Hugh Freeze is available, as a WKU fan though I want dibs on him first....

(09-24-2018 10:13 PM)southsideguy Wrote:  I grew up in El Paso and was a miner fan when i was minor. I remember being Wille Cager in the driveway. I went to many miner games while in high school and there were games that we lost as much as 86-6 (I think it was Utah). I remember Arizona State saying Utep did not belong in the WAC. Utep beat them that year. It is has always been tough to win in El Paso. A few good teams have popped up now and then but they can never seem to keep it going. I think location has a lot to do with. Utep sits on an island in the desert. It is not close to anything.

UTEP is my second favorite team in CUSA. I hate to see them at this point but there is always hope. I am a UNT alumni and a big fan. We at UNT are not that far removed from where UTEP is now.

Keep the faith and give the coach some time to turn it around. You have to have his type of players in his system. He has the left overs from the previous coach and it is like trying to put a square peg in a round hole.

There is only one game I am not cheering for UTEP so hang in there it has to get better.

Oh yeah I had Billy Stevens for a teacher at Magoffin Junior High after his pro football career ended at Green Bay.

It is far from everything. I realized how far Dallas was my first three months of my freshman year. I know as recent as the late 90s, players could only see their parents once or twice a year. Flying was very expensive before the airline deregulation and Greyhound was the only cheap alternative. These days, players can stay in touch via Skype, FaceTime, social media, etc. Flying is not that expensive especially if the player is from Dallas and Houston. What players want is a winning program. UTEP is falling short on that area. Another thing players worry about these days are mundane things like if x school is a Nike or UnderArmour school or if it has nice training facilities and dorms. El Paso is far from perfect but I’ll take it over most of the C-USA, MWC, AAC, Sun Belt and MAC towns I’ve been to. El Paso is a world class, cosmopolitan city compared to P5 towns like Lubbock, Waco and Baton Rouge.

Win and they will come no matter how geographically isolated you are. See Boise State football and Gonzaga basketball.

(09-23-2018 02:37 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  

(09-23-2018 12:59 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  _____________________________________________________

I just wanted to say that's one of the all-time best sig lines you now have there, 12thmonarch. Kudos!

Thanks Good Owl.

What's your biggest threat on offense?

(09-25-2018 02:41 PM)Lizard Breath Wrote:  What's your biggest threat on offense?

Every once in a while, we threaten to score...

There should be more than enough players within the El Paso, San Antonio, Austin, and Houston metroplexes for UTEP to build a good program. If Dimel can recruit, he'll be successful. From what I hear, El Paso is nice, and the Miners are the only game in town.

(09-24-2018 08:42 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  

(09-24-2018 05:42 PM)HogDawg Wrote:  

(09-23-2018 09:44 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  

(09-23-2018 02:53 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  

(09-23-2018 02:47 PM)HogDawg Wrote:  Coaching.

That's it.

UTEP will bounce back as soon as they hire good coaches. Mike Price was successful at UTEP because he was a really good coach. So quit hiring no name guys, and hire one REALLY, GOOD, head football coach to lead that program back. You need no further evidence that this strategy works than to look at the current state of FAU (Kiffin) or UNT (Littrell). Coaches matter.

I complete agree 100%

The issue is not paying enough money. Why go to UTEP when you can coach at another G5 school for more money? I really hope the new President is more enthusiastic to athletics than the one who’s about to retire.

Bullcrap it's hardly ever about how much your first contract is for....

the key part of a first time FBS coach is not the dollar amount. It's the chance to prove yourself and move up to the big dollars. There's only 36 asst coaches in all of FBS making more than $700,000. Being in a club of only 130 head coaches has value to it more than that first contract.

