Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
Author Message
colohank Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 978
Joined: Jul 2014
Reputation: 82
I Root For: Cincy
Location: Colorado
Post: #21
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
Sadly, Trump University has already been forced to close despite having the best administration, the best courses, and the best faculty. I hope all of those esteemed and highly respected faculty members enjoyed soft landings. It would be a shame to lose that kind of talent.

Anyone notice an uptick of Uber drivers in their area?
05-24-2018 09:33 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BePcr07 Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,435
Joined: Dec 2015
Reputation: 73
I Root For: Boise St & Zags
Location:
Post: #22
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
I appreciate DavidSt's threads. Often they are topics that never would've crossed my mind but they provide a very unique perspective into potentially relevant nuances in college sports.
05-24-2018 09:34 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
georgia_tech_swagger Offline
Res publica non dominetur
*

Posts: 46,125
Joined: Feb 2002
Reputation: 1306
I Root For: GT, USCU, FU
Location: Upstate, SC

SkunkworksFolding@NCAAbbsNCAAbbs LUGCrappies
Post: #23
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
Presbyterian is only D1 because they really really wanted to play in Atlanta and Georgia Tech said only if you're D1 so it counts towards a bowl game. I believe PC went to D1 and that year GT inked a 1-and-done in football and a two-and-none in men's basketball.

Newberry ... jeez. It's just depressing as a campus let alone an athletic program where if you kick a field goal you could legitimately hit a head stone in a cemetery with the football.

Both shouldn't be in D1 probably.
05-24-2018 10:58 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
RobtheAggie Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 277
Joined: Jan 2017
Reputation: 7
I Root For: NMSU
Location:
Post: #24
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-24-2018 10:58 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Presbyterian is only D1 because they really really wanted to play in Atlanta and Georgia Tech said only if you're D1 so it counts towards a bowl game. I believe PC went to D1 and that year GT inked a 1-and-done in football and a two-and-none in men's basketball.

Newberry ... jeez. It's just depressing as a campus let alone an athletic program where if you kick a field goal you could legitimately hit a head stone in a cemetery with the football.

Both shouldn't be in D1 probably.

Newberry is DII not DI. They used to have a very good rivalry with PC.
05-24-2018 01:01 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
DavidSt Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 12,490
Joined: Dec 2013
Reputation: 167
I Root For: ATU, P7
Location:
Post: #25
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-24-2018 01:01 PM)RobtheAggie Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 10:58 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Presbyterian is only D1 because they really really wanted to play in Atlanta and Georgia Tech said only if you're D1 so it counts towards a bowl game. I believe PC went to D1 and that year GT inked a 1-and-done in football and a two-and-none in men's basketball.

Newberry ... jeez. It's just depressing as a campus let alone an athletic program where if you kick a field goal you could legitimately hit a head stone in a cemetery with the football.

Both shouldn't be in D1 probably.

Newberry is DII not DI. They used to have a very good rivalry with PC.


Sadly, before the Southern Conference was formed, the conference that Southern, ACC and SEC were in had Newberry as a member. They were like somebody that Furman and other Private schools would associate with. Mount Ida was considered a D1 school before the 1940s. Now, they close.

For the person that says this is the dumbest thread? It is not. How many schools including D1 schools have to find new opponents for football, basketball and all that after schools like Saint Gregory's, Mount Ida and Bacone closed? Caldwell is on the failing list, and they are D1 in a couple of sports. This thread is a watch list to make because who else will close? This does effect realignment issues.

MEC in D2, does have a couple of schools that are failing. Wheeling Jesuit is selling off land to help pay debt. They could be the next to close down.
05-24-2018 02:38 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
AZcats Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 757
Joined: Dec 2014
Reputation: 48
I Root For: stAte, af, zona
Location: Pike's Peak
Post: #26
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-24-2018 02:38 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 01:01 PM)RobtheAggie Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 10:58 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Presbyterian is only D1 because they really really wanted to play in Atlanta and Georgia Tech said only if you're D1 so it counts towards a bowl game. I believe PC went to D1 and that year GT inked a 1-and-done in football and a two-and-none in men's basketball.

