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2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
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TribeNiner Offline
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Post: #41
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-17-2018 10:51 AM)va-eagle Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 08:01 AM)TribeNiner Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 05:02 PM)va-eagle Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 01:58 PM)TribeNiner Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 01:26 PM)TTT Wrote:  I promise this is not a jab or anything but I just don't understand how a school like USM in such a small market can get more people at their bb games (with our basketball warts and all) than schools in San Antonio and Miami/Boca...

A lot of it has to do with competition for the entertainment dollar. If you're the only show in town, that's where people go. If you're one of 75 different things to do on a Saturday afternoon (like Miami), then you've got to work pretty damn hard to beat out the beach, restaurants, clubs, professional sports, other schools, etc.

Obviously, winning/success is one of the best ways to overcome that challenge, but it's an uphill battle.

BS... they have what, 50k students.

If there are 10 things to do on a given Saturday afternoon for a student in Miami, all equally appealing, then 50k/10 would mean an average of about 5k per event. There are more than 10 things, but we'll go with that because it makes the math easy.

If there are 3 things to do on a given Saturday afternoon for a student in Hattiesburg, all equally appealing, then 15k/3 would mean an average of about 5k per event.

I think it's pretty easy, even by just back of the napkin math, to understand why competition for the attention of the customer can easily impact attendance.

Your example supports the comment that high population should still enable good attendance, even with more entertainment options.

Actually my example addresses your original question as to why attendance can be similar in a high population market vs a low population market.
07-17-2018 11:16 AM
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JCMiner Offline
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Post: #42
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-16-2018 02:31 PM)CardinalBlackTrojan Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 02:01 PM)MUther Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 12:40 PM)CardinalBlackTrojan Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 12:23 PM)Dawgxas Wrote:  Rank 21. Sun Belt 12 180 369,014 2,050 -78 6 9,902 1,650

Hey at least were not the Sunbelt, but they're a football conference... 03-lmfao

You cease to amaze me with your Sun Belt obsession. Is that just a La Tech thing?? That seems to be the trend for some strange reason...

Says the guy reading the CUSA board full time looking for any mention of the 'belt. 03-nutkick

No... was just curious how CUSA schools did attendance-wise in basketball... and just happened to stumble upon a strange mention of the Sun Belt in a CUSA basketball attendance thread. 03-melodramatic
Do you get email notifications for every new thread posted on this board or do check this board every 20 minutes?
07-17-2018 12:14 PM
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va-eagle Offline
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Post: #43
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-17-2018 11:16 AM)TribeNiner Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 10:51 AM)va-eagle Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 08:01 AM)TribeNiner Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 05:02 PM)va-eagle Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 01:58 PM)TribeNiner Wrote:  A lot of it has to do with competition for the entertainment dollar. If you're the only show in town, that's where people go. If you're one of 75 different things to do on a Saturday afternoon (like Miami), then you've got to work pretty damn hard to beat out the beach, restaurants, clubs, professional sports, other schools, etc.

Obviously, winning/success is one of the best ways to overcome that challenge, but it's an uphill battle.

BS... they have what, 50k students.

If there are 10 things to do on a given Saturday afternoon for a student in Miami, all equally appealing, then 50k/10 would mean an average of about 5k per event. There are more than 10 things, but we'll go with that because it makes the math easy.

If there are 3 things to do on a given Saturday afternoon for a student in Hattiesburg, all equally appealing, then 15k/3 would mean an average of about 5k per event.

I think it's pretty easy, even by just back of the napkin math, to understand why competition for the attention of the customer can easily impact attendance.

Your example supports the comment that high population should still enable good attendance, even with more entertainment options.

Actually my example addresses your original question as to why attendance can be similar in a high population market vs a low population market.

No where have I asked that question. But okay.
07-17-2018 12:30 PM
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OwlFamily Offline
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Post: #44
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
OwlFamily says Basketball is by far an afterthought in South Florida.

Even with a top team I doubt you would get lots of people to come watch it. The weather is too perfect in S. Florida during basketball season to go watch someone put a ball thru a peach basket.

