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(12-10-2018 12:22 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  2019 should bring 9 wins. Don't understand the 5-7 talk

Have you watched us the last two seasons?

(12-11-2018 08:09 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:22 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  2019 should bring 9 wins. Don't understand the 5-7 talk

Have you watched us the last two seasons?

In one season the team fell apart injury-wise, this season the team fell apart confidence-wise, and we still didn't go 5-7.

So, I agree with fastbuicks, I don't understand the 5-7 talk, just like I didn't get a few people who predicted 3-4 wins this season.

(12-11-2018 08:43 AM)RunningGame Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:09 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:22 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  2019 should bring 9 wins. Don't understand the 5-7 talk

Have you watched us the last two seasons?

In one season the team fell apart injury-wise, this season the team fell apart confidence-wise, and we still didn't go 5-7.

So, I agree with fastbuicks, I don't understand the 5-7 talk, just like I didn't get a few people who predicted 3-4 wins this season.

Possible 2019 losses-
@MSU
@Syracuse
@Toledo
@NIU
Possible cross divisional game @Ohio

(12-11-2018 08:09 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:22 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  2019 should bring 9 wins. Don't understand the 5-7 talk

Have you watched us the last two seasons?

Reading your posts you seem to always be on the negative side. "Have I watched us"? Haven't missed a home game in five years. Instant gratification doesn't work at G5 level. Did you watch Boise this year? How about UCF after they lost 12 games three years ago? It cycles at this level. Anyone expecting WMU to win 9-10 games in 2018 was dreaming. Like I stated only two D1 teams with so few Seniors as WMU had winning seasons. You can't lose your starting QB twice and expect miracles, can't lose two best defensive players a month before season starts when you already lost a CB and LB to the NFL. Many of you had Toledo winning the West in 2018, they lost their senior QB and five games this fall. NIU squeaks by as MAC champs with one more win than WMU. The ship isn't sinking some fans are just bailing because they don't have prospective the MAC teams live in.

(12-11-2018 08:59 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:43 AM)RunningGame Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:09 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:22 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  2019 should bring 9 wins. Don't understand the 5-7 talk

Have you watched us the last two seasons?

In one season the team fell apart injury-wise, this season the team fell apart confidence-wise, and we still didn't go 5-7.

So, I agree with fastbuicks, I don't understand the 5-7 talk, just like I didn't get a few people who predicted 3-4 wins this season.

Possible 2019 losses-
@MSU
@Syracuse
@Toledo
@NIU
Possible cross divisional game @Ohio

Will be more improved than NIU or Toledo. We beat NIU's finest with 10-12 freshmen playing in Brown/Gold. Toledo loses some key seniors and Ohio does as well.

(12-11-2018 12:30 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:59 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:43 AM)RunningGame Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:09 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:22 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  2019 should bring 9 wins. Don't understand the 5-7 talk

Have you watched us the last two seasons?

In one season the team fell apart injury-wise, this season the team fell apart confidence-wise, and we still didn't go 5-7.

So, I agree with fastbuicks, I don't understand the 5-7 talk, just like I didn't get a few people who predicted 3-4 wins this season.

Possible 2019 losses-
@MSU
@Syracuse
@Toledo
@NIU
Possible cross divisional game @Ohio

Will be more improved than NIU or Toledo. We beat NIU's finest with 10-12 freshmen playing in Brown/Gold. Toledo loses some key seniors and Ohio does as well.

And Syracuse loses at least one key senior

(12-11-2018 03:00 PM)Bronc33 Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 12:30 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:59 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:43 AM)RunningGame Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:09 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Have you watched us the last two seasons?

In one season the team fell apart injury-wise, this season the team fell apart confidence-wise, and we still didn't go 5-7.

So, I agree with fastbuicks, I don't understand the 5-7 talk, just like I didn't get a few people who predicted 3-4 wins this season.