Newberry ... jeez. It's just depressing as a campus let alone an athletic program where if you kick a field goal you could legitimately hit a head stone in a cemetery with the football.

Both shouldn't be in D1 probably.

Newberry is DII not DI. They used to have a very good rivalry with PC.


Sadly, before the Southern Conference was formed, the conference that Southern, ACC and SEC were in had Newberry as a member. They were like somebody that Furman and other Private schools would associate with. Mount Ida was considered a D1 school before the 1940s. Now, they close.

For the person that says this is the dumbest thread? It is not. How many schools including D1 schools have to find new opponents for football, basketball and all that after schools like Saint Gregory's, Mount Ida and Bacone closed? Caldwell is on the failing list, and they are D1 in a couple of sports. This thread is a watch list to make because who else will close? This does effect realignment issues.

MEC in D2, does have a couple of schools that are failing. Wheeling Jesuit is selling off land to help pay debt. They could be the next to close down.

Realignment should be the last thing you should be thinking about when a school closes. It is a trivial matter to have to replace an opponent on the schedule because that school closed.

it is more important to have concern for the students who now have to find someplace else to complete their education and for all the people who no longer have a job. "This is the dumbest thread" is an accurate statement when you take into consideration the priorities of an educational institution.

The Dowling College closure was difficult to watch. They announced they were closing, then it was may be closing, followed by we are not closing, before finally definitely closing. Nobody knew what to do and this had major implications to the rest of their lives. So, at this point what is more important: finding a new conference member, replacing an opponent, or the students? Priorities!

Caldwell has zero sports in D1. They do have a bowling team that competes in the NCAA National Collegiate Division. Wheeling Jesuit was purchased a year ago and now is becoming a stronger university. Diocese of Wheeling-Charleston Purchases Wheeling Jesuit University’s Assets
05-24-2018 05:13 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
quo vadis Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 30,487
Joined: Aug 2008
Reputation: 744
I Root For: USF/Georgetown
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Post: #27
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-23-2018 01:10 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(05-23-2018 10:33 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  
(05-23-2018 10:07 AM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  Finlandia University - this is the coolest school. It's located in far northern Michigan in the only part of the country that was settled by the Finnish and remains very, uh, Finnish.

They have 670 students and sponsor 14 sports including football. It makes no sense.


They have less students than Bacone.

The U. of Michigan is closer to the University of Maryland than it is to Finlandia University.
05-24-2018 05:20 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
quo vadis Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 30,487
Joined: Aug 2008
Reputation: 744
I Root For: USF/Georgetown
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Post: #28
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-24-2018 05:13 PM)AZcats Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 02:38 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 01:01 PM)RobtheAggie Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 10:58 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Presbyterian is only D1 because they really really wanted to play in Atlanta and Georgia Tech said only if you're D1 so it counts towards a bowl game. I believe PC went to D1 and that year GT inked a 1-and-done in football and a two-and-none in men's basketball.

Newberry ... jeez. It's just depressing as a campus let alone an athletic program where if you kick a field goal you could legitimately hit a head stone in a cemetery with the football.

Both shouldn't be in D1 probably.

Newberry is DII not DI. They used to have a very good rivalry with PC.


Sadly, before the Southern Conference was formed, the conference that Southern, ACC and SEC were in had Newberry as a member. They were like somebody that Furman and other Private schools would associate with. Mount Ida was considered a D1 school before the 1940s. Now, they close.

For the person that says this is the dumbest thread? It is not. How many schools including D1 schools have to find new opponents for football, basketball and all that after schools like Saint Gregory's, Mount Ida and Bacone closed? Caldwell is on the failing list, and they are D1 in a couple of sports. This thread is a watch list to make because who else will close? This does effect realignment issues.

MEC in D2, does have a couple of schools that are failing. Wheeling Jesuit is selling off land to help pay debt. They could be the next to close down.

