(12-01-2018 08:12 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 08:05 PM)Big Red Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 07:52 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 07:43 PM)Big Red Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 07:40 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  Yes, they play zero defense in that league...56-41.

So Tulane is in the AAC because of their great football and basketball attendance?

Temple football attendance is weak. Same with UConn football program and attendance. Tulsa football attendance is not that great.

Everyone in the AAC isn't the great school you make them out to be.

I'd rather have a successful program than 30k in attendance. Having both would be great, but our attendance died after 12+ years of midweek football.

Again, are you suggesting that the AAC should or would be interested in NIU? It's not clear. Even though I asked.

We're one of the most successful mid-major programs for the last 15+ years. Yes, we should be attractive. If anyone wants to gripe about attendance than look no further than Tulane, Temple, UConn, Tulsa, and SMU.

You are aware they take more into consideration than just the football team's record, right?

You are aware that more than attendance matters, right?

Our success on the football field is unmatched by all mid-majors but Boise. College football dominates college athletics. Men's basketball is a distant #2.

Yes. Obviously I do as I'm not advocating that, despite NIUs success on the field, there are other factors (namely football attendance) that would stop the AAC from being interested in the school.

Why is this so hard to understand? Yeah, you have to be good. But simply being good, while a requirement (although Temple wasn't good and they got in...I wonder why....) isn't enough.

Attendance, enrollment, location, athletic budget are all major factors that NIU simply doesn't have.

I would love to be in the AAC and have been saying this for years. It would help attendance and exposure by playing higher profile opponents. Unfortunately enrollment has gone the wrong direction. AAC schools come from bigger markets so I’d expect Toledo or Buffalo to get interest as well (Buffalo especially since it’s a good basketball conference too). We have tried to use the Chicago market to our advantage but that hasn’t really been as big a success as we’d like. Travel costs would be difficult to fund but it depends on how much more revenue the conference shares. Better bowls , better tv deal, and more basketball teams in the ncaa tourney equals more money. Plus more donors and ticket sales because of better competition. Probably just a pipe dream but when the landscape changes in a few years there might be some options.

The AAC just added Wichita State (as a non-football member). If you think that had to do with anything but their success on the basketball program you're nuts. It wasn't their enrollment, endowment or the mystical Wichita market.

Of course, success on the field isn't the only factor but it's the biggest. Conferences want revenue and exposure, which go hand in hand with winning and larger markets. They don't care if it the stadium looks cool or has X number of butts in the seats. That's just window dressing.

(12-02-2018 11:44 AM)Max Power Wrote:  The AAC just added Wichita State (as a non-football member). If you think that had to do with anything but their success on the basketball program you're nuts. It wasn't their enrollment, endowment or the mystical Wichita market.

Of course, success on the field isn't the only factor but it's the biggest. Conferences want revenue and exposure, which go hand in hand with winning and larger markets. They don't care if it the stadium looks cool or has X number of butts in the seats. That's just window dressing.

Like you said, they're basketball only. But since you think butts in seats don't matter. Just know that, last year, Wichita State led the AAC in attendance. Add that to being a nationally recognized and often ranked team along with a Final Four appearance in 2013 and a Sweet Sixteen showing in 2015 along with a ton of tournament appearances typically making it to the round of 32 (which is way more prestigious than playing in Bowl Games yearly).

Wichita is also the biggest city in Kansas (a low bar to hurdle, admittedly) and has a metro population of about 650,000. That's not nothing.

So, put it all together and you have two programs (NIU and Wichita) who have a long run of recent success (two different sports, although I'd say Wichita has been more successful), but the similarities end there.

For some reason, those here wanting to argue keep pointing to program success and acting as if I (or possibly others) are ignoring that. I'm not. But it's not the only factor and as far as the other factors go, NIU falls woefully short.

all comes down to endowment.

(12-03-2018 11:06 AM)thehappyhuskie Wrote:  all comes down to endowment.

In more ways than one.

UCF has the lowest AAC endowment at $150M but they have the highest stock. Endowment only matters to conferences if you’re willing to dip into your endowment for athletics which few schools are willing to do, or if the endowment is so low it will start to affect athletic budgets.

1. NIU Football: Regular MAC champs
2. NIU Other sports. Never MAC champs.

Until #2 is #1, then be prepared for cold Tuesday nights vs Akron at Huskie Stadium and an empty Convo vs Ball State.

(12-03-2018 12:18 PM)Max Power Wrote:  UCF has the lowest AAC endowment at $150M but they have the highest stock. Endowment only matters to conferences if you’re willing to dip into your endowment for athletics which few schools are willing to do, or if the endowment is so low it will start to affect athletic budgets.

NIU's endowment is half of that. And with a state budget that is always on the rocks the threat of having to invest some of that to keep your program running is always a real possibility.

(12-03-2018 01:08 PM)thehappyhuskie Wrote:  

(12-03-2018 12:18 PM)Max Power Wrote:  UCF has the lowest AAC endowment at $150M but they have the highest stock. Endowment only matters to conferences if you’re willing to dip into your endowment for athletics which few schools are willing to do, or if the endowment is so low it will start to affect athletic budgets.

NIU's endowment is half of that. And with a state budget that is always on the rocks the threat of having to invest some of that to keep your program running is always a real possibility.

Well most of that endowment is restricted anyways so you cant use it even if you wanted to for athletics.

Most of the AAC was in the old C-USA with us. UAB and Southern Miss were left behind. In expansion, probably the biggest factor is football (success, facilities, attendance, budget) and the number of TV eyeballs in a new market it brings. Then it's MBB, academics, enrollment, etc.

Look at the AAC on a map. If you *did* get in your travel costs would be enormous. Don't forget that all your non-moneymaking sports, WBB, volleyball, baseball/softball, etc. would also face much more extensive travel.

