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RiceFootball2K5 Offline
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Post: #41
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
Schlossnagle at TCU has said that he is going to meet with Mississippi State and "hear what they have to say". That will probably happen today or tomorrow. If he takes the MSU job, TCU will promote Saarloos to head coach in a split second.
05-29-2018 12:12 PM
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Post: #42
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 11:45 AM)mysticman Wrote:  While it is fun to read these post, none of the statements are remotely accurate

Got it. You know stuff and we don't.

Of course, this thread is primarily opinions and admitted speculation. To which inaccuracies do you refer?
05-29-2018 12:26 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 09:53 AM)HooCares Wrote:  
(05-29-2018 08:44 AM)Viejobuho Wrote:  Pro Berkman
Yesterday consulted former Astro (and Rice one-year volunteer coach) Dickie Thon: "...Berkman excellent...".
Good enough for me!
Not good enough for me. Since HC's wear the university's uniform, they need to project the right image, including being judicious about voicing personal political views. I'm not sure he knows when to shut his mouth. Who one wants to hire a PR headache?
He has said he really wants to be a preacher. Why doesn't he just go do that?

Well, if you don’t like Berkman for that reason then you probably wouldn’t like Matt Deggs either. That eliminates two of the top candidates from your short list.
(This post was last modified: 05-29-2018 12:48 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
05-29-2018 12:46 PM
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HooCares Offline
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Post: #44
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 12:46 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(05-29-2018 09:53 AM)HooCares Wrote:  
(05-29-2018 08:44 AM)Viejobuho Wrote:  Pro Berkman
Yesterday consulted former Astro (and Rice one-year volunteer coach) Dickie Thon: "...Berkman excellent...".
Good enough for me!
Not good enough for me. Since HC's wear the university's uniform, they need to project the right image, including being judicious about voicing personal political views. I'm not sure he knows when to shut his mouth. Who one wants to hire a PR headache?
He has said he really wants to be a preacher. Why doesn't he just go do that?

Well, if you don’t like Berkman for that reason then you probably wouldn’t like Matt Deggs either. That eliminates two of the top candidates from your short list.

I'm not aware of Deggs being very vocal with political stuff, but I confess to not knowing much about him beyond his record at Sam.
05-29-2018 01:35 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #45
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 01:35 PM)HooCares Wrote:  
(05-29-2018 12:46 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(05-29-2018 09:53 AM)HooCares Wrote:  
(05-29-2018 08:44 AM)Viejobuho Wrote:  Pro Berkman
Yesterday consulted former Astro (and Rice one-year volunteer coach) Dickie Thon: "...Berkman excellent...".
Good enough for me!
Not good enough for me. Since HC's wear the university's uniform, they need to project the right image, including being judicious about voicing personal political views. I'm not sure he knows when to shut his mouth. Who one wants to hire a PR headache?
He has said he really wants to be a preacher. Why doesn't he just go do that?
Well, if you don’t like Berkman for that reason then you probably wouldn’t like Matt Deggs either. That eliminates two of the top candidates from your short list.
I'm not aware of Deggs being very vocal with political stuff, but I confess to not knowing much about him beyond his record at Sam.

I don't know that Huntsville has many political controversies like a bathroom bill. Matt is probably more like Hatfield than like Berkman. But if you don't like a heavy Christian theme, you probably won't enjoy his interviews.
05-29-2018 03:10 PM
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Post: #46
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 09:42 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 08:51 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  Wait a minute?

So our target market for someone to replace one of the top coaches in the history of baseball because for the first time in a quarter century he didn't make the post-season, is a coach who didn't make the post season?

If that's the plan, then it better be Berkman WITH Pettit and then include someone like Pope AND Hallmark... At least that way we'd get some detailed college experience to go along with the 'splash' and potential.

I think it's disingenuous to suggest that the OG not making the post-season this year is the reason we decided not to renew his contract.

We've been on a steady decline for almost a decade now, as unfortunate as it is to say it, his age is now a negative for incoming recruits, and as others have alluded to, it seems as if our current players are not connecting with him as well as others used to.

College baseball has seen at least three long-time coaches step down this year (Rice, Miami, UCI). Of those three, two decided to step down because they recognized that their time had come. While we will all owe Wayne a debt forever, I do think he was a year or two late on realizing that all good things must come to an end and the torch needed to be passed.

Even the best can't be the best for forever.

