(10-01-2018 08:18 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I'm not the one following a party that is trying to discredit the EPA, the FBI, Public Education and other pillars of our society junior.

Re evaluate your life's decisions.

There's your problem. The government bureaucracy is NOT the pillars of our society. The pillars can be found in Declaration of Independence and the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. The pillars include the Puritan work ethic. Those bureacracies are trying to undermine the true pillars.

My daughter had an English assignment reading Emerson and Thoreau. You see where the Democrats get their philosophies of self-indulgence and ignoring the past. They follow not the great thinkers of the Enlightenment who built on the classics, but the lazy, flaky transcendentalists.

(10-01-2018 08:18 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I'm not the one following a party that is trying to discredit the EPA, the FBI, Public Education and other pillars of our society junior.

Re evaluate your life's decisions.

LOL...Mr. insult is at it again...Junior.

Mach, you used to be better than this. Now all you do is make wild claims and insult.

What makes you so sure that these claims against BK are truthful?

(10-01-2018 08:18 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I'm not the one following a party that is trying to discredit the EPA, the FBI, Public Education and other pillars of our society junior.
Re evaluate your life's decisions.

Neither am I. The party to which I believe you are referring doesn't go far enough for me.

EPA did some good work to reduce pollution 40 years ago. And it was needed. But they have evolved into a style bureaucracy more interested in protecting turf and accumulating power than in doing the right thing.

The FBI is an excellent organization that does good work, but its leadership has shown itself to be politically corrupt. I don't think anybody is trying to discredit the FBI, just certain bad apples that have floated to the top.

And Public Education has spent astronomically more money recently, without delivering a better product. We spend more on education than any other country in the world, and we get terrible results. Where have we heard that before? And if that meant we had a "failed" health care system, then this means we have a failed public education system.

So they are doing a pretty good job of discrediting themselves.

(10-01-2018 08:18 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I'm not the one following a party that is trying to discredit the EPA, the FBI, Public Education and other pillars of our society junior.

Re evaluate your life's decisions.

No, you follow a party that DID discredit the EPA, the FBI, public education and other pillars of our society.

Time for some self-reflection on your own life decisions.

(10-01-2018 08:58 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 08:18 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I'm not the one following a party that is trying to discredit the EPA, the FBI, Public Education and other pillars of our society junior.
Re evaluate your life's decisions.

Neither am I. The party to which I believe you are referring doesn't go far enough for me.

EPA did some good work to reduce pollution 40 years ago. And it was needed. But they have evolved into a style bureaucracy more interested in protecting turf and accumulating power than in doing the right thing.

The FBI is an excellent organization that does good work, but its leadership has shown itself to be politically corrupt. I don't think anybody is trying to discredit the FBI, just certain bad apples that have floated to the top.

And Public Education has spent astronomically more money recently, without delivering a better product. We spend more on education than any other country in the world, and we get terrible results. Where have we heard that before? And if that meant we had a "failed" health care system, then this means we have a failed public education system.

So they are doing a pretty good job of discrediting themselves.

I agree with all of this but would just note:
The EPA devolved instead of evolved into a self protecting bureaucracy, like most agencies.

The FBI's leadership issues didn't float to the top, they mostly were appointed to it by the ones appointed as director.

Education was once the provenance of the state there should be no federal education system. It was best when it was controlled locally. It was one of the best in the world when controlled locally where parents had the biggest input.

If we want to stop the ability of a national cadre of apparatchiks from imposing their agenda upon our nation, and we want to help the country shed boondoggle expenses we can kill both at the same time by decentralizing control over things best managed locally.

(10-01-2018 10:41 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 08:58 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 08:18 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I'm not the one following a party that is trying to discredit the EPA, the FBI, Public Education and other pillars of our society junior.
Re evaluate your life's decisions.

Neither am I. The party to which I believe you are referring doesn't go far enough for me.

EPA did some good work to reduce pollution 40 years ago. And it was needed. But they have evolved into a style bureaucracy more interested in protecting turf and accumulating power than in doing the right thing.

The FBI is an excellent organization that does good work, but its leadership has shown itself to be politically corrupt. I don't think anybody is trying to discredit the FBI, just certain bad apples that have floated to the top.

And Public Education has spent astronomically more money recently, without delivering a better product. We spend more on education than any other country in the world, and we get terrible results. Where have we heard that before? And if that meant we had a "failed" health care system, then this means we have a failed public education system.

So they are doing a pretty good job of discrediting themselves.