The previous 3 Western coaches started out at $500k and $750k (BP)

Skip Holtz won 9 games 3 out of 4 seasons at Tech making $700k or less

Doc Holliday won 10+ games 3 years in a row and 8 or more in 4 out of 5 making around $700k

Scott Satterfield (Appy) makes under $700k and won 11,10, 9 games in the last 3 seasons

It's about getting the correct coach playing the correct system to a hard to recruit to place. I personally think UTEP needs to be more like those schools that play the triple option....easier to recruit undersize skill players

Do you really think it takes $900k or a million dollars to find a Mason Fine? His offers include UNT and Austin Peay and without Mason Fine UNT is most likely over paying it's head coach. Who btw I believe was recruited by their former coach. At the G5 level its about spotting under value talent and then developing oit and a system to show case the talent.

I have a feeling UTEP is like most G5 Texas schools that still believe they are playing football in the 80s....smash mouth football where you try to line up and run it down the other teams throat to win a 21-14 game. Those type of players it takes to do just that go to the top schools and not many HS football programs play that style.

You're completely ignoring the problem; that UTEP is situated at least 700 miles from the nearest P5 university, and is destined to be a geographic outlier in any conference it decides to join. This means it's going to take more peso's to get a great coach to come to El Paso, vs almost any other FBS school in the country. Hence the big up front money contract.

As G5's go, UTEP already has a big football budget, a great fan base, wonderful athletic facilities, and a friendly local media to help support the program. The ONLY thing missing, is a great football coach. And that's gonna cost 'em.

Explain to me how money will fix UTEP other problems? As far as a great coach that's not happening unless you hire one with baggage that no P5 will touch till they prove they corrected what ever baggage they had. In that case money isn't the most important part of their contract.

I guess you missed the part about needing to pay a new coach a $1M BASE SALARY, plus incentives, to bring in a wide open offensive system.

UTEP doesn't need money for anything else. I thought I did a pretty good job explaining that UTEP already has a big budget, great facilities, etc.....Please try to keep up with the discussion. I hate repeating myself.

(09-25-2018 07:23 AM)stanman505 Wrote:  Having to play THREE freshmen on the offensive line would be hard for any CUSA team.

That's not always the case. Marshall had 3 freshman play over 700 snaps last year and they done just fine. Its about have a coach teach the right block schemes more so than their class ranking. Granted most OL and DL should be in a program a min of 2 years before they start but coaching can overcome that.

(09-25-2018 11:57 PM)HogDawg Wrote:  

(09-24-2018 08:42 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  

(09-24-2018 05:42 PM)HogDawg Wrote:  

(09-23-2018 09:44 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  

(09-23-2018 02:53 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  I complete agree 100%

The issue is not paying enough money. Why go to UTEP when you can coach at another G5 school for more money? I really hope the new President is more enthusiastic to athletics than the one who’s about to retire.

Bullcrap it's hardly ever about how much your first contract is for....

the key part of a first time FBS coach is not the dollar amount. It's the chance to prove yourself and move up to the big dollars. There's only 36 asst coaches in all of FBS making more than $700,000. Being in a club of only 130 head coaches has value to it more than that first contract.

The previous 3 Western coaches started out at $500k and $750k (BP)

Skip Holtz won 9 games 3 out of 4 seasons at Tech making $700k or less

Doc Holliday won 10+ games 3 years in a row and 8 or more in 4 out of 5 making around $700k

Scott Satterfield (Appy) makes under $700k and won 11,10, 9 games in the last 3 seasons

It's about getting the correct coach playing the correct system to a hard to recruit to place. I personally think UTEP needs to be more like those schools that play the triple option....easier to recruit undersize skill players

Do you really think it takes $900k or a million dollars to find a Mason Fine? His offers include UNT and Austin Peay and without Mason Fine UNT is most likely over paying it's head coach. Who btw I believe was recruited by their former coach. At the G5 level its about spotting under value talent and then developing oit and a system to show case the talent.

I have a feeling UTEP is like most G5 Texas schools that still believe they are playing football in the 80s....smash mouth football where you try to line up and run it down the other teams throat to win a 21-14 game. Those type of players it takes to do just that go to the top schools and not many HS football programs play that style.

