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Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
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Post: #1
Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articl...nd=opinion

<edit-accidentally copied the whole article-below is the piece I wanted to quote>


"...All that said, Graham is to be commended for trying to force Saudi Arabia to pay a greater price than the Trump administration has been willing to impose. He’s right that America’s allies must know that they cannot demolish international norms the way MBS has. Graham also deserves praise for pursuing a more sensible approach to Saudi Arabia than the resolution the Senate will debate next week that would cut off all U.S. support for the war in Yemen.

“Saudi Arabia is a strategic ally and the alliance is worth saving,” Graham said Tuesday. “But not at all costs.” The senator has named his price: the removal of Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman. What remains to be seen is whether Saudi Arabia is willing to pay it...."


Think this is a pretty dangerous game. None of the failed states would be more dangerous than a failed Saudi Arabia.
(This post was last modified: 12-05-2018 10:19 AM by bullet.)
12-05-2018 09:43 AM
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Lord Stanley Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
Regime change isn't on the Trump Admin books.

Next.
12-05-2018 10:13 AM
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miko33 Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
No to regime change. Common SOP used by our gov't for many years is to let others do your dirty work. The crown prince appears to be a willing ally of the U.S. He'll add his needs to the list of needs we want him to take care of for us in the ME.
12-05-2018 10:23 AM
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Crebman Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 10:13 AM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  Regime change isn't on the Trump Admin books.

Next.

No kidding......

When will we learn? We either deal with whomever is in power in a given country or we don't - but we should let the people that live there decide who runs their country. It isn't up to the United States who runs Saudi Arabia or any other country.
12-05-2018 10:24 AM
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stinkfist Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
puff puff pass at faux outrage....

#wrongagainlindsey
(This post was last modified: 12-05-2018 10:30 AM by stinkfist.)
12-05-2018 10:28 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #6
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
Here's what I don't understand. Why this time?

The Saudis and the Iranians have killed Christians for being Christians, women for being raped, some of them American citizens, not just residents. We did nothing. So why this one?

There is even a lot of information suggesting that Khashoggi is a bad guy--Muslim Brotherhood and so forth.

So why is this the one where we go ballistic?
12-05-2018 10:29 AM
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Ohio Poly Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
I don't disagree but I won't be surprised if this is LG's final term.
12-05-2018 10:41 AM
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GeorgeBorkFan Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 10:29 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's what I don't understand. Why this time?

The Saudis and the Iranians have killed Christians for being Christians, women for being raped, some of them American citizens, not just residents. We did nothing. So why this one?

There is even a lot of information suggesting that Khashoggi is a bad guy--Muslim Brotherhood and so forth.

So why is this the one where we go ballistic?

Because he was a "journalist," so the media keeps pushing the story, seeing him as one of their own. That is why the story isn't going away.
12-05-2018 10:43 AM
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Lord Stanley Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 10:29 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  So why is this the one where we go ballistic?

Because it hurts the President.
12-05-2018 10:51 AM
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Crebman Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 10:43 AM)GeorgeBorkFan Wrote:  
(12-05-2018 10:29 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's what I don't understand. Why this time?

The Saudis and the Iranians have killed Christians for being Christians, women for being raped, some of them American citizens, not just residents. We did nothing. So why this one?

There is even a lot of information suggesting that Khashoggi is a bad guy--Muslim Brotherhood and so forth.

So why is this the one where we go ballistic?

Because he was a "journalist," so the media keeps pushing the story, seeing him as one of their own. That is why the story isn't going away.

Yep. This in a nutshell.........and as someone else (Lord Stanley) said - use it as another weapon against Trump ....
(This post was last modified: 12-05-2018 11:15 AM by Crebman.)
12-05-2018 11:14 AM
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Paul M Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
9/11 did it for me. **** the Saudi's.
12-05-2018 11:14 AM
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Crebman Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
All Lindsey needs to do is run for President and win, then he can take the foreign policy wheel.
12-05-2018 11:16 AM
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SuperFlyBCat Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 10:29 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's what I don't understand. Why this time?

The Saudis and the Iranians have killed Christians for being Christians, women for being raped, some of them American citizens, not just residents. We did nothing. So why this one?

There is even a lot of information suggesting that Khashoggi is a bad guy--Muslim Brotherhood and so forth.

So why is this the one where we go ballistic?

Because the media tried to suggest that Kushner and the Prince were buddies. Mach even started a thread and suggested Kushner was in on it and tipped off the Saudis or something nutty like that.
12-05-2018 12:37 PM
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JDTulane Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 10:29 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's what I don't understand. Why this time?

The Saudis and the Iranians have killed Christians for being Christians, women for being raped, some of them American citizens, not just residents. We did nothing. So why this one?

