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Conference Realignment for D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and USCAA 2018 and Beyond
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AZcats Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Conference Realignment for D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and USCAA 2018 and Beyond
(04-18-2018 01:17 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 11:12 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(04-17-2018 07:23 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(04-17-2018 06:13 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  So NAIA now has 4 schools in Arizona (Ottawa, Benedictine, ACU and Embry-Riddle). If Park starts athletics in Gilbert, they would want NAIA, so that would be 5

Park is indeed planning on starting athletics, next year. If that's the case I would expect an NAIA application in October. It would follow a similar trajectory as Ottawa in Surprise.

Your implication though is that of an Arizona conference. I've though about that for the last couple of days. I doubt it will come to be. The bare minimum is 6, and at that size you are just 1 school failure or association change from a failed conference. And all schools would have to support the same sports, or you would still have sports that aren't in an officially recognized conference. Meaning you'd still have to rely on other conferences affiliations for scheduling. Now if you get to 7, THEN you've got my attention. However I don't see other existing candidates in Arizona. There's an art school in Tucson, but it's really small...

I think the likely outcome will be for the metro Phoenix schools to become travel partners. ACU paired with Ottawa in the GSAC, and Benedictine-Mesa with Park in the Cal Pac.

Not implying an Arizona conference - the four schools are split among two conferences already, which is a good set up - Non Arizona schools get a two for one trip.

I do expect more schools to follow the Benedictine/Ottawa/Park model - Arizona is vastly underserved when it comes to residential private universities, and athletics is a good way to build a campus.


They only have 3 4 year public schools as well. Arizona Western, Eastern Arizona, Central Arizona, Pima and Phoenix College all seemed to be offering some 4 year degrees in some fields. I suspect one or two of them will go 4 year. A lot of the NAIA schools that they get came from the NJCAA that went 4 years. The west coast do need to get some more 4 year schools pretty soon, and I do not mean privates either.

After a quick look at Pima CC, it looks like any 4-year degree earned there has Northern Arizona on the diploma. No Arizona CC is offering a 4-year degree it is just the location is being used as an extension in cooperation with UofA, NAU, or ASU. Why would Arizona Western have such a program when NAU-Yuma is in the same buildings?
04-18-2018 03:19 PM
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dbackjon Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Conference Realignment for D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and USCAA 2018 and Beyond
(04-18-2018 03:19 PM)AZcats Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 01:17 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 11:12 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(04-17-2018 07:23 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(04-17-2018 06:13 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  So NAIA now has 4 schools in Arizona (Ottawa, Benedictine, ACU and Embry-Riddle). If Park starts athletics in Gilbert, they would want NAIA, so that would be 5

Park is indeed planning on starting athletics, next year. If that's the case I would expect an NAIA application in October. It would follow a similar trajectory as Ottawa in Surprise.

Your implication though is that of an Arizona conference. I've though about that for the last couple of days. I doubt it will come to be. The bare minimum is 6, and at that size you are just 1 school failure or association change from a failed conference. And all schools would have to support the same sports, or you would still have sports that aren't in an officially recognized conference. Meaning you'd still have to rely on other conferences affiliations for scheduling. Now if you get to 7, THEN you've got my attention. However I don't see other existing candidates in Arizona. There's an art school in Tucson, but it's really small...

I think the likely outcome will be for the metro Phoenix schools to become travel partners. ACU paired with Ottawa in the GSAC, and Benedictine-Mesa with Park in the Cal Pac.

Not implying an Arizona conference - the four schools are split among two conferences already, which is a good set up - Non Arizona schools get a two for one trip.

I do expect more schools to follow the Benedictine/Ottawa/Park model - Arizona is vastly underserved when it comes to residential private universities, and athletics is a good way to build a campus.


They only have 3 4 year public schools as well. Arizona Western, Eastern Arizona, Central Arizona, Pima and Phoenix College all seemed to be offering some 4 year degrees in some fields. I suspect one or two of them will go 4 year. A lot of the NAIA schools that they get came from the NJCAA that went 4 years. The west coast do need to get some more 4 year schools pretty soon, and I do not mean privates either.

After a quick look at Pima CC, it looks like any 4-year degree earned there has Northern Arizona on the diploma. No Arizona CC is offering a 4-year degree it is just the location is being used as an extension in cooperation with UofA, NAU, or ASU. Why would Arizona Western have such a program when NAU-Yuma is in the same buildings?