Possible 2019 losses-
@MSU
@Syracuse
@Toledo
@NIU
Possible cross divisional game @Ohio

Will be more improved than NIU or Toledo. We beat NIU's finest with 10-12 freshmen playing in Brown/Gold. Toledo loses some key seniors and Ohio does as well.

And Syracuse loses at least one key senior

Going to have flashbacks about that guy for some time.

On a related note, every time I see a team go five-wide with a running QB:

I think we win between 6- 7 MAC games next year with injuries being the wildcard. I wish we had this years schedule for next years team though.

Lester won a "statement" (or "signature") game beating MAC champ NIU in Week 12 this fall.

Now he needs to win a similar one on the road and hold serve at home.

Next step up for program.

(12-11-2018 05:20 PM)MajorHoople Wrote:  Lester won a "statement" (or "signature") game beating MAC champ NIU in Week 12 this fall.

Now he needs to win a similar one on the road and hold serve at home.

Next step up for program.

Agreed. Also think we go into 2019 with most solid team since 2016.

(12-11-2018 12:24 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:09 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:22 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  2019 should bring 9 wins. Don't understand the 5-7 talk

Have you watched us the last two seasons?

Reading your posts you seem to always be on the negative side. "Have I watched us"? Haven't missed a home game in five years. Instant gratification doesn't work at G5 level. Did you watch Boise this year? How about UCF after they lost 12 games three years ago? It cycles at this level. Anyone expecting WMU to win 9-10 games in 2018 was dreaming. Like I stated only two D1 teams with so few Seniors as WMU had winning seasons. You can't lose your starting QB twice and expect miracles, can't lose two best defensive players a month before season starts when you already lost a CB and LB to the NFL. Many of you had Toledo winning the West in 2018, they lost their senior QB and five games this fall. NIU squeaks by as MAC champs with one more win than WMU. The ship isn't sinking some fans are just bailing because they don't have prospective the MAC teams live in.

I'm a realist.

I reject the idea that winning 9-10 games per year (after we went 13-1) is "dreaming" and unrealistic. Furthermore, I find it insulting that any WMU alum would accept anything less at this point.

But here we are in 2018... totally cool with mediocre football (7-5, 6-6) and making excuses for it. Two years removed from a MAC Championship and Cotton Bowl.

Frustrating that we continue to be small time when we can and should expect so much better.

(12-17-2018 10:00 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 12:24 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  

(12-11-2018 08:09 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:22 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  2019 should bring 9 wins. Don't understand the 5-7 talk

Have you watched us the last two seasons?

Reading your posts you seem to always be on the negative side. "Have I watched us"? Haven't missed a home game in five years. Instant gratification doesn't work at G5 level. Did you watch Boise this year? How about UCF after they lost 12 games three years ago? It cycles at this level. Anyone expecting WMU to win 9-10 games in 2018 was dreaming. Like I stated only two D1 teams with so few Seniors as WMU had winning seasons. You can't lose your starting QB twice and expect miracles, can't lose two best defensive players a month before season starts when you already lost a CB and LB to the NFL. Many of you had Toledo winning the West in 2018, they lost their senior QB and five games this fall. NIU squeaks by as MAC champs with one more win than WMU. The ship isn't sinking some fans are just bailing because they don't have prospective the MAC teams live in.

I'm a realist.

I reject the idea that winning 9-10 games per year (after we went 13-1) is "dreaming" and unrealistic. Furthermore, I find it insulting that any WMU alum would accept anything less at this point.

But here we are in 2018... totally cool with mediocre football (7-5, 6-6) and making excuses for it. Two years removed from a MAC Championship and Cotton Bowl.

Frustrating that we continue to be small time when we can and should expect so much better.

What do you expect your disappointment and being so frustrated to achieve? Interesting take. Are you out fund raising or donating to the Gary Fund?

I expect Tim and team to hit full stride the year after next. If he gets that perfect, once in a lifetime schedule like 2016 then anything is possible but even our OOC schedule looks tough at first glance.

