(06-25-2018 11:37 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 07:21 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  NFL is 50 plus 5 practice squad players I believe.

There is no need to run 85 scholarship programs.

The NFL also allows the signing of free agent players to fill roster spots opened by injury, release, etc. That option is not available to college programs.

Practice squads have 10 players on them. Regular rosters have 53. Total of 63 per NFL team.

And as already pointed out, NFL teams can sign any number of free agent guys to fill out rosters at any time during the season. Which they do quite regularly, as injuries can decimate positions at times.

Setting scholarship limits based on an NFL roster is not the best idea.

(06-25-2018 06:13 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Would it be in the PAC's interest to try and lower the number of FBS scholarships down to a number such as 70 or 75?

I can see where it could make them more competitive and also be good for the G5 too.

Somebody needs to send a memo to the Pac-12 and tell them to stop winning national championships because they cannot compete with the other power conferences. Forget the 512 national championships, which are about 200 more than the conference in second place (the Big Ten).

The Pac-12 obviously sucks in football, even though they did go 2-0 against the SEC in football this past season with UCLA beating Texas A&M and Cal beating Ole Miss. UCLA and USC clearly cannot compete with the SEC in football, even though they both have winning records against the SEC.

Oregon State has no business playing for a national championship in baseball against Arkansas, even though the Pac-12 has won 28 national championships in baseball, 16 more than the next best conference (SEC).

I don't know how the failing Pac-12 has made it this far...

(06-25-2018 11:21 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 10:58 AM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 08:01 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 07:55 AM)ken d Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 06:13 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Would it be in the PAC's interest to try and lower the number of FBS scholarships down to a number such as 70 or 75?

I can see where it could make them more competitive and also be good for the G5 too.

I could see how this would help the G5 schools, but not the PAC. The PAC would be better off picking a fight they could actually win.

I do not know how the PAC 12 could pick a fight when they lose to G5 and FCS teams a lot. There is no reason for a PAC 12 school to lose to Portland State (cough, Oregon State, cough).

Current FCS teams wins vs Current P5 teams
ACC - 17
Big 12 - 14
PAC-12 - 10
Big Ten - 9
SEC - 6

Facts get in your way once again.

2 things.
1- what's the time frame?
2- how many games vs FCS opponents?

Since 1978

(06-25-2018 07:21 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  NFL is 50 plus 5 practice squad players I believe.

There is no need to run 85 scholarship programs.

Except when you have excessive injuries in the NFL, you trade for a replacement player or hire someone who is not on a team. In college your limited to that 85 players and usually 20-25 of them are redshirting. Up until this year that limited you to 60-65 players. Now, at least, you can dip into your redshirts without them losing a year of eligibility.

(06-25-2018 12:01 PM)Pervis_Griffith Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 11:37 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 07:21 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  NFL is 50 plus 5 practice squad players I believe.

There is no need to run 85 scholarship programs.

The NFL also allows the signing of free agent players to fill roster spots opened by injury, release, etc. That option is not available to college programs.

Practice squads have 10 players on them. Regular rosters have 53. Total of 63 per NFL team.

And as already pointed out, NFL teams can sign any number of free agent guys to fill out rosters at any time during the season. Which they do quite regularly, as injuries can decimate positions at times.

Setting scholarship limits based on an NFL roster is not the best idea.

Setting almost any policy regarding college football because the NFL does it is not the best idea.

(06-25-2018 06:13 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Would it be in the PAC's interest to try and lower the number of FBS scholarships down to a number such as 70 or 75?

I can see where it could make them more competitive and also be good for the G5 too.

oh boy...

(06-25-2018 01:34 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 11:21 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 10:58 AM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 08:01 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 07:55 AM)ken d Wrote:  I could see how this would help the G5 schools, but not the PAC. The PAC would be better off picking a fight they could actually win.

