I have to agree we lost our identity since Keatts left. There are ways to win at the mid major level without the press. It doesn’t matter where you are, you usually go into rebuilding mode when you change philosophies as much as we have. And here we are.

Some coaches are the exception to the rule and can come in with immediate impact like Keatts did. They usually have quick stays before being pulled to bigger programs. I’m not giving up on CB by any means but this is what Bass signed up for when we made the hire. We purposelessly gave up on our brand. In-house assistant (Siddle) or another pressing style strong recruiter would have limited the change and, in my opinion, the risk.

That’s water under the bridge now. C.B has some good players and one of the top three players to ever wear a UNCW jersey. It wasn’t that we lost by 20 in this one. It was how we looked losing by 20. I don’t know that it was effort honestly. Hopefully it’s just players needing to gel and the rotation shortened. There is time. We have got to show significant progress this year.

The folks postings honest takes on this board aren’t our programs enemy if done in a tasteful way. We’re the ones who care enough to follow and post. What I’d be worried about is the fan base we’re trying to build/hang onto and the students. Apathy can set in easily with these folks with displays like this.

(11-13-2018 09:11 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  I’m not in favor of all the subs we tend to pour into games and drastically changing the rotations.

This is why I asked last game if McGrath truly cared about non conference games or if he used them as a time for experimentation to fine tune things for conference play

These 3 losses have been tough, but they have been against quality opponents. We started this way last year and finished the year playing our best basketball. Maybe next year McGrath should schedule the likes of such regional foes as Longwood, NC A&T, Presbyterian, Western Carolina, etc to pad the win loss record.

With that being said if we don’t win 2 out of 3 in the Battle in the Blue Ridge then our lack of progress will become concerning. The first couple of games of the year I can give a pass on, but by your fifth game you have to show improvement in year 2.

I counted at least 4 threes that UNCG made last night where they were contested. Not much you can do about that but tip your hat to the opponent.

That's not to excuse the overall play from last night, which had far too many turnovers and missed defensive assignments. This should have been a much closer game, especially when we made our run to cut it to 3. And additionally considering that Cacok avoided foul trouble.

If Sims can develop over the course of the season we'll be in much better shape. He has that length you look for and what we've seen out of our last two opponents. But he's just raw at the moment.

Toews didn't play like Toews last night either. Some credit to the defense there and certainly understanding that Toews is just a freshman. But I didn't see many efforts by him to break down the defense until we were well into the 2nd half. We'll be at our best on offense when he's got the ball in his hands and is making things happen. Hopefully he gets back to that quickly and gains confidence.

I don't fully agree with the substitution complaints. It's not that we don't care about non-conference games by doing this. But we also need to see what we have. You can't shorten your bench to 8-9 this early in the campaign, especially when we have several new faces. I get that certain lineups build "momentum" but you also have to be able to count on your "B" lineup to not completely fall apart, either. If they keep doing that, then you re-calibrate. But this early? I don't agree there.

I agree with 2010 and 08 in the two posts above. Also, Ty Taylor is in some kind of shooting funk. I'm hoping a few days off will do him some good. The next 5 games are all winnable. I think 4-1 is a reasonable expectation and a chance to turn the tide a bit on the season. We're gonna have our work cut out for us in December so we need to gain some confidence.

I tend to agree it’s too soon to cut the rotation drastically. I’m optimistic that when it is cut around the beginning of conference play that we will be better because of it.

I think Toews played extremely scared last night. That 8 turnover game made him tighten up imo.

(11-14-2018 10:10 AM)getmhawks Wrote:  I tend to agree it’s too soon to cut the rotation drastically. I’m optimistic that when it is cut around the beginning of conference play that we will be better because of it.

I think Toews played extremely scared last night. That 8 turnover game made him tighten up imo.

I'm definitely not saying to cut the rotation. I am saying make better decisions on when to sub. We need to keep a broad rotation now but quit subbing when we have a momentum going.

(11-14-2018 10:23 AM)surfsalot Wrote:  

(11-14-2018 10:10 AM)getmhawks Wrote:  I tend to agree it’s too soon to cut the rotation drastically. I’m optimistic that when it is cut around the beginning of conference play that we will be better because of it.

I think Toews played extremely scared last night. That 8 turnover game made him tighten up imo.

I'm definitely not saying to cut the rotation. I am saying make better decisions on when to sub. We need to keep a broad rotation now but quit subbing when we have a momentum going.

IMO Cacok, Taylor, and Fornes need to be on the court the most. Obviously, fouls can be a factor in this but those 3 guys are our best weapons. Cacok needs to play as much as possible. Taylor and Fornes need to be allowed to get in a rhythm. Other than that Cylla, O'Connell, Gasden, Toews, Estime, and Sims can all fight for the other minutes.