I see Gopherhole posters having similar discussions. And their coach took over a 9 win team that won a bowl against WSU with a lot of starters suspended.

I expected 9 this year and I think we’d have hit it if our QB doesn’t get hurt. Even with Daoust’s circus D.

Quote:I reject the idea that winning 9-10 games per year (after we went 13-1) is "dreaming" and unrealistic.

Well PJ, it is unrealistic. A team goes from 8-4 (+1L) to 7-5 (+1W), to 13-0 (+1L) -- and expecting them to get 9-10W *every year* after that, is unrealistic. When a team hits a peak like that, how often does it sustain 9-10W *every year*?

Quote:But here we are in 2018... totally cool with mediocre football (7-5, 6-6) and making excuses for it.

I take it season by season, and not making excuses for the screw-ups and potentiality to be better. Like losing to BSU and how bad our D was this year (even if so young). Or losing to Both Akron & CMU at home last year. Or getting blown out by SO much to both Toledo & Ohio at home this year.

We should have been better last year overall, and with a bit of a better record (7-5). With such a newer D, assuming we'd have a respectable D Coordinator, we should have been better with an extra win under our belt given so many home games against key opponents + the MAC not in a peak year (and us not having to play Buffalo either).

Just because I chuckle at expecting 9-10W *every year* as "par" -- doesn't mean I liked our 6-6 year right after going 13-1, or that we lived up to what our potential should be this year.

With our schedule notably tougher next year, on the road to two teams that stomped us at home + MACC on the road + feisty EMU on the road in Pepsi Can Alley -- I cannot realistically expect for "par" to be better than 8-4, even though our D should be better improved and our O a bit more polished. 9W is certainly possible, but I can't set that for "par".

Boise? OK. UCF? Huge college with huge budget & fan base -- yeah, I could see that being a year-in-year-out expectation after going undefeated two years in a row. We'd have to work our way up to that level, first. Not just win the MAC in a key year going undefeated in pre-bowl season.

Houston:
- 2013: 8-5
- 2014: 8-5
- 2015: 13-1
- 2016: 9-4
- 2017: 7-5
- 2018: 8-4* (plays Army in bowl)

Cinci:
- 2013: 9-4
- 2014: 9-4
- 2015: 7-6
- 2016: 4-8
- 2017: 4-8
- 2018: 10-2* (plays VA-Tech in bowl)

South Florida:
- 2013: 2-10
- 2014: 4-8
- 2015: 8-5
- 2016: 11-2
- 2017: 10-2
- 2018: 7-5* (plays Marshall in bowl)

Memphis:
- 2013: 3-9
- 2014: 10-3
- 2015: 9-4
- 2016: 8-5
- 2017: 10-3
- 2018: 8-5* (plays Wake Forrest in bowl)

Boise State:
- 2013: 8-5
- 2014: 12-2
- 2015: 9-4
- 2016: 10-3
- 2017: 11-3
- 2018: 10-3* (plays Boston College in bowl)

Fresno State:
- 2013: 11-2
- 2014: 6-8
- 2015: 3-9
- 2016: 1-11
- 2017: 10-4
- 2018: 12-2

San Diego State:
- 2013: 8-5
- 2014: 7-6
- 2015: 11-3
- 2016: 11-3
- 2017: 10-3
- 2018: 7-5* (plays Ohio in bowl)

Marshall (more on par with our program + budget & expectations moving forward):
- 2013: 10-4
- 2014: 13-1
- 2015: 10-3
- 2016: 3-9
- 2017: 8-5
- 2018: 8-4* (plays S Florida in bowl)

Northern Illinois (same concept):
- 2013: 12-2
- 2014: 11-3
- 2015: 8-6
- 2016: 5-7
- 2017: 8-5
- 2018: 8-5* (plays UAB in bowl)

WMU:
- 2013: 1-11
- 2014: 8-5
- 2015: 8-5
- 2016: 13-1
- 2017: 6-6
- 2018: 7-5* (plays BYU in bowl)

(12-18-2018 02:10 AM)toddjnsn Wrote:  

Quote:I reject the idea that winning 9-10 games per year (after we went 13-1) is "dreaming" and unrealistic.