I do not know how the PAC 12 could pick a fight when they lose to G5 and FCS teams a lot. There is no reason for a PAC 12 school to lose to Portland State (cough, Oregon State, cough).

Current FCS teams wins vs Current P5 teams
ACC - 17
Big 12 - 14
PAC-12 - 10
Big Ten - 9
SEC - 6

Facts get in your way once again.

2 things.
1- what's the time frame?
2- how many games vs FCS opponents?

Since 1978

I am talking about 2000 and beyond. Eastern Washington, Sacramento State and Portland State have been the most recent upset wins.

(06-25-2018 03:23 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 01:34 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 11:21 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 10:58 AM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 08:01 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  I do not know how the PAC 12 could pick a fight when they lose to G5 and FCS teams a lot. There is no reason for a PAC 12 school to lose to Portland State (cough, Oregon State, cough).

Current FCS teams wins vs Current P5 teams
ACC - 17
Big 12 - 14
PAC-12 - 10
Big Ten - 9
SEC - 6

Facts get in your way once again.

2 things.
1- what's the time frame?
2- how many games vs FCS opponents?

Since 1978

I am talking about 2000 and beyond. Eastern Washington, Sacramento State and Portland State have been the most recent upset wins.

https://herosports.com/news/complete-lis...teams-ajaj

(06-25-2018 01:39 PM)ChrisLords Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 07:21 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  NFL is 50 plus 5 practice squad players I believe.

There is no need to run 85 scholarship programs.

Except when you have excessive injuries in the NFL, you trade for a replacement player or hire someone who is not on a team. In college your limited to that 85 players and usually 20-25 of them are redshirting. Up until this year that limited you to 60-65 players. Now, at least, you can dip into your redshirts without them losing a year of eligibility.

Use the walk on program.

(06-25-2018 04:20 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 03:23 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 01:34 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 11:21 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 10:58 AM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  Current FCS teams wins vs Current P5 teams
ACC - 17
Big 12 - 14
PAC-12 - 10
Big Ten - 9
SEC - 6

Facts get in your way once again.

2 things.
1- what's the time frame?
2- how many games vs FCS opponents?

Since 1978

I am talking about 2000 and beyond. Eastern Washington, Sacramento State and Portland State have been the most recent upset wins.

https://herosports.com/news/complete-lis...teams-ajaj

Dude who compiled that list must be a Michigan fan, because he uses "current FCS teams" to allow himself to leave App State's win over Michigan off of his list.

(06-25-2018 07:21 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  NFL is 50 plus 5 practice squad players I believe.

There is no need to run 85 scholarship programs.

No, but the autonomous conferences want more so they can stockpile players, widening the gap. It also allows for powers to weather down years and make more mistakes picking players.

75 would be more than enough.

(06-25-2018 11:37 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 07:21 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  NFL is 50 plus 5 practice squad players I believe.

There is no need to run 85 scholarship programs.

The NFL also allows the signing of free agent players to fill roster spots opened by injury, release, etc. That option is not available to college programs.

Its called walk-ons. Seems like somebody did that for a kicker in the last couple of years.

(06-25-2018 12:01 PM)Pervis_Griffith Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 11:37 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 07:21 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  NFL is 50 plus 5 practice squad players I believe.

There is no need to run 85 scholarship programs.

The NFL also allows the signing of free agent players to fill roster spots opened by injury, release, etc. That option is not available to college programs.

Practice squads have 10 players on them. Regular rosters have 53. Total of 63 per NFL team.

And as already pointed out, NFL teams can sign any number of free agent guys to fill out rosters at any time during the season. Which they do quite regularly, as injuries can decimate positions at times.

Setting scholarship limits based on an NFL roster is not the best idea.

In the 60s and 70s, the NFL had 40 man rosters with a 7 man taxi squad.

here's what it is since 2000 (thru looks like 2016- no 2017 games on there)
Big 10 9
ACC 7
Pac 12 7
Big 12 7
SEC 3

looks like there was 1 FCS over FBS upset in 2017 in P5- Liberty over Baylor. But Liberty will be going FBS so kind of a tweener....

