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bearcatmark Offline
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Post: #61
RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 10:19 AM)CincyBro Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 07:52 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  Always glad to see a win. But really, there's still little support for any argument that this UC team can score enough points to compete and win in December and beyond against top forty teams.

We all hope they do. Realistically though, we have a large sample size now with this coaching staff (more than a decade), that suggests UC will blow out inferior teams (as most high and mid majors will) only to see players tighten up and miss shots against quality opponents. Or a failure to move the ball on offense and penetrate the lane for good looks or kick outs to open shooters when those scoring droughts set in.

There are encouraging signs--I really like Williams floor game and what he adds. But we're still looking at lots of projects offensively.

One of the most accurate statements yet, my opinion is Micks coaching style changes against quality opponents, he himself seems to be more uptight( taking guys out after one mistake, calling every offensive set, the mean face ) hard to play loose when players are uptight. He needs to be just as relaxed as he was last night and let his kids play. Thoughts.....

Maybe... but I thought the exact opposite partly cost us the Nevada game. I thought Mick clearly had a great gameplan that centered around making them run offense, score in the half court and make tough shots. I thought our offensive gameplan was a concerted effort to get the ball to the rim through post passes and driving. We got up big and we started playing fast and jacking up bad shots and Mick waited too long to reign them back in. That played to Nevada's strengths which was free flowing, open court basketball.
 
11-28-2018 10:27 AM
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Marcus Offline
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Post: #62
RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 09:55 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 09:51 AM)Marcus Wrote:  
(11-27-2018 08:39 PM)RealDeal Wrote:  How in the world does your starting point guard not shoot any free throws until game 7? All you need to know about how little pressure JJ puts on opposing defense

Exactly. We are going nowhere with him running the show. He doesn't create for anyone, never gets into the lane, he simply doesn't do anything you expect your PG to do.

More accurately, he doesn't do EVERYTHING you expect your PG to do. I expect my PG to have a high assist rate...he leads the Bearcats in assist rate. I expect my PG to protect the basketball...he is easily the best on the team at not turning the ball over (his turnover rate is 6.3 half as much as the next best on the team) and one of the best in the country. He's also been really efficient on offense...has the highest kenpom offensive rating on the team this year. He defends well.

People love to look at what Jenifer isn't and seemingly ignore any positive aspect to his game. He's a solid role play for this team and is being used as such.

I'd argue his TO rate is so low because he doesn't attempt to do anything on the offensive end. Just stands out on the perimeter and throws the ball to the guy next to him while everything bogs down. We simply need a more dynamic PG that can make the others around him better by getting into the lane, drawing fouls from time to time, and getting guys open looks. It just doesn't happen with him on the court. We'll never agree on this, which is fine, but we need much better play from our PG position IMO.
 
(This post was last modified: 11-28-2018 10:35 AM by Marcus.)
11-28-2018 10:34 AM
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DownOnRohs Offline
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Post: #63
RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 10:34 AM)Marcus Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 09:55 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 09:51 AM)Marcus Wrote:  
(11-27-2018 08:39 PM)RealDeal Wrote:  How in the world does your starting point guard not shoot any free throws until game 7? All you need to know about how little pressure JJ puts on opposing defense

Exactly. We are going nowhere with him running the show. He doesn't create for anyone, never gets into the lane, he simply doesn't do anything you expect your PG to do.

More accurately, he doesn't do EVERYTHING you expect your PG to do. I expect my PG to have a high assist rate...he leads the Bearcats in assist rate. I expect my PG to protect the basketball...he is easily the best on the team at not turning the ball over (his turnover rate is 6.3 half as much as the next best on the team) and one of the best in the country. He's also been really efficient on offense...has the highest kenpom offensive rating on the team this year. He defends well.

People love to look at what Jenifer isn't and seemingly ignore any positive aspect to his game. He's a solid role play for this team and is being used as such.

I'd argue his TO rate is so low because he doesn't attempt to do anything on the offensive end. Just stands out on the perimeter and throws the ball to the guy next to him while everything bogs down. We simply need a more dynamic PG that can make the others around him better by getting into the lane, drawing fouls from time to time, and getting guys open looks. It just doesn't happen with him on the court. We'll never agree on this, which is fine, but we need much better play from our PG position IMO.