Since we decided to not renew his contract long before we didn't make the tournament, It probably would be disingenuous to suggest that, which is why it isn't what I suggested.

If you're going to chastise me, I'd appreciate it if you'd stick to what I said and not simply look for reasons to keep replying with the same tired line beating the same dead horse.

The point is that if we're doing as some suggest and naming a coach within 7-14 days, that more than likely means we've already narrowed the list down and it DOESN'T include ANYONE whose season either has already ended, or will end very soon.

Unless you not only know more about what current players think, but you can also predict the tournament, that means an awful lot of people from good programs aren't even being considered.

Now to the Berkman comment.... I'm not nearly as excited about the TCU crew as others are. Saarloos is from Cali but turned down Stanford and others are after him as well, which means he won't remotely be cheap... and despite having potential, that's all it is at this point and doesn't excite me. I haven't watched them this year so perhaps there is a legitimate reason, but it sounds like they had a rather spectacular downturn this year. Taking #3 from that team is an even bigger risk. If we're going to take a big risk, I'd prefer to do it with someone who will be relatively cheap so that we can either re-deploy resources around them to help them, or we can redeploy those resources to improve other sports with more financial upside. As I understand it, Berkman could come relatively cheap for US for his own personal reasons at least up front and we could address some of the noted deficiencies/concerns around him OR we can redeploy those resources elsewhere.

The worst thing in the world for Rice Athletics and Rice Baseball would be for us to PAY top 25 money to a new baseball coach who is mostly potential and end up with top 100 results.

The biggest problem in my mind with someone like Saarloos is that he won't remotely come cheap. That's fine if he ends up returning us to Omaha with regularity... but we have to pay him as if he's already done that in order to find out, and then likely even more to keep him from leaving



(05-28-2018 09:07 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 08:51 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  Wait a minute?

So our target market for someone to replace one of the top coaches in the history of baseball because for the first time in a quarter century he didn't make the post-season, is a coach who didn't make the post season?

If that's the plan, then it better be Berkman WITH Pettit and then include someone like Pope AND Hallmark... At least that way we'd get some detailed college experience to go along with the 'splash' and potential.

Well I think its disingenuous to suggest that making the post-season from the Southland is as easy as from Rice. Not only are the conference opponents worse, they don't have the scheduling "capital" that Rice does in the non-conference not to mention facilities, assistant salaries, etc...

Where did you remotely get anything about the Southland Conference from my comment?
(This post was last modified: 05-29-2018 03:19 PM by Hambone10.)
05-29-2018 03:15 PM
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ExcitedOwl18 Online
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Post: #47
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 03:15 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  
(05-29-2018 09:42 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 08:51 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  Wait a minute?

So our target market for someone to replace one of the top coaches in the history of baseball because for the first time in a quarter century he didn't make the post-season, is a coach who didn't make the post season?

If that's the plan, then it better be Berkman WITH Pettit and then include someone like Pope AND Hallmark... At least that way we'd get some detailed college experience to go along with the 'splash' and potential.

I think it's disingenuous to suggest that the OG not making the post-season this year is the reason we decided not to renew his contract.

We've been on a steady decline for almost a decade now, as unfortunate as it is to say it, his age is now a negative for incoming recruits, and as others have alluded to, it seems as if our current players are not connecting with him as well as others used to.

College baseball has seen at least three long-time coaches step down this year (Rice, Miami, UCI). Of those three, two decided to step down because they recognized that their time had come. While we will all owe Wayne a debt forever, I do think he was a year or two late on realizing that all good things must come to an end and the torch needed to be passed.

Even the best can't be the best for forever.

Since we decided to not renew his contract long before we didn't make the tournament, It probably would be disingenuous to suggest that, which is why it isn't what I suggested.

If you're going to chastise me, I'd appreciate it if you'd stick to what I said and not simply look for reasons to keep replying with the same tired line beating the same dead horse.

The point is that if we're doing as some suggest and naming a coach within 7-14 days, that more than likely means we've already narrowed the list down and it DOESN'T include ANYONE whose season either has already ended, or will end very soon.

Unless you not only know more about what current players think, but you can also predict the tournament, that means an awful lot of people from good programs aren't even being considered.

