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Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
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doss2 Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-22-2018 11:42 PM)Loco Bearcat Wrote:  
(03-22-2018 11:03 PM)MrCincy Wrote:  
(03-21-2018 05:54 AM)jarr Wrote:  I am curious what everyone's own expectations are for this program. There seems to be a lot of varying opinions on this, some seem very pleased with what Mick has done here and his trajectory, others seem to think he has taken this program to a certain level but won't get us further.

I personally, have always felt this program is a top 15 hoops school. History should tell us that based on all of the basic metrics (all time wins, final 4's championships, tourney appearances, AA's, times ranked in the polls, conference titles, etc.) We will be playing in a top 15 on campus arena next year, and I believe if committed, can pay a top 25 salary. I also believe we have a top 20 fan base, at least for Basketball. It doesn't always show, but when the team is doing well, UC fans travel pretty well and will fill up the arena on a consistent basis. We are and always will be a Basketball first school, where most schools learn Football first.


I do agree with some, that basing a season on what happens in the tournament can be a bit unfair, looking at this over a longer time frame should be more accurate. I believe that 1 sweet 16 in 12 years is not meeting the expectations of this program. However, this year gave me a glimmer of hope, that perhaps Mick is turning the corner (until Sunday).

I believe our expectations should be the following:

1) Be a final four contender every other year (realizing this may result in an expected early exit, but we should be considered in the running

2) Be a tournament level team nearly every year, probably 9 out of 10 years

3) Be challenging for the league title almost every year, maybe finishing top 3. But winning a championship about 4 out of 10 times.

4) At least one final four in a 10 year span. Whether we were a heavy favorite to do so entering as a 1 or 2 seed, or making an unexpected run as 3-6 seed.

5) Staying in the top 25 about 85% of the time.

6) Consistently bringing in top 40 recruiting classes, and top 3 AAC classes

7) Creating a pipleine with local talent, possibly having a somewhat local kid (100 mile radius) every other year.

8) Producing at least one NBA player every 4 year cycle

9) At least 3 sweet 16's in a 10 year span

10) Win totals should consistently be over 25 W per year

10) OOC SOS should be top 25 consistently, with our league not providing many opportunities for quality wins

11) Continuing to graduate players on a consistent basis and have good quality players that represent the school well

12) Coming close to winning a national championship or perhaps doing the whole thing. I realize winning the whole thing is a little unrealistic, but it would be nice to get close or be discussed as a heavy favorite at least once. Winning it would probably exceed my expectations.


Are these expectations realistic or unrealistic? Has Mick met yours in his 12 years, or has he exceeded or or not met yours?
Mick is a great BB coach. Your expectations are a dream in your own mind. Coach Cronin is a consistent winner. I expect you to get all A's over the next 10 years.

If Cronin was a great coach UC would be playing Kansas St in the Elite 8 on Saturday, however Sweet 16 and Elite 8 don't matter to him!!

If Cronin were great others would have approached him. Oh UNLV was, as we say in takeovers, a take under.
 
03-26-2018 06:35 PM
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Not Duane Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-26-2018 06:35 PM)doss2 Wrote:  
(03-22-2018 11:42 PM)Loco Bearcat Wrote:  
(03-22-2018 11:03 PM)MrCincy Wrote:  
(03-21-2018 05:54 AM)jarr Wrote:  I am curious what everyone's own expectations are for this program. There seems to be a lot of varying opinions on this, some seem very pleased with what Mick has done here and his trajectory, others seem to think he has taken this program to a certain level but won't get us further.

I personally, have always felt this program is a top 15 hoops school. History should tell us that based on all of the basic metrics (all time wins, final 4's championships, tourney appearances, AA's, times ranked in the polls, conference titles, etc.) We will be playing in a top 15 on campus arena next year, and I believe if committed, can pay a top 25 salary. I also believe we have a top 20 fan base, at least for Basketball. It doesn't always show, but when the team is doing well, UC fans travel pretty well and will fill up the arena on a consistent basis. We are and always will be a Basketball first school, where most schools learn Football first.


