The unofficial online home for fans of the Western Michigan University Broncos. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

(08-02-2018 10:03 AM)WMUPorter Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 09:23 AM)Fthechips Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 09:05 AM)WMUPorter Wrote:  I played high school football and then played some in college actually for another school in the MAC. I have lived in Kalamazoo for about 20 years. My wife is a graduate of WMU. I have had season tickets for men's basketball for 17 seasons but never wanted to buy season tickets for football because we had too much on our schedule in the fall but I would go to any games we were available for. Bought season tickets for football for the first time when they hired Coach Fleck. I was one of the few that was all in on Coach Fleck from day 1. Shortly after he was hired, he spoke to the crowd at a home basketball game at halftime and I immediately told my wife that he was going to turn the football team into a winner and I wanted to buy season tickets. I regretted that decision after his first year but I stuck with them and it paid off huge in 2016. I have purchased my tickets every year since then and was very reluctant this season but figured I would give it one more try. I have not lost all faith in Coach Lester yet but was very disappointed in last season. That along with the midweek games really made it difficult to renew my tickets for this season but I ultimately decided to not throw in the towel yet. I hope the team has a better season and I hope we are luckier with the weather for home games this season. Go Broncos!!

Fleck got a free pass year 1, why shouldn't Lester?

This has been discussed numerous times, in great detail, by many in this forum and others. All I will say is that, IMO, Fleck was hired into a disaster. The roster was ok but not great but the program was in a total free-fall. Lester was hired into a program coming off the best season in program history, bar none, with a roster loaded with talent with many returning starters from the 2016 team. They were hard to watch a lot of the time last season.

If Alex Carder hadn't been injured in the UConn game, WMU would have won at least another 3 games and Bowl eligible. Fleck would not have been hired. There was enough talent on the roster to win more than one game in 2013. That tells me either PJ didn't know how to coach or he intentionally tubed the program to make himself look better with the turn around. Watching his modus operandi, I would assume the latter. I don't see that Fleck inherited a hot mess. A good JUCO QB would have probably been enough to keep WMU on the winning track in 2013.

(08-02-2018 11:30 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 10:03 AM)WMUPorter Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 09:23 AM)Fthechips Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 09:05 AM)WMUPorter Wrote:  I played high school football and then played some in college actually for another school in the MAC. I have lived in Kalamazoo for about 20 years. My wife is a graduate of WMU. I have had season tickets for men's basketball for 17 seasons but never wanted to buy season tickets for football because we had too much on our schedule in the fall but I would go to any games we were available for. Bought season tickets for football for the first time when they hired Coach Fleck. I was one of the few that was all in on Coach Fleck from day 1. Shortly after he was hired, he spoke to the crowd at a home basketball game at halftime and I immediately told my wife that he was going to turn the football team into a winner and I wanted to buy season tickets. I regretted that decision after his first year but I stuck with them and it paid off huge in 2016. I have purchased my tickets every year since then and was very reluctant this season but figured I would give it one more try. I have not lost all faith in Coach Lester yet but was very disappointed in last season. That along with the midweek games really made it difficult to renew my tickets for this season but I ultimately decided to not throw in the towel yet. I hope the team has a better season and I hope we are luckier with the weather for home games this season. Go Broncos!!

Fleck got a free pass year 1, why shouldn't Lester?

This has been discussed numerous times, in great detail, by many in this forum and others. All I will say is that, IMO, Fleck was hired into a disaster. The roster was ok but not great but the program was in a total free-fall. Lester was hired into a program coming off the best season in program history, bar none, with a roster loaded with talent with many returning starters from the 2016 team. They were hard to watch a lot of the time last season.

If Alex Carder hadn't been injured in the UConn game, WMU would have won at least another 3 games and Bowl eligible. Fleck would not have been hired. There was enough talent on the roster to win more than one game in 2013. That tells me either PJ didn't know how to coach or he intentionally tubed the program to make himself look better with the turn around. Watching his modus operandi, I would assume the latter. I don't see that Fleck inherited a hot mess. A good JUCO QB would have probably been enough to keep WMU on the winning track in 2013.

