(08-27-2019 03:04 PM)stever20 Wrote:  correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ACC RSN package gone now- with all games exclusive to the ACC Network?

No, they still remain as lost revenue for the ACCN. The legacy of the forced marriage with Raycom lives on through it.

Possible good news for ACCN on Dish and Sling

https://www.broadcastingcable.com/news/d...o-blackout

It would seem logical for Disney to use this negotiation to for ACCN coverage

(08-27-2019 09:14 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 03:04 PM)stever20 Wrote:  correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ACC RSN package gone now- with all games exclusive to the ACC Network?

No, they still remain as lost revenue for the ACCN. The legacy of the forced marriage with Raycom lives on through it.

Correct. ESPN and the ACC bought out the Raycom sublicensing arrangement, but that contract was still subject to a further sublicensing agreement with the Fox RSNs. Fox would needed to have been dealt with separately.

Ironically, Disney acquired these rights as part of the larger purchase of Fox assets, but the feds required Disney to divest the Fox RSNs. I'm guessing Disney did not want to risk doing anything that might have appeared to undermine its compliance with the the divestiture requirement when it sold the Fox RSNs to Sinclair. If the sale hadn't been required by such an order, it's the kind of asset they may have tried to keep.

The rights will eventually revert to ESPN, IIRC around 2026. Now that the sale to Sinclair is complete, ESPN could try to negotiate an arms length deal to reacquire the rights without jeopardizing its divestiture obligation. Alternatively, Sinclair's selection rights are pretty far down the pecking order, so the value of the package may not be huge in any event.

(08-28-2019 08:44 AM)orangefan Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 09:14 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 03:04 PM)stever20 Wrote:  correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ACC RSN package gone now- with all games exclusive to the ACC Network?

No, they still remain as lost revenue for the ACCN. The legacy of the forced marriage with Raycom lives on through it.

Correct. ESPN and the ACC bought out the Raycom sublicensing arrangement, but that contract was still subject to a further sublicensing agreement with the Fox RSNs. Fox would needed to have been dealt with separately.

Ironically, Disney acquired these rights as part of the larger purchase of Fox assets, but the feds required Disney to divest the Fox RSNs. I'm guessing Disney did not want to risk doing anything that might have appeared to undermine its compliance with the the divestiture requirement when it sold the Fox RSNs to Sinclair. If the sale hadn't been required by such an order, it's the kind of asset they may have tried to keep.

The rights will eventually revert to ESPN, IIRC around 2026. Now that the sale to Sinclair is complete, ESPN could try to negotiate an arms length deal to reacquire the rights without jeopardizing its divestiture obligation. Alternatively, Sinclair's selection rights are pretty far down the pecking order, so the value of the package may not be huge in any event.

While it hurts revenue, it helps in one area: one to two more ACC football games will be on TV on Saturday (as opposed to possibly on a weeknight or on the ACCNX).

(08-28-2019 10:47 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 08:44 AM)orangefan Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 09:14 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 03:04 PM)stever20 Wrote:  correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ACC RSN package gone now- with all games exclusive to the ACC Network?

No, they still remain as lost revenue for the ACCN. The legacy of the forced marriage with Raycom lives on through it.

Correct. ESPN and the ACC bought out the Raycom sublicensing arrangement, but that contract was still subject to a further sublicensing agreement with the Fox RSNs. Fox would needed to have been dealt with separately.

Ironically, Disney acquired these rights as part of the larger purchase of Fox assets, but the feds required Disney to divest the Fox RSNs. I'm guessing Disney did not want to risk doing anything that might have appeared to undermine its compliance with the the divestiture requirement when it sold the Fox RSNs to Sinclair. If the sale hadn't been required by such an order, it's the kind of asset they may have tried to keep.

The rights will eventually revert to ESPN, IIRC around 2026. Now that the sale to Sinclair is complete, ESPN could try to negotiate an arms length deal to reacquire the rights without jeopardizing its divestiture obligation. Alternatively, Sinclair's selection rights are pretty far down the pecking order, so the value of the package may not be huge in any event.

While it hurts revenue, it helps in one area: one to two more ACC football games will be on TV on Saturday (as opposed to possibly on a weeknight or on the ACCNX).