At a certain point, losing becomes contagious. If we keep playing for wins in the future, the future never comes as confidence is eroded and players begin to question themselves and the coaches. You can also lose a fan base who shows up to support the team, but walks away witnesssing another humiliating loss. Nobody is going to hop in their car and drive for that or spend their money.

Somtimes you just need the W more than experience for inexperienced players. Not saying you cut the rotation every game yet, but when you've got an opportunity in this midst of a run to take a lead or get some distance with your lead, keep the pedal to the floor with the players on the floor. Try to get the W. You can always pick up playing time at a later date against a lesser opponent.

IMO, Fornes and Cacok should never be on the bench together. And I still think Cyalla should come off the bench behind O'Connell.

I've been around here longer than I care to admit. And I tend to not have a season at a time memory. Without going too far back for most to not know, I remember that both Wainright and Brownell had starts like this by experimenting early on with players. Especially with so many new faces like we have this year. And, with Florence putting us behind the eight ball, I'm hoping this is exactly what McGrath is doing. We are not good enough for an at large bid this year, so preparation for conference play should be the goal. I expect the bench to shrink by the time we enter CAA play. On top of that, we need to improve on shooting and especially protect the ball much better.
On another note, how about Cacok's ft % being lights out?

I concur with 33. March is/should be our major concern. I hope no one here was operating under the delusion that this was/is a 20+ win team and would be deserving of an at large bid. Our goal should be to peak the first weekend in March.
As for Devontae's free throw shooting - come on 33 don't put the hex on him!

Sent from my SM-G955U using CSNbbs mobile app

(11-14-2018 10:23 AM)surfsalot Wrote:  I'm definitely not saying to cut the rotation. I am saying make better decisions on when to sub. We need to keep a broad rotation now but quit subbing when we have a momentum going.

How do you suggest we do that then? Wait until the other team starts to go on a run to bring in the "B" lineup, and potentially fall behind even further?

Not sure what exactly you guys want from C.B. in that respect. Since we're using 10-11 guys for now there's not really going to be an ideal time to make subs.

UNCG is a very good team,balanced and experienced. UNCW has a freshman playing point and it is what you would expect. The amount of unforced turnovers is what cost the game. I think UNCG beats the Seahawks 99 times out of 100. Pressing a team like this would be a total joke,they are simply way better at the ball spots and it would be a dunk contest very quickly. For those that love Keats go to Raleigh and watch them play and in the meantime STFU.

Looking through the UNCG and noticed that former UNCW assistant Andre Gray is in his first year with UNCG after the coaching change at Charlotte.

(11-14-2018 06:36 PM)jumpinmullet Wrote:  UNCG is a very good team,balanced and experienced. UNCW has a freshman playing point and it is what you would expect. The amount of unforced turnovers is what cost the game. I think UNCG beats the Seahawks 99 times out of 100. Pressing a team like this would be a total joke,they are simply way better at the ball spots and it would be a dunk contest very quickly. For those that love Keats go to Raleigh and watch them play and in the meantime STFU.

I'm suddenly wondering what weird dimension of time and space I've crossed into where I'm in agreement with Mullet on the current state of UNCW basketball.

Look, we've played some strong teams early on. Like he said, we have a true freshman running the point (and aside from a high turnover rate AS A TEAM), he's not bad. He's better than what we had last year when Talley was on the bench. It's going to be a season of growing pains. That's the truth of it. I think we'll compete well with other teams in the CAA. We just have to maintain focus through our out of conference schedule. This team will be fine come March, IMO.

(11-14-2018 08:04 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  

(11-14-2018 06:36 PM)jumpinmullet Wrote:  UNCG is a very good team,balanced and experienced. UNCW has a freshman playing point and it is what you would expect. The amount of unforced turnovers is what cost the game. I think UNCG beats the Seahawks 99 times out of 100. Pressing a team like this would be a total joke,they are simply way better at the ball spots and it would be a dunk contest very quickly. For those that love Keats go to Raleigh and watch them play and in the meantime STFU.

I'm suddenly wondering what weird dimension of time and space I've crossed into where I'm in agreement with Mullet on the current state of UNCW basketball.

Look, we've played some strong teams early on. Like he said, we have a true freshman running the point (and aside from a high turnover rate AS A TEAM), he's not bad. He's better than what we had last year when Talley was on the bench. It's going to be a season of growing pains. That's the truth of it. I think we'll compete well with other teams in the CAA. We just have to maintain focus through our out of conference schedule. This team will be fine come March, IMO.

