I have a very bad feeling... I think the great American experiment is going to come to an end. Anyone else worried?

no

(11-08-2018 10:27 PM)No Bull Wrote:  I have a very bad feeling... I think the great American experiment is going to come to an end. Anyone else worried?

The military is very patriotic. They won't support a coup.

One thing is clear. Florida, Arizona and California don't have a clue on how to do elections. Georgia is pretty bad also.

(11-08-2018 10:27 PM)No Bull Wrote:  I have a very bad feeling... I think the great American experiment is going to come to an end. Anyone else worried?

Please define “the great American experiment”.

“Worried” about ... what, exactly?

(11-08-2018 10:27 PM)No Bull Wrote:  I have a very bad feeling... I think the great American experiment is going to come to an end. Anyone else worried?

Yes, very much. I sincerely believe that I may see the end of the USA in my lifetime.

If this country didn't end in the 60s, it won't end now

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using CSNbbs mobile app

I do think at some point the country will split apart. Probably more likely from a national debt hyperinflation crisis than civil war. We dont share a common culture anymore. The left thinks America and American values are racist and evil.

(11-09-2018 08:57 AM)Jugnaut Wrote:  I do think at some point the country will split apart. Probably more likely from a national debt hyperinflation crisis than civil war. We dont share a common culture anymore. The left thinks America and American values are racist and evil.

This.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

(11-09-2018 08:57 AM)Jugnaut Wrote:  I do think at some point the country will split apart. Probably more likely from a national debt hyperinflation crisis than civil war. We don't share a common culture anymore. The left thinks America and American values are racist and evil.

The one thing I still cannot wrap my head around when looking at blue vs red is the general disconnect between "helping your fellow man" and "carrying your fellow man"

Not to over simplify this, but your basic Republican ideal is that people can and should take care of themselves and most who can do that simple thing, will also care about the greater good and help someone / anyone who needs help.

The basic Democrat ideal is that people are "helpless" forever and that everyone else should carry the water for those people indefinitely, to the point that those who do almost nothing should be able to live up to the same standard of living as those who do everything to earn it.


It is very frustrating to me that one party supports and encourages lazy freeloader behavior and demonizes people who want to work hard and celebrate the fruits of their labor. I am all for helping a person in need as most are, but it should not be a lifetime commitment.

(11-08-2018 10:27 PM)No Bull Wrote:  I have a very bad feeling... I think the great American experiment is going to come to an end. Anyone else worried?

No.

Communist sympathizers nearly winning state wide elections along with the popularity of Bernie Sanders does have me worried. The lack of education along with those given a loud voice in the MSM to overwhelm the low information voter with socialist propaganda is a recipe for disaster. DJT just slowed the decent down some, that is all.

(11-09-2018 08:46 AM)fsquid Wrote:  If this country didn't end in the 60s, it won't end now

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using CSNbbs mobile app

You didn't have the ability to disseminate information nor coordinate far flung compatriots in the 1960's that you do today.

(11-08-2018 10:27 PM)No Bull Wrote:  I have a very bad feeling... I think the great American experiment is going to come to an end. Anyone else worried?

I think we have two Americas that are so divided over fundamental issues that I don't see how they can be reconciled. The divisions are pretty much geographic--the coasts versus flyover country. I am really starting to believe that both would be better off with a peaceful divorce.

(11-08-2018 11:30 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(11-08-2018 10:27 PM)No Bull Wrote:  I have a very bad feeling... I think the great American experiment is going to come to an end. Anyone else worried?

Please define “the great American experiment”.

It's a reference to writings by Alexis de Tocqueville. While Tocqueville never used the exact phrase, the concept of such flowed through much of his writings. At this point in history no one had tried a democratic system like America. It was unknown if it would survive or function at all.

In his nook "De la démocratie en Amérique" (Democracy in America) he stated:

(translated)

Quote:In that land the great experiment was to be made, by civilized man, of the attempt to construct society upon a new basis; and it was there, for the first time, that theories hitherto unknown, or deemed impracticable, were to exhibit a spectacle for which the world had not been prepared by the history of the past.

(original)

Quote:C'est là que les hommes civilisés devaient essayer de bâtir la société sur des fondements nouveaux, et qu'appliquant pour la première fois des théories jusqu'alors inconnues ou réputées inapplicables, ils allaient donner au monde un spectacle auquel l'histoire du passé ne l'avait pas préparé.

I think Tocqueville should be required reading in schools... but seeing as how we've stopped teaching Civics... i dont see that happening ever.

Some other fantastic comments by Tocqueville from his works in the 1830s:

Quote:We can state with conviction, therefore, that a man's support for absolute government is in direct proportion to the contempt he feels for his country.

Quote:Americans are so enamored of equality, they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

Quote:The health of a democratic society may be measured by the quality of functions performed by private citizens.

