Same rule??? Please explain.

(11-25-2018 12:01 PM)HyperDuke Wrote:  Same rule??? Please explain.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neutral_Zone_Infraction

Search for the Neutral Zone Infraction (defense) row. The terminology in the rule book isn't so straightforward, but the gist is the same.

All I know is that rule isn’t applied the same in the NCAA/HS vs what people expect based on NFL application. Plenty of scenarios where defensive lineman jump offsides and make it back pre-snap with no flag.

Also...regarding the second targeting:

Quote:Defenseless Player
ARTICLE 14. A defenseless player is one who because of his physical
position and focus of concentration is especially vulnerable to injury. When
in question, a player is defenseless. Examples of defenseless players include but
are not limited to:
a. A player in the act of or just after throwing a pass.
b. A receiver attempting to catch a forward pass or in position to receive a
backward pass, or one who has completed a catch and has not had time
to protect himself or has not clearly become a ball carrier.
c. A kicker in the act of or just after kicking a ball, or during the kick or the
return.
d. A kick returner attempting to catch or recover a kick, or one who has
completed a catch or recovery and has not had time to protect himself or
has not clearly become a ball carrier..
e. A player on the ground.
f. A player obviously out of the play.
g. A player who receives a blind-side block.
h. A ball carrier already in the grasp of an opponent and whose forward
progress has been stopped.
i. A quarterback any time after a change of possession.
j. A ball carrier who has obviously given himself up and is sliding feet-first.

Dinucci had his knees on the ground being held motionless by two defenders before being contacted to the helmet by #4. By the rules, he was defenseless and targeted to the helmet.

Yeah that was targeting fo sho.

(11-25-2018 12:29 PM)HyperDuke Wrote:  All I know is that rule isn’t applied the same in the NCAA/HS vs what people expect based on NFL application. Plenty of scenarios where defensive lineman jump offsides and make it back pre-snap with no flag.

Back to my WWE analogy; this is because the NFL decides what penalties it feels like emphasizing in any given year. (make it up as you go basically)

This year, they have decided they don't want as many free plays and have made it a point to blow plays dead pre-snap on both offense and defensive fouls. Watch any Packers game and you'll hear about it for 20 minutes after Rogers throws his hands up for the third time on what used to be a free play for him.

(11-25-2018 12:24 AM)Potomac Wrote:  

(11-24-2018 03:35 PM)Purple Wrote:  CAA representing well today. Towson, Elon, and Stony Brook all leading in their games.

Lol this post didn’t age well...

It was 100% true when I posted it. All 3 CAA teams were leading, per ESPN.

(11-25-2018 11:57 AM)DooX Wrote:  

(11-25-2018 10:00 AM)Duke Dawg Wrote:  Did anyone but me notice Riley didn’t come out as a starter in the 2nd half?

We went with dean, brown and Eldridge as the 3 wr’s.

He didn’t enter until dean limped off.

Did notice that. He caught a little out route and came up limping a bit. He waved for another guy to come in. But he did play later, so hopefully nothing serious.

Riley appeared to ding something in his hammy or his knee early in the game. He was rubbing the area a good deal and either went back to the locker room or to a trainer’s table way to my right during the first half. I didn’t notice the limp in the second half, but he was definitely bothered in the first.

(11-25-2018 12:35 PM)jmufan2008 Wrote:  Also...regarding the second targeting:

Quote:Defenseless Player
ARTICLE 14. A defenseless player is one who because of his physical
position and focus of concentration is especially vulnerable to injury. When
in question, a player is defenseless. Examples of defenseless players include but
are not limited to:
a. A player in the act of or just after throwing a pass.
b. A receiver attempting to catch a forward pass or in position to receive a
backward pass, or one who has completed a catch and has not had time
to protect himself or has not clearly become a ball carrier.
c. A kicker in the act of or just after kicking a ball, or during the kick or the
return.
d. A kick returner attempting to catch or recover a kick, or one who has
completed a catch or recovery and has not had time to protect himself or
has not clearly become a ball carrier..
e. A player on the ground.
f. A player obviously out of the play.
g. A player who receives a blind-side block.
h. A ball carrier already in the grasp of an opponent and whose forward
progress has been stopped.
i. A quarterback any time after a change of possession.
j. A ball carrier who has obviously given himself up and is sliding feet-first.