I agree with all of this but would just note:
The EPA devolved instead of evolved into a self protecting bureaucracy, like most agencies.

The FBI's leadership issues didn't float to the top, they mostly were appointed to it by the ones appointed as director.

Education was once the provenance of the state there should be no federal education system. It was best when it was controlled locally. It was one of the best in the world when controlled locally where parents had the biggest input.

If we want to stop the ability of a national cadre of apparatchiks from imposing their agenda upon our nation, and we want to help the country shed boondoggle expenses we can kill both at the same time by decentralizing control over things best managed locally.

I'd love to see Rick Perry do what he promised and shut down the Department of Energy. And Trump follow up on those ideas and shut down the Department of Education and also the cabinet level VA secretary who, under Obama, presided over the worst service scandals in the VA's history. Mix education with labor. Put VA with HHS. Energy should go back to being part of interior.

(10-01-2018 10:48 AM)bullet Wrote:  I'd love to see Rick Perry do what he promised and shut down the Department of Energy. And Trump follow up on those ideas and shut down the Department of Education and also the cabinet level VA secretary who, under Obama, presided over the worst service scandals in the VA's history. Mix education with labor. Put VA with HHS. Energy should go back to being part of interior.

Department of Energy - Employees - 12,944 federal (2014) - 93,094 contract (2008) Budget - $27.9 billion (2015)

Department of Education - 3912 (2018) - Budget - $68 billion (2016)

(10-01-2018 10:48 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 10:41 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 08:58 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 08:18 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I'm not the one following a party that is trying to discredit the EPA, the FBI, Public Education and other pillars of our society junior.
Re evaluate your life's decisions.

Neither am I. The party to which I believe you are referring doesn't go far enough for me.

EPA did some good work to reduce pollution 40 years ago. And it was needed. But they have evolved into a style bureaucracy more interested in protecting turf and accumulating power than in doing the right thing.

The FBI is an excellent organization that does good work, but its leadership has shown itself to be politically corrupt. I don't think anybody is trying to discredit the FBI, just certain bad apples that have floated to the top.

And Public Education has spent astronomically more money recently, without delivering a better product. We spend more on education than any other country in the world, and we get terrible results. Where have we heard that before? And if that meant we had a "failed" health care system, then this means we have a failed public education system.

So they are doing a pretty good job of discrediting themselves.

I agree with all of this but would just note:
The EPA devolved instead of evolved into a self protecting bureaucracy, like most agencies.

The FBI's leadership issues didn't float to the top, they mostly were appointed to it by the ones appointed as director.

Education was once the provenance of the state there should be no federal education system. It was best when it was controlled locally. It was one of the best in the world when controlled locally where parents had the biggest input.

If we want to stop the ability of a national cadre of apparatchiks from imposing their agenda upon our nation, and we want to help the country shed boondoggle expenses we can kill both at the same time by decentralizing control over things best managed locally.

I'd love to see Rick Perry do what he promised and shut down the Department of Energy. And Trump follow up on those ideas and shut down the Department of Education and also the cabinet level VA secretary who, under Obama, presided over the worst service scandals in the VA's history. Mix education with labor. Put VA with HHS. Energy should go back to being part of interior.

The Federal Government has no business having oversight over education in a free market society. I feel similarly about labor, but see the need for some oversight there.

The VA should be under the DoD. Agree on Energy.

In the meantime, Kavanaugh is lying his ass off directly before Grassley’s Committee.

(10-01-2018 07:43 AM)bullet Wrote:  And Kavanaugh needs to sue people like the one who backed up Ford's story and then retracted.

Link? I think you may be missing some facts to this story if it's the one I'm thinking of.

Thanks.

(10-01-2018 11:35 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  In the meantime, Kavanaugh is lying his ass off directly before Grassley’s Committee.

Based off what?

At this point I don't believe either one. Ford's story has way too many holes. And I find it unlikely that Kavanaugh was the goody-two-shoes he claims to have been in high school. I really don't know why he had to play it that way.

(10-01-2018 01:14 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  At this point I don't believe either one. Ford's story has way too many holes. And I find it unlikely that Kavanaugh was the goody-two-shoes he claims to have been in high school. I really don't know why he had to play it that way.

Clearly, he got his marching orders from the trump camp. I can somewhat understand the anger, but he lost all credibility when he tried to tie this all back to some conspiracy about trump, the 2016 election, and the Clintons. That was just moronic.

(10-01-2018 01:41 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 01:14 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  At this point I don't believe either one. Ford's story has way too many holes. And I find it unlikely that Kavanaugh was the goody-two-shoes he claims to have been in high school. I really don't know why he had to play it that way.