I do agree with some, that basing a season on what happens in the tournament can be a bit unfair, looking at this over a longer time frame should be more accurate. I believe that 1 sweet 16 in 12 years is not meeting the expectations of this program. However, this year gave me a glimmer of hope, that perhaps Mick is turning the corner (until Sunday).

I believe our expectations should be the following:

1) Be a final four contender every other year (realizing this may result in an expected early exit, but we should be considered in the running

2) Be a tournament level team nearly every year, probably 9 out of 10 years

3) Be challenging for the league title almost every year, maybe finishing top 3. But winning a championship about 4 out of 10 times.

4) At least one final four in a 10 year span. Whether we were a heavy favorite to do so entering as a 1 or 2 seed, or making an unexpected run as 3-6 seed.

5) Staying in the top 25 about 85% of the time.

6) Consistently bringing in top 40 recruiting classes, and top 3 AAC classes

7) Creating a pipleine with local talent, possibly having a somewhat local kid (100 mile radius) every other year.

8) Producing at least one NBA player every 4 year cycle

9) At least 3 sweet 16's in a 10 year span

10) Win totals should consistently be over 25 W per year

10) OOC SOS should be top 25 consistently, with our league not providing many opportunities for quality wins

11) Continuing to graduate players on a consistent basis and have good quality players that represent the school well

12) Coming close to winning a national championship or perhaps doing the whole thing. I realize winning the whole thing is a little unrealistic, but it would be nice to get close or be discussed as a heavy favorite at least once. Winning it would probably exceed my expectations.


Are these expectations realistic or unrealistic? Has Mick met yours in his 12 years, or has he exceeded or or not met yours?
Mick is a great BB coach. Your expectations are a dream in your own mind. Coach Cronin is a consistent winner. I expect you to get all A's over the next 10 years.

If Cronin was a great coach UC would be playing Kansas St in the Elite 8 on Saturday, however Sweet 16 and Elite 8 don't matter to him!!

If Cronin were great others would have approached him. Oh UNLV was, as we say in takeovers, a take under.

I think we may have the first ever tenured MBB coach in DI...Find me another coach that has lasted this long at a DI school with only one deep run in almost a decade and a half...I don't think there are any!
 
03-26-2018 06:45 PM
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CliftonAve Online
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Post: #63
RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-26-2018 06:45 PM)Not Duane Wrote:  
(03-26-2018 06:35 PM)doss2 Wrote:  
(03-22-2018 11:42 PM)Loco Bearcat Wrote:  
(03-22-2018 11:03 PM)MrCincy Wrote:  
(03-21-2018 05:54 AM)jarr Wrote:  I am curious what everyone's own expectations are for this program. There seems to be a lot of varying opinions on this, some seem very pleased with what Mick has done here and his trajectory, others seem to think he has taken this program to a certain level but won't get us further.

I personally, have always felt this program is a top 15 hoops school. History should tell us that based on all of the basic metrics (all time wins, final 4's championships, tourney appearances, AA's, times ranked in the polls, conference titles, etc.) We will be playing in a top 15 on campus arena next year, and I believe if committed, can pay a top 25 salary. I also believe we have a top 20 fan base, at least for Basketball. It doesn't always show, but when the team is doing well, UC fans travel pretty well and will fill up the arena on a consistent basis. We are and always will be a Basketball first school, where most schools learn Football first.


I do agree with some, that basing a season on what happens in the tournament can be a bit unfair, looking at this over a longer time frame should be more accurate. I believe that 1 sweet 16 in 12 years is not meeting the expectations of this program. However, this year gave me a glimmer of hope, that perhaps Mick is turning the corner (until Sunday).

