earn a playoff spot (much like this season), then there really is no problem with the current landscape. It would be akin to forcing the SEC to relinquish their FCS buy-games, which offer tremendous value as additional home games for revenue, in favor of equal home/away games with other conferences. You cannot force a program, which already has established and considerable value, to give that up because it better aligns the structural system. Not all programs are created equal, as shown in college football.

I will say, however, that since Notre Dame (and others) choose to remain independent, they should not be given special privileges to have an additional 13th game in order to compete against teams that have a conference championship opportunity. Doing so would open up Pandora's Box and allow all schools not in a CCG to schedule a 13th game during that open week as well, which would (conceivably) take away the platforms of the Conference Championships.

Notre Dame has absolutely zero value as an independent to anyone other than Notre Dame. I think their independence isn't really of value to them either, but that's hard to quantify.

As long as they have the NBC deal (or something similar), they are in no hurry to move. The second this goes away and nobody else bids on their games, they would be the 15th team in the ACC within a month.

That's the thing though: ND has concrete value as an Independent. Networks (NBC) pay them a determined amount to broadcast their games (and, conversely, major college programs schedule them as an Independent because of the exposure and value they provide). If they didn't provide value, big programs like Alabama, Texas, Oklahoma, Ohio State, Michigan, Texas A&M and Georgia would not have scheduled Notre Dame to play them - either in the past ten years or in the future - nor would other big programs like USC and Stanford continue scheduling them annually.

The people that get frustrated by Notre Dame's independence are either frustrated that their program cannot receive the same considerations, or are ignorant of what Notre Dame brings to the table. Either way, Notre Dame's status is not changing - and the P5 will continue to make accommodations for them because there remains value in the current construction. 07-coffee3

they might make some accommodations, but allowing them a 13th game sure as hell isn't going to be one of them....
01-10-2019 10:45 AM
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Fighting Muskie Offline
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Post: #74
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-10-2019 10:24 AM)panite Wrote:  
(01-10-2019 08:19 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  ND is an independent by choice not be necessity. All ten FBS conferences would gladly take them--half would let them play all their conference games at home with the ND coaching staff refereeing the game.

They should get no special treatment and their should be no exemption that might encourage others, like Texas, to go the independent route.

ND needs to do the best they can with the 12 data points they do have. The fact that they don't play FCS schools is a step in the right direction. The Irish need to be playing 10 P5 opponents at a minimum and at least a few of them need to be contenders for a conference crown.

If they want an easier path to the post season it's as simple as adding three more ACC opponents each year. The USC and Navy rivalries can probably stay but Stanford will no longer be able to be an annual event and they'd probably want to play a Big Ten school annually, rotating among their historic rivals. The ACC would probably even create a divisional structure where ND would be the annual favorite for their division each year.

Old BE Division plus UConn - Old ACC Division minus Maryland.

Old BE - ND, Cuse, VT, BC, L'Ville, Miami, Pitt, and bring in UConn for 16/8. Last game of the season "Convicts verses the Catholics".

Old ACC - Virginia, NCST, NC, Georgia Tech, Florida St, Wake Forest, Duke, Clemson.

02-13-banana 02-13-banana 04-jawdrop 04-jawdropCOGS COGS 04-cheers

Swap UConn for WVU and it's perfect. The VA schools and FL schools get protected crossovers.
01-10-2019 10:54 AM
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Wedge Offline
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RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-07-2019 11:08 AM)Shox Wrote:  The obvious fear is that Notre Dame will basterdize this and try to schedule 8 home games to maximize profits. It might make sense to limit home games to 7 to keep them reigned in.

You want a rule that prevents Notre Dame from playing 8 home games, even if they play 13 total games, but you're ok with anyone else playing 8 home games.

Kentucky will play 8 home games in 2019. Other teams have done it as well. Why is that ok but only an "outrage" if Notre Dame does it.
01-10-2019 11:28 AM
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RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
No just no, but HELL no! Notre Dame should not be given any special consideration. If they want a 13th game, they have choices.
01-10-2019 11:35 AM
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Fighting Muskie Offline
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Post: #77
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-10-2019 10:41 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  
(01-09-2019 04:54 PM)whittx Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 01:56 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 09:44 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  It goes without saying, but Notre Dame will not be forced to join a conference. Notre Dame provides incredible value as an independent. Forcing them to join the ACC would be forcing them to lose their value playing a national schedule (which is better for the NCAA for popularity reasons). As long as there is a conceivable pathway for ND to earn a playoff spot (much like this season), then there really is no problem with the current landscape. It would be akin to forcing the SEC to relinquish their FCS buy-games, which offer tremendous value as additional home games for revenue, in favor of equal home/away games with other conferences. You cannot force a program, which already has established and considerable value, to give that up because it better aligns the structural system. Not all programs are created equal, as shown in college football.

I will say, however, that since Notre Dame (and others) choose to remain independent, they should not be given special privileges to have an additional 13th game in order to compete against teams that have a conference championship opportunity. Doing so would open up Pandora's Box and allow all schools not in a CCG to schedule a 13th game during that open week as well, which would (conceivably) take away the platforms of the Conference Championships.

Notre Dame has absolutely zero value as an independent to anyone other than Notre Dame. I think their independence isn't really of value to them either, but that's hard to quantify.

As long as they have the NBC deal (or something similar), they are in no hurry to move. The second this goes away and nobody else bids on their games, they would be the 15th team in the ACC within a month.

That's the thing though: ND has concrete value as an Independent. Networks (NBC) pay them a determined amount to broadcast their games (and, conversely, major college programs schedule them as an Independent because of the exposure and value they provide). If they didn't provide value, big programs like Alabama, Texas, Oklahoma, Ohio State, Michigan, Texas A&M and Georgia would not have scheduled Notre Dame to play them - either in the past ten years or in the future - nor would other big programs like USC and Stanford continue scheduling them annually.

