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Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
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NewTimes Offline
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Post: #1
Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
As one who has chastised the LU leadership at times, I have good and mixed feelings about the Freeze hire.

The good. Hiring a former SEC HC to be a LU HC is a very big deal. He'll likely get more than TG $950k per season. It shows incoming and potential recruits the commitment to win. From this perspective, it is a big time hire and a big time move by a school desperately seeking FBS legitimacy and peer approval.

The mixed feeling. With an AD immersed with a previous scandal, LU now hires a coach who in the past has desired to work with professional ladies. It opens LU up to lots of criticism with a dynamic duo of past scandals. At least it was not Briles.

In the end, a bold move. A thumbs up to the school for the hire. From an on field perspective, it's a great hire. When you can hire a HC who has beaten Alabama twice in the recent past, that speaks volumes to players and fans. And Freeze said the right things supporting the "mission" of LU back in a previous speech at LU in an attempt to less the impact of his previous indiscretions. Now his challenge is walk the talk, keep his pants on and win.
(This post was last modified: 12-07-2018 01:19 PM by NewTimes.)
12-07-2018 01:15 PM
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WesternSkillet Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
As a point of reference, here is the Hugh Freeze speech at LU in January 2018.



12-07-2018 01:21 PM
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NewTimes Offline
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RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
Reference not needed for me. He deserves a second chance in hope he learned his lesson the first time. Not that he got caught but that he realizes the mistake. If he has wandering eyes, soliciting phone calls, or inappropriate actions, then he's got to go immediately.
12-07-2018 01:25 PM
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Ewglenn Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
I was hoping to go a different direction because it’s just a bad look but that’s not the Liberty Way. I am having a tough time supporting this move. I understand it but just wish it wasn’t his first real gig since the scandal.
12-07-2018 07:25 PM
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GE and MTS Offline
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RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
Pros:
At least it wasn't Briles. Freeze can coach and recruit, assuming he was good at recruiting before giving out cash to kids at Ole Miss.

Cons:
Nobody else touched him with a ten foot pole. We now have two black eyes with McCaw and Freeze. We look like a win at all cost athletic department that ignores its Christian values for the sake of money and fame.

Overall a net negative for the school. Hopefully Freeze doesn't tarnish LU and helps improve our football program. What's done is done.
12-07-2018 07:48 PM
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NewTimes Offline
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RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
(12-07-2018 07:48 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  Pros:
At least it wasn't Briles. Freeze can coach and recruit, assuming he was good at recruiting before giving out cash to kids at Ole Miss.

Cons:
Nobody else touched him with a ten foot pole. We now have two black eyes with McCaw and Freeze. We look like a win at all cost athletic department that ignores its Christian values for the sake of money and fame.

Overall a net negative for the school. Hopefully Freeze doesn't tarnish LU and helps improve our football program. What's done is done.
The hire does seem to compromise the position of LU and the values it espouses. If he wins, and makes LU bowl eligible, the sting of his past negatives will diminish. If he goes less than 6-6 next year, which is a tall order, and has 5-7 or worse seasons, the baggage will resurface and loom larger.

College FB is a unique mix of position/values of the school, fans who support the program from diverse backgrounds, and a Prez and admins that direct the athletics. The Prez and admin select the leader/HC to be the top FB administrator.

Reading other threads and online reporting, sarcasm in the hire seems to be around 70-75% with the remainder saying great hire. The only way that percentage changes is by on field success. But that's why HCs make the big bucks. To win.
12-07-2018 08:56 PM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Exclamation RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
WOWZ. 04-jawdrop Yikes!
12-07-2018 09:45 PM
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LUbball23 Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
This wouldn't be a story if FSU/Auburn hired him for their OC position, teams that we beat out for his services. The only reason people are mocking this hire is because its Liberty and we have McCaw.

He's a game changer.
12-07-2018 10:08 PM
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army56mike Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
(12-07-2018 08:56 PM)NewTimes Wrote:  The hire does seem to compromise the position of LU and the values it espouses.

What? I believe pretty much the exact opposite is true.