That's why JJ, LoJo, Cane, and Jarron ALL bring the ball up the court throughout the game. We aren't talented enough just line up the same 1-5 every game. Most college teams aren't.
 
11-28-2018 10:37 AM
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DownOnRohs Offline
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RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
The play that got me most excited about Mamoudou? His dunk off the feed from Fredericks. Around the 1:50 mark in the video below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDT2P_xhxTc

How quickly and athletically he elevates from underneath the rim to flush it home. The kind of quickness that is common in the NBA.
 
(This post was last modified: 11-28-2018 10:56 AM by DownOnRohs.)
11-28-2018 10:40 AM
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CallMeSlim Online
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Post: #65
RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 09:55 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 09:51 AM)Marcus Wrote:  
(11-27-2018 08:39 PM)RealDeal Wrote:  How in the world does your starting point guard not shoot any free throws until game 7? All you need to know about how little pressure JJ puts on opposing defense

Exactly. We are going nowhere with him running the show. He doesn't create for anyone, never gets into the lane, he simply doesn't do anything you expect your PG to do.

More accurately, he doesn't do EVERYTHING you expect your PG to do. I expect my PG to have a high assist rate...he leads the Bearcats in assist rate. I expect my PG to protect the basketball...he is easily the best on the team at not turning the ball over (his turnover rate is 6.3 half as much as the next best on the team) and one of the best in the country. He's also been really efficient on offense...has the highest kenpom offensive rating on the team this year. He defends well.

People love to look at what Jenifer isn't and seemingly ignore any positive aspect to his game. He's a solid role play for this team and is being used as such.


the high assist rate isn't likely to continue because he relies on guys hitting long jumpers to boost it. he's not penetrating and getting guys easy looks.


his assist rate last year was the lowest for any starting PG we've had since Cash's freshman season.


his assist rate this year has already dropped from sky high after 2 games down to what Cane's was last year.
 
11-28-2018 10:52 AM
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Bruce Monnin Online
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Post: #66
RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 10:34 AM)Marcus Wrote:  I'd argue his TO rate is so low because he doesn't attempt to do anything on the offensive end. Just stands out on the perimeter and throws the ball to the guy next to him while everything bogs down. We simply need a more dynamic PG that can make the others around him better by getting into the lane, drawing fouls from time to time, and getting guys open looks. It just doesn't happen with him on the court. We'll never agree on this, which is fine, but we need much better play from our PG position IMO.

Terry Nelson intimated the same theory during the game broadcast, though in a much more political way.
 
11-28-2018 11:10 AM
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Cataclysmo Offline
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Post: #67
RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 10:27 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 10:19 AM)CincyBro Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 07:52 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  Always glad to see a win. But really, there's still little support for any argument that this UC team can score enough points to compete and win in December and beyond against top forty teams.

We all hope they do. Realistically though, we have a large sample size now with this coaching staff (more than a decade), that suggests UC will blow out inferior teams (as most high and mid majors will) only to see players tighten up and miss shots against quality opponents. Or a failure to move the ball on offense and penetrate the lane for good looks or kick outs to open shooters when those scoring droughts set in.

There are encouraging signs--I really like Williams floor game and what he adds. But we're still looking at lots of projects offensively.

One of the most accurate statements yet, my opinion is Micks coaching style changes against quality opponents, he himself seems to be more uptight( taking guys out after one mistake, calling every offensive set, the mean face ) hard to play loose when players are uptight. He needs to be just as relaxed as he was last night and let his kids play. Thoughts.....

Maybe... but I thought the exact opposite partly cost us the Nevada game. I thought Mick clearly had a great gameplan that centered around making them run offense, score in the half court and make tough shots. I thought our offensive gameplan was a concerted effort to get the ball to the rim through post passes and driving. We got up big and we started playing fast and jacking up bad shots and Mick waited too long to reign them back in. That played to Nevada's strengths which was free flowing, open court basketball.

A better example would be the first half against OSU.
 
