(06-07-2018 11:10 AM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  See ya Cashaw.

Fire Pera.

And Karlgaard. Men's basketball has been a mess since Rhoades announced his departure.

(06-07-2018 01:41 PM)ESE84 Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 11:10 AM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  See ya Cashaw.

Fire Pera.

And Karlgaard. Men's basketball has been a mess since Rhoades announced his departure.

Men's basketball has been a mess since 1970.

(06-07-2018 02:13 PM)Frizzy Owl Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 01:41 PM)ESE84 Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 11:10 AM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  See ya Cashaw.

Fire Pera.

And Karlgaard. Men's basketball has been a mess since Rhoades announced his departure.

Men's basketball has been a mess since 1970.

+1

69/70/73 keeps repeating the same stupid ideas from long ago about the need to improve basketball to the Gonzaga level. With things as they are in the NCAA regarding transfers, and with that only getting worse, Rice has no chance to field a decent Division I team. Period.

It is time to drop men's basketball.

Rice would still have issues with men's basketball, but the idiotic hiring of Rhoades just accelerated the inevitable slide into the current morass. The fault lies with the Athletic Director in (1) hiring Rhoades; (2) allowing Rhoades (with the willing assistance of certain alums) to renegotiate his contract for more money; and (3) panicking by choosing Pera without doing the proper due diligence.

someone correct me if I’m wrong but I am pretty sure that you can’t field more than 1 D1 team for each sex if you do not have basketball. And that one team can’t be basketball.

So we couldn’t have baseball and women’s basketball.

But we could have baseball and women’s hockey.

(06-07-2018 03:11 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  69/70/73 keeps repeating the same stupid ideas from long ago about the need to improve basketball to the Gonzaga level. With things as they are in the NCAA regarding transfers, and with that only getting worse, Rice has no chance to field a decent Division I team. Period.

It is time to drop men's basketball.

Rice would still have issues with men's basketball, but the idiotic hiring of Rhoades just accelerated the inevitable slide into the current morass. The fault lies with the Athletic Director in (1) hiring Rhoades; (2) allowing Rhoades (with the willing assistance of certain alums) to renegotiate his contract for more money; and (3) panicking by choosing Pera without doing the proper due diligence.

1. What was wrong with Rhoades? He gave our program more life than it’s had in 10 years. It’s the leaving that was an issue.
2. The market clearly proved he deserved a raise. VCU (or someone else) still paid more.
3. Please give me your insider knowledge on the last basketball search. Do you even know who was considered?

(06-07-2018 03:15 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  someone correct me if I’m wrong but I am pretty sure that you can’t field more than 1 D1 team for each sex if you do not have basketball. And that one team can’t be basketball.

So we couldn’t have baseball and women’s basketball.

But we could have baseball and women’s hockey.

Schools must field teams in at least seven sports for men and seven for women or six for men and eight for women, with at least two team sports for each gender.

http://www.ncaapublications.com/productd...s/D118.pdf

Another rule that you might be thinking of is:

Members must sponsor at least one team sport for each sex in each playing season (fall, winter, spring)

(06-07-2018 03:11 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  69/70/73 keeps repeating the same stupid ideas from long ago about the need to improve basketball to the Gonzaga level. With things as they are in the NCAA regarding transfers, and with that only getting worse, Rice has no chance to field a decent Division I team. Period.
It is time to drop men's basketball.
Rice would still have issues with men's basketball, but the idiotic hiring of Rhoades just accelerated the inevitable slide into the current morass. The fault lies with the Athletic Director in (1) hiring Rhoades; (2) allowing Rhoades (with the willing assistance of certain alums) to renegotiate his contract for more money; and (3) panicking by choosing Pera without doing the proper due diligence.

If merely stating what has been an obvious objective of the program is "repeating the same stupid ideas from long ago" then so be it. I think I've made it pretty clear that with Bloomgren I think there is some degree of shift in emphasis back to football.

Trying to have a D-1 program without basketball is almost as tricky as trying to have one in our part of the world without football. TV contracts are based on football and to a lesser extent basketball. Without either one, you are looking at difficulty maintaining a conference affiliation. Tulane and Miami tried dropping basketball a few years ago. Neither one lasted. In our own situation, if you think dropping basketball is a viable option, perhaps you could explain how to get that by Tudor and Trauber.

(06-07-2018 03:52 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 03:15 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  someone correct me if I’m wrong but I am pretty sure that you can’t field more than 1 D1 team for each sex if you do not have basketball. And that one team can’t be basketball.

So we couldn’t have baseball and women’s basketball.

But we could have baseball and women’s hockey.