There is even a lot of information suggesting that Khashoggi is a bad guy--Muslim Brotherhood and so forth.

So why is this the one where we go ballistic?

Legal US resident, journalist with US citizen children who was critical of this and SA administrations winds up tortured and murdered in an embassy and President openly tries to lie for and cover for SA administration. And gets caught.

Sounds like perfect media storm material.
12-05-2018 01:08 PM
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VA49er Offline
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Post: #15
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 01:08 PM)JDTulane Wrote:  
(12-05-2018 10:29 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's what I don't understand. Why this time?

The Saudis and the Iranians have killed Christians for being Christians, women for being raped, some of them American citizens, not just residents. We did nothing. So why this one?

There is even a lot of information suggesting that Khashoggi is a bad guy--Muslim Brotherhood and so forth.

So why is this the one where we go ballistic?

Legal US resident, journalist with US citizen children who was critical of this and SA administrations winds up tortured and murdered in an embassy and President openly tries to lie for and cover for SA administration. And gets caught.

Sounds like perfect media storm material.

OK, I'll play. So we get regime change in Saudi Arabia. Then what? I have a feeling what replaces what is there now could be much worse.
12-05-2018 01:16 PM
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JDTulane Offline
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Post: #16
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 01:16 PM)VA49er Wrote:  
(12-05-2018 01:08 PM)JDTulane Wrote:  
(12-05-2018 10:29 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's what I don't understand. Why this time?

The Saudis and the Iranians have killed Christians for being Christians, women for being raped, some of them American citizens, not just residents. We did nothing. So why this one?

There is even a lot of information suggesting that Khashoggi is a bad guy--Muslim Brotherhood and so forth.

So why is this the one where we go ballistic?

Legal US resident, journalist with US citizen children who was critical of this and SA administrations winds up tortured and murdered in an embassy and President openly tries to lie for and cover for SA administration. And gets caught.

Sounds like perfect media storm material.

OK, I'll play. So we get regime change in Saudi Arabia. Then what? I have a feeling what replaces what is there now could be much worse.

Shrug. Out of my wheelhouse to advocate for a regime change. I'll leave that to people with expertise/degrees in that field. I will say though that the current slap on the wrist this administration is giving (AT BEST) is not enough.

It doesn't take a PhD in international politics to know this administration royally blundered how they dealt with this.
12-05-2018 01:18 PM
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umbluegray Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
Meddling in other nations' governments is exactly what Mueller is investigating now.

We don't like it when other nations meddle in our affairs so why do we assume the right to meddle in others' affairs?

Be consistent.

And if we are hell-bent on ending foreign meddling in US affairs we need to:
1. Realize we'll never reach a point where we've eliminated meddling.
2. Stop meddling in others (see Obama meddling in Israel's election).


Anyway, engaging/encouraging regime change can very well have unintended consequences.

Allies today might become enemies tomorrow.
12-05-2018 01:22 PM
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Lord Stanley Offline
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Post: #18
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 01:16 PM)VA49er Wrote:  OK, I'll play. So we get regime change in Saudi Arabia. Then what?

Then the left will complain about US imperialism.

The only winning move is not to play.
12-05-2018 01:54 PM
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Post: #19
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 01:18 PM)JDTulane Wrote:  Shrug. Out of my wheelhouse to advocate for a regime change. I'll leave that to people with expertise/degrees in that field. I will say though that the current slap on the wrist this administration is giving (AT BEST) is not enough.

It doesn't take a PhD in international politics to know this administration royally blundered how they dealt with this.

This sums up the left's response. I don't know what should have been done differently, but whatever Trump did isn't enough.
12-05-2018 02:02 PM
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JDTulane Offline
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Post: #20
RE: Graham wants regime change in Saudi Arabia
(12-05-2018 02:02 PM)GeorgeBorkFan Wrote:  
(12-05-2018 01:18 PM)JDTulane Wrote:  Shrug. Out of my wheelhouse to advocate for a regime change. I'll leave that to people with expertise/degrees in that field. I will say though that the current slap on the wrist this administration is giving (AT BEST) is not enough.

It doesn't take a PhD in international politics to know this administration royally blundered how they dealt with this.

This sums up the left's response. I don't know what should have been done differently, but whatever Trump did isn't enough.

What Trump himself did was moronic. What his administration is doing is not enough.

Do you want me to pretend I'm an expert in geopolitical diplomatic affairs and throw out some bull**** action of choice I regurgitated from a talking head? Because I can do that. Or I can be honest and I say I don't know what course of action is best but I can attest to disagreeing with the current modus operandi.
12-05-2018 02:13 PM
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