You're completely ignoring the problem; that UTEP is situated at least 700 miles from the nearest P5 university, and is destined to be a geographic outlier in any conference it decides to join. This means it's going to take more peso's to get a great coach to come to El Paso, vs almost any other FBS school in the country. Hence the big up front money contract.

As G5's go, UTEP already has a big football budget, a great fan base, wonderful athletic facilities, and a friendly local media to help support the program. The ONLY thing missing, is a great football coach. And that's gonna cost 'em.

Explain to me how money will fix UTEP other problems? As far as a great coach that's not happening unless you hire one with baggage that no P5 will touch till they prove they corrected what ever baggage they had. In that case money isn't the most important part of their contract.

I guess you missed the part about needing to pay a new coach a $1M BASE SALARY, plus incentives, to bring in a wide open offensive system.

UTEP doesn't need money for anything else. I thought I did a pretty good job explaining that UTEP already has a big budget, great facilities, etc.....Please try to keep up with the discussion. I hate repeating myself.

That's your opinion but facts dont back it up that you need to pay 1 million to get a coach that plays a wide open system. Getting the right coach is more important and that magic 1 million dollars you bring up. So instead of repeat that bull**** if it only took money there wouldn't be bottom feeders in the P5 or the AAC

UCONN is paying 1 million
ECU is paying 1 milion
SMU is paying 2 million
Tulsa is paying 1.4 million

So stop repeating the bull**** and back up what you say because 1 million is not some magic mark that means you win. If UTEP has all the other things as you say.....

it should be easier getting a good OC to take that job as any other place in CUSA. Hell according to you they have more in place than Tech or Western and it didn't take a million dollars for either of those to get a winning coach

(09-26-2018 09:02 AM)WKUYG Wrote:  

(09-25-2018 11:57 PM)HogDawg Wrote:  

(09-24-2018 08:42 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  

(09-24-2018 05:42 PM)HogDawg Wrote:  

(09-23-2018 09:44 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  Bullcrap it's hardly ever about how much your first contract is for....

the key part of a first time FBS coach is not the dollar amount. It's the chance to prove yourself and move up to the big dollars. There's only 36 asst coaches in all of FBS making more than $700,000. Being in a club of only 130 head coaches has value to it more than that first contract.

The previous 3 Western coaches started out at $500k and $750k (BP)

Skip Holtz won 9 games 3 out of 4 seasons at Tech making $700k or less

Doc Holliday won 10+ games 3 years in a row and 8 or more in 4 out of 5 making around $700k

Scott Satterfield (Appy) makes under $700k and won 11,10, 9 games in the last 3 seasons

It's about getting the correct coach playing the correct system to a hard to recruit to place. I personally think UTEP needs to be more like those schools that play the triple option....easier to recruit undersize skill players

Do you really think it takes $900k or a million dollars to find a Mason Fine? His offers include UNT and Austin Peay and without Mason Fine UNT is most likely over paying it's head coach. Who btw I believe was recruited by their former coach. At the G5 level its about spotting under value talent and then developing oit and a system to show case the talent.

I have a feeling UTEP is like most G5 Texas schools that still believe they are playing football in the 80s....smash mouth football where you try to line up and run it down the other teams throat to win a 21-14 game. Those type of players it takes to do just that go to the top schools and not many HS football programs play that style.

You're completely ignoring the problem; that UTEP is situated at least 700 miles from the nearest P5 university, and is destined to be a geographic outlier in any conference it decides to join. This means it's going to take more peso's to get a great coach to come to El Paso, vs almost any other FBS school in the country. Hence the big up front money contract.

As G5's go, UTEP already has a big football budget, a great fan base, wonderful athletic facilities, and a friendly local media to help support the program. The ONLY thing missing, is a great football coach. And that's gonna cost 'em.

Explain to me how money will fix UTEP other problems? As far as a great coach that's not happening unless you hire one with baggage that no P5 will touch till they prove they corrected what ever baggage they had. In that case money isn't the most important part of their contract.