Yes, he did wrong things. However.....
Yes, he confessed these things, to God and those he offended.
Yes, he has been contrite and repentent.
Yes, he has been an outspoken believer before, during, and after his transgression.
Yes, he suffered consequences of his actions, and had lost his position of leadership.
To Liberty’s credit, they have lived out the Word of God by embracing the coach and welcoming him back and supporting him.
What would you prefer they do? Turn their back on him, push him away?

Look, I know I didn’t communicate what I’m trying to express clearly. But I firmly believe Liberty isn’t compromising it’ Christian values, but rather actually fulfilling those values. It’s a great thing.
(This post was last modified: 12-08-2018 02:15 AM by army56mike.)
12-08-2018 02:13 AM
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army56mike Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
I like the hire and think there is great potential. Welcome to the Liberty family Coach Freeze.04-cheers
12-08-2018 02:17 AM
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Ewglenn Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
(12-08-2018 02:13 AM)army56mike Wrote:  
(12-07-2018 08:56 PM)NewTimes Wrote:  The hire does seem to compromise the position of LU and the values it espouses.

What? I believe pretty much the exact opposite is true.

Yes, he did wrong things. However.....
Yes, he confessed these things, to God and those he offended.
Yes, he has been contrite and repentent.
Yes, he has been an outspoken believer before, during, and after his transgression.
Yes, he suffered consequences of his actions, and had lost his position of leadership.
To Liberty’s credit, they have lived out the Word of God by embracing the coach and welcoming him back and supporting him.
What would you prefer they do? Turn their back on him, push him away?

Look, I know I didn’t communicate what I’m trying to express clearly. But I firmly believe Liberty isn’t compromising it’ Christian values, but rather actually fulfilling those values. It’s a great thing.

There are a lot of people that sin and repent. I don’t like the hire because it looks like we will do anything to win. I understand forgiveness but a Christian university, I would think, would want someone without a glaring history to be the most prominent figure at that university (you could make the case for Jerry). Idk his heart and wish him luck but it is a bad look.
12-08-2018 05:30 AM
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army56mike Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
I’m not convinced hiring Freeze guarantees we are winning anything. I am hopeful. But I’ll wait and see what kind of product he puts on the field and the kind of men he turns out from the program before I make any judgement on him. I don’t in any way see this as a win at any cost situation.
12-08-2018 09:29 AM
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NewTimes Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
(12-08-2018 02:13 AM)army56mike Wrote:  
(12-07-2018 08:56 PM)NewTimes Wrote:  The hire does seem to compromise the position of LU and the values it espouses.

What? I believe pretty much the exact opposite is true.

Yes, he did wrong things. However.....
Yes, he confessed these things, to God and those he offended.
Yes, he has been contrite and repentent.
Yes, he has been an outspoken believer before, during, and after his transgression.
Yes, he suffered consequences of his actions, and had lost his position of leadership.
To Liberty’s credit, they have lived out the Word of God by embracing the coach and welcoming him back and supporting him.
What would you prefer they do? Turn their back on him, push him away?

Look, I know I didn’t communicate what I’m trying to express clearly. But I firmly believe Liberty isn’t compromising it’ Christian values, but rather actually fulfilling those values. It’s a great thing.
It’s a great thing.. Let's be realistic. What conversations did JFJr, McCall and others have prior to communicating with HF? It's naive to think the upside and downsides of hiring a coach who committed a huge moral transgression wasn't the topic at hand. The ultimate decision had to be is the benefit of the hire, with the slanted remembrance of his poor decision stoked in the media, a lesser factor than the potential for on field FB victories. He was not hired as a reclamation project or to improve his past moral indiscretions. He was hired to win at FB.

We all deserve a second chance. We all have made mistakes we wish we had not made. The high moral person accepts the bad choice and does not make the same error and learns from the mistake. I watched his announcement. He said all the right things and mentioned the error and praised his family. He seemed sincere and we can agree to give him another opportunity.

But a great thing. No. The hire comes with baggage that time and winning will lessen. A great hire would be a successful ACC or SEC coach without the baggage.
(This post was last modified: 12-10-2018 10:47 AM by NewTimes.)
12-10-2018 10:46 AM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
(12-08-2018 02:13 AM)army56mike Wrote:  
(12-07-2018 08:56 PM)NewTimes Wrote:  The hire does seem to compromise the position of LU and the values it espouses.