If a game is on TV and nobody watches does it matter? Exactly how many eyeballs do you expect to tune in to watch NC State & Western Carolina on Saturday Sept 7th at 12:30PM? At least if the game were on the ACCN we would see some benefit from the advertising, with it being on the RSN we get nothing.

(08-28-2019 11:21 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 10:47 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 08:44 AM)orangefan Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 09:14 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 03:04 PM)stever20 Wrote:  correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ACC RSN package gone now- with all games exclusive to the ACC Network?

No, they still remain as lost revenue for the ACCN. The legacy of the forced marriage with Raycom lives on through it.

Correct. ESPN and the ACC bought out the Raycom sublicensing arrangement, but that contract was still subject to a further sublicensing agreement with the Fox RSNs. Fox would needed to have been dealt with separately.

Ironically, Disney acquired these rights as part of the larger purchase of Fox assets, but the feds required Disney to divest the Fox RSNs. I'm guessing Disney did not want to risk doing anything that might have appeared to undermine its compliance with the the divestiture requirement when it sold the Fox RSNs to Sinclair. If the sale hadn't been required by such an order, it's the kind of asset they may have tried to keep.

The rights will eventually revert to ESPN, IIRC around 2026. Now that the sale to Sinclair is complete, ESPN could try to negotiate an arms length deal to reacquire the rights without jeopardizing its divestiture obligation. Alternatively, Sinclair's selection rights are pretty far down the pecking order, so the value of the package may not be huge in any event.

While it hurts revenue, it helps in one area: one to two more ACC football games will be on TV on Saturday (as opposed to possibly on a weeknight or on the ACCNX).

If a game is on TV and nobody watches does it matter? Exactly how many eyeballs do you expect to tune in to watch NC State & Western Carolina on Saturday Sept 7th at 12:30PM? At least if the game were on the ACCN we would see some benefit from the advertising, with it being on the RSN we get nothing.

For the league, agreed. For the fans of that school who don't want to be stuck playing on a Thursday or Friday night, the RSN game (on Saturday) is better. Don't get me wrong, though, I don't like it any more than you do.

The Raycom contract is truly the "gift" that keeps on "giving"... and by giving, I mean taking.

(08-28-2019 01:11 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 11:21 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 10:47 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 08:44 AM)orangefan Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 09:14 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  No, they still remain as lost revenue for the ACCN. The legacy of the forced marriage with Raycom lives on through it.

Correct. ESPN and the ACC bought out the Raycom sublicensing arrangement, but that contract was still subject to a further sublicensing agreement with the Fox RSNs. Fox would needed to have been dealt with separately.

Ironically, Disney acquired these rights as part of the larger purchase of Fox assets, but the feds required Disney to divest the Fox RSNs. I'm guessing Disney did not want to risk doing anything that might have appeared to undermine its compliance with the the divestiture requirement when it sold the Fox RSNs to Sinclair. If the sale hadn't been required by such an order, it's the kind of asset they may have tried to keep.

The rights will eventually revert to ESPN, IIRC around 2026. Now that the sale to Sinclair is complete, ESPN could try to negotiate an arms length deal to reacquire the rights without jeopardizing its divestiture obligation. Alternatively, Sinclair's selection rights are pretty far down the pecking order, so the value of the package may not be huge in any event.

While it hurts revenue, it helps in one area: one to two more ACC football games will be on TV on Saturday (as opposed to possibly on a weeknight or on the ACCNX).

If a game is on TV and nobody watches does it matter? Exactly how many eyeballs do you expect to tune in to watch NC State & Western Carolina on Saturday Sept 7th at 12:30PM? At least if the game were on the ACCN we would see some benefit from the advertising, with it being on the RSN we get nothing.

For the league, agreed. For the fans of that school who don't want to be stuck playing on a Thursday or Friday night, the RSN game (on Saturday) is better. Don't get me wrong, though, I don't like it any more than you do.

The Raycom contract is truly the "gift" that keeps on "giving"... and by giving, I mean taking.

I doubt that the NC State fans who will be actually going to the game on 9/7 are more appreciative of a 12:30PM Saturday start than a Thursday or Friday night when the chances of heat stroke sitting in the stands is much lower.

(08-28-2019 02:36 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 01:11 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 11:21 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 10:47 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 08:44 AM)orangefan Wrote:  Correct. ESPN and the ACC bought out the Raycom sublicensing arrangement, but that contract was still subject to a further sublicensing agreement with the Fox RSNs. Fox would needed to have been dealt with separately.