Schools must field teams in at least seven sports for men and seven for women or six for men and eight for women, with at least two team sports for each gender.

http://www.ncaapublications.com/productd...s/D118.pdf

Another rule that you might be thinking of is:

Members must sponsor at least one team sport for each sex in each playing season (fall, winter, spring)

Gotcha, I guess we’d have to add something for the winter since I don’t think track counts as a team sport?

I’d love to trade basketball for hockey. Would give us some great publicity and we’d be the go-to game for any hockey fan in Houston.

I've pretty much been the most stalwart supporter of men's basketball the last 5-10 years on this site. But this is the final straw for me so I'm even giving up the optimistic viewpoint now. There are a lot of things I would like to say about this but I need to bite my tongue. There's not much fun in being a Rice athletics fan anymore.

(06-07-2018 03:24 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  1. What was wrong with Rhoades? He gave our program more life than it’s had in 10 years. It’s the leaving that was an issue.
2. The market clearly proved he deserved a raise. VCU (or someone else) still paid more.
3. Please give me your insider knowledge on the last basketball search. Do you even know who was considered?

I agree that Rhoades made basketball fun. But Karlgaard had to know Rhoades would eventually leave. If Karlgaard had a succession plan, and it was Pera, that has been shown to have not worked very well at all.

(06-07-2018 04:51 PM)ESE84 Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 03:24 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  1. What was wrong with Rhoades? He gave our program more life than it’s had in 10 years. It’s the leaving that was an issue.
2. The market clearly proved he deserved a raise. VCU (or someone else) still paid more.
3. Please give me your insider knowledge on the last basketball search. Do you even know who was considered?

I agree that Rhoades made basketball fun. But Karlgaard had to know Rhoades would eventually leave. If Karlgaard had a succession plan, and it was Pera, that has been shown to have not worked very well at all.

Not sure anyone could’ve done better. Pera lost 6 guys because Rhoades left. He scrapped together a class of 3 freshmen and 2 unwanted grad transfers + 1 non grad transfer. The 3 freshmen were kids who had been passed over by most programs.

So ya... this season was going to be tough no matter what.

Those 3 freshmen played a lot as expected. 1 didn’t do school work and chose to leave. Not sure what Pera can do about a kid that doesn’t want to take tests. 1 played well and heard he could go to a P5 program so he left (the sad state of college basketball). 1 was going to see his role diminish greatly if he stayed and chose to leave for non baskeball reasons and be a walk on elsewhere (doesn’t really impact next year).

Cashaw graduated (which is what we all want right?). He sees next year isn’t going to be much better than this year and he’s played in front of dismal crowds for 3 years. If he doesn’t have to sit out he can leave and go play for a team that might make the tournament. What’s Pera supposed to do there?

So now we’re stuck with the prospects of another bad year. We can thank Rice for not supporting athletics for 50 years and getting us to this state. Not really sure what you expect JK or Pera to do about this in one season. Blame Rhoades for shopping himself around and taking a VCU job if you’re going to blame anyone.

(06-07-2018 04:58 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 04:51 PM)ESE84 Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 03:24 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  1. What was wrong with Rhoades? He gave our program more life than it’s had in 10 years. It’s the leaving that was an issue.
2. The market clearly proved he deserved a raise. VCU (or someone else) still paid more.
3. Please give me your insider knowledge on the last basketball search. Do you even know who was considered?

I agree that Rhoades made basketball fun. But Karlgaard had to know Rhoades would eventually leave. If Karlgaard had a succession plan, and it was Pera, that has been shown to have not worked very well at all.

Not sure anyone could’ve done better. Pera lost 6 guys because Rhoades left. He scrapped together a class of 3 freshmen and 2 unwanted grad transfers + 1 non grad transfer. The 3 freshmen were kids who had been passed over by most programs.

So ya... this season was going to be tough no matter what.

Those 3 freshmen played a lot as expected. 1 didn’t do school work and chose to leave. Not sure what Pera can do about a kid that doesn’t want to take tests. 1 played well and heard he could go to a P5 program so he left (the sad state of college basketball). 1 was going to see his role diminish greatly if he stayed and chose to leave for non baskeball reasons and be a walk on elsewhere (doesn’t really impact next year).

Cashaw graduated (which is what we all want right?). He sees next year isn’t going to be much better than this year and he’s played in front of dismal crowds for 3 years. If he doesn’t have to sit out he can leave and go play for a team that might make the tournament. What’s Pera supposed to do there?

So now we’re stuck with the prospects of another bad year. We can thank Rice for not supporting athletics for 50 years and getting us to this state. Not really sure what you expect JK or Pera to do about this in one season. Blame Rhoades for shopping himself around and taking a VCU job if you’re going to blame anyone.

+1

I would drop MBB for at least two years and try a different sport after this year or tell Pera he must bring in more players from Texas and see if that reduces the transfer problem.