I believe our expectations should be the following:

1) Be a final four contender every other year (realizing this may result in an expected early exit, but we should be considered in the running

2) Be a tournament level team nearly every year, probably 9 out of 10 years

3) Be challenging for the league title almost every year, maybe finishing top 3. But winning a championship about 4 out of 10 times.

4) At least one final four in a 10 year span. Whether we were a heavy favorite to do so entering as a 1 or 2 seed, or making an unexpected run as 3-6 seed.

5) Staying in the top 25 about 85% of the time.

6) Consistently bringing in top 40 recruiting classes, and top 3 AAC classes

7) Creating a pipleine with local talent, possibly having a somewhat local kid (100 mile radius) every other year.

8) Producing at least one NBA player every 4 year cycle

9) At least 3 sweet 16's in a 10 year span

10) Win totals should consistently be over 25 W per year

10) OOC SOS should be top 25 consistently, with our league not providing many opportunities for quality wins

11) Continuing to graduate players on a consistent basis and have good quality players that represent the school well

12) Coming close to winning a national championship or perhaps doing the whole thing. I realize winning the whole thing is a little unrealistic, but it would be nice to get close or be discussed as a heavy favorite at least once. Winning it would probably exceed my expectations.


Are these expectations realistic or unrealistic? Has Mick met yours in his 12 years, or has he exceeded or or not met yours?
Mick is a great BB coach. Your expectations are a dream in your own mind. Coach Cronin is a consistent winner. I expect you to get all A's over the next 10 years.

If Cronin was a great coach UC would be playing Kansas St in the Elite 8 on Saturday, however Sweet 16 and Elite 8 don't matter to him!!

If Cronin were great others would have approached him. Oh UNLV was, as we say in takeovers, a take under.

I think we may have the first ever tenured MBB coach in DI...Find me another coach that has lasted this long at a DI school with only one deep run in almost a decade and a half...I don't think there are any!

Putting aside the “low majors”, the only other two are Fran Dunphy (Temple) and Dave Rose (BYU).
 
03-27-2018 04:45 AM
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BearcatJerry Offline
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
I'm not really sure why, this long into Mick's tenure, anyone is "expecting" anything other that what we've got...

We'll get an NCAA Bid about 85% of the time, which means in the next ten years we'll go dancing 9 times. (I'll round up.)

Out of those 9 times, we'll get bounced in the first weekend (the first 2 rounds) 8 times, and about 5 times we'll exit in the first round.

We'll "challenge" for Conference titles about 8 or 9 of those next ten years; we'll "win" the conference title outright in the tournament maybe twice (2) and we'll win the "Regular Season Title" probably three or four times.

Depending on what happens with Xavier, our fortunes may improve in the "Crosstown Shootout," but if everything stayed the same, we'd win about two or three of those in the next ten years.

Those are my expectations.
 
03-27-2018 07:52 AM
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doss2 Offline
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-27-2018 07:52 AM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  I'm not really sure why, this long into Mick's tenure, anyone is "expecting" anything other that what we've got...

We'll get an NCAA Bid about 85% of the time, which means in the next ten years we'll go dancing 9 times. (I'll round up.)

Out of those 9 times, we'll get bounced in the first weekend (the first 2 rounds) 8 times, and about 5 times we'll exit in the first round.

We'll "challenge" for Conference titles about 8 or 9 of those next ten years; we'll "win" the conference title outright in the tournament maybe twice (2) and we'll win the "Regular Season Title" probably three or four times.

Depending on what happens with Xavier, our fortunes may improve in the "Crosstown Shootout," but if everything stayed the same, we'd win about two or three of those in the next ten years.

Those are my expectations.

In business we always said if you set low expectations do not be surprised when your expectations are met.
 
03-27-2018 08:19 AM
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jarr Offline
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-27-2018 07:52 AM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  I'm not really sure why, this long into Mick's tenure, anyone is "expecting" anything other that what we've got...

We'll get an NCAA Bid about 85% of the time, which means in the next ten years we'll go dancing 9 times. (I'll round up.)