Ironically, Disney acquired these rights as part of the larger purchase of Fox assets, but the feds required Disney to divest the Fox RSNs. I'm guessing Disney did not want to risk doing anything that might have appeared to undermine its compliance with the the divestiture requirement when it sold the Fox RSNs to Sinclair. If the sale hadn't been required by such an order, it's the kind of asset they may have tried to keep.

The rights will eventually revert to ESPN, IIRC around 2026. Now that the sale to Sinclair is complete, ESPN could try to negotiate an arms length deal to reacquire the rights without jeopardizing its divestiture obligation. Alternatively, Sinclair's selection rights are pretty far down the pecking order, so the value of the package may not be huge in any event.

While it hurts revenue, it helps in one area: one to two more ACC football games will be on TV on Saturday (as opposed to possibly on a weeknight or on the ACCNX).

If a game is on TV and nobody watches does it matter? Exactly how many eyeballs do you expect to tune in to watch NC State & Western Carolina on Saturday Sept 7th at 12:30PM? At least if the game were on the ACCN we would see some benefit from the advertising, with it being on the RSN we get nothing.

For the league, agreed. For the fans of that school who don't want to be stuck playing on a Thursday or Friday night, the RSN game (on Saturday) is better. Don't get me wrong, though, I don't like it any more than you do.

The Raycom contract is truly the "gift" that keeps on "giving"... and by giving, I mean taking.

I doubt that the NC State fans who will be actually going to the game on 9/7 are more appreciative of a 12:30PM Saturday start than a Thursday or Friday night when the chances of heat stroke sitting in the stands is much lower.

Good point. I was really thinking more of later kickoff times, but those games may all be around noon for all I know.

The noon kicks ruin the atmospher at CF in the month of September. Night games used to be a staple in September so you could avoid 90-95 degrees and 60-85% humidity. The stadium is not really designed for summer football in the daytime. If your tickets are in the East Stands, God help you. The West Stands are a little bit better as the 3 story press box can give some shade, but you need to be between the 20's and very high up in the stands. It's particularly tough on little kids and the elderly.

(08-28-2019 07:22 PM)Statefan Wrote:  The noon kicks ruin the atmospher at CF in the month of September. Night games used to be a staple in September so you could avoid 90-95 degrees and 60-85% humidity. The stadium is not really designed for summer football in the daytime. If your tickets are in the East Stands, God help you. The West Stands are a little bit better as the 3 story press box can give some shade, but you need to be between the 20's and very high up in the stands. It's particularly tough on little kids and the elderly.

I've sat in the east stands of Carter Finley for an early kickoff October game, I want absolutely no part in an early September game.

Hell, me and my wife almost gave up our Clemson tickets early on after getting UM seats in the north stands. Luckily we got south stands seats and it's been grand since.

Having gone to FSU, I want no part in noon or 3:30 games in September. Even in Syracuse (based on the sauna I sat in last season.)

(08-29-2019 03:22 AM)whittx Wrote:  Having gone to FSU, I want no part in noon or 3:30 games in September. Even in Syracuse (based on the sauna I sat in last season.)

AC coming as part of the Dome renovations. Not sure which phase, but by 2022 at the latest.

Perhaps the biggest benefit of the ACC Network launch has been the effect on kick times.

Last year there were 10 noon-ish (11:00 to 1:30) games and 8 night games in the first 3 weeks. This year there are only 4 noon-ish games and 11 night games for ACC football! One reason: the ACCN needed night games for this Thursday, Friday and Saturday, as well as every Saturday night and many future Thu/Fri night games. That draws down noon games significantly.

https://accfootballrx.blogspot.com/2019/...-accn.html

Mark, now you did it:. Here come the Thursday/Friday night haters. LOL

BTW the guys in the South have a point about Friday. Friday doesn't affect Cuse and BC as much. Well for BC traffic is a *****.

(08-27-2019 09:14 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 03:04 PM)stever20 Wrote:  correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ACC RSN package gone now- with all games exclusive to the ACC Network?

No, they still remain as lost revenue for the ACCN. The legacy of the forced marriage with Raycom lives on through it.