If you're in agreement that we should expect to lose to UNCG 99 out of 100 times, please feel free to count me out of that expectation. It means we suck and that we should suck. I want no part of that mentality or expectation of this program. Mullet has proven he knows absolutley nothing about basketball. I have no clue why anyone listens to a word he says. But you're welcome to join him in low expectations for UNCW as he's always had.

It makes people mad that the G has traditionally been worse than the Dub, but is currently better this year. The Dub gets their coach stolen 2x and then goes way downward. That's the frustration.

I'll just add this...that 1-2-2 press for the G looked freaking GREAT! Why not just do something like that? I like it a lot and better than what Keatts did because it doesn't sell the whole floor out. If the G can do it, the Dub should at least entertain it.

It could be that the PG is killing us. Heck, Talley was going for like 15 to 20 so that's buckets right there and he wasn't turning it over. As a freshman, he was also good but not as good as a senior. Hopefully Toews or somebody can step the heck up because UNCW has always at least been competitive. Last night sucked.

(11-14-2018 08:21 PM)82hawk Wrote:  

(11-14-2018 08:04 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  

(11-14-2018 06:36 PM)jumpinmullet Wrote:  UNCG is a very good team,balanced and experienced. UNCW has a freshman playing point and it is what you would expect. The amount of unforced turnovers is what cost the game. I think UNCG beats the Seahawks 99 times out of 100. Pressing a team like this would be a total joke,they are simply way better at the ball spots and it would be a dunk contest very quickly. For those that love Keats go to Raleigh and watch them play and in the meantime STFU.

I'm suddenly wondering what weird dimension of time and space I've crossed into where I'm in agreement with Mullet on the current state of UNCW basketball.

Look, we've played some strong teams early on. Like he said, we have a true freshman running the point (and aside from a high turnover rate AS A TEAM), he's not bad. He's better than what we had last year when Talley was on the bench. It's going to be a season of growing pains. That's the truth of it. I think we'll compete well with other teams in the CAA. We just have to maintain focus through our out of conference schedule. This team will be fine come March, IMO.

If you're in agreement that we should expect to lose to UNCG 99 out of 100 times, please feel free to count me out of that expectation. It means we suck and that we should suck. I want no part of that mentality or expectation of this program. Mullet has proven he knows absolutley nothing about basketball. I have no clue why anyone listens to a word he says. But you're welcome to join him in low expectations for UNCW as he's always had.

You're discounting the facts here, IMO. The fact that UNCG is CURRENTLY a more experienced and athletic group who are expected to win their league. We are a very young squad and we are not EXPECTED to compete for a title. That's two programs in very different situations. Do I expect our guys to lose? No. Do I expect them to not compete? No. Do I expect them to just mail in the season? No. However, I'm a realist and I'm not going to lose my mind because they lost to teams that are better. That's where I was agreeing with Mullet. You read one sentence of my response up there and didn't bother reading the rest, apparently. I agreed with Mullet's take of the UNCG game, but I still firmly stated that I expect this team to get it together in conference and by the end of the season when it counts.

(11-14-2018 08:59 PM)billthebighawksfan Wrote:  It makes people mad that the G has traditionally been worse than the Dub, but is currently better this year. The Dub gets their coach stolen 2x and then goes way downward. That's the frustration.

I'll just add this...that 1-2-2 press for the G looked freaking GREAT! Why not just do something like that? I like it a lot and better than what Keatts did because it doesn't sell the whole floor out. If the G can do it, the Dub should at least entertain it.

It could be that the PG is killing us. Heck, Talley was going for like 15 to 20 so that's buckets right there and he wasn't turning it over. As a freshman, he was also good but not as good as a senior. Hopefully Toews or somebody can step the heck up because UNCW has always at least been competitive. Last night sucked.

Bill, I agree on the 1-2-2 press that UNCG employed and I'm with you on our guys testing it, with the caveat that I think the only times we could reasonably expect it to work is with Cacok on the floor as our big in that zone scheme. He's the only big on our roster that I would expect to get down the floor quick enough to prevent a dunk-a-thon from the opposition. O'Connell just doesn't strike me as having that quickness and conditioning. That's a result of us losing that pressing defense identity when we moved out of the Keatts era. We did play the Box-1 zone a few times last night and it seemed moderately effective. I'd like to see more of that in conference play. Things like that were some of the "positives" I saw from the game last night. I'm not a coach though, nor ever claim to be. My basketball IQ is strictly from playing and learning, not from a coaching stand point.

As of this morning UNCW is #315 out of the 351 DI Schools in Assist to turnover Ratio, at .65

Pretty hard to win when you are doing that.