As I stated, the roster was ok. Not great but not horrible either. What was worse was the state of the program. It was in an out of control downward spiral. There was absolutely no excitement surrounding the program in the University, in the fanbase(which was shrinking rapidly) or in the community. Which is why Coach Fleck was hired to not only turn the program around but to change the culture and get people excited about WMU football again.

(08-02-2018 12:02 PM)WMUPorter Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 11:30 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 10:03 AM)WMUPorter Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 09:23 AM)Fthechips Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 09:05 AM)WMUPorter Wrote:  I played high school football and then played some in college actually for another school in the MAC. I have lived in Kalamazoo for about 20 years. My wife is a graduate of WMU. I have had season tickets for men's basketball for 17 seasons but never wanted to buy season tickets for football because we had too much on our schedule in the fall but I would go to any games we were available for. Bought season tickets for football for the first time when they hired Coach Fleck. I was one of the few that was all in on Coach Fleck from day 1. Shortly after he was hired, he spoke to the crowd at a home basketball game at halftime and I immediately told my wife that he was going to turn the football team into a winner and I wanted to buy season tickets. I regretted that decision after his first year but I stuck with them and it paid off huge in 2016. I have purchased my tickets every year since then and was very reluctant this season but figured I would give it one more try. I have not lost all faith in Coach Lester yet but was very disappointed in last season. That along with the midweek games really made it difficult to renew my tickets for this season but I ultimately decided to not throw in the towel yet. I hope the team has a better season and I hope we are luckier with the weather for home games this season. Go Broncos!!

Fleck got a free pass year 1, why shouldn't Lester?

This has been discussed numerous times, in great detail, by many in this forum and others. All I will say is that, IMO, Fleck was hired into a disaster. The roster was ok but not great but the program was in a total free-fall. Lester was hired into a program coming off the best season in program history, bar none, with a roster loaded with talent with many returning starters from the 2016 team. They were hard to watch a lot of the time last season.

If Alex Carder hadn't been injured in the UConn game, WMU would have won at least another 3 games and Bowl eligible. Fleck would not have been hired. There was enough talent on the roster to win more than one game in 2013. That tells me either PJ didn't know how to coach or he intentionally tubed the program to make himself look better with the turn around. Watching his modus operandi, I would assume the latter. I don't see that Fleck inherited a hot mess. A good JUCO QB would have probably been enough to keep WMU on the winning track in 2013.

As I stated, the roster was ok. Not great but not horrible either. What was worse was the state of the program. It was in an out of control downward spiral. There was absolutely no excitement surrounding the program in the University, in the fanbase(which was shrinking rapidly) or in the community. Which is why Coach Fleck was hired to not only turn the program around but to change the culture and get people excited about WMU football again.

I looked at the attendance figures since 2008. The Broncos drew over 20,000 a game in 2009 and almost 20,000 in 2011. 14,529 in 2012. Best attendance under PJ was 19,441/game in 2015, but the #'s were skewed by the 30,000+ for MSU. Then 23,838/game in 2016. Those numbers effected by ESPN Gameday and no home midweek MACTION games played. In year one under PJ, WMU's average attendance was 17,347. Year two, 14,579.

As far as Fleck year 1, everyone forgets we suffered a horrible boatload of injuries that year too. Truly a ridiculous amount of them. Wilson, Braverman, Davisson, Brant, Easmon, Atkins. TVT got destroyed at MSU and never recovered. We lost some players in the transition. Even though we had 6 current NFL players on that roster, if things don't line up, you lose a lot of games.

I played football in middle school, so yeah...I'm kind of a big deal.

CB and backup RB. Skill positions, baby!

I've never had season tickets (did not need them while a student or while living out of state), but I hope to become a season ticket holder soon. Just bought a house in Kzoo and it looks like we're settling down here.

(08-02-2018 02:26 PM)RunningGame Wrote:  As far as Fleck year 1, everyone forgets we suffered a horrible boatload of injuries that year too. Truly a ridiculous amount of them. Wilson, Braverman, Davisson, Brant, Easmon, Atkins. TVT got destroyed at MSU and never recovered. We lost some players in the transition. Even though we had 6 current NFL players on that roster, if things don't line up, you lose a lot of games.

Losing to a 4 win Nicholls State in Kalamazoo?

Never played football but have loved it since elementary school.

I have family that played for WMU football and is a big reason why I support WMU football and all WMU athletics.