11-28-2018 11:38 AM
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Lush Online
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Post: #68
RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 10:52 AM)CallMeSlim Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 09:55 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 09:51 AM)Marcus Wrote:  
(11-27-2018 08:39 PM)RealDeal Wrote:  How in the world does your starting point guard not shoot any free throws until game 7? All you need to know about how little pressure JJ puts on opposing defense

Exactly. We are going nowhere with him running the show. He doesn't create for anyone, never gets into the lane, he simply doesn't do anything you expect your PG to do.

More accurately, he doesn't do EVERYTHING you expect your PG to do. I expect my PG to have a high assist rate...he leads the Bearcats in assist rate. I expect my PG to protect the basketball...he is easily the best on the team at not turning the ball over (his turnover rate is 6.3 half as much as the next best on the team) and one of the best in the country. He's also been really efficient on offense...has the highest kenpom offensive rating on the team this year. He defends well.

People love to look at what Jenifer isn't and seemingly ignore any positive aspect to his game. He's a solid role play for this team and is being used as such.


the high assist rate isn't likely to continue because he relies on guys hitting long jumpers to boost it. he's not penetrating and getting guys easy looks.


his assist rate last year was the lowest for any starting PG we've had since Cash's freshman season.


his assist rate this year has already dropped from sky high after 2 games down to what Cane's was last year.

maybe it's because jarron's the one who initiates the offense?
 
11-28-2018 02:15 PM
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Marcus Offline
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Post: #69
RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 02:15 PM)Lush Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 10:52 AM)CallMeSlim Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 09:55 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 09:51 AM)Marcus Wrote:  
(11-27-2018 08:39 PM)RealDeal Wrote:  How in the world does your starting point guard not shoot any free throws until game 7? All you need to know about how little pressure JJ puts on opposing defense

Exactly. We are going nowhere with him running the show. He doesn't create for anyone, never gets into the lane, he simply doesn't do anything you expect your PG to do.

More accurately, he doesn't do EVERYTHING you expect your PG to do. I expect my PG to have a high assist rate...he leads the Bearcats in assist rate. I expect my PG to protect the basketball...he is easily the best on the team at not turning the ball over (his turnover rate is 6.3 half as much as the next best on the team) and one of the best in the country. He's also been really efficient on offense...has the highest kenpom offensive rating on the team this year. He defends well.

People love to look at what Jenifer isn't and seemingly ignore any positive aspect to his game. He's a solid role play for this team and is being used as such.


the high assist rate isn't likely to continue because he relies on guys hitting long jumpers to boost it. he's not penetrating and getting guys easy looks.


his assist rate last year was the lowest for any starting PG we've had since Cash's freshman season.


his assist rate this year has already dropped from sky high after 2 games down to what Cane's was last year.

maybe it's because jarron's the one who initiates the offense?

Which is even more of a reason to reduce his minutes IMO.
 
11-28-2018 02:19 PM
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bearcatmark Offline
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Post: #70
RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 02:19 PM)Marcus Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 02:15 PM)Lush Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 10:52 AM)CallMeSlim Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 09:55 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 09:51 AM)Marcus Wrote:  Exactly. We are going nowhere with him running the show. He doesn't create for anyone, never gets into the lane, he simply doesn't do anything you expect your PG to do.

More accurately, he doesn't do EVERYTHING you expect your PG to do. I expect my PG to have a high assist rate...he leads the Bearcats in assist rate. I expect my PG to protect the basketball...he is easily the best on the team at not turning the ball over (his turnover rate is 6.3 half as much as the next best on the team) and one of the best in the country. He's also been really efficient on offense...has the highest kenpom offensive rating on the team this year. He defends well.

People love to look at what Jenifer isn't and seemingly ignore any positive aspect to his game. He's a solid role play for this team and is being used as such.


the high assist rate isn't likely to continue because he relies on guys hitting long jumpers to boost it. he's not penetrating and getting guys easy looks.


his assist rate last year was the lowest for any starting PG we've had since Cash's freshman season.


his assist rate this year has already dropped from sky high after 2 games down to what Cane's was last year.

maybe it's because jarron's the one who initiates the offense?

Which is even more of a reason to reduce his minutes IMO.

Reduce to what? He's getting less than 20 minutes a game. His playing time seems reasonable to me.
 