Realignment should be the last thing you should be thinking about when a school closes. It is a trivial matter to have to replace an opponent on the schedule because that school closed.

Yes, but this particular message board happens to be dedicated to discussing that "last, trivial" aspect of a school's closing. So your complaint is null and void. 07-coffee3
05-24-2018 05:27 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
AZcats Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 757
Joined: Dec 2014
Reputation: 48
I Root For: stAte, af, zona
Location: Pike's Peak
Post: #29
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
05-24-2018 06:04 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
seaking4steel Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 404
Joined: May 2018
Reputation: 22
I Root For: Penn St, App St
Location:
Post: #30
Wheeling Jesuit
(05-24-2018 02:38 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 01:01 PM)RobtheAggie Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 10:58 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Presbyterian is only D1 because they really really wanted to play in Atlanta and Georgia Tech said only if you're D1 so it counts towards a bowl game. I believe PC went to D1 and that year GT inked a 1-and-done in football and a two-and-none in men's basketball.

Newberry ... jeez. It's just depressing as a campus let alone an athletic program where if you kick a field goal you could legitimately hit a head stone in a cemetery with the football.

Both shouldn't be in D1 probably.

Newberry is DII not DI. They used to have a very good rivalry with PC.


Sadly, before the Southern Conference was formed, the conference that Southern, ACC and SEC were in had Newberry as a member. They were like somebody that Furman and other Private schools would associate with. Mount Ida was considered a D1 school before the 1940s. Now, they close.

For the person that says this is the dumbest thread? It is not. How many schools including D1 schools have to find new opponents for football, basketball and all that after schools like Saint Gregory's, Mount Ida and Bacone closed? Caldwell is on the failing list, and they are D1 in a couple of sports. This thread is a watch list to make because who else will close? This does effect realignment issues.

MEC in D2, does have a couple of schools that are failing. Wheeling Jesuit is selling off land to help pay debt. They could be the next to close down.
Wheeling Jesuit announced a while back that they were adding football I doubt the school is shutting down
05-24-2018 08:06 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,028
Joined: Jul 2014
Reputation: 170
I Root For: NIU, Chicago St
Location: South Side
Post: #31
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-24-2018 09:34 AM)BePcr07 Wrote:  I appreciate DavidSt's threads. Often they are topics that never would've crossed my mind but they provide a very unique perspective into potentially relevant nuances in college sports.

Hell to the yes!


And considering how much activity his threads generate, he should probably receive a slice of the site’s revenue stream.
05-24-2018 08:20 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
arkstfan Away
Sorry folks
*

Posts: 23,257
Joined: Feb 2004
Reputation: 710
I Root For: Fresh Starts
Location:
Post: #32
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-24-2018 08:20 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 09:34 AM)BePcr07 Wrote:  I appreciate DavidSt's threads. Often they are topics that never would've crossed my mind but they provide a very unique perspective into potentially relevant nuances in college sports.

Hell to the yes!


And considering how much activity his threads generate, he should probably receive a slice of the site’s revenue stream.

Well some border on the insane but university finances is a real and serious issue with a ton of implications beyond just schools closing.

Maryland was in dire straits until the Big Ten offer and the "travel offset" that helped them deal with the athletic debt issue.
05-24-2018 09:28 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,028
Joined: Jul 2014
Reputation: 170
I Root For: NIU, Chicago St
Location: South Side
Post: #33
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-23-2018 01:16 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(05-23-2018 09:12 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  Shouldn't this be posted on the "Obscure College Realignment Board"?

