(10-01-2018 09:08 AM)billyjack Wrote:  

(09-30-2018 01:18 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  

(09-30-2018 08:36 AM)solohawks Wrote:  

(09-27-2018 06:18 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  

(09-27-2018 05:09 PM)Poster Wrote:  St. John's and Villanova voted no. It's not clear who the 3rd no vote was, although it's often rumored to be Seton Hall.

I'm pretty sure it was Georgetown.

With that being said, if BC and Cuse would have realized how important having a football conference was they could have threatened to leave, forcing a revote that would have been favorable to Penn St.

Truth be told, in 1982 the should have just blown up the Big East and the Eastern 8 and started from scratch.

I think there was some antagonism already there between BC/Cuse and Penn St.

That's an interesting what if.

If BC and Cuse had said bump this and left the Big East, taking the lead on forming an eastern centric football conference with basketball as a priority what would it have looked like.

I think BC and Cuse woud have invited the Big East Schools that voted yes - UConn, Providence, and let's say Seton Hall. Then they would have gotten Rutgers, Pitt, Temple, and WVU IF Penn State was on board. Let's assume they would have finally worked out the revenue sharing differences and Penn St was a yes. You have:
Penn St
Pitt
Temple
WVU
Rutgers
Syracuse
BC
Seton Hall*
UConn*
Providence*

This 10 team conference with 7 football playing members would have been perfect for the 1980's requirements and would have been a solid Bball league and well. I suspect that St John's and Georgetown would have been invited too after learning the error of their ways, while Villanova feels the other side of the Philly blackball

I like your line of speculation, and I think you are right in that Georgetown and St John's would eventually get to join the league if Penn St was willing to look past their prior transgressions.

I think this group eventually tries recruiting Miami, VT, FSU etc.

Fighting and Solo,
You're assigning way way way too much influence towards Penn State. And way too little understanding of how little the northeast basketball schools ever gave a sh-t about them, then or now. No way would Georgetown or St John's bend a knee to Paterno for the privilege of getting sh-t on by the guy.

Yes, Tranghese said the thing about "rue-ing the day PSU was voted down", but Tranghese (while a good guy) has always been a sad-sack dark-cloud overly-dramatic guy. The PSU down-vote was met by fans back in 1981 or so with indifference or relief.

In the group of 7 schools in your hypothetical football conference, Syracuse is the only team that the northeast hoops schools care about. And Providence, Seton Hall, and UConn aren't joining that PSU-7 group, and trading away Georgetown, Villanova and St John's, just to keep together with Syracuse.

What would've been the motivation for Providence or UConn or Georgetown for example to join a PSU dominated league back then with flights into Happy Valley and Morgantown?

Here's the PSU-7 you proposed for 1979, with nothing located in NYC or DC, and very little or no history with the Big East group:
- Penn St
- Pitt
- Temple
- WVU
- Rutgers
- Syracuse
- BC

Here's the Big East in 1979 without SU and BC:
- Georgetown.
- St John's.
- Villanova.
- Providence.
- UConn.
- Seton Hall.
then:
- St Bonaventure (trade a great program in Syracuse for a good 1970's Bonnies program, get Buffalo market).
- add one of the Boston or Mass schools (trade a program at BC with zero Final Fours and crappy attendance) for another nearby school with similar attendance but good potential... Boston U with Pitino, Northeastern with Jim Calhoun, Holy Cross with a ranked late-70's program and good attendance, or UMass as a 4th option.

- or go balls-out ground-breaking and try to convince Notre Dame, Marquette, DePaul and Dayton to join, and get to 10:

This could've happened (that PSU-7 clump of teams would not have happened):
Big East 10 for 1979:
Georgetown
St John's
Villanova
Providence
Seton Hall
UConn
Marquette
DePaul
Notre Dame
Dayton or a Boston school.

Mike Deane, former HC at Marquette and Siena, always proclaimed (even before Marquette went to the Big East) that, down the road, the successful Catholic basketball schools would band together and create a new conference. He specifically referenced the Catholic schools from the original Big East (Georgetown, Providence, Seton Hall, St. John's and Villanova) as well as the strong Midwestern programs (Dayton, DePaul, Marquette, Saint Louis and Xavier) one day having a non-football conference due to their like-mindedness, as well as their strong commitment to men's basketball. He also spoke on Notre Dame and Boston College being non-football members, while keeping their football independence. Obviously, while his specific prediction did not come true, it is pretty remarkable that he anticipated the non-football schools creating a league of their own (and having a Catholic-school basis).

Conversely, Al McGuire was vehemently opposed to being a part of a Catholic conference. There were simply too many strong independent programs at his time, and there was not a strong desire to make a conference out of all of them.

Maybe Penn St should have announced they were starting a league with Florida St and Miami and then waited to see who was interested in jumping on board.

If those 3 were willing to take them, South Carolina, VT, WVU, Rutgers, and Temple are all locks.

You might get a look from Maryland and/or Clemson.

I guess that point is that if you take away that many of the leading independents BC, Cuse, and Pitt have no one to play and they have to come to the negotiating table.

I still think that PSU knew that Syracuse and BC wouldn't give in to their "requests" Paterno wanted the B10 and to appease the fans floated the idea of an eastern league. IMO he figured he'd make an outrageous demand and see what would happen. Either way it would be win win. They get eastern league and get more $ than the others or they get an excuse to approach the B10 about membership

A “what if” with PSU of that time...if Paterno was never the AD and didn’t annoint Tarman. The world of possibilities...specifically, though...someone holding Paterno’s leash in an era where AD titles had real power, meaning Paterno wouldn’t have much/any.

Another Big East what if....what if Holy Cross took the Boston slot instead of BC. That leaves Syracuse as the only football school. No way does Penn St get in this what if.

Does the conference add schools in 82 like BC and Pitt to try and appease Syracuse or do they completely ignore any school with football and let the chips fall where they may with Syracuse?