Im too lazy to look it up but I believe UMiami had a good team this year and Id bet they probably didnt knock it out of the park on attendance.
(This post was last modified: 07-17-2018 12:31 PM by OwlFamily.)
07-17-2018 12:30 PM
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FAU Connoisseur Offline
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Post: #45
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-17-2018 12:30 PM)OwlFamily Wrote:  OwlFamily says Basketball is by far an afterthought in South Florida.

Even with a top team I doubt you would get lots of people to come watch it. The weather is too perfect in S. Florida during basketball season to go watch someone put a ball thru a peach basket.

Im too lazy to look it up but I believe UMiami had a good team this year and Id bet they probably didnt knock it out of the park on attendance.

They averaged 7,100 in 2017...their arena is just under 8,000. They did pretty good.
07-17-2018 12:34 PM
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OwlFamily Offline
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Post: #46
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-17-2018 12:34 PM)FAU Connoisseur Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 12:30 PM)OwlFamily Wrote:  OwlFamily says Basketball is by far an afterthought in South Florida.

Even with a top team I doubt you would get lots of people to come watch it. The weather is too perfect in S. Florida during basketball season to go watch someone put a ball thru a peach basket.

Im too lazy to look it up but I believe UMiami had a good team this year and Id bet they probably didnt knock it out of the park on attendance.

They averaged 7,100 in 2017...their arena is just under 8,000. They did pretty good.

OwlFamily admits he was wrong then. 04-cheers
07-17-2018 12:35 PM
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TOPSTRAIGHT Offline
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Post: #47
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
UTEP may have MORE overall sports POTENTIAL than anyone in the conference.

Also--it is obvious that UAB is under performing in basketball attendance.

Additinally, LA TECH and North Texas should have bigger crowds when you consider the strength of their teams.

At WKU we must also improve.
(This post was last modified: 07-17-2018 12:47 PM by TOPSTRAIGHT.)
07-17-2018 12:43 PM
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inutech Offline
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Post: #48
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-16-2018 09:41 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  Again I will point out attendance numbers means very little.....

I would like to see dollars generated off tickets sold vs attendance.

I find it hard to believe that anyone would care about either.

Seems like you could maybe find some other metric to measure success in basketball. . .
07-17-2018 01:02 PM
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ThreeifbyLightning Offline
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Post: #49
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-16-2018 09:41 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  Again I will point out attendance numbers means very little.....

I would like to see dollars generated off tickets sold vs attendance. There's only a couple schools in this conference that puts a value on ticket cost over butts.

Other words at 2 schools you wont find dollar night or a side door open where no one cares if you just walk on in like there is at a lot of schools in CUSA. It makes a huge difference in attendance when you have to pay $15 to $25 dollars to attend a game vs tickets that are free or discounted to $1-$5

I guarantee you that ODU's and Western's attendance numbers go way up with the games some schools in this conference plays. Hell Western's attendance moves to well over 6k if you just count tickets sold. I can't speak for ODU on that.

When you actually sell all tickets to all seats and your listed attendance is a 800 to 1000 under cap...it goes to show that school is counting butts. Not sold tickets.

Listed Attendance is just as much a game in basketball as it is in football...other words meaningless

Actually they do mean something. There is a balance to that. Consider two schools that bring in the same revenue. If school A always has a full arena but essentially gives away the tickets they are losing out on a good portion of revenue. If school B charges a lot but has a 80% empty arena they are missing out on developing a culture/brand.

The balance comes from generating both revenue not just from tickets but concessions, merchandise, etc., while also creating the best possible environment. It's one of the hardest things to do in G5 life - as football for all of us demonstrates.
07-17-2018 01:09 PM
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TribeNiner Offline
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Post: #50
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-17-2018 12:30 PM)va-eagle Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 11:16 AM)TribeNiner Wrote:  Actually my example addresses your original question as to why attendance can be similar in a high population market vs a low population market.

No where have I asked that question. But okay.

Can't tell if you're joking or not, but:

"I just don't understand how a school like USM in such a small market can get more people at their bb games (with our basketball warts and all) than schools in San Antonio and Miami/Boca..."