I guess you missed the part about needing to pay a new coach a $1M BASE SALARY, plus incentives, to bring in a wide open offensive system.

UTEP doesn't need money for anything else. I thought I did a pretty good job explaining that UTEP already has a big budget, great facilities, etc.....Please try to keep up with the discussion. I hate repeating myself.

That's your opinion but facts dont back it up that you need to pay 1 million to get a coach that plays a wide open system. Getting the right coach is more important and that magic 1 million dollars you bring up. So instead of repeat that bull**** if it only took money there wouldn't be bottom feeders in the P5 or the AAC

UCONN is paying 1 million
ECU is paying 1 milion
SMU is paying 2 million
Tulsa is paying 1.4 million

So stop repeating the bull**** and back up what you say because 1 million is not some magic mark that means you win. If UTEP has all the other things as you say.....

it should be easier getting a good OC to take that job as any other place in CUSA. Hell according to you they have more in place than Tech or Western and it didn't take a million dollars for either of those to get a winning coach

Neither LA Tech nor Western Kentucky are in the hinterland, a thousand miles form civilization (only a slight exaggeration). And that's the problem. Of course, UTEP has much better athletic facilities and better athletic resources than either LA Tech, or WKU do. That's one of the points.

But even with the big salary, you still have to hire the RIGHT GUY! Duh! ECU, UCONN and Tulsa may not have done that. (not personally familiar with their hires.) I do expect SMU to eventually be successful with Dykes, because we LA Tech fans have personally experienced it.

It will take a $1M Base Salary to get a REALLY GOOD coach to come to UTEP and stay, and build the program from the ground up. That's the point.

The alternative is, don't bother to listen to me, and let UTEP keep doing what they're doing. Especially since what UTEP is doing is working so well.

(09-23-2018 12:50 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  We think $1 million is breaking the bank. We want a Boise State type of program by paying our coach $500k. Do you really think an upcoming young assistant coordinator at a P5 school like Justin Fuente, Scott Frost and Tom Herman would be interested in the UTEP gig if we are only paying $500k? Sure, those three guys are having issues in their P5 jobs but they succeeded at their G5 gigs. The thing is, nothing will change until UTEP makes it attractive to coach there. We have to start paying at least $1 million and even then it might not be enough for an ambitious young coach.

Sorry, got news for you, Fuente, Frost, and Herman made a lot more than 1 million at their AAC school. Most AAC schools pay from 1.5-3M. Herman was supposedly offered over 3M to stay at Houston. Frost was making around 2M at UCF and would have been offered over 3M. Charlie Strong at USF is making like 2.7M after his Texas payout goes away.

You could get a decent coordinator for 1.2-1.3, but just pointing out the guys you mentioned made more than that.

It would have taken over one million to lure Jones, Hughes, Dykes, or any hot young assistant. Kugler burned the program to the ground. We don’t even have FCS talent on the roster we have D2! Which coach wants to start his head coaching career at 3-21? Or which established coach wants to add 20+ losses to his record in the first two years?

We didn’t have many options and we can’t afford to pay in the 2-3 million dollar range. For now they hired Dimel to come do all the dirty work of laying down the foundation and reestablishing us as an FBS school. It will take time and he might be successful. At the minimum he will get D1 talent on the team and get us into the 4-6 win range. From that point UTEP should be set up to attract better candidates. Maybe the unthinkable happens, and he follows in the footsteps of his mentor and turns us into the KState of CUSA.

(09-26-2018 10:13 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(09-23-2018 12:50 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  We think $1 million is breaking the bank. We want a Boise State type of program by paying our coach $500k. Do you really think an upcoming young assistant coordinator at a P5 school like Justin Fuente, Scott Frost and Tom Herman would be interested in the UTEP gig if we are only paying $500k? Sure, those three guys are having issues in their P5 jobs but they succeeded at their G5 gigs. The thing is, nothing will change until UTEP makes it attractive to coach there. We have to start paying at least $1 million and even then it might not be enough for an ambitious young coach.