Well PJ, it is unrealistic. A team goes from 8-4 (+1L) to 7-5 (+1W), to 13-0 (+1L) -- and expecting them to get 9-10W *every year* after that, is unrealistic. When a team hits a peak like that, how often does it sustain 9-10W *every year*?

Quote:But here we are in 2018... totally cool with mediocre football (7-5, 6-6) and making excuses for it.

I take it season by season, and not making excuses for the screw-ups and potentiality to be better. Like losing to BSU and how bad our D was this year (even if so young). Or losing to Both Akron & CMU at home last year. Or getting blown out by SO much to both Toledo & Ohio at home this year.

We should have been better last year overall, and with a bit of a better record (7-5). With such a newer D, assuming we'd have a respectable D Coordinator, we should have been better with an extra win under our belt given so many home games against key opponents + the MAC not in a peak year (and us not having to play Buffalo either).

Just because I chuckle at expecting 9-10W *every year* as "par" -- doesn't mean I liked our 6-6 year right after going 13-1, or that we lived up to what our potential should be this year.

With our schedule notably tougher next year, on the road to two teams that stomped us at home + MACC on the road + feisty EMU on the road in Pepsi Can Alley -- I cannot realistically expect for "par" to be better than 8-4, even though our D should be better improved and our O a bit more polished. 9W is certainly possible, but I can't set that for "par".

Boise? OK. UCF? Huge college with huge budget & fan base -- yeah, I could see that being a year-in-year-out expectation after going undefeated two years in a row. We'd have to work our way up to that level, first. Not just win the MAC in a key year going undefeated in pre-bowl season.

Houston:
- 2013: 8-5
- 2014: 8-5
- 2015: 13-1
- 2016: 9-4
- 2017: 7-5
- 2018: 8-4* (plays Army in bowl)

Cinci:
- 2013: 9-4
- 2014: 9-4
- 2015: 7-6
- 2016: 4-8
- 2017: 4-8
- 2018: 10-2* (plays VA-Tech in bowl)

South Florida:
- 2013: 2-10
- 2014: 4-8
- 2015: 8-5
- 2016: 11-2
- 2017: 10-2
- 2018: 7-5* (plays Marshall in bowl)

Memphis:
- 2013: 3-9
- 2014: 10-3
- 2015: 9-4
- 2016: 8-5
- 2017: 10-3
- 2018: 8-5* (plays Wake Forrest in bowl)

Boise State:
- 2013: 8-5
- 2014: 12-2
- 2015: 9-4
- 2016: 10-3
- 2017: 11-3
- 2018: 10-3* (plays Boston College in bowl)

Fresno State:
- 2013: 11-2
- 2014: 6-8
- 2015: 3-9
- 2016: 1-11
- 2017: 10-4
- 2018: 12-2

San Diego State:
- 2013: 8-5
- 2014: 7-6
- 2015: 11-3
- 2016: 11-3
- 2017: 10-3
- 2018: 7-5* (plays Ohio in bowl)

Marshall (more on par with our program + budget & expectations moving forward):
- 2013: 10-4
- 2014: 13-1
- 2015: 10-3
- 2016: 3-9
- 2017: 8-5
- 2018: 8-4* (plays S Florida in bowl)

Northern Illinois (same concept):
- 2013: 12-2
- 2014: 11-3
- 2015: 8-6
- 2016: 5-7
- 2017: 8-5
- 2018: 8-5* (plays UAB in bowl)

WMU:
- 2013: 1-11
- 2014: 8-5
- 2015: 8-5
- 2016: 13-1
- 2017: 6-6
- 2018: 7-5* (plays BYU in bowl)

Toledo
-2013 7-5
-2014 9-4
-2015 10-2
-2016 9-4
-2017 11-3
-2018 7-5*(plays FIU in Bowl)

(12-18-2018 02:10 AM)toddjnsn Wrote:  

Quote:I reject the idea that winning 9-10 games per year (after we went 13-1) is "dreaming" and unrealistic.