What? I believe pretty much the exact opposite is true.

Yes, he did wrong things. However.....
Yes, he confessed these things, to God and those he offended.
Yes, he has been contrite and repentent.
Yes, he has been an outspoken believer before, during, and after his transgression.
Yes, he suffered consequences of his actions, and had lost his position of leadership.
To Liberty’s credit, they have lived out the Word of God by embracing the coach and welcoming him back and supporting him.
What would you prefer they do? Turn their back on him, push him away?

Look, I know I didn’t communicate what I’m trying to express clearly. But I firmly believe Liberty isn’t compromising it’ Christian values, but rather actually fulfilling those values. It’s a great thing.

You do understand that the reason he got in trouble with Ole Miss were NCAA Recruiting violations...right? He faced a show cause penalty and an automatic 2 game suspension if he had been hired last year. The Escort service was completely secondary.

Also...be forewarned...I don't believe for a second that Hugh practices the Christian principles he professes. He pulled that same stunt with us in Jonesboro, and as a Bible belt school everyone ate it up. Than when he left, he claimed that he wanted to stay, but that he prayed about it, and God led him to a scripture from the Gospel that told him to go to Ole Miss. And still half of us feverishly believed him. The other half wanted to know what God had to do with his rather large request for a raise out of us to keep him from leaving.
12-10-2018 01:48 PM
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Willflop Offline
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Post: #15
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
(12-10-2018 01:48 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(12-08-2018 02:13 AM)army56mike Wrote:  
(12-07-2018 08:56 PM)NewTimes Wrote:  The hire does seem to compromise the position of LU and the values it espouses.

What? I believe pretty much the exact opposite is true.

Yes, he did wrong things. However.....
Yes, he confessed these things, to God and those he offended.
Yes, he has been contrite and repentent.
Yes, he has been an outspoken believer before, during, and after his transgression.
Yes, he suffered consequences of his actions, and had lost his position of leadership.
To Liberty’s credit, they have lived out the Word of God by embracing the coach and welcoming him back and supporting him.
What would you prefer they do? Turn their back on him, push him away?

Look, I know I didn’t communicate what I’m trying to express clearly. But I firmly believe Liberty isn’t compromising it’ Christian values, but rather actually fulfilling those values. It’s a great thing.

You do understand that the reason he got in trouble with Ole Miss were NCAA Recruiting violations...right? He faced a show cause penalty and an automatic 2 game suspension if he had been hired last year. The Escort service was completely secondary.

Also...be forewarned...I don't believe for a second that Hugh practices the Christian principles he professes. He pulled that same stunt with us in Jonesboro, and as a Bible belt school everyone ate it up. Than when he left, he claimed that he wanted to stay, but that he prayed about it, and God led him to a scripture from the Gospel that told him to go to Ole Miss. And still half of us feverishly believed him. The other half wanted to know what God had to do with his rather large request for a raise out of us to keep him from leaving.

He didn't end up getting a show cause, however, just a two game suspension. His level-one infraction was ruled as mitigated, since the NCAA didn't think he had knowledge of what his assistant was doing. Given the nature of this scandal and how long the investigation was ongoing, that's next to nothing compared to the 8 and 5 year show causes handed to the assistants prior to his tenure, and the 5 and 2 year show causes to the assistants on his staff. Hard to know what really happened, but I don't know of any reason why they would rule that way when they were set on making an example of Ole Miss.

Either way, do you think he would have actually accepted a raise at asu and turned down an SEC position? What amount was he asking for?
12-10-2018 06:51 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #16
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
(12-10-2018 06:51 PM)Willflop Wrote:  
(12-10-2018 01:48 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(12-08-2018 02:13 AM)army56mike Wrote:  
(12-07-2018 08:56 PM)NewTimes Wrote:  The hire does seem to compromise the position of LU and the values it espouses.

What? I believe pretty much the exact opposite is true.