Loved Fleck from Day 1 (did not waver during 2013), was indifferent to the Lester hire ("the sky isn't falling" "we could stay good under him"), believe we need few more years before we can judge, excited about this year, plagued by injuries and new QB/WRs last year (2 positions you really really really really need in the MAC).

(08-02-2018 03:48 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  4-win Nicholls St

Brand new, first-time head-coach. But we choked that game away.

(08-02-2018 02:26 PM)RunningGame Wrote:  As far as Fleck year 1, everyone forgets we suffered a horrible boatload of injuries that year too. Truly a ridiculous amount of them. Wilson, Braverman, Davisson, Brant, Easmon, Atkins. TVT got destroyed at MSU and never recovered. We lost some players in the transition. Even though we had 6 current NFL players on that roster, if things don't line up, you lose a lot of games.

Sounds similar to Lester Year 1.

(08-02-2018 01:30 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  I looked at the attendance figures since 2008. The Broncos drew over 20,000 a game in 2009 and almost 20,000 in 2011. 14,529 in 2012. Best attendance under PJ was 19,441/game in 2015, but the #'s were skewed by the 30,000+ for MSU. Then 23,838/game in 2016. Those numbers effected by ESPN Gameday and no home midweek MACTION games played. In year one under PJ, WMU's average attendance was 17,347. Year two, 14,579.

I agree. Anyone who says WMU football was ****** or no one cared prior to Fleck is delusional. (But I don't think it's fair to pull out the MSU or Gameday games, especially the Gameday game)

(08-02-2018 12:02 PM)WMUPorter Wrote:  There was absolutely no excitement surrounding the program..........to change the culture and get people excited about WMU football

That's a problem all MAC schools face.

What was clear: Cubit wasn't going to win a MAC Championship.

So maybe you're right: there was some excitement in that people believed WMU would win a MACC under Fleck.

(08-02-2018 11:30 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  If Alex Carder hadn't been injured in the UConn game, WMU would have won at least another 3 games and Bowl eligible. Fleck would not have been hired. There was enough talent on the roster to win more than one game in 2013. That tells me either PJ didn't know how to coach or he intentionally tubed the program to make himself look better with the turn around. Watching his modus operandi, I would assume the latter. I don't see that Fleck inherited a hot mess. A good JUCO QB would have probably been enough to keep WMU on the winning track in 2013.

Interesting assessment. Usually I say 'if you go 2-2 OOC you're going to have a good year' and we did start off 2-2 in 2012. Then what happened? Carder went down. What did we have in 2017? A new QB. You live and die by the QB.

(07-30-2018 09:22 AM)Aimless1 Wrote:  Would never speak for a group I don't belong to. I can only speak for the former players I know and talk to. In general, hated Fleck & love Lester. I think most fans in the stands are on the fence on Lester, at least in my immediate area in Waldo. Personally, I loved Peej on field success but hated that he didn't build a program. I also felt he took a lot of chances recruiting, some of which paid off. Again, I'm lukewarm to Timbo. Game management seems to be a major weakness. Not holding last year against him though. New system, program changed, injuries, receivers couldn't catch and linebackers seemed lost.

Interesting............What about Fleck did they hate and what do they love about Lester? Is liking a coach always a good thing?

(07-30-2018 09:10 AM)RunningGame Wrote:  

(07-30-2018 06:14 AM)Aimless1 Wrote:  Couple of curiosity questions ....

Have you played football?

Do you have season tickets?

I played high school ball and we have season tickets.

I find ex players, especially ex college players, have a different view of the program than fans do. "Retired" Broncos certainly see Lester in a different light than I do.

Many of you live too far away to attend games. If you live close enough I hope you are able to support the team. Nothing quite like watching the game in Waldo.

Played HS football, linebacker mostly.

Coached several years of middle school football, offense mostly (hey, I called a pass play at least once a game!!!).

Season ticket holder since 2002 season, though I bummed them off my father-in-law for a few years in between.

Recovering Lions fan. I've been clean since 2014.

When I was younger I loved the Lions and thought they'd get good someday. I didn't like college football because even when I was younger I thought UofM and MSU were sleazy as hell.
Now I like WMU/G5 football, don't care as much for the Lions, and still think MSU and UofM are sleazy.