Because that doesn't fit David's narrative. NAU provides degree programs in conjunction with a number of state CC, as a cost savings and to help local students. There is ZERO money or desire to elevate any CC in Arizona to a four-year college.
04-18-2018 03:27 PM
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DavidSt Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Conference Realignment for D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and USCAA 2018 and Beyond
(04-18-2018 03:27 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 03:19 PM)AZcats Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 01:17 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 11:12 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(04-17-2018 07:23 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  Park is indeed planning on starting athletics, next year. If that's the case I would expect an NAIA application in October. It would follow a similar trajectory as Ottawa in Surprise.

Your implication though is that of an Arizona conference. I've though about that for the last couple of days. I doubt it will come to be. The bare minimum is 6, and at that size you are just 1 school failure or association change from a failed conference. And all schools would have to support the same sports, or you would still have sports that aren't in an officially recognized conference. Meaning you'd still have to rely on other conferences affiliations for scheduling. Now if you get to 7, THEN you've got my attention. However I don't see other existing candidates in Arizona. There's an art school in Tucson, but it's really small...

I think the likely outcome will be for the metro Phoenix schools to become travel partners. ACU paired with Ottawa in the GSAC, and Benedictine-Mesa with Park in the Cal Pac.

Not implying an Arizona conference - the four schools are split among two conferences already, which is a good set up - Non Arizona schools get a two for one trip.

I do expect more schools to follow the Benedictine/Ottawa/Park model - Arizona is vastly underserved when it comes to residential private universities, and athletics is a good way to build a campus.


They only have 3 4 year public schools as well. Arizona Western, Eastern Arizona, Central Arizona, Pima and Phoenix College all seemed to be offering some 4 year degrees in some fields. I suspect one or two of them will go 4 year. A lot of the NAIA schools that they get came from the NJCAA that went 4 years. The west coast do need to get some more 4 year schools pretty soon, and I do not mean privates either.

After a quick look at Pima CC, it looks like any 4-year degree earned there has Northern Arizona on the diploma. No Arizona CC is offering a 4-year degree it is just the location is being used as an extension in cooperation with UofA, NAU, or ASU. Why would Arizona Western have such a program when NAU-Yuma is in the same buildings?

Because that doesn't fit David's narrative. NAU provides degree programs in conjunction with a number of state CC, as a cost savings and to help local students. There is ZERO money or desire to elevate any CC in Arizona to a four-year college.

I looked up the colleges in Arizona. As far I know from the accreditation and all that. Those schools could offer 4 year degrees without the use of the bigger schools. I have also seen some larger schools do help the smaller schools in conjunction to get a degree. Like Arkansas Tech have a nursing and Pre-med degrees. once the students graduate, they go to UAMS to get the post-grad degrees. It means schools in partnership with the large state flagship schools get students. Arkansas Tech was a junior College and so was Boise State. Ay help from the larger schools do help boast the enrollment for the local schools which some will become 4 years. As it is, Pima is the largest CC in Arizona. With Arizona, Arizona State and Northern Arizona growing too quickly with their rising population? they would need to start turning some CCs into 4 year schools. The Colorado river Valley from Bullhead City down to Yuma have population growth on both sides of the river. When I used to lived in that area, Bullhead City was under 10,000. Now, with the Lachlan, Bullhead, Kingman and other towns nearby? It is up to close to 100,000 thanks to the Casinos on the Nevada side of the river. Yuma is one of the largest cities in Arizona, and that is where the population growth is at. Arizona do need a 4 year school there which could attract California kids to come to school there. Would be nice to see them playing football at the NAIA level.
04-18-2018 03:41 PM
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AZcats Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Conference Realignment for D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and USCAA 2018 and Beyond
(04-18-2018 03:41 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 03:27 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 03:19 PM)AZcats Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 01:17 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 11:12 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  Not implying an Arizona conference - the four schools are split among two conferences already, which is a good set up - Non Arizona schools get a two for one trip.

I do expect more schools to follow the Benedictine/Ottawa/Park model - Arizona is vastly underserved when it comes to residential private universities, and athletics is a good way to build a campus.


They only have 3 4 year public schools as well. Arizona Western, Eastern Arizona, Central Arizona, Pima and Phoenix College all seemed to be offering some 4 year degrees in some fields. I suspect one or two of them will go 4 year. A lot of the NAIA schools that they get came from the NJCAA that went 4 years. The west coast do need to get some more 4 year schools pretty soon, and I do not mean privates either.

After a quick look at Pima CC, it looks like any 4-year degree earned there has Northern Arizona on the diploma. No Arizona CC is offering a 4-year degree it is just the location is being used as an extension in cooperation with UofA, NAU, or ASU. Why would Arizona Western have such a program when NAU-Yuma is in the same buildings?