Yes, he did wrong things. However.....
Yes, he confessed these things, to God and those he offended.
Yes, he has been contrite and repentent.
Yes, he has been an outspoken believer before, during, and after his transgression.
Yes, he suffered consequences of his actions, and had lost his position of leadership.
To Liberty’s credit, they have lived out the Word of God by embracing the coach and welcoming him back and supporting him.
What would you prefer they do? Turn their back on him, push him away?

Look, I know I didn’t communicate what I’m trying to express clearly. But I firmly believe Liberty isn’t compromising it’ Christian values, but rather actually fulfilling those values. It’s a great thing.

You do understand that the reason he got in trouble with Ole Miss were NCAA Recruiting violations...right? He faced a show cause penalty and an automatic 2 game suspension if he had been hired last year. The Escort service was completely secondary.

Also...be forewarned...I don't believe for a second that Hugh practices the Christian principles he professes. He pulled that same stunt with us in Jonesboro, and as a Bible belt school everyone ate it up. Than when he left, he claimed that he wanted to stay, but that he prayed about it, and God led him to a scripture from the Gospel that told him to go to Ole Miss. And still half of us feverishly believed him. The other half wanted to know what God had to do with his rather large request for a raise out of us to keep him from leaving.

He didn't end up getting a show cause, however, just a two game suspension. His level-one infraction was ruled as mitigated, since the NCAA didn't think he had knowledge of what his assistant was doing. Given the nature of this scandal and how long the investigation was ongoing, that's next to nothing compared to the 8 and 5 year show causes handed to the assistants prior to his tenure, and the 5 and 2 year show causes to the assistants on his staff. Hard to know what really happened, but I don't know of any reason why they would rule that way when they were set on making an example of Ole Miss.

Either way, do you think he would have actually accepted a raise at asu and turned down an SEC position? What amount was he asking for?

It wasn't that he asked us for a raise. (Frankly we weren't paying him peanuts back then) It was that he decided to announce his departure as if God was telling him to go take the Ole Miss job, when Ole Miss was going to pay him 2.5 million a year, and this came a few days after where he had tried to get us to raise his salary to keep him from going to Tulane. To some close to our program, it felt like Hugh was playing us for money, and when we didn't budge to his liking, pretending he was leaving because God told him too.

Look, Jonesboro is a very evangelical conservative town. He knew the minute he came here that if he announced God was telling him to do something, almost anyone would identify and believe him (I've joked a few pastors here could commit murder claiming God told them to and they would be still believed by a few) I always felt he took advantage of that with our fan base. We actually lost a few so called "supporters" to Ole Miss when he left. Some of those will follow him to Lynchburg no doubt.

I repeat the one thing I know. Arkansas State was both asked by Freeze and the NCAA to provide a character reference for him during the beginning of his NCAA issues at Ole Miss, and we declined. Ask our fans about Hugh and they'll tell you about a fine looking good man of high character and principles. They'll tell you of a born again Christian who was caught in a sin, and has realized his mistake and is out for repentance.

Ask someone who actually worked with him at Arkansas State, you probably don't get the same answer. That's my concern. I felt he took advantage of us. I'm not the only one who does.
12-11-2018 03:49 AM
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Willflop Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
Thanks. I suspect Liberty may end in a similar situation, and I'd prefer not to hear a "God told me to get back into the SEC." Just say you want the best opportunity in coaching and call it what it is. Although it's not fun being a stepping stone, it's just the reality and fans should recognize that. Not sure if it will be one year like asu, but my glass half empty thinks that's what will happen. It seems like the optics of the hire is improving and Liberty will probably take the brunt of it for a one year return.
12-11-2018 07:18 AM
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chiefsfan Offline
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RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
(12-11-2018 07:18 AM)Willflop Wrote:  Thanks. I suspect Liberty may end in a similar situation, and I'd prefer not to hear a "God told me to get back into the SEC." Just say you want the best opportunity in coaching and call it what it is. Although it's not fun being a stepping stone, it's just the reality and fans should recognize that. Not sure if it will be one year like asu, but my glass half empty thinks that's what will happen. It seems like the optics of the hire is improving and Liberty will probably take the brunt of it for a one year return.

