(07-31-2018 05:05 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 11:29 AM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  If I had to pick the top 4 schools from each conference in football AND basketball since realignment ended (2013ish), it would probably look like:

The MAC:
Western Michigan
Toledo
Ohio
Akron

CUSA:
MTSU
Marshall
Southern Miss
La Tech

The SBC:
Troy
ULL
Georgia St
Georgia Southern

Replace Southern with App. App has 3 bowl wins, 2 conference championships and hasn't had a losing record since moving up to FBS. Regarding basketball neither App nor GaSo have been outstanding (Although admittedly, Georgia Southern is better than App in the sport), and between the two only Georgia Southern has made any post season tournament since joining the Sun Belt. (CBI, and they lost in the first round).

Agreed. Well put.

(07-31-2018 05:14 PM)ken d Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 04:53 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 04:45 PM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 04:40 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  I do not view the AAC or MWC to be in a class above the others in the G5. If that were the case, they would have their own path to the access bowl. So, in my opinion the focus of the thread should be to find the best among the G5 programs from the central US to the Atlantic, regardless of G5 conference affiliation.

But you didn't start the thread.....

That's more of a hijacking the thread to push an agenda.

I believe the thread in it's original form is trying to push an agenda. The AAC and the MWC are in fact in the same class as the other G5 conferences, and based on that fact, posters should consider modifying their responses. Of course it is their choice.

Hogwash. There is no school in the MAC, CUSA or SBC who would help either the AAC or the MWC. And there is nobody in the MWC or AAC who are going to move down voluntarily to any of those three conferences.

And schools can move back and forth among the MAC, CUSA and SBC and it won't help any of them. They will all still be the FBS bottom feeders.

In my argument I left the MWC out because they are isolated in the west.

But there are certainly programs among C-USA, MAC, and Sun Belt that are better then some in the AAC.

(07-31-2018 05:05 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 11:29 AM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  If I had to pick the top 4 schools from each conference in football AND basketball since realignment ended (2013ish), it would probably look like:

The MAC:
Western Michigan
Toledo
Ohio
Akron

CUSA:
MTSU
Marshall
Southern Miss
La Tech

The SBC:
Troy
ULL
Georgia St
Georgia Southern

Replace Southern with App. App has 3 bowl wins, 2 conference championships and hasn't had a losing record since moving up to FBS. Regarding basketball neither App nor GaSo have been outstanding (Although admittedly, Georgia Southern is better than App in the sport), and between the two only Georgia Southern has made any post season tournament since joining the Sun Belt. (CBI, and they lost in the first round).

That’s why I said “in football AND basketball.” App has good football right now but atrocious everything else. Georgia Southern has a more complete athletic department. The OP was looking for more than just football. That’s why didn’t say Arkansas St either.

Further, Georgia State only has one bowl win and no conference titles but you would replace Georgia Southern? I see your reply has no bias in it obviously.

(07-31-2018 05:38 PM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:05 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 11:29 AM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  If I had to pick the top 4 schools from each conference in football AND basketball since realignment ended (2013ish), it would probably look like:

The MAC:
Western Michigan
Toledo
Ohio
Akron

CUSA:
MTSU
Marshall
Southern Miss
La Tech

The SBC:
Troy
ULL
Georgia St
Georgia Southern

Replace Southern with App. App has 3 bowl wins, 2 conference championships and hasn't had a losing record since moving up to FBS. Regarding basketball neither App nor GaSo have been outstanding (Although admittedly, Georgia Southern is better than App in the sport), and between the two only Georgia Southern has made any post season tournament since joining the Sun Belt. (CBI, and they lost in the first round).

That’s why I said “in football AND basketball.” App has good football right now but atrocious everything else. Georgia Southern has a more complete athletic department. The OP was looking for more than just football. That’s why didn’t say Arkansas St either.

Further, Georgia State only has one bowl win and no conference titles but you would replace Georgia Southern? I see your reply has no bias in it obviously.

Georgia State has the benefit of being in a large city, is building top facilities, and has one of the better hoops programs in the Sun Belt with two NCAA appearances and a round of 32 appearance since they joined. They also have as many bowl wins as Southern does now, and the football program looks to be on the rise.

Last season App had their best season of hoops since joining the Sun Belt. Hopefully we can finally see a winning record next season. Baseball was close to a super regional years ago and actually won a series against LSU, but the coach left for Duke and the program began to suck. If App ever gets a chance to join a better conference, I'm sure will be primarily on football prowess with being bad at hoops and baseball being more of an afterthought.