Now to the Berkman comment.... I'm not nearly as excited about the TCU crew as others are. Saarloos is from Cali but turned down Stanford and others are after him as well, which means he won't remotely be cheap... and despite having potential, that's all it is at this point and doesn't excite me. I haven't watched them this year so perhaps there is a legitimate reason, but it sounds like they had a rather spectacular downturn this year. Taking #3 from that team is an even bigger risk. If we're going to take a big risk, I'd prefer to do it with someone who will be relatively cheap so that we can either re-deploy resources around them to help them, or we can redeploy those resources to improve other sports with more financial upside. As I understand it, Berkman could come relatively cheap for US for his own personal reasons at least up front and we could address some of the noted deficiencies/concerns around him OR we can redeploy those resources elsewhere.

The worst thing in the world for Rice Athletics and Rice Baseball would be for us to PAY top 25 money to a new baseball coach who is mostly potential and end up with top 100 results.

The biggest problem in my mind with someone like Saarloos is that he won't remotely come cheap. That's fine if he ends up returning us to Omaha with regularity... but we have to pay him as if he's already done that in order to find out, and then likely even more to keep him from leaving



(05-28-2018 09:07 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 08:51 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  Wait a minute?

So our target market for someone to replace one of the top coaches in the history of baseball because for the first time in a quarter century he didn't make the post-season, is a coach who didn't make the post season?

If that's the plan, then it better be Berkman WITH Pettit and then include someone like Pope AND Hallmark... At least that way we'd get some detailed college experience to go along with the 'splash' and potential.

Well I think its disingenuous to suggest that making the post-season from the Southland is as easy as from Rice. Not only are the conference opponents worse, they don't have the scheduling "capital" that Rice does in the non-conference not to mention facilities, assistant salaries, etc...

Where did you remotely get anything about the Southland Conference from my comment?

Well you were objecting to hiring a coach that wasn't in the tournament and presumably two potential candidates are Matt Riser and Matt Deggs, both of whom aren't in the tournament and coach in the Southland.
05-29-2018 03:27 PM
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RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-28-2018 03:29 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 01:41 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 01:35 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 01:31 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 12:48 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  Also another con to Berkman: His team this year was under .500.

By that standard, Wayne wouldn't make the cut to replace Wayne.

Lance has also coached 2 seasons compared to Wayne’s 40+.

I mean the state championship was impressive but following it up with an under .500 season doesn’t inspire confidence.

Shame on Lance for not getting his coaching career started when he was in diapers.

Look, Lance may or may not be the right guy, but his record in his 2nd year of coaching is not high on the list of determining factors. I'd more concerned with his (or any other candidate's) approach to coaching and recruiting, use of analytics, ability to fundraise, etc.

His record in his 2nd year of coaching is very definitely and absolutely high on the list of determining factors when that happens to be the rank total of years of his coaching. And coaching not even at a Juco level, mind you.

I would be summarily appalled if Lance was selected for the position.

It would be like Team Mercedes putting the keys to the team Formula 1 car in the hands of my 15 year old nephew who just got his learner's permit, tbh. That choice would be grounds for looking at an AD operating under a gross negligence standard.
That's discouraging, but given how important I think recruiting is going to be for Rice moving forward, I don't think you can count Berkman out.

One thing I want to see from candidates is reassurance that they will be able top recruit well to Rice in the current environment. I don't know how anyone will convince me that they can do a better job of that than coach Graham has, but I think that is what is needed to restore Rice to top 25 status.
05-29-2018 03:32 PM
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RiceLad15 Offline
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RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 03:15 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  
(05-29-2018 09:42 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 08:51 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  Wait a minute?

So our target market for someone to replace one of the top coaches in the history of baseball because for the first time in a quarter century he didn't make the post-season, is a coach who didn't make the post season?

If that's the plan, then it better be Berkman WITH Pettit and then include someone like Pope AND Hallmark... At least that way we'd get some detailed college experience to go along with the 'splash' and potential.

I think it's disingenuous to suggest that the OG not making the post-season this year is the reason we decided not to renew his contract.

We've been on a steady decline for almost a decade now, as unfortunate as it is to say it, his age is now a negative for incoming recruits, and as others have alluded to, it seems as if our current players are not connecting with him as well as others used to.

College baseball has seen at least three long-time coaches step down this year (Rice, Miami, UCI). Of those three, two decided to step down because they recognized that their time had come. While we will all owe Wayne a debt forever, I do think he was a year or two late on realizing that all good things must come to an end and the torch needed to be passed.