I highly doubt he'd go anywhere after one year with you guys...especially to the SEC. The Common belief within the admins in that conference is that Freeze knew a lot more about what was going on recruiting wise than he let on. It's going to take a lot to get him back.

But yeah, that's really more what rubbed me the wrong way. If someone offered me 2.5 million dollars to work my dream job, I'm gone, I'll worry about praying about it later. There's no reason to sit there and have to find some sort of religious reason for trying to make a better life for you and your family. God's not going to blame you for that.
(This post was last modified: 12-11-2018 01:26 PM by chiefsfan.)
12-11-2018 01:24 PM
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NewTimes Offline
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RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
(12-11-2018 01:24 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(12-11-2018 07:18 AM)Willflop Wrote:  Thanks. I suspect Liberty may end in a similar situation, and I'd prefer not to hear a "God told me to get back into the SEC." Just say you want the best opportunity in coaching and call it what it is. Although it's not fun being a stepping stone, it's just the reality and fans should recognize that. Not sure if it will be one year like asu, but my glass half empty thinks that's what will happen. It seems like the optics of the hire is improving and Liberty will probably take the brunt of it for a one year return.

I highly doubt he'd go anywhere after one year with you guys...especially to the SEC. The Common belief within the admins in that conference is that Freeze knew a lot more about what was going on recruiting wise than he let on. It's going to take a lot to get him back.

But yeah, that's really more what rubbed me the wrong way. If someone offered me 2.5 million dollars to work my dream job, I'm gone, I'll worry about praying about it later. There's no reason to sit there and have to find some sort of religious reason for trying to make a better life for you and your family. God's not going to blame you for that.
And when those who wear their beliefs on their sleeve for all to see vs. living it, it allows the insincere to manipulate and massage their perceived perception to their own ilk. And it sux when mid-major schools are deceived and taken advantage of which they tend to feel more the effort more than the mighty P5 programs with more insulation to protect them.

The ironic part in this discussion is the moral quality of the individual, not his ability to coach. This just shows how rare it is to have both. A great coach who continually wins who is also a high moral person. Freeze may use LU as a stepping stone as his desire to regain his perch among the mighty SEC. But with LU's infant position as FBS, and his coaching ability to win, seem at this time to be a good match. If the admins did not agree, or thought his past moral turpitudes were a bigger problem then he would not have been hired. Obviously they did not think that.
12-11-2018 04:33 PM
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GE and MTS Offline
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RE: Freeze is new Liberty FB coach, what now?
(12-11-2018 01:24 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(12-11-2018 07:18 AM)Willflop Wrote:  Thanks. I suspect Liberty may end in a similar situation, and I'd prefer not to hear a "God told me to get back into the SEC." Just say you want the best opportunity in coaching and call it what it is. Although it's not fun being a stepping stone, it's just the reality and fans should recognize that. Not sure if it will be one year like asu, but my glass half empty thinks that's what will happen. It seems like the optics of the hire is improving and Liberty will probably take the brunt of it for a one year return.

I highly doubt he'd go anywhere after one year with you guys...especially to the SEC. The Common belief within the admins in that conference is that Freeze knew a lot more about what was going on recruiting wise than he let on. It's going to take a lot to get him back.

But yeah, that's really more what rubbed me the wrong way. If someone offered me 2.5 million dollars to work my dream job, I'm gone, I'll worry about praying about it later. There's no reason to sit there and have to find some sort of religious reason for trying to make a better life for you and your family. God's not going to blame you for that.

I agree with what you've been saying about Freeze. I totally get the whole stepping stone mentality and wish he were honest (or presented it better if he was telling the truth).

Honestly, I don't mind being a stepping stone for a while. If coaches come here, win, and get a big payday somewhere else in a P5 conference then I'm okay with that. That will lay a strong foundation for someone else to come in and hit the ground running and keep the good times rolling. Rinse and repeat. Just means we are winning, right? I want coaches who are hungry and want lots of success at the highest level and hopefully this would build up Liberty to eventually be in the highest level. Arkansas State had a ridiculous four new coaches in four years or something like that but you were winning the Sun Belt so I imagine it was pretty nice even if not ideal.
12-11-2018 10:15 PM
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