Because that doesn't fit David's narrative. NAU provides degree programs in conjunction with a number of state CC, as a cost savings and to help local students. There is ZERO money or desire to elevate any CC in Arizona to a four-year college.

I looked up the colleges in Arizona. As far I know from the accreditation and all that. Those schools could offer 4 year degrees without the use of the bigger schools. I have also seen some larger schools do help the smaller schools in conjunction to get a degree. Like Arkansas Tech have a nursing and Pre-med degrees. once the students graduate, they go to UAMS to get the post-grad degrees. It means schools in partnership with the large state flagship schools get students. Arkansas Tech was a junior College and so was Boise State. Ay help from the larger schools do help boast the enrollment for the local schools which some will become 4 years. As it is, Pima is the largest CC in Arizona. With Arizona, Arizona State and Northern Arizona growing too quickly with their rising population? they would need to start turning some CCs into 4 year schools. The Colorado river Valley from Bullhead City down to Yuma have population growth on both sides of the river. When I used to lived in that area, Bullhead City was under 10,000. Now, with the Lachlan, Bullhead, Kingman and other towns nearby? It is up to close to 100,000 thanks to the Casinos on the Nevada side of the river. Yuma is one of the largest cities in Arizona, and that is where the population growth is at. Arizona do need a 4 year school there which could attract California kids to come to school there. Would be nice to see them playing football at the NAIA level.

Delusions. Last time I checked, Arizona and Arkansas were 2 different states who have their own Uni systems and Departments of Education. Just because something happened in one place does not mean it has or will happen somewhere else.
04-18-2018 06:09 PM
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dbackjon Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Conference Realignment for D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and USCAA 2018 and Beyond
(04-18-2018 06:09 PM)AZcats Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 03:41 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 03:27 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 03:19 PM)AZcats Wrote:  
(04-18-2018 01:17 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  They only have 3 4 year public schools as well. Arizona Western, Eastern Arizona, Central Arizona, Pima and Phoenix College all seemed to be offering some 4 year degrees in some fields. I suspect one or two of them will go 4 year. A lot of the NAIA schools that they get came from the NJCAA that went 4 years. The west coast do need to get some more 4 year schools pretty soon, and I do not mean privates either.

After a quick look at Pima CC, it looks like any 4-year degree earned there has Northern Arizona on the diploma. No Arizona CC is offering a 4-year degree it is just the location is being used as an extension in cooperation with UofA, NAU, or ASU. Why would Arizona Western have such a program when NAU-Yuma is in the same buildings?

Because that doesn't fit David's narrative. NAU provides degree programs in conjunction with a number of state CC, as a cost savings and to help local students. There is ZERO money or desire to elevate any CC in Arizona to a four-year college.

I looked up the colleges in Arizona. As far I know from the accreditation and all that. Those schools could offer 4 year degrees without the use of the bigger schools. I have also seen some larger schools do help the smaller schools in conjunction to get a degree. Like Arkansas Tech have a nursing and Pre-med degrees. once the students graduate, they go to UAMS to get the post-grad degrees. It means schools in partnership with the large state flagship schools get students. Arkansas Tech was a junior College and so was Boise State. Ay help from the larger schools do help boast the enrollment for the local schools which some will become 4 years. As it is, Pima is the largest CC in Arizona. With Arizona, Arizona State and Northern Arizona growing too quickly with their rising population? they would need to start turning some CCs into 4 year schools. The Colorado river Valley from Bullhead City down to Yuma have population growth on both sides of the river. When I used to lived in that area, Bullhead City was under 10,000. Now, with the Lachlan, Bullhead, Kingman and other towns nearby? It is up to close to 100,000 thanks to the Casinos on the Nevada side of the river. Yuma is one of the largest cities in Arizona, and that is where the population growth is at. Arizona do need a 4 year school there which could attract California kids to come to school there. Would be nice to see them playing football at the NAIA level.

Delusions. Last time I checked, Arizona and Arkansas were 2 different states who have their own Uni systems and Departments of Education. Just because something happened in one place does not mean it has or will happen somewhere else.

No kidding. And acting like a population of 200K (Mohave County) is big enough to warrant the tens of millions needed to establish a four year college.

Especially a county with only 12K college age residents. Most of whom either are going to work in the casinos, move to Vegas, or if they want to go to college, they want to get the heck outta there.
04-18-2018 07:59 PM
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DavidSt Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Conference Realignment for D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and USCAA 2018 and Beyond
04-18-2018 09:32 PM
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