Out of those 9 times, we'll get bounced in the first weekend (the first 2 rounds) 8 times, and about 5 times we'll exit in the first round.

We'll "challenge" for Conference titles about 8 or 9 of those next ten years; we'll "win" the conference title outright in the tournament maybe twice (2) and we'll win the "Regular Season Title" probably three or four times.

Depending on what happens with Xavier, our fortunes may improve in the "Crosstown Shootout," but if everything stayed the same, we'd win about two or three of those in the next ten years.

Those are my expectations.

Is this good enough? I have higher expectations for this program as a whole, but do believe these are probably the expectations we should have with Mick. I dont see any reason for this to change based on recruiting and no foreseeable adjustments with the staff or philosophy.

I do believe there are candidates out there that could improve on this with the right vision. I suggested Bryce Drew's name a few years ago when UNLV was courting Mick. He is now at Vandy and will be bringing in a top 3 recruiting class next year. Vandy should be well positioned for the next few years with who has coming back,.probably top 10 or 15 team.
 
(This post was last modified: 03-27-2018 08:36 AM by jarr.)
03-27-2018 08:36 AM
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-27-2018 07:52 AM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  I'm not really sure why, this long into Mick's tenure, anyone is "expecting" anything other that what we've got...

We'll get an NCAA Bid about 85% of the time, which means in the next ten years we'll go dancing 9 times. (I'll round up.)

Out of those 9 times, we'll get bounced in the first weekend (the first 2 rounds) 8 times, and about 5 times we'll exit in the first round.

We'll "challenge" for Conference titles about 8 or 9 of those next ten years; we'll "win" the conference title outright in the tournament maybe twice (2) and we'll win the "Regular Season Title" probably three or four times.

Depending on what happens with Xavier, our fortunes may improve in the "Crosstown Shootout," but if everything stayed the same, we'd win about two or three of those in the next ten years.

Those are my expectations.

I guess it depends on how you view the last 3 seasons. I think objectively UC has gotten better each year and this year was far and away the best of the Mick Cronin era (despite not going as far in the tourney as 2012). Is the improvement of the last 3 years a trend or a fluke? If you only measure college hoops by how a team does in the tournament things aren't much different, but if you measure by conference titles, conference tournament titles, top ten rankings, etc...this year was easily the best team UC has had. It wasn't built overnight either it was a trend that you could see coming.

I don't have a clear answer right now whether is was a rare great year or the program is moving forward to the next step of being a top 10-15 on a semi regular basis. If it is the later I think more conference titles, more high seeds and some deep runs will be there. If its the former the administration will need to make a decision in a couple years on if that is enough for the program. I'm not ready to give up on where we're going after a season where the team was that good and accomplished a ton, but we have to build on it. If we don't start seeing this more regularly it may be time to look elsewhere.
 
03-27-2018 09:05 AM
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Def Berkkat Offline
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
Man, we've got a lot of spoiled people on here.

People are losing touch with what it takes to even make the tournament, let alone eight years in a row. When we start missing the tournament, then I say let the whining begin.

If your name's not Duke, North Carolina, Kansas, Villanova or 3-4 others you don't see many people carrying around many trophies either. If you lose in the second round or lose in the final four, you're still one of the losers.

Heck, it's been 18 years since the wizard of Izzo won a championship and he only won it then because Kenyon snapped his leg. UC would have beat that team by 25 with Kenyon.

So yeah, it sucks to get bounced out early, but there's no trophy for the elite 8. That's zavier mentality.

Look at UConn. Look at Indiana. In the here and now they'd gladly trade places with us. It kills them to see the brackets come out and not be in there.

OK, now come at me with the "settling for mediocrity" and "mid major" pack mentality. I for one think Cronin's done a fine job and am satisfied with the state of the program.

... and no, I'm not a native west sider catholic schooler and I don't know the guy.
 