That's a common situation. E.g., the SEC is still paying, via a poor split of revenue with ESPN, for the praised at the time but ultimately bad deal that Slive signed in 2008. The entire structure of the SECN, which is very favorable to ESPN, is colored by the terms of that bad deal. The ACC's revenue from the ACCN will also be adversely affected by the bad deal they signed with ESPN in 2010.

For the ACC and the SEC, it will be sometimes in the mid-2030s before the legacy of lowball deals signed before 2011 are completely washed out.

(08-29-2019 06:47 AM)orangefan Wrote:  

(08-29-2019 03:22 AM)whittx Wrote:  Having gone to FSU, I want no part in noon or 3:30 games in September. Even in Syracuse (based on the sauna I sat in last season.)

AC coming as part of the Dome renovations. Not sure which phase, but by 2022 at the latest.

So I hear. It's next phase.

(08-29-2019 09:34 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 09:14 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 03:04 PM)stever20 Wrote:  correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ACC RSN package gone now- with all games exclusive to the ACC Network?

No, they still remain as lost revenue for the ACCN. The legacy of the forced marriage with Raycom lives on through it.

That's a common situation. E.g., the SEC is still paying, via a poor split of revenue with ESPN, for the praised at the time but ultimately bad deal that Slive signed in 2008. The entire structure of the SECN, which is very favorable to ESPN, is colored by the terms of that bad deal. The ACC's revenue from the ACCN will also be adversely affected by the bad deal they signed with ESPN in 2010.

For the ACC and the SEC, it will be sometimes in the mid-2030s before the legacy of lowball deals signed before 2011 are completely washed out.

Oh no the SEC is in a much much better spot than the ACC. They negotiate with CBS and ESPN sooner and have no Raycom deal.
The ACC owns 0 if it’s games until the mid 2030’s and the ACC network won’t do very well with the little profits that come in going to ESPIN.

(08-29-2019 09:34 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 09:14 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 03:04 PM)stever20 Wrote:  correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ACC RSN package gone now- with all games exclusive to the ACC Network?

No, they still remain as lost revenue for the ACCN. The legacy of the forced marriage with Raycom lives on through it.

That's a common situation. E.g., the SEC is still paying, via a poor split of revenue with ESPN, for the praised at the time but ultimately bad deal that Slive signed in 2008. The entire structure of the SECN, which is very favorable to ESPN, is colored by the terms of that bad deal. The ACC's revenue from the ACCN will also be adversely affected by the bad deal they signed with ESPN in 2010.

For the ACC and the SEC, it will be sometimes in the mid-2030s before the legacy of lowball deals signed before 2011 are completely washed out.

In 2035 the Boomer demographic will be over as a leading factor in viewing. So they won't be washed out in the mid 30's. The times and numbers will finally justify the lower rates. That is why the CBS deal is such a vital factor for the SEC. At least, and this is a key distinction, our T1 rights aren't tied up with ESPN like the ACC's are. The SECN essentially gave us 50% of their profits as a benchmark. So in 2034 when the SEC's T2 is up it will only be those rights that are going to be renewed.

Consider then the place of expansion in all of this for the SEC. It adds volume to both T1 and T2. In 2034 we could (with expansion prior) essentially split up T1 and T2 rights and sell a 50/50 split to the highest two bidders, and quite possibly for 2 different dedicated air times. And by then T3 rights may be marketed in an entirely different manner than a conference network. So how we wangle higher profits has a viable pathway. We just have to have a commissioner who will take advantage of it. And, if Aresco is successful in going divisionless that makes expansion to 18 highly viable.

(08-29-2019 04:04 PM)whittx Wrote:  

(08-29-2019 06:47 AM)orangefan Wrote:  

(08-29-2019 03:22 AM)whittx Wrote:  Having gone to FSU, I want no part in noon or 3:30 games in September. Even in Syracuse (based on the sauna I sat in last season.)

AC coming as part of the Dome renovations. Not sure which phase, but by 2022 at the latest.

So I hear. It's next phase.

Yes...some challenges to be solved. The chilled water plant has to push the water (refrigerant) uphill and I'm not sure that have it all figured out.

Dish and Sling TV will carry ACC Network tonight for GT/Clemson. Looks to be a temporary thing while negotiations are ongoing. Encouraging, though.

https://mobile.twitter.com/i/web/status/...1981982720