Clearly, he got his marching orders from the trump camp. I can somewhat understand the anger, but he lost all credibility when he tried to tie this all back to some conspiracy about trump, the 2016 election, and the Clintons. That was just moronic.

So it just so happens that, out the millions of lawyers in this country, Dr Ford retains a former Clinton family attorney and the third accuser retains Avenatti?

(10-01-2018 01:45 PM)HuskyU Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 01:41 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 01:14 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  At this point I don't believe either one. Ford's story has way too many holes. And I find it unlikely that Kavanaugh was the goody-two-shoes he claims to have been in high school. I really don't know why he had to play it that way.

Clearly, he got his marching orders from the trump camp. I can somewhat understand the anger, but he lost all credibility when he tried to tie this all back to some conspiracy about trump, the 2016 election, and the Clintons. That was just moronic.

So it just so happens that, out the millions of lawyers in this country, Dr Ford retains a former Clinton family attorney and the third accuser retains Avenatti?

And they all were in a film with Kevin Bacon too!

(10-01-2018 01:41 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 01:14 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  At this point I don't believe either one. Ford's story has way too many holes. And I find it unlikely that Kavanaugh was the goody-two-shoes he claims to have been in high school. I really don't know why he had to play it that way.

Clearly, he got his marching orders from the trump camp. I can somewhat understand the anger, but he lost all credibility when he tried to tie this all back to some conspiracy about trump, the 2016 election, and the Clintons. That was just moronic.

I actually think those tie-ins may have far more merit--and more impact on this issue--than even he suggested. That's "may" not necessarily my opinion. But I think it is in the realm of possibility, and would be entirely consistent with the run of play.

(10-01-2018 11:35 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  In the meantime, Kavanaugh is lying his ass off directly before Grassley’s Committee.

Can to be specific? Please note a specific question, and a specific answer to that question which is 'lying'. Should be easy, since it is so obvious as to warrant such a broad claim. I look forward to a response denoting which question and answer thereof is such a lie.

(10-01-2018 11:33 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 10:48 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 10:41 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 08:58 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(10-01-2018 08:18 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I'm not the one following a party that is trying to discredit the EPA, the FBI, Public Education and other pillars of our society junior.
Re evaluate your life's decisions.

Neither am I. The party to which I believe you are referring doesn't go far enough for me.

EPA did some good work to reduce pollution 40 years ago. And it was needed. But they have evolved into a style bureaucracy more interested in protecting turf and accumulating power than in doing the right thing.

The FBI is an excellent organization that does good work, but its leadership has shown itself to be politically corrupt. I don't think anybody is trying to discredit the FBI, just certain bad apples that have floated to the top.

And Public Education has spent astronomically more money recently, without delivering a better product. We spend more on education than any other country in the world, and we get terrible results. Where have we heard that before? And if that meant we had a "failed" health care system, then this means we have a failed public education system.

So they are doing a pretty good job of discrediting themselves.

I agree with all of this but would just note:
The EPA devolved instead of evolved into a self protecting bureaucracy, like most agencies.

The FBI's leadership issues didn't float to the top, they mostly were appointed to it by the ones appointed as director.

Education was once the provenance of the state there should be no federal education system. It was best when it was controlled locally. It was one of the best in the world when controlled locally where parents had the biggest input.

If we want to stop the ability of a national cadre of apparatchiks from imposing their agenda upon our nation, and we want to help the country shed boondoggle expenses we can kill both at the same time by decentralizing control over things best managed locally.

I'd love to see Rick Perry do what he promised and shut down the Department of Energy. And Trump follow up on those ideas and shut down the Department of Education and also the cabinet level VA secretary who, under Obama, presided over the worst service scandals in the VA's history. Mix education with labor. Put VA with HHS. Energy should go back to being part of interior.

The Federal Government has no business having oversight over education in a free market society. I feel similarly about labor, but see the need for some oversight there.

The VA should be under the DoD. Agree on Energy.

Well they moved it out of DoD because it had low priority in their budgeting. That's why I suggest HHS.

(10-01-2018 01:14 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  At this point I don't believe either one. Ford's story has way too many holes. And I find it unlikely that Kavanaugh was the goody-two-shoes he claims to have been in high school. I really don't know why he had to play it that way.

You are accepting the MSM. How does, I sometimes drank too much and did things in high school that make me cringe, come out to a goody-two-shoes?

The MSM is the one who we all know is lying in the whole situation.