The people that get frustrated by Notre Dame's independence are either frustrated that their program cannot receive the same considerations, or are ignorant of what Notre Dame brings to the table. Either way, Notre Dame's status is not changing - and the P5 will continue to make accommodations for them because there remains value in the current construction. 07-coffee3

For the Bluebloods of college football, those 7 schools you rattled off for example, could all very well command top dollar for their media rights as independents but they choose to work within the confines of a conference. It's not the 80s anymore. The days of the independents are over but Notre Dame remains 3 decades behind due to their own hubris.

I think the days of coddling the Irish are over. Notice that the Irish got no special provisions in the CFP like they had in Bowl Alliance, Bowl Coalition, and BCS.
01-10-2019 11:40 AM
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OdinFrigg Offline
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Post: #78
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
Notre Dame, for decades, has received privileges and enabling not afforded to others. Stop with the requests for special accommodations that essentially only apply to them for a sought advantage.

Many schools would enjoy hand-picking all their opponents from across the nation for exposure, recruiting, and a lucrative TV (NBC) contract while remaining secure in a lofty conference for their other sports. This "national schedule" argument by Notre Dame is a privilege unto itself.

Swarbrick needs to add 3 more ACC games to ND's fb schedule, and terminate the lobbying efforts for more unique and selfish accommodations.

I don't blame Notre Dame, really. I blame the enabling governing committees and association, broadcast media, the ACC, the old Big East, certain sponsors, some BIG schools, Southern Cal, Stanford, etc.
(This post was last modified: 01-10-2019 12:20 PM by OdinFrigg.)
01-10-2019 12:17 PM
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Post: #79
RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-10-2019 11:40 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  
(01-10-2019 10:41 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  
(01-09-2019 04:54 PM)whittx Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 01:56 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(01-07-2019 09:44 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  It goes without saying, but Notre Dame will not be forced to join a conference. Notre Dame provides incredible value as an independent. Forcing them to join the ACC would be forcing them to lose their value playing a national schedule (which is better for the NCAA for popularity reasons). As long as there is a conceivable pathway for ND to earn a playoff spot (much like this season), then there really is no problem with the current landscape. It would be akin to forcing the SEC to relinquish their FCS buy-games, which offer tremendous value as additional home games for revenue, in favor of equal home/away games with other conferences. You cannot force a program, which already has established and considerable value, to give that up because it better aligns the structural system. Not all programs are created equal, as shown in college football.

I will say, however, that since Notre Dame (and others) choose to remain independent, they should not be given special privileges to have an additional 13th game in order to compete against teams that have a conference championship opportunity. Doing so would open up Pandora's Box and allow all schools not in a CCG to schedule a 13th game during that open week as well, which would (conceivably) take away the platforms of the Conference Championships.

Notre Dame has absolutely zero value as an independent to anyone other than Notre Dame. I think their independence isn't really of value to them either, but that's hard to quantify.

As long as they have the NBC deal (or something similar), they are in no hurry to move. The second this goes away and nobody else bids on their games, they would be the 15th team in the ACC within a month.

That's the thing though: ND has concrete value as an Independent. Networks (NBC) pay them a determined amount to broadcast their games (and, conversely, major college programs schedule them as an Independent because of the exposure and value they provide). If they didn't provide value, big programs like Alabama, Texas, Oklahoma, Ohio State, Michigan, Texas A&M and Georgia would not have scheduled Notre Dame to play them - either in the past ten years or in the future - nor would other big programs like USC and Stanford continue scheduling them annually.

The people that get frustrated by Notre Dame's independence are either frustrated that their program cannot receive the same considerations, or are ignorant of what Notre Dame brings to the table. Either way, Notre Dame's status is not changing - and the P5 will continue to make accommodations for them because there remains value in the current construction. 07-coffee3

For the Bluebloods of college football, those 7 schools you rattled off for example, could all very well command top dollar for their media rights as independents but they choose to work within the confines of a conference. It's not the 80s anymore. The days of the independents are over but Notre Dame remains 3 decades behind due to their own hubris.

I think the days of coddling the Irish are over. Notice that the Irish got no special provisions in the CFP like they had in Bowl Alliance, Bowl Coalition, and BCS.

None of them were ever offered an individual national, over the air network TV contract. They could not command one.

(The major independents at the time, Penn State, Florida State, Miami, Pitt, etc..could not command one, either)

They didn't "choose" to join a conference. They really didn't have any choice.

None of them were ever football independents, either. All were members of conferences for many decades.

ND has been a football independent for over 130 years.

Apples and oranges.
(This post was last modified: 01-10-2019 03:18 PM by TerryD.)
01-10-2019 12:23 PM
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GoldenWarrior11 Online
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RE: ND wants NCAA to allow them a 13th game
(01-10-2019 11:40 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  For the Bluebloods of college football, those 7 schools you rattled off for example, could all very well command top dollar for their media rights as independents but they choose to work within the confines of a conference. It's not the 80s anymore. The days of the independents are over but Notre Dame remains 3 decades behind due to their own hubris.

I think the days of coddling the Irish are over. Notice that the Irish got no special provisions in the CFP like they had in Bowl Alliance, Bowl Coalition, and BCS.

Notre Dame values its independence because it views itself as a national school and brand, not confined to one section of the country. It attracts students from all over the country, and desires to play a national schedule every year. A conference membership restricts that. There are very few programs that truly play a national schedule anymore.

And, actually, Notre Dame did get a special provision in the CFP contract. They receive between $3.5-$4 million as a base every year, despite not belonging to a conference or having any direct bowl tie-ins.
01-10-2019 12:23 PM
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