B1G would also enjoy that scholly cut.

I'd also drop the minimum required sport total in FBS to 14.

(06-25-2018 05:22 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 04:20 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 03:23 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 01:34 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 11:21 AM)stever20 Wrote:  2 things.
1- what's the time frame?
2- how many games vs FCS opponents?

Since 1978

I am talking about 2000 and beyond. Eastern Washington, Sacramento State and Portland State have been the most recent upset wins.

https://herosports.com/news/complete-lis...teams-ajaj

Dude who compiled that list must be a Michigan fan, because he uses "current FCS teams" to allow himself to leave App State's win over Michigan off of his list.

also Georgia Southern's win over Florida was left off as well.
He did not update it for last year's upset as Liberty took down Baylor.

(06-25-2018 04:20 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 03:23 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 01:34 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 11:21 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 10:58 AM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  Current FCS teams wins vs Current P5 teams
ACC - 17
Big 12 - 14
PAC-12 - 10
Big Ten - 9
SEC - 6

Facts get in your way once again.

2 things.
1- what's the time frame?
2- how many games vs FCS opponents?

Since 1978

I am talking about 2000 and beyond. Eastern Washington, Sacramento State and Portland State have been the most recent upset wins.

https://herosports.com/news/complete-lis...teams-ajaj

So, by that list, FCS schools have won against P5 teams an average of 1.4 times a year, against teams that averaged 3.6 wins per season. I don't find that hard to believe. Or especially enlightening.

(06-25-2018 12:29 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 06:13 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Would it be in the PAC's interest to try and lower the number of FBS scholarships down to a number such as 70 or 75?

I can see where it could make them more competitive and also be good for the G5 too.

Somebody needs to send a memo to the Pac-12 and tell them to stop winning national championships because they cannot compete with the other power conferences. Forget the 512 national championships, which are about 200 more than the conference in second place (the Big Ten).

The Pac-12 obviously sucks in football, even though they did go 2-0 against the SEC in football this past season with UCLA beating Texas A&M and Cal beating Ole Miss. UCLA and USC clearly cannot compete with the SEC in football, even though they both have winning records against the SEC.

Oregon State has no business playing for a national championship in baseball against Arkansas, even though the Pac-12 has won 28 national championships in baseball, 16 more than the next best conference (SEC).

I don't know how the failing Pac-12 has made it this far...

This OP is not a poop on the PAC.

Its a different way of solving the PAC's football problem since they can't expand in a way that increases revenue.

(06-25-2018 07:08 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  B1G would also enjoy that scholly cut.

I'd also drop the minimum required sport total in FBS to 14.

They are never going to make it easier for FCS schools to move up.

(06-25-2018 05:50 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 12:01 PM)Pervis_Griffith Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 11:37 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(06-25-2018 07:21 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  NFL is 50 plus 5 practice squad players I believe.

There is no need to run 85 scholarship programs.

The NFL also allows the signing of free agent players to fill roster spots opened by injury, release, etc. That option is not available to college programs.

Practice squads have 10 players on them. Regular rosters have 53. Total of 63 per NFL team.

And as already pointed out, NFL teams can sign any number of free agent guys to fill out rosters at any time during the season. Which they do quite regularly, as injuries can decimate positions at times.

Setting scholarship limits based on an NFL roster is not the best idea.

In the 60s and 70s, the NFL had 40 man rosters with a 7 man taxi squad.

I have no idea how that is relevant to this conversation.

But ... to play along ... in the 60's and 70's there were NO scholly limits for college teams. And power house programs used that to their advantage.

Tony Dorsett's freshmen year Pitt had a freshmen class of something like 60 players. And Pitt wasn't the only school doing that. It's just one example. (But Pitt did win a national title before TD left. So it worked well for them.)