Even the best can't be the best for forever.

Since we decided to not renew his contract long before we didn't make the tournament, It probably would be disingenuous to suggest that, which is why it isn't what I suggested.

If you're going to chastise me, I'd appreciate it if you'd stick to what I said and not simply look for reasons to keep replying with the same tired line beating the same dead horse.

The point is that if we're doing as some suggest and naming a coach within 7-14 days, that more than likely means we've already narrowed the list down and it DOESN'T include ANYONE whose season either has already ended, or will end very soon.

Unless you not only know more about what current players think, but you can also predict the tournament, that means an awful lot of people from good programs aren't even being considered.

Now to the Berkman comment.... I'm not nearly as excited about the TCU crew as others are. Saarloos is from Cali but turned down Stanford and others are after him as well, which means he won't remotely be cheap... and despite having potential, that's all it is at this point and doesn't excite me. I haven't watched them this year so perhaps there is a legitimate reason, but it sounds like they had a rather spectacular downturn this year. Taking #3 from that team is an even bigger risk. If we're going to take a big risk, I'd prefer to do it with someone who will be relatively cheap so that we can either re-deploy resources around them to help them, or we can redeploy those resources to improve other sports with more financial upside. As I understand it, Berkman could come relatively cheap for US for his own personal reasons at least up front and we could address some of the noted deficiencies/concerns around him OR we can redeploy those resources elsewhere.

The worst thing in the world for Rice Athletics and Rice Baseball would be for us to PAY top 25 money to a new baseball coach who is mostly potential and end up with top 100 results.

The biggest problem in my mind with someone like Saarloos is that he won't remotely come cheap. That's fine if he ends up returning us to Omaha with regularity... but we have to pay him as if he's already done that in order to find out, and then likely even more to keep him from leaving



(05-28-2018 09:07 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 08:51 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  Wait a minute?

So our target market for someone to replace one of the top coaches in the history of baseball because for the first time in a quarter century he didn't make the post-season, is a coach who didn't make the post season?

If that's the plan, then it better be Berkman WITH Pettit and then include someone like Pope AND Hallmark... At least that way we'd get some detailed college experience to go along with the 'splash' and potential.

Well I think its disingenuous to suggest that making the post-season from the Southland is as easy as from Rice. Not only are the conference opponents worse, they don't have the scheduling "capital" that Rice does in the non-conference not to mention facilities, assistant salaries, etc...

Where did you remotely get anything about the Southland Conference from my comment?

Ham - I was replying to what you said.

"So our target market for someone to replace one of the top coaches in the history of baseball because for the first time in a quarter century he didn't make the post-season, is a coach who didn't make the post season?"

Based on your current reply I'm now guessing that you weren't actually stating your own opinion, but projecting that of others? If that's the case, sorry for the misunderstanding, but that wasn't clear.

As I stated, I agree that this was a long time coming and that we likely have some key candidates in mind. But I disagree that if we had a potential list created alread, it must only include people outside of the tournament. If we are looking to hire top tier assistant coaches, they could be on that list and still coaching in the post season. We see situations like that in football all the time, where assistant coaches will be interviewed and hired before the post-season is over.
05-29-2018 03:47 PM
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tanqtonic Offline
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RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
But the situation and question then becomes very stark for Rice:

Given that there is limited funding for D-1 athletics, what program do you 'juice' to make Rice Athletics more viable?

Seems to me Pera was the 'cheap out' for baskeball, although BB can be a huge margin if done correctly. But Rhoades skipped out and pulled the plug on that avenue especially with the diaspora of starters.

Bloomgren was probably not a complete 'all-in', but the salaries and monies to the program will go up substantially (comments about recruiting budgets at the Coaches Caravan being a good example of the increases).

So, given that Pera seems to be a 'sit in the cheap seats' solution and the Mens BB will not be the 'revenues increaser' that Karlgaard always alluded to and seemed to want it to be, and that FB pretty much ate up a huge chunk, where does this leave Baseball?

I have to believe that the person that will be tapped will *not* be a 'lots of talk' current Div-1 coach, or a 'rising star assistant' or a 'top tier assistant' in that same vein. The person that will be tapped will be a 'passing grade' Div-2, maybe even a very good Div-2 current coach who will be (at least initially) able to fit into the budget.