You mean, it belongs on the board that has other threads titled

"What is Big South’s next move?"
"Grambling State May Have An Open Date For Football for 2018"
"Hampton & MEAC getting testy as the split goes down"
"Liberty expected to make major conference affiliation announcement on Thursday"
"SIU-C and SIU-E mulling split"
"Colorado Mesa Adds Women's Wrestling"
"South Dakota St drops M&W Tennis"
"Siena drops field hockey"

07-coffee3

You just described nirvana.
05-24-2018 09:49 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
texasorange Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,444
Joined: May 2005
Reputation: 82
I Root For: Syracuse Orange
Location: Plano, TX
Post: #34
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-23-2018 08:10 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  With a number of colleges and universities shutting down in a mass numbers in recent years from Lon Morris in the NJCAA to Saint Joseph's Indiana in D2, we could see more schools in trouble.

Private Colleges Fail, In Debt

This article came out last year. 177 private colleges which 112 are not for profit are in danger. Several on the list already closed down like Dowling, Mount Ida, Saint Gregory's, Bacone and others. If a school have a 1.5 or below are failing. bacone had a 1.7 rating, but still closing. Here are some schools that could be the next ones to close which some do play D1 sports.

Adrian College 1.2
Alderson Broaddus 0.4
Alliant International -0.4 was a former NCAA D1 under another name.
Arkansas Baptist 0.3 HBCU junior College
Azusa Pacific 1.5
Belmont Abbey 1.6 on the edge
Bethany Kansas 0.6 NAIA
Bethel Indiana 0.7 NAIA
Bethel Kansas 0.6 NAIA
Bethel Tennessee 1.4
Caldwell 1.5
Carson-Newman 1.4
Chestnut Hill 1.7
Columbia College, SC 1.4
Ecclesia 1.3 NAIa
Emmanuel -0.9 D2 could be the next to close.
Finlandia 1.1
Green Mountain 1
Hannibal-La Grange 1.4
Hillsdale free Will Baptist in Moore, Oklahoma 0.8
Hiram 1.1
Howard
Huntington Indiana 1.7
Iowa Wesleyan 0.6
Kansas Christian 1.2
Kentucky Wesleyan 1.3
Keystone College 0.4
Lake Erie 1.3
MidAmerica Nazarene 1.3
Morthland 1.7 in a holding pattern to reformed the school.
Multumuh 0.8
Newberry 1.8
Notre Dame, Ohio 1.6
Ohio Valley -1
Ottawa Kansas 1
Paine 1.7
Pine Manor 1.2
Quincy 1.8
Rochester, Mich. -0.1
St. Joseph's, NY 1.9
Saint Martin's 1.6
Saint Xavier 1.7
Salem International 1.5
Selma 1.9
Shorter 1.3
Sierra Nevada 1.8
Southern Vermont 1.1
Spring Hill 1.4
Sterling 1.9
Thomas More 1.6
U. of Mobile 1.2
Westminster, MO. 1.1
Wheeling Jesuit U.1.5
Wilberforce 1.3

All this are private schools. This does not show how bad the public school's debts are. 3 is perfect record that a lot of d1 and D2 schools have. between 1.5 to 2.0 is on the border of failure. Below 1.5 gets a school a fail grade. A lot of schools that closed in recent years have a fail grade below 1.5 except for Bacone who had a 1.7. People who are saying Howard going to the Big South may have to rethink that they might have to go down to D2 or something. Usually a school's debt decides where a school moves to like Thomas More dropping back down to NAIA. There are chatter that Kentucky Wesleyan would be moving back down to NAIA. So far, only Howard at the D1 level seems to be borderline of moving towards rock bottom. This could be also the next big realignment talks that have to do with the small private schools who have major debt. I think Presbyterian should be on the watch list as well. They are the smallest in D1. Bacone had a similar size enrollment as Presbyterian,

Lon Morris College! I actually was there once. Never went back. The place was as crooked as a Soprano waste disposal company.
05-24-2018 10:19 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Kittonhead Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 10,000
Joined: Jun 2013
Reputation: 119
I Root For: Beat Matisse
Location:
Post: #35
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
HS graduates are projected on the decline the next decade or so also hurting things.

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2016...ly-diverse
05-24-2018 10:52 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
arkstfan Away
Sorry folks
*

Posts: 23,257
Joined: Feb 2004
Reputation: 710
I Root For: Fresh Starts
Location:
Post: #36
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-24-2018 10:52 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  HS graduates are projected on the decline the next decade or so also hurting things.