Dinucci had his knees on the ground being held motionless by two defenders before being contacted to the helmet by #4. By the rules, he was defenseless and targeted to the helmet.

He was in the grasp but he was also falling forward. If a player is falling forward his forward progress hasn't been stopped.

His knees were on the ground. Falling forward or not, he was defenseless and the shot he took was to the head and neck area. Why do you think his mouthpiece went flying out?

UD was trying to put our QB out of the game and used two illegal hits to do so. I applaud the officials for putting a stop to it early.

(11-25-2018 08:28 PM)JMUNation Wrote:  His knees were on the ground. Falling forward or not, he was defenseless and the shot he took was to the head and neck area. Why do you think his mouthpiece went flying out?

UD was trying to put our QB out of the game and used two illegal hits to do so. I applaud the officials for putting a stop to it early.

Yep, after those two penalties, that nonsense stopped. Regardless of how you interpret rules, they weren't just trying to stop him, they were going for the knockout. Maybe Nova did something similar when they took out 3 of UD's QBs the week prior, so they thought they could get away with it.

(11-25-2018 08:28 PM)JMUNation Wrote:  His knees were on the ground. Falling forward or not, he was defenseless and the shot he took was to the head and neck area. Why do you think his mouthpiece went flying out?

UD was trying to put our QB out of the game and used two illegal hits to do so.

That's what I thought too. Filthy bastards! I kept thinking about Rodney Landers against Montana in 2008. Montana was the dirtiest team I have ever seen.

(11-25-2018 10:20 PM)JMURocks Wrote:  

(11-25-2018 08:28 PM)JMUNation Wrote:  His knees were on the ground. Falling forward or not, he was defenseless and the shot he took was to the head and neck area. Why do you think his mouthpiece went flying out?

UD was trying to put our QB out of the game and used two illegal hits to do so. I applaud the officials for putting a stop to it early.

Yep, after those two penalties, that nonsense stopped. Regardless of how you interpret rules, they weren't just trying to stop him, they were going for the knockout. Maybe Nova did something similar when they took out 3 of UD's QBs the week prior, so they thought they could get away with it.

And the officials were correct on the 2nd one after reviewing it, saying it was not targeting.

If the roles had been reversed, Kehoe scrambling,...nevermind, that statue couldn't scramble..

If it had been an opposing QB, and a JMU LB did the exact same hit (as the 2nd one), and was ejected for targeting, almost everyone on here would have been going apeshit that it was a BS call...

(11-26-2018 01:31 AM)BDKJMU Wrote:  

(11-25-2018 10:20 PM)JMURocks Wrote:  

(11-25-2018 08:28 PM)JMUNation Wrote:  His knees were on the ground. Falling forward or not, he was defenseless and the shot he took was to the head and neck area. Why do you think his mouthpiece went flying out?

UD was trying to put our QB out of the game and used two illegal hits to do so. I applaud the officials for putting a stop to it early.

Yep, after those two penalties, that nonsense stopped. Regardless of how you interpret rules, they weren't just trying to stop him, they were going for the knockout. Maybe Nova did something similar when they took out 3 of UD's QBs the week prior, so they thought they could get away with it.

And the officials were correct on the 2nd one after reviewing it, saying it was not targeting.

If the roles had been reversed, Kehoe scrambling,...nevermind, that statue couldn't scramble..

If it had been an opposing QB, and a JMU LB did the exact same hit (as the 2nd one), and was ejected for targeting, almost everyone on here would have been going apeshit that it was a BS call...

I agree the second hit could be interpreted as not targeting. It was definitely unnecessary roughness. The players saving grace was that he led with his shoulder.