Quote:The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.

Quote:It's not an endlessly expanding list of rights — the 'right' to education, the 'right' to health care, the 'right' to food and housing. That's not freedom, that's dependency. Those aren't rights, those are the rations of slavery — hay and a barn for human cattle.

Quote:I sought for the greatness and genius of America in her commodious harbors and her ample rivers – and it was not there . . . in her fertile fields and boundless forests and it was not there . . . in her rich mines and her vast world commerce – and it was not there . . . in her democratic Congress and her matchless Constitution – and it was not there. Not until I went into the churches of America and heard her pulpits aflame with righteousness did I understand the secret of her genius and power. America is great because she is good, and if America ever ceases to be good, she will cease to be great.

no sure why this was moved to wild west spin room...

(11-09-2018 08:46 AM)fsquid Wrote:  If this country didn't end in the 60s, it won't end now

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using CSNbbs mobile app

Really? This country is in the mess it is today because we didn't deal with the 60's and the damned 60's criminal radicals like Bernadine Dohrn, Bill Ayers, and their money backers like George Soros, who funded their legal defense way back then. We have allowed those who are willing to do anything to advance their cause including fraud and violence to continue to operate, and way back then when those 60's radicals didn't want to fight they stayed in school to get Masters and Doctorate degrees to avoid the draft, and they stayed because the academia provided them a place to sew their social discord and infect the brains of new generations with their venomous spew and do so at tax payer's expense in the most socialist system they could possibly hide in within a capitalist society, education.

The Viet Nam war and Watergate made our polite society want to sweep things under the rug and pretend they didn't happen. Well the mold grew under that carpet, and McCarthy from the 50's prevented us from calling communists what they were and Watergate from the early 70's kept us from keeping an eye on those within our government who were seeking to undermine our system and just like with a leaky roof and termites our American House is full of rot and destruction sewn by our enemies within because we wanted to pretend that Ozzie and Harriet and Ricky and Lucy still represented what it was to be American.

Our Cuban portion of the family kept warning us what would happen when Castro cleaned out his prisons and sent his worst to Miami. Our Asian portion of the family kept warning us about how our minorities were being radicalized by Maoist philosophy when they saw it emerge in the 60's, and our intelligence community warned of what damage was being done by radicals within the political system, but once Viet Nam was over we wanted to sweep aside the drugs, rebellion, violence, and sin of the 60's and pretend it was 1955 all over again. Only it wasn't.

So now here we sit and our children and grandchildren are being poisoned by the toxic waste dump that is an education system run by the far left. Our streets are filled with a criminal element that the police hate to deal with because liberal judges and over crowded prisons let them back out about as fast as they get locked up and our government under Obama started subsidizing temp organizations to place them and work places to hire them.

We've alternatingly attacked and ignored illicit drugs until the money made off of them has corrupted too many levels of our lives from the beat cops to judges to political organizing groups.

We permitted and encouraged our faith based organizations to pander to the popular culture to placate things we once held anathema until any concept of individual morality is no longer relevant.

Two periods of our country have allowed all of this to be born and then to flourish. The great depression gave rise to birth of the socialist movement and fascist movement with the United States. Demagogues like Huey P. Long represented the opportunists that played upon socialist concepts in politics. The American Bund grew in New England, Pennsylvania, and into the American Northwest. The Klan was at its height of power as a political force during the worst years of the depression, and Roosevelt's new deal was a concerted effort not only to combat the depression itself, but to blunt the socialist forces at work within our Republic by embracing in small measure some of their aims and working them into a governable system of assistance.

What was born in the depression found root in the 60's. In part this happened unobstructed because the 50's glossed over all that was unpleasant with booze and denial, while the fascist organizations pretty much died following WWII leaving the radical left both the cover (social denial & McCarthyism) and the opportunity (Civil rights) to grow. Hoover, much as I couldn't stand him, pointed out the inroads the left was making. But Watergate, like McCarthy before it, was a very public mistake by the right, which gave further shelter to these cancerous elements within our country. The embarrassment of Viet Nam kept criminal proceedings from going against Tom Hayden and Jane Fonda, and the Weather Underground and their backer Soros, and Hayden would up prominent in California politics while Dohrn became a professor in charge of children's justice at the University of Chicago where Ayers trained and directed political Organizers like Barack Obama in the Saul Alinsky tactics of civil unrest.

So Squid, you couldn't be more wrong. The ills we face today are a poison that has so infiltrated our body politic that it has been paralyzed to cleanse itself of it. And we didn't survive the 60's at all. Instead we've let the poison of the 60's do its work for 50 years and do it unchecked because we couldn't admit that as a Republic and as a world leader that we were internally fighting a cancer. After all such an admission during the cold war and since would only weaken our position within the global community.