(07-30-2018 07:12 AM)bronco89 Wrote:  I played at Western in the early 80s and go every chance I get. My son goes their now so I can combine a visit with taking in a game.

That's great! Does your son go to a lot of the games?

(07-30-2018 07:12 AM)bronco89 Wrote:  I like Tim, and think that he will be just fine. He needs to find his footing and it may take another year but, from what I heard, the players love him.

Definitely. What bothers a lot of people tho: We were coming off a Cotton Bowl and we hire someone with average experience? I'm just playing devil's advocate. I don't and didn't dislike the hire.

(07-30-2018 07:12 AM)bronco89 Wrote:  I also enjoyed the energy and attention that Fleck brought to the program. I did hear that he was a bit of a prick to play for and that it was all about him.... but most coaches at that level have that personality type. Elliot and Jack where hardly the group hug types.

Definitely too. I know a couple Grand Valley St players who decommited from WMU because of Fleck the person.

(08-02-2018 11:30 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 10:03 AM)WMUPorter Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 09:23 AM)Fthechips Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 09:05 AM)WMUPorter Wrote:  I played high school football and then played some in college actually for another school in the MAC. I have lived in Kalamazoo for about 20 years. My wife is a graduate of WMU. I have had season tickets for men's basketball for 17 seasons but never wanted to buy season tickets for football because we had too much on our schedule in the fall but I would go to any games we were available for. Bought season tickets for football for the first time when they hired Coach Fleck. I was one of the few that was all in on Coach Fleck from day 1. Shortly after he was hired, he spoke to the crowd at a home basketball game at halftime and I immediately told my wife that he was going to turn the football team into a winner and I wanted to buy season tickets. I regretted that decision after his first year but I stuck with them and it paid off huge in 2016. I have purchased my tickets every year since then and was very reluctant this season but figured I would give it one more try. I have not lost all faith in Coach Lester yet but was very disappointed in last season. That along with the midweek games really made it difficult to renew my tickets for this season but I ultimately decided to not throw in the towel yet. I hope the team has a better season and I hope we are luckier with the weather for home games this season. Go Broncos!!

Fleck got a free pass year 1, why shouldn't Lester?

This has been discussed numerous times, in great detail, by many in this forum and others. All I will say is that, IMO, Fleck was hired into a disaster. The roster was ok but not great but the program was in a total free-fall. Lester was hired into a program coming off the best season in program history, bar none, with a roster loaded with talent with many returning starters from the 2016 team. They were hard to watch a lot of the time last season.

If Alex Carder hadn't been injured in the UConn game, WMU would have won at least another 3 games and Bowl eligible. Fleck would not have been hired. There was enough talent on the roster to win more than one game in 2013. That tells me either PJ didn't know how to coach or he intentionally tubed the program to make himself look better with the turn around. Watching his modus operandi, I would assume the latter. I don't see that Fleck inherited a hot mess. A good JUCO QB would have probably been enough to keep WMU on the winning track in 2013.

I think it's a little much to say he "intentionally tubed" the program, but I do think he started playing a bunch of younger guys that wouldn't have otherwise seen the field much once we started out so poorly.

(08-02-2018 05:28 PM)Bronco14 Wrote:  Never played football but have loved it since elementary school.

I have family that played for WMU football and is a big reason why I support WMU football and all WMU athletics.

Loved Fleck from Day 1 (did not waver during 2013), was indifferent to the Lester hire ("the sky isn't falling" "we could stay good under him"), believe we need few more years before we can judge, excited about this year, plagued by injuries and new QB/WRs last year (2 positions you really really really really need in the MAC).

(08-02-2018 03:48 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  4-win Nicholls St

Brand new, first-time head-coach. But we choked that game away.

(08-02-2018 02:26 PM)RunningGame Wrote:  As far as Fleck year 1, everyone forgets we suffered a horrible boatload of injuries that year too. Truly a ridiculous amount of them. Wilson, Braverman, Davisson, Brant, Easmon, Atkins. TVT got destroyed at MSU and never recovered. We lost some players in the transition. Even though we had 6 current NFL players on that roster, if things don't line up, you lose a lot of games.

Sounds similar to Lester Year 1.