Well PJ, it is unrealistic. A team goes from 8-4 (+1L) to 7-5 (+1W), to 13-0 (+1L) -- and expecting them to get 9-10W *every year* after that, is unrealistic. When a team hits a peak like that, how often does it sustain 9-10W *every year*?

Quote:But here we are in 2018... totally cool with mediocre football (7-5, 6-6) and making excuses for it.

I take it season by season, and not making excuses for the screw-ups and potentiality to be better. Like losing to BSU and how bad our D was this year (even if so young). Or losing to Both Akron & CMU at home last year. Or getting blown out by SO much to both Toledo & Ohio at home this year.

We should have been better last year overall, and with a bit of a better record (7-5). With such a newer D, assuming we'd have a respectable D Coordinator, we should have been better with an extra win under our belt given so many home games against key opponents + the MAC not in a peak year (and us not having to play Buffalo either).

Just because I chuckle at expecting 9-10W *every year* as "par" -- doesn't mean I liked our 6-6 year right after going 13-1, or that we lived up to what our potential should be this year.

With our schedule notably tougher next year, on the road to two teams that stomped us at home + MACC on the road + feisty EMU on the road in Pepsi Can Alley -- I cannot realistically expect for "par" to be better than 8-4, even though our D should be better improved and our O a bit more polished. 9W is certainly possible, but I can't set that for "par".

Boise? OK. UCF? Huge college with huge budget & fan base -- yeah, I could see that being a year-in-year-out expectation after going undefeated two years in a row. We'd have to work our way up to that level, first. Not just win the MAC in a key year going undefeated in pre-bowl season.

Houston:
- 2013: 8-5
- 2014: 8-5
- 2015: 13-1
- 2016: 9-4
- 2017: 7-5
- 2018: 8-4* (plays Army in bowl)

Cinci:
- 2013: 9-4
- 2014: 9-4
- 2015: 7-6
- 2016: 4-8
- 2017: 4-8
- 2018: 10-2* (plays VA-Tech in bowl)

South Florida:
- 2013: 2-10
- 2014: 4-8
- 2015: 8-5
- 2016: 11-2
- 2017: 10-2
- 2018: 7-5* (plays Marshall in bowl)

Memphis:
- 2013: 3-9
- 2014: 10-3
- 2015: 9-4
- 2016: 8-5
- 2017: 10-3
- 2018: 8-5* (plays Wake Forrest in bowl)

Boise State:
- 2013: 8-5
- 2014: 12-2
- 2015: 9-4
- 2016: 10-3
- 2017: 11-3
- 2018: 10-3* (plays Boston College in bowl)

Fresno State:
- 2013: 11-2
- 2014: 6-8
- 2015: 3-9
- 2016: 1-11
- 2017: 10-4
- 2018: 12-2

San Diego State:
- 2013: 8-5
- 2014: 7-6
- 2015: 11-3
- 2016: 11-3
- 2017: 10-3
- 2018: 7-5* (plays Ohio in bowl)

Marshall (more on par with our program + budget & expectations moving forward):
- 2013: 10-4
- 2014: 13-1
- 2015: 10-3
- 2016: 3-9
- 2017: 8-5
- 2018: 8-4* (plays S Florida in bowl)

Northern Illinois (same concept):
- 2013: 12-2
- 2014: 11-3
- 2015: 8-6
- 2016: 5-7
- 2017: 8-5
- 2018: 8-5* (plays UAB in bowl)

WMU:
- 2013: 1-11
- 2014: 8-5
- 2015: 8-5
- 2016: 13-1
- 2017: 6-6
- 2018: 7-5* (plays BYU in bowl)

Well said.