(07-31-2018 05:38 PM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:05 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 11:29 AM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  If I had to pick the top 4 schools from each conference in football AND basketball since realignment ended (2013ish), it would probably look like:

The MAC:
Western Michigan
Toledo
Ohio
Akron

CUSA:
MTSU
Marshall
Southern Miss
La Tech

The SBC:
Troy
ULL
Georgia St
Georgia Southern

Replace Southern with App. App has 3 bowl wins, 2 conference championships and hasn't had a losing record since moving up to FBS. Regarding basketball neither App nor GaSo have been outstanding (Although admittedly, Georgia Southern is better than App in the sport), and between the two only Georgia Southern has made any post season tournament since joining the Sun Belt. (CBI, and they lost in the first round).

That’s why I said “in football AND basketball.” App has good football right now but atrocious everything else. Georgia Southern has a more complete athletic department. The OP was looking for more than just football. That’s why didn’t say Arkansas St either.

Further, Georgia State only has one bowl win and no conference titles but you would replace Georgia Southern? I see your reply has no bias in it obviously.

I mean to be fair GSU has been better at football and basketball lately...

(07-31-2018 05:38 PM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:05 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 11:29 AM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  If I had to pick the top 4 schools from each conference in football AND basketball since realignment ended (2013ish), it would probably look like:

The MAC:
Western Michigan
Toledo
Ohio
Akron

CUSA:
MTSU
Marshall
Southern Miss
La Tech

The SBC:
Troy
ULL
Georgia St
Georgia Southern

Replace Southern with App. App has 3 bowl wins, 2 conference championships and hasn't had a losing record since moving up to FBS. Regarding basketball neither App nor GaSo have been outstanding (Although admittedly, Georgia Southern is better than App in the sport), and between the two only Georgia Southern has made any post season tournament since joining the Sun Belt. (CBI, and they lost in the first round).

That’s why I said “in football AND basketball.” App has good football right now but atrocious everything else. Georgia Southern has a more complete athletic department. The OP was looking for more than just football. That’s why didn’t say Arkansas St either.

Further, Georgia State only has one bowl win and no conference titles but you would replace Georgia Southern? I see your reply has no bias in it obviously.

I mean to be fair GSU has been better at football and basketball lately...

I calculated average Sagarin ratings for basketball and football for the last five seasons for all current CUSA, MAC, and SBC full members. The numbers are in the attached image, which for whatever reason can't be displayed in or below this post. If you take the average BB/FB rank for the schools within each conference, here are the top 4:

CUSA
Louisiana Tech (2.5: BB 2, FB 3)
Middle Tennessee (2.5: BB 1, FB 4)
Western Kentucky (3.0: BB 5, FB 1)
Marshall (4.5: BB 7, FB 2)

MAC
Toledo (1.5: BB 2, FB 1)
Buffalo (4.5: BB 1, FB 8)
Akron (5.0: BB 3, FB 7)
Ohio (5.0: BB 5, FB 5)
Western Michigan (5.0: BB 7, FB 3)

Sun Belt
Arkansas State (3.5: BB 6, FB 1)
Georgia Southern (3.5: BB 4, FB 3)
Coastal Carolina (4.0: BB 3, FB 5)
Louisiana-Lafayette (4.0: BB 2, FB 6)


  NCAA CUSA-MAC-SBC Average SR 2013-14 to 2017-18.png (Size: 41.93 KB / Downloads: 9)

And if you combine all the schools, here are the top 12 in average BB/FB rank:

Toledo
Louisiana Tech
Western Kentucky
Middle Tennessee
Marshall
Western Michigan
Ohio
Northern Illinois
Louisiana-Lafayette
Buffalo
Old Dominion
Akron


  NCAA CUSA-MAC-SBC Average SR 2013-14 to 2017-18 (Combined).png (Size: 38.07 KB / Downloads: 11)

(07-31-2018 06:35 PM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:38 PM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:05 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 11:29 AM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  If I had to pick the top 4 schools from each conference in football AND basketball since realignment ended (2013ish), it would probably look like:

The MAC:
Western Michigan
Toledo
Ohio
Akron

CUSA:
MTSU
Marshall
Southern Miss
La Tech

The SBC:
Troy
ULL
Georgia St
Georgia Southern

Replace Southern with App. App has 3 bowl wins, 2 conference championships and hasn't had a losing record since moving up to FBS. Regarding basketball neither App nor GaSo have been outstanding (Although admittedly, Georgia Southern is better than App in the sport), and between the two only Georgia Southern has made any post season tournament since joining the Sun Belt. (CBI, and they lost in the first round).

That’s why I said “in football AND basketball.” App has good football right now but atrocious everything else. Georgia Southern has a more complete athletic department. The OP was looking for more than just football. That’s why didn’t say Arkansas St either.