(08-02-2018 01:30 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  I looked at the attendance figures since 2008. The Broncos drew over 20,000 a game in 2009 and almost 20,000 in 2011. 14,529 in 2012. Best attendance under PJ was 19,441/game in 2015, but the #'s were skewed by the 30,000+ for MSU. Then 23,838/game in 2016. Those numbers effected by ESPN Gameday and no home midweek MACTION games played. In year one under PJ, WMU's average attendance was 17,347. Year two, 14,579.

I agree. Anyone who says WMU football was ****** or no one cared prior to Fleck is delusional. (But I don't think it's fair to pull out the MSU or Gameday games, especially the Gameday game)

(08-02-2018 12:02 PM)WMUPorter Wrote:  There was absolutely no excitement surrounding the program..........to change the culture and get people excited about WMU football

That's a problem all MAC schools face.

What was clear: Cubit wasn't going to win a MAC Championship.

So maybe you're right: there was some excitement in that people believed WMU would win a MACC under Fleck.

(08-02-2018 11:30 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  If Alex Carder hadn't been injured in the UConn game, WMU would have won at least another 3 games and Bowl eligible. Fleck would not have been hired. There was enough talent on the roster to win more than one game in 2013. That tells me either PJ didn't know how to coach or he intentionally tubed the program to make himself look better with the turn around. Watching his modus operandi, I would assume the latter. I don't see that Fleck inherited a hot mess. A good JUCO QB would have probably been enough to keep WMU on the winning track in 2013.

Interesting assessment. Usually I say 'if you go 2-2 OOC you're going to have a good year' and we did start off 2-2 in 2012. Then what happened? Carder went down. What did we have in 2017? A new QB. You live and die by the QB.

(07-30-2018 09:22 AM)Aimless1 Wrote:  Would never speak for a group I don't belong to. I can only speak for the former players I know and talk to. In general, hated Fleck & love Lester. I think most fans in the stands are on the fence on Lester, at least in my immediate area in Waldo. Personally, I loved Peej on field success but hated that he didn't build a program. I also felt he took a lot of chances recruiting, some of which paid off. Again, I'm lukewarm to Timbo. Game management seems to be a major weakness. Not holding last year against him though. New system, program changed, injuries, receivers couldn't catch and linebackers seemed lost.

Interesting............What about Fleck did they hate and what do they love about Lester? Is liking a coach always a good thing?

(07-30-2018 09:10 AM)RunningGame Wrote:  

(07-30-2018 06:14 AM)Aimless1 Wrote:  Couple of curiosity questions ....

Have you played football?

Do you have season tickets?

I played high school ball and we have season tickets.

I find ex players, especially ex college players, have a different view of the program than fans do. "Retired" Broncos certainly see Lester in a different light than I do.

Many of you live too far away to attend games. If you live close enough I hope you are able to support the team. Nothing quite like watching the game in Waldo.

Played HS football, linebacker mostly.

Coached several years of middle school football, offense mostly (hey, I called a pass play at least once a game!!!).

Season ticket holder since 2002 season, though I bummed them off my father-in-law for a few years in between.

Recovering Lions fan. I've been clean since 2014.

When I was younger I loved the Lions and thought they'd get good someday. I didn't like college football because even when I was younger I thought UofM and MSU were sleazy as hell.
Now I like WMU/G5 football, don't care as much for the Lions, and still think MSU and UofM are sleazy.

(07-30-2018 07:12 AM)bronco89 Wrote:  I played at Western in the early 80s and go every chance I get. My son goes their now so I can combine a visit with taking in a game.

That's great! Does your son go to a lot of the games?

(07-30-2018 07:12 AM)bronco89 Wrote:  I like Tim, and think that he will be just fine. He needs to find his footing and it may take another year but, from what I heard, the players love him.

Definitely. What bothers a lot of people tho: We were coming off a Cotton Bowl and we hire someone with average experience? I'm just playing devil's advocate. I don't and didn't dislike the hire.

(07-30-2018 07:12 AM)bronco89 Wrote:  I also enjoyed the energy and attention that Fleck brought to the program. I did hear that he was a bit of a prick to play for and that it was all about him.... but most coaches at that level have that personality type. Elliot and Jack where hardly the group hug types.