(This post was last modified: 03-27-2018 09:28 AM by Def Berkkat.)
03-27-2018 09:27 AM
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-27-2018 09:27 AM)Def Berkkat Wrote:  Man, we've got a lot of spoiled people on here.

People are losing touch with what it takes to even make the tournament, let alone eight years in a row. When we start missing the tournament, then I say let the whining begin.

If your name's not Duke, North Carolina, Kansas, Villanova or 3-4 others you don't see many people carrying around many trophies either. If you lose in the second round or lose in the final four, you're still one of the losers.

Heck, it's been 18 years since the wizard of Izzo won a championship and he only won it then because Kenyon snapped his leg. UC would have beat that team by 25 with Kenyon.

So yeah, it sucks to get bounced out early, but there's no trophy for the elite 8. That's zavier mentality.

Look at UConn. Look at Indiana. In the here and now they'd gladly trade places with us. It kills them to see the brackets come out and not be in there.

OK, now come at me with the "settling for mediocrity" and "mid major" pack mentality. I for one think Cronin's done a fine job and am satisfied with the state of the program.

... and no, I'm not a native west sider catholic schooler and I don't know the guy.

I'm satisfied with the direction of the program the last 3 years... but we need more teams that are top 10-15 quality like we had this season. If Cronin can't deliver that we'll never be a real threat in March. I've said many times I'd rather have a top 5-10 that loses early than an 11 seed that makes an elite 8 run, because I want a team that has a realistic path to the championship. The problem is UC mostly hasn't had either of those things under Cronin. We need to see this kind of team more often. If we do we will break through in March.
 
03-27-2018 09:34 AM
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-27-2018 09:27 AM)Def Berkkat Wrote:  Man, we've got a lot of spoiled people on here.

People are losing touch with what it takes to even make the tournament, let alone eight years in a row. When we start missing the tournament, then I say let the whining begin.

If your name's not Duke, North Carolina, Kansas, Villanova or 3-4 others you don't see many people carrying around many trophies either. If you lose in the second round or lose in the final four, you're still one of the losers.

Heck, it's been 18 years since the wizard of Izzo won a championship and he only won it then because Kenyon snapped his leg. UC would have beat that team by 25 with Kenyon.

So yeah, it sucks to get bounced out early, but there's no trophy for the elite 8. That's zavier mentality.

Look at UConn. Look at Indiana. In the here and now they'd gladly trade places with us. It kills them to see the brackets come out and not be in there.

OK, now come at me with the "settling for mediocrity" and "mid major" pack mentality. I for one think Cronin's done a fine job and am satisfied with the state of the program.

... and no, I'm not a native west sider catholic schooler and I don't know the guy.

I think its naive to think we can't do better, and I realize we could also do worse. Villanova wasn't anything special 10 or 15 years ago. Our program was way ahead of theirs. Also, winning Championships is not everything. Kansas only has 3 in their storied history, and many people view their program as having a greater history than UCLA with their 11. Sweet 16, Elite 8's, and final 4's absolutely matter. That is the next step before you can start talking about winning championships.
 
(This post was last modified: 03-27-2018 09:35 AM by jarr.)
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
Realistic expectation: This season will we tough to beat... except that the NCAA tournament results - well we can be hopeful.

I don't expect next season to be the dumpster fire that a few of you seem to be predicting.

I do expect a real drop off next year without Clark, Washington, and Evans. (If Evans comes back, my expectations will increase.) I am not sold on Moore, Williams, and Broome to lift the offense. (I hope I am wrong on that.)

Going forward beyond next year. Mick should be able to continue to find some good players looking for a stable environment and keep us a winning program. He will not suddenly develop into Coach K and put us in the top 10 every year.

(Still bummed about that Nevada game.)
 