You expressed mystification about relative attendance between a school in a small market and schools in a big market. My example pretty directly answered how competition for attention can nullify a seeming advantage of a larger population center.
07-17-2018 01:12 PM
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odu09 Offline
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Post: #51
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-17-2018 01:02 PM)inutech Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 09:41 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  Again I will point out attendance numbers means very little.....

I would like to see dollars generated off tickets sold vs attendance.

I find it hard to believe that anyone would care about either.

Seems like you could maybe find some other metric to measure success in basketball. . .

Attendance numbers aren't meant to become a pissing match, as often as that's what it becomes. Rather, it's a pretty telling metric for fan support. Using these numbers compared to results, you could reasonably state that UTEP has among the best fan support in the league since they finished 3rd in attendance while finishing 12th in standings. Compare that to UTSA, who finished in the bottom of attendance while finishing 5th in standings.
(This post was last modified: 07-17-2018 02:03 PM by odu09.)
07-17-2018 02:02 PM
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inutech Offline
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Post: #52
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-17-2018 02:02 PM)odu09 Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 01:02 PM)inutech Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 09:41 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  Again I will point out attendance numbers means very little.....

I would like to see dollars generated off tickets sold vs attendance.

I find it hard to believe that anyone would care about either.

Seems like you could maybe find some other metric to measure success in basketball. . .

Attendance numbers aren't meant to become a pissing match, as often as that's what it becomes. Rather, it's a pretty telling metric for fan support. Using these numbers compared to results, you could reasonably state that UTEP has among the best fan support in the league since they finished 3rd in attendance while finishing 12th in standings. Compare that to UTSA, who finished in the bottom of attendance while finishing 5th in standings.

Meh.

I like basketball, some people like attendanceball. Different strokes I guess.

I really don't care about any other school's fan support. I mean, I get that in theory it matters for tv deals or conference realignment or whatever. I have a vested interest in my school's marketing and pricing and reputation, but ultimately it's all beyond my control, and I'm cool with that (because I don't really care about it very much).

Even if debating this on the internet non-stop somehow unearths some great revelation (like UTSA doesn't have good basketball attendance), then so what? They're not going anywhere (and neither is anyone else, at least for the time being). What's the point? Why should I care about UTSA's basketball support?

I'd rather debate their basketball product.
07-17-2018 02:17 PM
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odu09 Offline
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Post: #53
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-17-2018 02:17 PM)inutech Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 02:02 PM)odu09 Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 01:02 PM)inutech Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 09:41 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  Again I will point out attendance numbers means very little.....

I would like to see dollars generated off tickets sold vs attendance.

I find it hard to believe that anyone would care about either.

Seems like you could maybe find some other metric to measure success in basketball. . .

Attendance numbers aren't meant to become a pissing match, as often as that's what it becomes. Rather, it's a pretty telling metric for fan support. Using these numbers compared to results, you could reasonably state that UTEP has among the best fan support in the league since they finished 3rd in attendance while finishing 12th in standings. Compare that to UTSA, who finished in the bottom of attendance while finishing 5th in standings.

Meh.

I like basketball, some people like attendanceball. Different strokes I guess.

I really don't care about any other school's fan support. I mean, I get that in theory it matters for tv deals or conference realignment or whatever. I have a vested interest in my school's marketing and pricing and reputation, but ultimately it's all beyond my control, and I'm cool with that (because I don't really care about it very much).

Even if debating this on the internet non-stop somehow unearths some great revelation (like UTSA doesn't have good basketball attendance), then so what? They're not going anywhere (and neither is anyone else, at least for the time being). What's the point? Why should I care about UTSA's basketball support?

I'd rather debate their basketball product.

Okay. We all very much appreciate you chiming in to let us all know that you don't care.
07-17-2018 02:21 PM
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inutech Offline
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Post: #54
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-17-2018 02:21 PM)odu09 Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 02:17 PM)inutech Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 02:02 PM)odu09 Wrote:  
(07-17-2018 01:02 PM)inutech Wrote:  
(07-16-2018 09:41 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  Again I will point out attendance numbers means very little.....

I would like to see dollars generated off tickets sold vs attendance.

I find it hard to believe that anyone would care about either.

Seems like you could maybe find some other metric to measure success in basketball. . .