Definitely too. I know a couple Grand Valley St players who decommited from WMU because of Fleck the person.

My son is a sports nut so he does go to a lot of games. I do think Lester will do well, his game management will develop. If the players ended up at GVSU they probably wouldn’t have seen the field at Western.

(08-02-2018 06:08 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 11:30 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 10:03 AM)WMUPorter Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 09:23 AM)Fthechips Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 09:05 AM)WMUPorter Wrote:  I played high school football and then played some in college actually for another school in the MAC. I have lived in Kalamazoo for about 20 years. My wife is a graduate of WMU. I have had season tickets for men's basketball for 17 seasons but never wanted to buy season tickets for football because we had too much on our schedule in the fall but I would go to any games we were available for. Bought season tickets for football for the first time when they hired Coach Fleck. I was one of the few that was all in on Coach Fleck from day 1. Shortly after he was hired, he spoke to the crowd at a home basketball game at halftime and I immediately told my wife that he was going to turn the football team into a winner and I wanted to buy season tickets. I regretted that decision after his first year but I stuck with them and it paid off huge in 2016. I have purchased my tickets every year since then and was very reluctant this season but figured I would give it one more try. I have not lost all faith in Coach Lester yet but was very disappointed in last season. That along with the midweek games really made it difficult to renew my tickets for this season but I ultimately decided to not throw in the towel yet. I hope the team has a better season and I hope we are luckier with the weather for home games this season. Go Broncos!!

Fleck got a free pass year 1, why shouldn't Lester?

This has been discussed numerous times, in great detail, by many in this forum and others. All I will say is that, IMO, Fleck was hired into a disaster. The roster was ok but not great but the program was in a total free-fall. Lester was hired into a program coming off the best season in program history, bar none, with a roster loaded with talent with many returning starters from the 2016 team. They were hard to watch a lot of the time last season.

If Alex Carder hadn't been injured in the UConn game, WMU would have won at least another 3 games and Bowl eligible. Fleck would not have been hired. There was enough talent on the roster to win more than one game in 2013. That tells me either PJ didn't know how to coach or he intentionally tubed the program to make himself look better with the turn around. Watching his modus operandi, I would assume the latter. I don't see that Fleck inherited a hot mess. A good JUCO QB would have probably been enough to keep WMU on the winning track in 2013.

I think it's a little much to say he "intentionally tubed" the program, but I do think he started playing a bunch of younger guys that wouldn't have otherwise seen the field much once we started out so poorly.

The one game we didn't lose that year...I was nursing the worst hangover of my life. Ugh. Thank you coach Fleck!!!! (or should I thank the UMASS coach?)

(08-02-2018 06:29 PM)bronco89 Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 05:28 PM)Bronco14 Wrote:  Never played football but have loved it since elementary school.

I have family that played for WMU football and is a big reason why I support WMU football and all WMU athletics.

Loved Fleck from Day 1 (did not waver during 2013), was indifferent to the Lester hire ("the sky isn't falling" "we could stay good under him"), believe we need few more years before we can judge, excited about this year, plagued by injuries and new QB/WRs last year (2 positions you really really really really need in the MAC).

(08-02-2018 03:48 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  4-win Nicholls St

Brand new, first-time head-coach. But we choked that game away.

(08-02-2018 02:26 PM)RunningGame Wrote:  As far as Fleck year 1, everyone forgets we suffered a horrible boatload of injuries that year too. Truly a ridiculous amount of them. Wilson, Braverman, Davisson, Brant, Easmon, Atkins. TVT got destroyed at MSU and never recovered. We lost some players in the transition. Even though we had 6 current NFL players on that roster, if things don't line up, you lose a lot of games.

Sounds similar to Lester Year 1.

(08-02-2018 01:30 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  I looked at the attendance figures since 2008. The Broncos drew over 20,000 a game in 2009 and almost 20,000 in 2011. 14,529 in 2012. Best attendance under PJ was 19,441/game in 2015, but the #'s were skewed by the 30,000+ for MSU. Then 23,838/game in 2016. Those numbers effected by ESPN Gameday and no home midweek MACTION games played. In year one under PJ, WMU's average attendance was 17,347. Year two, 14,579.