Karlgaard hitched his money train to football earlier this year; baseball will have to deal with the results of that budget allocation. I think that Karlgaard knew that money train switch had to be made when Rhoades bolted with the subsequent decimation of the starters --- it looks to be reflected in the choice of Pera, tbh.

FWIW, I have no inside knowledge --- just bringing a business perspective view to the issue.

edited to add: interesting to see that *every* men's major sports program at Rice is in 'startup' mode concurrently.
(This post was last modified: 05-29-2018 04:17 PM by tanqtonic.)
05-29-2018 04:11 PM
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RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
Do we have any idea of what sort of salary we can offer an incoming head coach?
05-29-2018 04:26 PM
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Rice81 Offline
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RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
Rice has the prestige and name recognition in baseball. We need to definitely leverage of that and hire a suitable coach that will take us to a top 10 finish regularly. We can't guess and hope that some one from a lesser conference and status may grow as a coach and take us to where we have been in the recent past. We are in the same spot as when Jess Neely left. After Neely left, it only took 10 years for Rice to become irrelevant in college football. Let's not blow this.
05-29-2018 04:42 PM
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RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 04:42 PM)Rice81 Wrote:  Rice has the prestige and name recognition in baseball. We need to definitely leverage of that and hire a suitable coach that will take us to a top 10 finish regularly. We can't guess and hope that some one from a lesser conference and status may grow as a coach and take us to where we have been in the recent past. We are in the same spot as when Jess Neely left. After Neely left, it only took 10 years for Rice to become irrelevant in college football. Let's not blow this.

Hate to say it but unless we’re willing to pay upwards of a million we aren’t getting anyone from the ACC, SEC, or Big 12... PAC-12, probably not someone we’d want... Big 10 I think might have some potential like the Purdue guy or the Minnesota coach.
05-29-2018 05:12 PM
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RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 04:42 PM)Rice81 Wrote:  Rice has the prestige and name recognition in baseball. We need to definitely leverage of that and hire a suitable coach that will take us to a top 10 finish regularly. We can't guess and hope that some one from a lesser conference and status may grow as a coach and take us to where we have been in the recent past. We are in the same spot as when Jess Neely left. After Neely left, it only took 10 years for Rice to become irrelevant in college football. Let's not blow this.

To do that will be a very expensive coach.

I think that one of the root problems with Rice Athletics overall is money -- both spent and revenues.

So, from a business perspective (from which it is at Karlgaard's level) how much revenue can you pull out of NCAA baseball, and how much do you need to spend to do that?

I dont think baseball ever will be a 'money sport' for anyone except the top P5 programs, maybe even not for them. So why would you commit large op-ex to a low margin business unit with zero to no prospect for revenue growth? Makes zero sense.

Trust me, I would love to see a restoration of the Rice grandeur in baseball. But a large investment in it at this time with *no* appreciable revenues from *anywhere* else make no sense in the slightest.

Karlgaard probably has the ability to throw one set of dice -- that is all he has the money for. I think Karlgaard lined up his bets on FB and that is where the op-ex is going to be sent.

Without a large private-side push and with no appreciable revenues, all the monies to uplift Rice sports in toto are budgeted by the administration through Karlgaard. Where do you think the limited resources should be expended to benefit Rice athletics as a whole?

The tea leaves tell me that question was decided, probably at the end of last year's BB season, where Karlgaard knew that he *had* to perform emergency surgery on FB, and wasnt prepared to try to resuscitate men's BB with the Rhoades/starters leaving en masse debacle that happened in parallel.

edited to add: Again, no inside information here in the slightest. Bloviating and sheer speculation abound aplenty in the above.....
(This post was last modified: 05-29-2018 05:20 PM by tanqtonic.)
05-29-2018 05:18 PM
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RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
Tanq, I think you're pretty warm there. 3 years or so ago, I think the feeling was football is okay, baseball is okay, let's fix basketball. Football fell out of bed, baseball regressed, and turning basketball around is proving more difficult than anticipated. I think the Bloomgren hire is a move to go back to football as the prime mover. Football probably has more potential total upside, but it's probably harder to fix. Basketball doesn't have as much upside as football, but the risk is a lot lower. Baseball is probably the lowest risk, lowest reward option. Getting back to Omaha on a frequent basis does wonders for visibility and reputation, and from where we are starting is probably more easily attainable than similar levels of success in football or basketball, but it does not pay many bills. At least one of the money sports has to make money. We've tried basketball, but I think the Bloomgren hire and all that has gone with it suggests pretty strongly that we are shifting back to football as the prime mover. With people like Tudor and Trauber involved, basketball will get decently taken care of. That means it could be a rough road for baseball for a while.