Attendance numbers aren't meant to become a pissing match, as often as that's what it becomes. Rather, it's a pretty telling metric for fan support. Using these numbers compared to results, you could reasonably state that UTEP has among the best fan support in the league since they finished 3rd in attendance while finishing 12th in standings. Compare that to UTSA, who finished in the bottom of attendance while finishing 5th in standings.

Meh.

I like basketball, some people like attendanceball. Different strokes I guess.

I really don't care about any other school's fan support. I mean, I get that in theory it matters for tv deals or conference realignment or whatever. I have a vested interest in my school's marketing and pricing and reputation, but ultimately it's all beyond my control, and I'm cool with that (because I don't really care about it very much).

Even if debating this on the internet non-stop somehow unearths some great revelation (like UTSA doesn't have good basketball attendance), then so what? They're not going anywhere (and neither is anyone else, at least for the time being). What's the point? Why should I care about UTSA's basketball support?

I'd rather debate their basketball product.

Okay. We all very much appreciate you chiming in to let us all know that you don't care.

Anytime.

But that wasn't the only point of my posts.

In addition to chiming in to let y'all know that I don't care, I also wanted to offer a better metric for discussing basketball in general (in the spirit of contribution).

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...conference
07-17-2018 02:31 PM
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ghostofclt Offline
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Post: #55
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
clt says attendance is part of the basketball product that is brought to the table
07-17-2018 05:45 PM
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herdfan129 Offline
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Post: #56
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
If UTEP starts winning again then WATCH OUT!
07-17-2018 09:43 PM
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stanman505 Offline
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Post: #57
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
I will say that I think UTEP will see a small increase in attendance this year with the coaching change. The 4 transfers sitting out this year are, IMO, better than any 4 we will have on the floor this year. With that said I think UTEP is going to be really good 2019-2020 season and will average 9-10k per game. During the 2004-2005 season UTEP average 10,405 and in 2006 it was 9,694. My senior year at UTEP was in 1987-1988 and they averaged 11,106 in an arena that has a capacity of 12,000. We had to camp out to get student tickets.
(This post was last modified: 07-22-2018 10:03 AM by stanman505.)
07-22-2018 10:00 AM
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Dawgxas Offline
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Post: #58
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
Some of you forget how small the population is in Ruston, 21k with a metro of 47k.

Who else averages 15% of their population? No one in CUSA that’s for sure!

The next closest in CUSA are at Bowling Green metro 165k and Hattiesburg metro 147K

Now look at the metro areas of Norfolk, Denton, Birmingham, El Paso or Nashville no comparison
07-22-2018 04:33 PM
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ghostofclt Offline
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Post: #59
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-22-2018 04:33 PM)Dawgxas Wrote:  Some of you forget how small the population is in Ruston, 21k with a metro of 47k.

Who else averages 15% of their population? No one in CUSA that’s for sure!

The next closest in CUSA are at Bowling Green metro 165k and Hattiesburg metro 147K

Now look at the metro areas of Norfolk, Denton, Birmingham, El Paso or Nashville no comparison


clt says or even a larger city like Houston or Charlotte.
07-22-2018 05:50 PM
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eager eagle Offline
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Post: #60
RE: 2018 Men's Basketball Attendance
(07-16-2018 11:46 AM)odu09 Wrote:  Attendance from the 2017-18 season for MBB has been released:

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketba...ndance.pdf

These figures mean absolutely nothing and are meaningless until they decide to define and set some parameters. First, what is the definition of attendance? Is it actual butts in the seats, is it ticket sold plus students, is it tickets used plus students, is it "estimated attendance", is it "announced attendance", is it "official attendance", or is it what some athletic director thinks it should be. They should implement rules that attendance is determined by the number of bodies that enter the venue 2hrs before and during game time. This includes refs, players, media, students, or EVERY swinging you know what that comes inside as determined by turnstiles at each and every entrance. This would exclude ambulance drivers, etc or others that come and go into the stadium via vehicle. Put that rule in place and then we can compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges. Otherwise our time is wasted on the discussion.
07-22-2018 08:27 PM
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