Basically, everyone in the G5 wants to move to a better conference. We'd jump to the AAC in a heartbeat, and indeed are positioning ourselves to make a run at it during the next conference realignment. Our current map in C-USA is even worse - from Norfolk to Boca to El Paso, so if we make it the travel will actually be a little better... maybe. Conference money is better for certain.

Just be careful what you wish for, and realize that everybody and their brother will be trying for it too. I doubt anything happens until the current TV contracts end, in 2022 I think it is.

(12-01-2018 06:46 PM)dogdangit Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:35 PM)NIUSox10 Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:27 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:07 PM)Big Red Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 05:20 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Not going anywhere unless we can grow our fan base and somehow dramatically increase our budget for football and basketball.

Yup, both of those conferences would take one look at our attendance numbers and laugh themselves silly.

They play zero defense in that league though. Everytime I see a final score its 40-something to 50-something. UConn set a record for most points given up in a season.

I think if niu had an enrollment of 30k, attendence of 25k, AD budget 2x the current one, a univ endowment of $1B, and a somewhat competitive basketball team when the AAC was formed - we would have gotten the nod.

The football team has nothing to do with not moving from the MAC.

The reason they're all able to achieve this is their local populations as well. AAC has teams scattered all throughout major population areas such as Houston, Philly, Orlando, Cinci, Dallas and Memphis. NIU needs to capture a nearby population to tab as "its own" and go all in on marketing. We all know Chicago is a waste of time at this point. Either choose Rockford or the Naperville/Aurora area and build a solid base there.

(12-01-2018 06:51 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:38 PM)Big Red Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:27 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:07 PM)Big Red Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 05:20 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Not going anywhere unless we can grow our fan base and somehow dramatically increase our budget for football and basketball.

Yup, both of those conferences would take one look at our attendance numbers and laugh themselves silly.

They play zero defense in that league though. Everytime I see a final score its 40-something to 50-something. UConn set a record for most points given up in a season.

What does that have to do with NIU's (and the MAC's) attendance numbers? It's not like the offense is keeping people away. Yeah, the weeknight scheduling is a factor (and it's not like either of those conferences don't play weeknight games....they absolutely do), NIU has never had sustained attendance numbers like either the MW or AAC get on the regular.

And that's even before you get to the subject of budget, which isn't just going to magically grow if they changed conferences.

Most of their teams play in warm weather states. They also get to play their conference championship in the home stadium of the team with the best record. UCF has 3x as many students as NIU. Not all things are equal.

Look at these pictures of Temple vs. USF. Temple plays its games in the city of Philadelphia and their attendance is not good (despite what they claim as their attendance).

https://www.whipradiotu.com/photos-templ...-11-17-18/

Our attendance is fine, and growing every year. It's not going to look good in a 70K stadium, because we aren't close to filling it. If we get the on campus stadium at 35K-38K, it's going to be rocking.

(12-01-2018 04:56 PM)Boggs747474 Wrote:  Would love to move conferences, I think it’s provem we are done with the Mac and there is nothing more for NIU to accomplish.

...Proving once again why our message board is so ridiculous. Comments like this.

The only close conference is the big 10. Big 12 wouldn't consider our paltry fan base. Where would you suggest NIU go?

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(12-01-2018 06:46 PM)dogdangit Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:35 PM)NIUSox10 Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:27 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:07 PM)Big Red Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 05:20 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Not going anywhere unless we can grow our fan base and somehow dramatically increase our budget for football and basketball.

Yup, both of those conferences would take one look at our attendance numbers and laugh themselves silly.

They play zero defense in that league though. Everytime I see a final score its 40-something to 50-something. UConn set a record for most points given up in a season.

I think if niu had an enrollment of 30k, attendence of 25k, AD budget 2x the current one, a univ endowment of $1B, and a somewhat competitive basketball team when the AAC was formed - we would have gotten the nod.

The football team has nothing to do with not moving from the MAC.

The reason they're all able to achieve this is their local populations as well. AAC has teams scattered all throughout major population areas such as Houston, Philly, Orlando, Cinci, Dallas and Memphis. NIU needs to capture a nearby population to tab as "its own" and go all in on marketing. We all know Chicago is a waste of time at this point. Either choose Rockford or the Naperville/Aurora area and build a solid base there.

Naperville is Chicago west and Chicago is a pro town. Just ask Northwestern. They rebuilt their tiny bball gym and reduced the size. DePaul has a new arena.l and it is nice but they don't come close to filling the place.

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(12-04-2018 06:23 PM)Teamduh Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:46 PM)dogdangit Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:35 PM)NIUSox10 Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:27 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:07 PM)Big Red Wrote:  Yup, both of those conferences would take one look at our attendance numbers and laugh themselves silly.

They play zero defense in that league though. Everytime I see a final score its 40-something to 50-something. UConn set a record for most points given up in a season.

I think if niu had an enrollment of 30k, attendence of 25k, AD budget 2x the current one, a univ endowment of $1B, and a somewhat competitive basketball team when the AAC was formed - we would have gotten the nod.

The football team has nothing to do with not moving from the MAC.

The reason they're all able to achieve this is their local populations as well. AAC has teams scattered all throughout major population areas such as Houston, Philly, Orlando, Cinci, Dallas and Memphis. NIU needs to capture a nearby population to tab as "its own" and go all in on marketing. We all know Chicago is a waste of time at this point. Either choose Rockford or the Naperville/Aurora area and build a solid base there.

Naperville is Chicago west and Chicago is a pro town. Just ask Northwestern. They rebuilt their tiny bball gym and reduced the size. DePaul has a new arena.l and it is nice but they don't come close to filling the place.

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Depaul needs to win and get some top Chicago kids to start going there again for their attendance to be good.