11-28-2018 03:22 PM
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RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
also maybe mick is reluctant to give logan a proper run
 
11-28-2018 03:35 PM
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RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 03:35 PM)Lush Wrote:  also maybe mick is reluctant to give logan a proper run

04-cheers
 
11-28-2018 06:36 PM
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RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
Did not see the game. Visiting the kids out of town. From what I have read we now have 2 legit pro prospects in Scott and Diarra, a Kobe Bryant clone in Williams, and heck even our walk on would start at most MAC schools. Holy crap, Final four here we come! 03-lmfao Amazing what winning against cupcakes year after year will do for morale.
 
11-28-2018 08:40 PM
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UC-nati Offline
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RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 10:40 AM)DownOnRohs Wrote:  The play that got me most excited about Mamoudou? His dunk off the feed from Fredericks. Around the 1:50 mark in the video below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDT2P_xhxTc

How quickly and athletically he elevates from underneath the rim to flush it home. The kind of quickness that is common in the NBA.

Was that fredricks? I thought it was Logan. That, and the way he stepped up and hit that three. Very encouraging. He’s sure got hops. The other play was when Logan got after that loose ball for the lay in. His balance, quickness, and ball handling was amazing.
 
11-28-2018 08:50 PM
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Post: #75
RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 08:50 PM)UC-nati Wrote:  
(11-28-2018 10:40 AM)DownOnRohs Wrote:  The play that got me most excited about Mamoudou? His dunk off the feed from Fredericks. Around the 1:50 mark in the video below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDT2P_xhxTc

How quickly and athletically he elevates from underneath the rim to flush it home. The kind of quickness that is common in the NBA.

Was that fredricks? I thought it was Logan. That, and the way he stepped up and hit that three. Very encouraging. He’s sure got hops. The other play was when Logan got after that loose ball for the lay in. His balance, quickness, and ball handling was amazing.

Logan went off the backboard to him. The one I was referencing was when Fredericks found him in the paint and Mamadou rose up and flushed it in traffic like it was nothing.
 
11-28-2018 10:10 PM
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RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
He’s a Mamadou, not a Mamadon’t
 
11-28-2018 11:46 PM
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Cataclysmo Offline
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RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-28-2018 08:40 PM)rtaylor Wrote:  Did not see the game. Visiting the kids out of town. From what I have read we now have 2 legit pro prospects in Scott and Diarra, a Kobe Bryant clone in Williams, and heck even our walk on would start at most MAC schools. Holy crap, Final four here we come! 03-lmfao Amazing what winning against cupcakes year after year will do for morale.

I said Keith seems to shoot better when he's not spotting up, similar to Kobe Bryant. It's an analogy, my guy. God forbid this board turn optimistic for a change...
 
11-28-2018 11:56 PM
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RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
Also, Sam Martin could reasonably start a lower end Mac school. He's really good. And I wouldn't rule out him contributing at UC before it's all said and done.
 
11-28-2018 11:56 PM
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RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
FWIW on Sam Martin Cronin said he was good enough to start DII. I remember last year that he said that he was probably a walk on who would be able to play as an upper classman. He also said that he's going to redshirt next year since he'll be studying abroad as part of the Lindner Honors program.
 
11-29-2018 07:09 AM
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RE: UC vs Arkansas Pine-Bluff Game Thread
(11-29-2018 07:09 AM)RealDeal Wrote:  FWIW on Sam Martin Cronin said he was good enough to start DII. I remember last year that he said that he was probably a walk on who would be able to play as an upper classman. He also said that he's going to redshirt next year since he'll be studying abroad as part of the Lindner Honors program.

I heard the same interview. I think people sometimes overestimate certain guys ability to play at the D1 level. I don't think he has the size or quickness to play a ton at anything but D2 schools or low level D1 schools. I remember my high school was pretty loaded with players when I was there. We had a big guy go to UD, had a big guy go to Miami (OH). However, the unquestioned best player (who was on varsity since he was a freshman) at my school ended up at NKU. Just didn't have the quickness or athleticism for major D1 ball, but the guy was an absolute force in high school. Great shooter, but just had a knack for scoring in so many different ways. Incredible high school player.
 
11-29-2018 08:23 AM
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