Further, Georgia State only has one bowl win and no conference titles but you would replace Georgia Southern? I see your reply has no bias in it obviously.

I mean to be fair GSU has been better at football and basketball lately...

But the OP said the time period since realignment ended. Read the OP. One season means nothing.

(07-31-2018 06:07 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:38 PM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:05 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 11:29 AM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  If I had to pick the top 4 schools from each conference in football AND basketball since realignment ended (2013ish), it would probably look like:

The MAC:
Western Michigan
Toledo
Ohio
Akron

CUSA:
MTSU
Marshall
Southern Miss
La Tech

The SBC:
Troy
ULL
Georgia St
Georgia Southern

Replace Southern with App. App has 3 bowl wins, 2 conference championships and hasn't had a losing record since moving up to FBS. Regarding basketball neither App nor GaSo have been outstanding (Although admittedly, Georgia Southern is better than App in the sport), and between the two only Georgia Southern has made any post season tournament since joining the Sun Belt. (CBI, and they lost in the first round).

That’s why I said “in football AND basketball.” App has good football right now but atrocious everything else. Georgia Southern has a more complete athletic department. The OP was looking for more than just football. That’s why didn’t say Arkansas St either.

Further, Georgia State only has one bowl win and no conference titles but you would replace Georgia Southern? I see your reply has no bias in it obviously.

Georgia State has the benefit of being in a large city, is building top facilities, and has one of the better hoops programs in the Sun Belt with two NCAA appearances and a round of 32 appearance since they joined. They also have as many bowl wins as Southern does now, and the football program looks to be on the rise.

Last season App had their best season of hoops since joining the Sun Belt. Hopefully we can finally see a winning record next season. Baseball was close to a super regional years ago and actually won a series against LSU, but the coach left for Duke and the program began to suck. If App ever gets a chance to join a better conference, I'm sure will be primarily on football prowess with being bad at hoops and baseball being more of an afterthought.

So only basketball counts for Georgia State and only football counts for App state. Got it.

Also, the OP isn’t asking who has the most potential or who is in a city and who isn’t. Nice try though.

(07-31-2018 07:16 PM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 06:35 PM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:38 PM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:05 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 11:29 AM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  If I had to pick the top 4 schools from each conference in football AND basketball since realignment ended (2013ish), it would probably look like:

The MAC:
Western Michigan
Toledo
Ohio
Akron

CUSA:
MTSU
Marshall
Southern Miss
La Tech

The SBC:
Troy
ULL
Georgia St
Georgia Southern

Replace Southern with App. App has 3 bowl wins, 2 conference championships and hasn't had a losing record since moving up to FBS. Regarding basketball neither App nor GaSo have been outstanding (Although admittedly, Georgia Southern is better than App in the sport), and between the two only Georgia Southern has made any post season tournament since joining the Sun Belt. (CBI, and they lost in the first round).

That’s why I said “in football AND basketball.” App has good football right now but atrocious everything else. Georgia Southern has a more complete athletic department. The OP was looking for more than just football. That’s why didn’t say Arkansas St either.

Further, Georgia State only has one bowl win and no conference titles but you would replace Georgia Southern? I see your reply has no bias in it obviously.

I mean to be fair GSU has been better at football and basketball lately...

But the OP said the time period since realignment ended. Read the OP. One season means nothing.

They've been better at yall in football for at least 3 years and in basketball all 5.

(07-31-2018 07:18 PM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 06:07 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:38 PM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 05:05 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 11:29 AM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  If I had to pick the top 4 schools from each conference in football AND basketball since realignment ended (2013ish), it would probably look like:

The MAC:
Western Michigan
Toledo
Ohio
Akron

CUSA:
MTSU
Marshall
Southern Miss
La Tech

The SBC:
Troy
ULL
Georgia St
Georgia Southern

Replace Southern with App. App has 3 bowl wins, 2 conference championships and hasn't had a losing record since moving up to FBS. Regarding basketball neither App nor GaSo have been outstanding (Although admittedly, Georgia Southern is better than App in the sport), and between the two only Georgia Southern has made any post season tournament since joining the Sun Belt. (CBI, and they lost in the first round).

That’s why I said “in football AND basketball.” App has good football right now but atrocious everything else. Georgia Southern has a more complete athletic department. The OP was looking for more than just football. That’s why didn’t say Arkansas St either.

Further, Georgia State only has one bowl win and no conference titles but you would replace Georgia Southern? I see your reply has no bias in it obviously.

Georgia State has the benefit of being in a large city, is building top facilities, and has one of the better hoops programs in the Sun Belt with two NCAA appearances and a round of 32 appearance since they joined. They also have as many bowl wins as Southern does now, and the football program looks to be on the rise.