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2016...ly-diverse

Tack on to that a number of schools increasing the number of students they admit in order to use tuition to offset stagnant or falling state funding and a lot of regional schools face a big struggle, many have borrowed to offer nicer dorms, student unions, and workout facilities.
05-25-2018 01:02 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
JRsec Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 20,474
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation: 1647
I Root For: SEC
Location:
Post: #37
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
After reading all of the posts, and thoroughly understanding the demographic factors, all I can say is just damn! Wilberforce failing? I'm simply speechless. I guess I won't get any rest tonight. Geeze! Wilberforce!

What will the A.M.E. folks in Ohio do?

David, you do know that they are in the middle of an enrollment drive and are a historic African American school?
(This post was last modified: 05-25-2018 01:18 AM by JRsec.)
05-25-2018 01:08 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Kittonhead Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 10,000
Joined: Jun 2013
Reputation: 119
I Root For: Beat Matisse
Location:
Post: #38
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-25-2018 01:02 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 10:52 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  HS graduates are projected on the decline the next decade or so also hurting things.

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2016...ly-diverse

Tack on to that a number of schools increasing the number of students they admit in order to use tuition to offset stagnant or falling state funding and a lot of regional schools face a big struggle, many have borrowed to offer nicer dorms, student unions, and workout facilities.

Its a food chain. Texas State is one of the schools that has benefited by rebranding itself into a major state school for Texas with a larger enrollment. Missouri State is another example of this.

This makes the lower tier public and private schools more desperate to compete against expanding state schools with new facilities. State funding, while declining is an advantage for the public ones over the privates.

Online education hasn't been fully embraced by the public yet either. That might push more of the smaller educational players out of the game.
05-25-2018 09:19 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
arkstfan Away
Sorry folks
*

Posts: 23,257
Joined: Feb 2004
Reputation: 710
I Root For: Fresh Starts
Location:
Post: #39
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
(05-25-2018 09:19 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  
(05-25-2018 01:02 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  
(05-24-2018 10:52 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  HS graduates are projected on the decline the next decade or so also hurting things.

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2016...ly-diverse

Tack on to that a number of schools increasing the number of students they admit in order to use tuition to offset stagnant or falling state funding and a lot of regional schools face a big struggle, many have borrowed to offer nicer dorms, student unions, and workout facilities.

Its a food chain. Texas State is one of the schools that has benefited by rebranding itself into a major state school for Texas with a larger enrollment. Missouri State is another example of this.

This makes the lower tier public and private schools more desperate to compete against expanding state schools with new facilities. State funding, while declining is an advantage for the public ones over the privates.

Online education hasn't been fully embraced by the public yet either. That might push more of the smaller educational players out of the game.

My son has done some online and some in-person and plans to finish up with on-campus because he concluded he would be better off getting to know some of his fellow students and build on his network of friends.

I think it is interesting that the last stats I had seen, the ratio of online masters students was much higher than bachelor's degree students, presumably because so many masters students are already in the work force.

Used to go to church with a guy who in his late 40's started working on an online masters and in his mid-50's a PhD in construction management. He had been a manager for a LARGE construction firm. After the masters he was promoted. Within a few months of completing his PhD he was transferred out of state to manage a regional office and it must of been a nice promotion because his wife said she wasn't going to be looking for work and they made a big upgrade in house in a market more expensive than Little Rock and then upgraded again three years later.

Most masters students have a business network already.
05-25-2018 09:47 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
DavidSt Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 12,490
Joined: Dec 2013
Reputation: 167
I Root For: ATU, P7
Location:
Post: #40
RE: Colleges and Universities School Debts Can Lead To Closures And Forced Realignment
D3 Beloit College in a Deficit

Another school had an appearance in the old days of football rankings are in trouble.
06-03-2018 04:16 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2019 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2019 MyBB Group.