Egg heads in Washington thought that like FDR did in the 30's if we embraced some of the socialist tenets we could outlive and outproduce it. But thanks to bureaucracy any new program now becomes so entrenched with government workers overseeing it that it is impossible to kill. So the taxpayers are sapped with the share the wealth programs already in place, and the Democratic left panders to them to stay entrenched in power. And that cancer, germinated in the 30's, diagnosed but untreated in the 60's is killing us, and now the option before us is radiation therapy. We either kill the disease, or die trying. But if we do nothing we are dead already.

(11-09-2018 08:46 AM)fsquid Wrote:  If this country didn't end in the 60s, it won't end now

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using CSNbbs mobile app

Now as to solutions:

The modern day ills are the seeds of the Hydra raising up the deaf and dumb warriors of the new age to fight their old struggles of the 60's. Every issue we face today is from the counter culture of the 60's and the worst leaders we've had were students of the 60's radicals.

I see this more like the last howls of demons before exorcism finally drives them from their hosts.

But to put a final end to it we must put a stake through the heart of what public education is teaching. They need to teach as someone said here reading, writing, and arithmetic, and when they teach history and humanities stick to the facts, teach the theories, and let free minds come to their own conclusions. The crap these kids truly believe today is what frightens me. How could we let someone so distort their view of reality?

But all of this stuff is about to be blown away by much larger social issues rooted in environmental changes wrought by overpopulation not the least of which will be an ever increasing water shortage.

When people in the U.S. go to grocery stores and find some shortages of things that were always available before they'll sober up in a damned big hurry when it comes to letting more mouths enter the country when there are less supplies with which to feed them. And I'm not talking beef, chicken, pork, etc, but water, quality fish and seafood, and foods free of contaminants.

And as corporate America buys more and more commercial and private property and renting becomes the main option not of choice by of necessity, the bleeding heart mentality will come to a grinding halt.

People are selfish by nature, and socially reticent to speak their minds for fear of rejection. But necessity being the mother of invention will also be the key point to returning people to voting self interest and self interest says less immigration means better supply of resources and more affordable available space.

The next 10 to 15 years should wipe out most of the 60's radicals, but we need to cut off their nonsensical narcissistic legacy and that means eliminating their crap from public education and starting to turn the tables on the real enemies of freedom, corporate multinationals which feel they owe nothing to citizens or consumers because they are too big and too important to fail.

(06-26-2019 01:44 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(11-09-2018 08:46 AM)fsquid Wrote:  If this country didn't end in the 60s, it won't end now

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using CSNbbs mobile app

Now as to solutions:

The modern day ills are the seeds of the Hydra raising up the deaf and dumb warriors of the new age to fight their old struggles of the 60's. Every issue we face today is from the counter culture of the 60's and the worst leaders we've had were students of the 60's radicals.

I see this more like the last howls of demons before exorcism finally drives them from their hosts.

But to put a final end to it we must put a stake through the heart of what public education is teaching. They need to teach as someone said here reading, writing, and arithmetic, and when they teach history and humanities stick to the facts, teach the theories, and let free minds come to their own conclusions. The crap these kids truly believe today is what frightens me. How could we let someone so distort their view of reality?

But all of this stuff is about to be blown away by much larger social issues rooted in environmental changes wrought by overpopulation not the least of which will be an ever increasing water shortage.

When people in the U.S. go to grocery stores and find some shortages of things that were always available before they'll sober up in a damned big hurry when it comes to letting more mouths enter the country when there are less supplies with which to feed them. And I'm not talking beef, chicken, pork, etc, but water, quality fish and seafood, and foods free of contaminants.

And as corporate America buys more and more commercial and private property and renting becomes the main option not of choice by of necessity, the bleeding heart mentality will come to a grinding halt.

People are selfish by nature, and socially reticent to speak their minds for fear of rejection. But necessity being the mother of invention will also be the key point to returning people to voting self interest and self interest says less immigration means better supply of resources and more affordable available space.

The next 10 to 15 years should wipe out most of the 60's radicals, but we need to cut off their nonsensical narcissistic legacy and that means eliminating their crap from public education and starting to turn the tables on the real enemies of freedom, corporate multinationals which feel they owe nothing to citizens or consumers because they are too big and too important to fail.

We need a competent Republican who can relate to the common man like Richard Nixon (who was definitely not from wealth) or a leader and visionary who can relate like Ronald Reagan to electorally crush the left wing of the Democratic Party and drive them to the center.

Trump is too alienating. He won't destroy them even though he will probably beat them.

Nixon carried every state but Massachusetts. Reagan carried every state but Mondale's Minnesota. Those races discredited the left wing of the Democrats. There really are Democrats who are not alt-left, just not many of them in DC.