Who should have been hired after Rhoades? Who would have been able to keep Evans et al at Rice? If Evans et al did leave who could have recruited a better roster in the short time frame?

(06-07-2018 05:29 PM)Tiki Owl Wrote:  Who should have been hired after Rhoades? Who would have been able to keep Evans et al at Rice? If Evans et al did leave who could have recruited a better roster in the short time frame?

Good questions that probably could have been better answered with a longer timeframe than the 48 hours that transpired between Rhoades leaving and Pera getting the nod.

(06-07-2018 05:42 PM)At Ease Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 05:29 PM)Tiki Owl Wrote:  Who should have been hired after Rhoades? Who would have been able to keep Evans et al at Rice? If Evans et al did leave who could have recruited a better roster in the short time frame?

Good questions that probably could have been better answered with a longer timeframe than the 48 hours that transpired between Rhoades leaving and Pera getting the nod.

But not as long as picking a new baseball coach?

(06-07-2018 03:24 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 03:11 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  69/70/73 keeps repeating the same stupid ideas from long ago about the need to improve basketball to the Gonzaga level. With things as they are in the NCAA regarding transfers, and with that only getting worse, Rice has no chance to field a decent Division I team. Period.

It is time to drop men's basketball.

Rice would still have issues with men's basketball, but the idiotic hiring of Rhoades just accelerated the inevitable slide into the current morass. The fault lies with the Athletic Director in (1) hiring Rhoades; (2) allowing Rhoades (with the willing assistance of certain alums) to renegotiate his contract for more money; and (3) panicking by choosing Pera without doing the proper due diligence.

1. What was wrong with Rhoades? He gave our program more life than it’s had in 10 years. It’s the leaving that was an issue.
2. The market clearly proved he deserved a raise. VCU (or someone else) still paid more.
3. Please give me your insider knowledge on the last basketball search. Do you even know who was considered?

1. In order to build a program, stability outweighs "excitement" every time. Rhoades wanted to make a big splash as quickly as possible, so he recruited players for him, and not for Rice. That distinction is crucial.

2. He had a contract. The time for a raise would have been after that contract had run, or, in the extreme example, after at least a trip to the NIT. Neither applied.

3. I have no insider knowledge. I'm using common sense. If SIX players transfer, after the coach's first season, something is drastically wrong - especially since that coach had been on the previous staff.

Maybe we can get special dispensation to have basketball compete in a JUCO league.

Sent from my SM-G892U using CSNbbs mobile app

Wow on Conner. I asked his aunt if he was going to stay and she said yes, but I think this was a Kazemi situation-someone who worked his tail off, had some moments, solid guy, but wanted some success in his career, but saw next year as sinking. Another horrible in the worse rice sports year since 88 or so.

Re Rhodes, imho in short, we got unlucky, once LSU hired VCU's coach, the dominos were about to fall. Braun was the disaster.

Re JK, does anybody really think that the best AD ever (not sure who that would be) could have made chicken salad out of this mess? All the issues have been stated over and over again, but it starts at the top, the very top and the lack of commitment, support, and funding. What did TCU, UH, others do? We cut budgets, stay in the WAC way too long, hire Greenspan, Braun, keep Bailiff after 2011, can't handle the Wayne situation when as they said in the Godfather, it was clear that he was slippin, etc etc. The BOT and Leebron can not hide from the responsibility of this disaster.

I am not conspiratorial in nature, but am convinced that "those" who wanted to kill sports at rice, but we're unable to do the deed directly, did so through starvation and neglect.

Let's face it, did the McKinsey report state anything that a rational follower of Rice sports not know? The "pro" crowd hoped that it would lay out the magic bullet. The "anti" crowd hoped it would provide a case for hopelessness. Neither got what they wanted, but in short, it said there are two options: 1) commit, fund, go all in or 2) kill it. It did not say muddle along, market based on hope, ignore what little fan base that is left, hire retreads, fund minimally and too late (sorry, but convincing a rich alum or 2 to fund a bldg is not funding), ignore the obvious (wasn't 5 1/2 years of bailiff enough?), in short, the same ole Rice way of the past 50 years (not meant to slam Bobby May as he did a great job of turning the on the field/court results around). The minute after we won the 96 SWC baseball tournament, we needed a whole different approach and attitude, but sadly.

Those who aren't followers, like the Comical and their occasional reporting such as columns on when bailiff was fired or the Wayne situation, don't get why on either since "but didn't they do all this before", from a perspective of that should be enough for you Rice guys. In other words, irrelevancy, which tells it all. Bet if MK did a long retrospective on the past 20 or 25 years, the analysis would be different.

Well we played Southwestern in football a couple of times during WWII, hope they will let us in their D3 conference. Scary thing is that Trinity is in that one and they are quite the powerhouse.

Well to paraphrase Casablanca, we always will have the CWS championship.....