Last season App had their best season of hoops since joining the Sun Belt. Hopefully we can finally see a winning record next season. Baseball was close to a super regional years ago and actually won a series against LSU, but the coach left for Duke and the program began to suck. If App ever gets a chance to join a better conference, I'm sure will be primarily on football prowess with being bad at hoops and baseball being more of an afterthought.

So only basketball counts for Georgia State and only football counts for App state. Got it.

Also, the OP isn’t asking who has the most potential or who is in a city and who isn’t. Nice try though.

Aside from winning the SunBelt their first season up what makes Georgia Southern an outstanding candidate to be top 4 in the SunBelt? They haven't done anything good in football the last two years and have been an average team in basketball.

(07-31-2018 05:16 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 04:56 PM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 04:53 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  I believe the thread in it's original form is trying to push an agenda. The AAC and the MWC are in fact in the same class as the other G5 conferences, and based on that fact, posters should consider modifying their responses. Of course it is their choice.

Maybe..... but there was a question and you tried to shift it to what "you" think should be the discussion.

There are no "classes" anyway. G5... P5.... are made up "classifications" we are all FBS schools.

Again if you would like to discuss who is better start a thread of your own.

If you would like to discuss who among those conferences would be good fits that would be an interesting conversation.

You didn't even start this thread. If the OP doesn't like my input, he could let me know.

P5 and G5 conferences have different paths to the post-season, and the P5 have autonomy. So, there are certainly different classes within the FBS, and the AAC like C-USA, MWC, MAC, and the Sun Belt are in the lesser.

The title of the thread is "The Best of the Rest...", and all of the G5 conferences are "the Rest".

I could start another topic, but it would be very similar to this one.

You're more than welcome to open your proposal to criticism. I didn't post this thread with an agenda, but rather (as stated in the opening) to think of realigning the MAC, SBC, C-USA from a best of the rest perspective rather than the tried geographic perspective. In each one of the previous threads, someone presents a realignment of the AAC and the other conferences and it is almost immediately shot down, so I thought that was a waste of time.

(07-31-2018 06:45 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  And if you combine all the schools, here are the top 12 in average BB/FB rank:

Toledo
Louisiana Tech
Western Kentucky
Middle Tennessee
Marshall
Western Michigan
Ohio
Northern Illinois
Louisiana-Lafayette
Buffalo
Old Dominion
Akron

Nice work. If you wanted to prioritize football it’d no doubt be different and the reason there’s not more Sun Belt teams on the list.

The MAC's top contributors to this league would Ohio, Toledo, WMU, and NIU. Miami might not have much post-Rothlisberger success but they'd be a quality legacy program.

As far as C-USA and the SBC goes it depends if you are looking at best on field performance, attendance, history, or program potential. Each of those sets of criteria produces a radically different set of schools

(07-31-2018 08:40 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  The MAC's top contributors to this league would Ohio, Toledo, WMU, and NIU. Miami might not have much post-Rothlisberger success but they'd be a quality legacy program.

As far as C-USA and the SBC goes it depends if you are looking at best on field performance, attendance, history, or program potential. Each of those sets of criteria produces a radically different set of schools

Take your best shot. We need more MAC input on this.

The MAC has a pretty established top crust at the moment but this is a league with a history of parity.

From the two southern leagues my picks are:

Marshall
UAB
MTSU
LA Tech
UNT
UTSA
Ark St

Northern division
Northern Illinois
Ohio
Toledo
Western Michigan
Central Michigan
Buffalo
Marshall

Southern division
Western Kentucky
MTSU
Old Dominion
Georgia State
Southern Miss
Louisiana Tech
Arkansas State

(07-31-2018 06:45 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  And if you combine all the schools, here are the top 12 in average BB/FB rank:

Toledo
Louisiana Tech
Western Kentucky
Middle Tennessee
Marshall
Western Michigan
Ohio
Northern Illinois
Louisiana-Lafayette
Buffalo
Old Dominion
Akron

Football wise App is 9-0 vs teams on that list.

Sent from my XT1635-01 using CSNbbs mobile app

(07-31-2018 10:09 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  

(07-31-2018 06:45 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  And if you combine all the schools, here are the top 12 in average BB/FB rank:

Toledo
Louisiana Tech
Western Kentucky
Middle Tennessee
Marshall
Western Michigan
Ohio
Northern Illinois
Louisiana-Lafayette
Buffalo
Old Dominion
Akron

Football wise App is 9-0 vs teams on that list.

Sent from my XT1635-01 using CSNbbs mobile app

If you click on his link it gives a breakdow. App is seventh in football but 36th in basketball.