I agree. Anyone who says WMU football was ****** or no one cared prior to Fleck is delusional. (But I don't think it's fair to pull out the MSU or Gameday games, especially the Gameday game)

(08-02-2018 12:02 PM)WMUPorter Wrote:  There was absolutely no excitement surrounding the program..........to change the culture and get people excited about WMU football

That's a problem all MAC schools face.

What was clear: Cubit wasn't going to win a MAC Championship.

So maybe you're right: there was some excitement in that people believed WMU would win a MACC under Fleck.

(08-02-2018 11:30 AM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  If Alex Carder hadn't been injured in the UConn game, WMU would have won at least another 3 games and Bowl eligible. Fleck would not have been hired. There was enough talent on the roster to win more than one game in 2013. That tells me either PJ didn't know how to coach or he intentionally tubed the program to make himself look better with the turn around. Watching his modus operandi, I would assume the latter. I don't see that Fleck inherited a hot mess. A good JUCO QB would have probably been enough to keep WMU on the winning track in 2013.

Interesting assessment. Usually I say 'if you go 2-2 OOC you're going to have a good year' and we did start off 2-2 in 2012. Then what happened? Carder went down. What did we have in 2017? A new QB. You live and die by the QB.

(07-30-2018 09:22 AM)Aimless1 Wrote:  Would never speak for a group I don't belong to. I can only speak for the former players I know and talk to. In general, hated Fleck & love Lester. I think most fans in the stands are on the fence on Lester, at least in my immediate area in Waldo. Personally, I loved Peej on field success but hated that he didn't build a program. I also felt he took a lot of chances recruiting, some of which paid off. Again, I'm lukewarm to Timbo. Game management seems to be a major weakness. Not holding last year against him though. New system, program changed, injuries, receivers couldn't catch and linebackers seemed lost.

Interesting............What about Fleck did they hate and what do they love about Lester? Is liking a coach always a good thing?

(07-30-2018 09:10 AM)RunningGame Wrote:  

(07-30-2018 06:14 AM)Aimless1 Wrote:  Couple of curiosity questions ....

Have you played football?

Do you have season tickets?

I played high school ball and we have season tickets.

I find ex players, especially ex college players, have a different view of the program than fans do. "Retired" Broncos certainly see Lester in a different light than I do.

Many of you live too far away to attend games. If you live close enough I hope you are able to support the team. Nothing quite like watching the game in Waldo.

Played HS football, linebacker mostly.

Coached several years of middle school football, offense mostly (hey, I called a pass play at least once a game!!!).

Season ticket holder since 2002 season, though I bummed them off my father-in-law for a few years in between.

Recovering Lions fan. I've been clean since 2014.

When I was younger I loved the Lions and thought they'd get good someday. I didn't like college football because even when I was younger I thought UofM and MSU were sleazy as hell.
Now I like WMU/G5 football, don't care as much for the Lions, and still think MSU and UofM are sleazy.

(07-30-2018 07:12 AM)bronco89 Wrote:  I played at Western in the early 80s and go every chance I get. My son goes their now so I can combine a visit with taking in a game.

That's great! Does your son go to a lot of the games?

(07-30-2018 07:12 AM)bronco89 Wrote:  I like Tim, and think that he will be just fine. He needs to find his footing and it may take another year but, from what I heard, the players love him.

Definitely. What bothers a lot of people tho: We were coming off a Cotton Bowl and we hire someone with average experience? I'm just playing devil's advocate. I don't and didn't dislike the hire.

(07-30-2018 07:12 AM)bronco89 Wrote:  I also enjoyed the energy and attention that Fleck brought to the program. I did hear that he was a bit of a prick to play for and that it was all about him.... but most coaches at that level have that personality type. Elliot and Jack where hardly the group hug types.

Definitely too. I know a couple Grand Valley St players who decommited from WMU because of Fleck the person.

My son is a sports nut so he does go to a lot of games. I do think Lester will do well, his game management will develop. If the players ended up at GVSU they probably wouldn’t have seen the field at Western.

I am happy he's continuing your legacy like I'm continuing the legacy of my family who are WMU sports nuts. :)
What's he think of the team? (Always good to get insight from students! :) )

Also, I agree about those GVSU players too. They painted it as they didn't like Fleck the person, but I'm sure their playing skill played a role in that too.