Sorry, got news for you, Fuente, Frost, and Herman made a lot more than 1 million at their AAC school. Most AAC schools pay from 1.5-3M. Herman was supposedly offered over 3M to stay at Houston. Frost was making around 2M at UCF and would have been offered over 3M. Charlie Strong at USF is making like 2.7M after his Texas payout goes away.

You could get a decent coordinator for 1.2-1.3, but just pointing out the guys you mentioned made more than that.

$1 million should be the minimum. Raise the salary if he starts winning, gets the team ranked, wins a bowl, has a NY6 run, etc. At the end, they’ll leave. They’re still young, they want to coach at the highest level and even if the G5 school matches what the P5 offers, they’ll leave as it happened to Herman. Houston or any other G5 school for that matter can’t compete with a power like Texas. Now, you can get a coach who failed at a P5 school like Strong and he might stay for the long haul or a disgraced coach who will not get hired anywhere but got paid millions as part of his firing so money is not that big of a deal as was the case with Mike Price.

(09-26-2018 10:56 AM)JCMiner Wrote:  It would have taken over one million to lure Jones, Hughes, Dykes, or any hot young assistant. Kugler burned the program to the ground. We don’t even have FCS talent on the roster we have D2! Which coach wants to start his head coaching career at 3-21? Or which established coach wants to add 20+ losses to his record in the first two years?

We didn’t have many options and we can’t afford to pay in the 2-3 million dollar range. For now they hired Dimel to come do all the dirty work of laying down the foundation and reestablishing us as an FBS school. It will take time and he might be successful. At the minimum he will get D1 talent on the team and get us into the 4-6 win range. From that point UTEP should be set up to attract better candidates. Maybe the unthinkable happens, and he follows in the footsteps of his mentor and turns us into the KState of CUSA.

Hopefully the recruiting pipeline to powerhouse Euless Trinity will be reestablished. I remember seeing players from that HS on the roster during the Price era. Euless is a suburb of Fort Worth that’s known for producing Samoan talent. Dallas-Fort Worth alone has 7.5 million people. It’s expected to grow to 10 million by 2030 and overtake Chicago as the third largest metro area in the nation. The school district where I graduated in ‘96 went from one HS to five in less than 20 years and there’s tons of school district in DFW that are experiencing explosive growth. The Big XII and SEC can’t take them all. Houston and Austin-San Antonio are similar. Los Ángeles has tons of HS talent that the Pac-12 and MWC won’t take them all. All El Paso offers recruiting wise are baseball and men’s soccer players which sadly UTEP doesn’t sponsor any of those sports.

Wouldn't be surprised that UTEP ends their losing streak @ UTSA this week. No home team has won in this series. I hope not, but would not be surprised.

Lets just put it like this: UNT started Littrell at about 850k, raised him to 1M after year one, and he now is at 1.4M. UNT will try to retain him another year, and I am sure the AD will find donors who will be willing to cough up more for that (I imagine it will get close to 2M). That may not be enough of what it takes to defend against the poachers who are likely to try and come in, but it at least is something the coach has to look at and consider an honest try. It is also something potential replacement candidates will look at and say, well this school is serious. What UTEP was willing to pay in its last search just doesn't amount to an honest try in the minds of many confident coaches. And its not just the salary itself that is a problem there, it is also the message that this sends to the candidates, about what importance the program currently has at the university. That may be a wrong perception on candidates behalf, but you can be sure that they still have it.

UNT is geographically better situated than UTEP, both for recruiting and other things. Yes, you are competing with lots of other schools etc, but if your coach is confident, he'll believe that he'll beat the others out. UTEP, on the other hand, is on an island. A confident coach will still believe he can make that work, but he'll want a premium to try there rather than in a place that is closer to more densely populated areas.
So when somebody says that UTEP should look at paying its next coach in the area of 1M I think that is reasonable to me. That said if you then still can't get anybody but a Dimmel type, its understandable if you're not gonna pay more than 600k