You don't forget about revenues for 50 years and still have enough to do what you want. It just doesn't work that way. We have some hard choices to make, and somebody is going to get hurt.
05-29-2018 05:43 PM
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Post: #56
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 03:47 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  Ham - I was replying to what you said.

"So our target market for someone to replace one of the top coaches in the history of baseball because for the first time in a quarter century he didn't make the post-season, is a coach who didn't make the post season?"

Based on your current reply I'm now guessing that you weren't actually stating your own opinion, but projecting that of others? If that's the case, sorry for the misunderstanding, but that wasn't clear.

As I stated, I agree that this was a long time coming and that we likely have some key candidates in mind. But I disagree that if we had a potential list created alread, it must only include people outside of the tournament. If we are looking to hire top tier assistant coaches, they could be on that list and still coaching in the post season. We see situations like that in football all the time, where assistant coaches will be interviewed and hired before the post-season is over.

Let me try and be a little more clear... My apologies.

My comment dealt with the two week to hire. The specifics surrounding the departure were immaterial... and the failure of this team to make the tournament was merely a euphamism for the decline, but also a measure of the quality of the teams still playing. I thought about half-heartedly talking about TCU coaches as a team 'on the decline' since they clearly disappointed this year... but that was precisely what I thought I could avoid by using a more simple line

As to hires, In football, perhaps... but until recently there hasn't been a playoff... but do we really often see situations where teams are still fighting for the Championship in basketball or baseball where assistants announce they're leaving before the final game? TALK to them, absolutely... maybe even strike a deal... but announce it?

I'm not saying it never happens... it just seems presumptuous to know that of the 10 coaches on our list and say 3 of them still playing... that we know that none of those three would mind if we threw a little water on their 'road to Omaha' fire? I'm not sure I'd want to hire THAT guy.

That aside, it's pure speculation... and my comment was really intended to demonstrate that. I'd like to think that there is SOMEONE on our short list still playing, who would not want to harm his current team...

If we're going to go high dollar to win like we used to... it's going to be tough because we don't have the dollars most of these schools have... and as has been stated, competing with them like that may not be the best use of our limited Athletic dollars.

We were lucky as heck with Wayne... more than most people know...
(This post was last modified: 05-29-2018 06:43 PM by Hambone10.)
05-29-2018 06:36 PM
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Volente Beach Owl Offline
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Post: #57
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 09:53 AM)HooCares Wrote:  Not good enough for me. Since HC's wear the university's uniform, they need to project the right image, including being judicious about voicing personal political views. I'm not sure he knows when to shut his mouth. Who one wants to hire a PR headache?

He has said he really wants to be a preacher. Why doesn't he just go do that?

Are you now introducing a political test for the head baseball coaching role? If so, that's absurd and very intolerant of you.
05-29-2018 09:16 PM
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Post: #58
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
(05-29-2018 03:15 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  
(05-29-2018 09:42 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 08:51 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  Wait a minute?

So our target market for someone to replace one of the top coaches in the history of baseball because for the first time in a quarter century he didn't make the post-season, is a coach who didn't make the post season?

If that's the plan, then it better be Berkman WITH Pettit and then include someone like Pope AND Hallmark... At least that way we'd get some detailed college experience to go along with the 'splash' and potential.

I think it's disingenuous to suggest that the OG not making the post-season this year is the reason we decided not to renew his contract.

We've been on a steady decline for almost a decade now, as unfortunate as it is to say it, his age is now a negative for incoming recruits, and as others have alluded to, it seems as if our current players are not connecting with him as well as others used to.

College baseball has seen at least three long-time coaches step down this year (Rice, Miami, UCI). Of those three, two decided to step down because they recognized that their time had come. While we will all owe Wayne a debt forever, I do think he was a year or two late on realizing that all good things must come to an end and the torch needed to be passed.

Even the best can't be the best for forever.

Since we decided to not renew his contract long before we didn't make the tournament, It probably would be disingenuous to suggest that, which is why it isn't what I suggested.

If you're going to chastise me, I'd appreciate it if you'd stick to what I said and not simply look for reasons to keep replying with the same tired line beating the same dead horse.