(11-26-2018 08:41 AM)JMUNation Wrote:  

(11-26-2018 01:31 AM)BDKJMU Wrote:  

(11-25-2018 10:20 PM)JMURocks Wrote:  

(11-25-2018 08:28 PM)JMUNation Wrote:  His knees were on the ground. Falling forward or not, he was defenseless and the shot he took was to the head and neck area. Why do you think his mouthpiece went flying out?

UD was trying to put our QB out of the game and used two illegal hits to do so. I applaud the officials for putting a stop to it early.

Yep, after those two penalties, that nonsense stopped. Regardless of how you interpret rules, they weren't just trying to stop him, they were going for the knockout. Maybe Nova did something similar when they took out 3 of UD's QBs the week prior, so they thought they could get away with it.

And the officials were correct on the 2nd one after reviewing it, saying it was not targeting.

If the roles had been reversed, Kehoe scrambling,...nevermind, that statue couldn't scramble..

If it had been an opposing QB, and a JMU LB did the exact same hit (as the 2nd one), and was ejected for targeting, almost everyone on here would have been going apeshit that it was a BS call...

I agree the second hit could be interpreted as not targeting. It was definitely unnecessary roughness. The players saving grace was that he led with his shoulder.

By the rule, he wasn't defensiveness because he had forward momentum, so you can't just disregard that fact. Your argument appears to be that they should have tackled him easier or allowed him the extra yard falling forward, instead of tackling within the rules of the game. His 'saving grace' as you say, is exactly how tackling is taught, in football and rugby (the best examples of fundamental tackling).

(11-24-2018 06:49 PM)84Breeze Wrote:  This game sort of reminded me of the national championship game vs. Youngstown. Early on it was clear they couldn’t hang with us so we dialed things back. We definitely have another gear or 2 on offense that we will need moving forward. Survive and advance. Go Dukes!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I 'thought' the YSU game dial back was due to two key defensive injuries in the first half and an attempt to keep our defensive off the field for as long as possible. I'm beginning to think that was his Houston's first showing of dialing it back when ahead in games that it appears that JMU will win by 2 possessions. As others have pointed out, it reminds me of MM's play not to lose mentality.

(11-26-2018 09:41 AM)DoubleDogDare Wrote:  

(11-26-2018 08:41 AM)JMUNation Wrote:  

(11-26-2018 01:31 AM)BDKJMU Wrote:  

(11-25-2018 10:20 PM)JMURocks Wrote:  

(11-25-2018 08:28 PM)JMUNation Wrote:  His knees were on the ground. Falling forward or not, he was defenseless and the shot he took was to the head and neck area. Why do you think his mouthpiece went flying out?

UD was trying to put our QB out of the game and used two illegal hits to do so. I applaud the officials for putting a stop to it early.

Yep, after those two penalties, that nonsense stopped. Regardless of how you interpret rules, they weren't just trying to stop him, they were going for the knockout. Maybe Nova did something similar when they took out 3 of UD's QBs the week prior, so they thought they could get away with it.

And the officials were correct on the 2nd one after reviewing it, saying it was not targeting.

If the roles had been reversed, Kehoe scrambling,...nevermind, that statue couldn't scramble..

If it had been an opposing QB, and a JMU LB did the exact same hit (as the 2nd one), and was ejected for targeting, almost everyone on here would have been going apeshit that it was a BS call...

I agree the second hit could be interpreted as not targeting. It was definitely unnecessary roughness. The players saving grace was that he led with his shoulder.

By the rule, he wasn't defensiveness because he had forward momentum, so you can't just disregard that fact. Your argument appears to be that they should have tackled him easier or allowed him the extra yard falling forward, instead of tackling within the rules of the game. His 'saving grace' as you say, is exactly how tackling is taught, in football and rugby (the best examples of fundamental tackling).

Both knees were on the ground. If he falls forward, he does not gain any additional yardage. You are implying that he was still able to gain additional yardage.

Article from the local UD beatwriter on the game Sat:
https://www.delawareonline.com/story/spo...104869002/

FWIW UD fired their OC yesterday:
https://www.delawareonline.com/story/spo...127696002/

Maybe they'll promote Alex Wood to OC..