(12-11-2018 08:09 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:22 PM)fastbuicks Wrote:  2019 should bring 9 wins. Don't understand the 5-7 talk

Have you watched us the last two seasons?

(12-17-2018 10:00 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  I reject the idea that winning 9-10 games per year (after we went 13-1) is "dreaming" and unrealistic. Furthermore, I find it insulting that any WMU alum would accept anything less at this point.

But here we are in 2018... totally cool with mediocre football (7-5, 6-6) and making excuses for it. Two years removed from a MAC Championship and Cotton Bowl.

Running game LITERALLY SAID 9 wins, that's his expectation and mine (or better) and you responded with "have you watched us the last two seasons?"

Who's the person here talking about being cool with mediocre football?

Quote:Who's the person here talking about being cool with mediocre football?

My issue is that going 6-6 after our Year of PJ and how we executed wasn't "mediocre" -- it was a step down from that. And this year, carrying out the last 3rd of our season, was sub-par except for avoiding disaster in a very relieving way and giving us hope.

(12-18-2018 01:11 PM)toddjnsn Wrote:  

Quote:Who's the person here talking about being cool with mediocre football?

My issue is that going 6-6 after our Year of PJ and how we executed wasn't "mediocre" -- it was a step down from that. And this year, carrying out the last 3rd of our season, was sub-par except for avoiding disaster in a very relieving way and giving us hope.

The RunningGame Scale of WMU Football Mediocrity

12-0: Screw Gameday, where's our playoff bid?!?
11-1: Screw potatoes, where's our NY6 bowl bid?!?
10-2: We should've beat MSU!
9-2: Why couldn't Kathy schedule 12 games so we could get 10 wins?!?
9-3: MAC refs screwed in that Akron game. How else could we have lost?
8-4: Damn it, NIU foiled us again!
7-5: Potatoes are tasty.
6-6: Literally mediocre.
5-7: If we had run a flea flicker against EMU, we'd be 6-6 and bowling!
4-8: Cubit was better than this...
3-9: Good thing we scheduled South Central Louisiana State.
2-10: Hello darkness my old friend...
1-11: "Well, at least I got to fondle that trophy once!"
0-12: Excited about coach search.

I do appreciate the effort that went into this...

(12-18-2018 03:01 PM)RunningGame Wrote:  

(12-18-2018 01:11 PM)toddjnsn Wrote:  

Quote:Who's the person here talking about being cool with mediocre football?

My issue is that going 6-6 after our Year of PJ and how we executed wasn't "mediocre" -- it was a step down from that. And this year, carrying out the last 3rd of our season, was sub-par except for avoiding disaster in a very relieving way and giving us hope.

The RunningGame Scale of WMU Football Mediocrity

12-0: Screw Gameday, where's our playoff bid?!?
11-1: Screw potatoes, where's our NY6 bowl bid?!?
10-2: We should've beat MSU!
9-2: Why couldn't Kathy schedule 12 games so we could get 10 wins?!?
9-3: MAC refs screwed in that Akron game. How else could we have lost?
8-4: Damn it, NIU foiled us again!
7-5: Potatoes are tasty.
6-6: Literally mediocre.
5-7: If we had run a flea flicker against EMU, we'd be 6-6 and bowling!
4-8: Cubit was better than this...
3-9: Good thing we scheduled South Central Louisiana State.
2-10: Hello darkness my old friend...
1-11: "Well, at least I got to fondle that trophy once!"
0-12: Excited about coach search.

Indeed, anyone thinking we'd be 9-3 type seasons consistently every year after the Cotton Bowl was crazy, considering how the team was just 4-8, 1-11, 8-5, 8-5 the years prior. Add that the All-Time best FBS receiver graduated and arguably the program's best QB graduated.

I do think the team has underperformed these past couple seasons, tho. Should've had an 8-5 season last year and this year we should already be 8-4.