The point is that if we're doing as some suggest and naming a coach within 7-14 days, that more than likely means we've already narrowed the list down and it DOESN'T include ANYONE whose season either has already ended, or will end very soon.

Unless you not only know more about what current players think, but you can also predict the tournament, that means an awful lot of people from good programs aren't even being considered.

Now to the Berkman comment.... I'm not nearly as excited about the TCU crew as others are. Saarloos is from Cali but turned down Stanford and others are after him as well, which means he won't remotely be cheap... and despite having potential, that's all it is at this point and doesn't excite me. I haven't watched them this year so perhaps there is a legitimate reason, but it sounds like they had a rather spectacular downturn this year. Taking #3 from that team is an even bigger risk. If we're going to take a big risk, I'd prefer to do it with someone who will be relatively cheap so that we can either re-deploy resources around them to help them, or we can redeploy those resources to improve other sports with more financial upside. As I understand it, Berkman could come relatively cheap for US for his own personal reasons at least up front and we could address some of the noted deficiencies/concerns around him OR we can redeploy those resources elsewhere.

The worst thing in the world for Rice Athletics and Rice Baseball would be for us to PAY top 25 money to a new baseball coach who is mostly potential and end up with top 100 results.

The biggest problem in my mind with someone like Saarloos is that he won't remotely come cheap. That's fine if he ends up returning us to Omaha with regularity... but we have to pay him as if he's already done that in order to find out, and then likely even more to keep him from leaving



(05-28-2018 09:07 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(05-28-2018 08:51 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  Wait a minute?

So our target market for someone to replace one of the top coaches in the history of baseball because for the first time in a quarter century he didn't make the post-season, is a coach who didn't make the post season?

If that's the plan, then it better be Berkman WITH Pettit and then include someone like Pope AND Hallmark... At least that way we'd get some detailed college experience to go along with the 'splash' and potential.

Well I think its disingenuous to suggest that making the post-season from the Southland is as easy as from Rice. Not only are the conference opponents worse, they don't have the scheduling "capital" that Rice does in the non-conference not to mention facilities, assistant salaries, etc...

Where did you remotely get anything about the Southland Conference from my comment?

I'm scratching my head with your comment that Saarloos is simply potential and unproven. He's widely considered among the Top 3 assistant coaches in all of college baseball. And I wouldn't call him the #3 guy at TCU. No, he's not the Assistant Head Coach, but he's the pitching coach (and, unlike The OG, Schloz leaves the pitching to his pitching coach) and head recruiter, which are arguably the two most important coaching jobs in college baseball besides the head coaching job itself. You get what you pay for. Of all the potential candidates out there, no one comes close on the risk factor scale to Berkman, who is totally unproven as a D-1 college coach.
05-29-2018 09:22 PM
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Post: #59
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
Quote:Mark Berman
‏@MarkBermanFox26
4h4 hours ago
More
The search for a new coach for @RiceBaseball is underway. Rice officials hope to have the process completed by the opening of the College World Series which is June 16.
05-29-2018 09:31 PM
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Post: #60
RE: *OFFICIAL* Baseball Coaching Search Thread
Cryptic twitter message to me from Kendall after I responded to a tweet in which he mentioned Coach Pierce and Herman Coachman...

Quote:Kendall Rogers
@KendallRogers
1m1 minute ago
More Kendall Rogers Retweeted Walter Greenberg
Okay, I’ll give you good news, Walt. Good news is headed @RiceBaseball’s direction soon … maybe in about a week.

One can only hope. I know Kendall is a huge Saarloos supporter, but considers Dreggs ahead of Riser on the potential candidates list. Not sure who he's talking to as I don't believe he has a relationship with JK.

I responded, "I'm hoping you're right, K. I want either Saarloos or Riser"...to which he just responded...

Quote:Kendall Rogers
‏@KendallRogers
2m2 minutes ago
Funny you mention that …… coming shortly.

Also, just posted...

Quote:Mark Berman
@MarkBermanFox26
4m4 minutes ago
College baseball sources: Rice received permission from TCU to interview Horned Frogs pitching coach Kirk Saarloos as the Owls search for a new coach for @RiceBaseball. Saarloos has been TCU's pitching coach since 2012. Played 7 years in the Big Leagues. With the #Astros 2002-03
05-29-2018 09:56 PM
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