03-27-2018 10:13 AM
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
Late to the party, but my biggest expectation is for Mick to try and actually be likable. The complaining, excuses, and backhanded compliments are very immature. Mick has 'little man' syndrome. I'm tired of defending his behavior to friends and other acquaintances. Actually, I just laugh at him now. I just want the guy to act like he can handle a loss in the heat of the moment instead of lowering himself to Macura standards.
 
03-27-2018 11:36 AM
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-27-2018 04:45 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(03-26-2018 06:45 PM)Not Duane Wrote:  
(03-26-2018 06:35 PM)doss2 Wrote:  
(03-22-2018 11:42 PM)Loco Bearcat Wrote:  
(03-22-2018 11:03 PM)MrCincy Wrote:  Mick is a great BB coach. Your expectations are a dream in your own mind. Coach Cronin is a consistent winner. I expect you to get all A's over the next 10 years.

If Cronin was a great coach UC would be playing Kansas St in the Elite 8 on Saturday, however Sweet 16 and Elite 8 don't matter to him!!

If Cronin were great others would have approached him. Oh UNLV was, as we say in takeovers, a take under.

I think we may have the first ever tenured MBB coach in DI...Find me another coach that has lasted this long at a DI school with only one deep run in almost a decade and a half...I don't think there are any!

Putting aside the “low majors”, the only other two are Fran Dunphy (Temple) and Dave Rose (BYU).

Expanding on my post this morning, attached are all D1 coaches who have coached at least 12 years at the same school and have just one Sweet 16 or less:

Lewis Jackson (Alabama State)
Will Brown (Albany)
Rick Byrd (Belmont)
Dave Rose (BYU) * One S16
Barclay Radebaugh (Charleston Southern)
Mick Cronin (Cincinnati) * One S16
Bill Herrion (New Hampshire)
Brian Jones (North Dakota State)
Ben Jacobson (Northern Iowa) * One S16
Mike McConathy (Northwestern State)
Greg Kampe (Oakland)
Chris Mooney (Richmond) * One S16
Randy Bennett (Saint Mary's) *One S16
John Dunne (Saint Peter's)
Horace Broadnax (Savannah State)
Fran Dunphy (Temple)
Randy Rahe (Weber State)
Steve Hawkins (Western Michigan)
Tony Shaver (William & Mary)
Mike Young (Wofford)
James Jones (Yale)
 
03-27-2018 12:37 PM
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
If the Nevada game doesn't force some changes in Mick, then I fear this past season was the best team we will ever see under him. While most of the following comments are about the (lack of) offense, I also want to see huge changes in how he deals with the media. I'm beyond tired of the whining and idiotic statements after a loss. What happened to the version of Mick who dealt with the media after the brawl?

All 4 regular season losses were extremely disappointing, but not unexpected based upon Mick's track record. While watching the Nevada game with friends, I continually said that I wasn't comfortable with the lead because Nevada has shooters and UC will start playing stupid and tight.

It got to the point this season, despite how many individual players on this team I enjoy watching, I couldn't stomach watching this team play. I even stopped recording the games when I would be busy with volleyball. I either listened on the radio while in the car or checked the final score (often receiving the score and a rant about how crappy the team looked from my best friend).

This was a team on paper with real offensive balance and depth that was still easy for good teams to shut down. I've long been a believer that offensive efficiency is more important than points per game, so a slow pace never bothered me. I also self-justified the ugly offensive basketball in the years past because of the lack of offensive talent. (Side note, Troy Caupain looks so much better in the G league than he ever did under Cronin)

This program needs a top down review of everything it does and Mick needs to be open to change. Like most of you, I find Rick Pitino to be a scumbag, but recruiting with hookers aside, he does understand what a winning program should look like. I'd be fine with Mick hiring Rick as a consultant to review the entire program because Rick is one of the few people Mick would actually listen to.

One of the old sayings in sports is that it is about the Jimmys and the Joes. This was a season where UC had the Jimmys and Joes to stack up with any team in the country. Mick has proven in the past that he coach and drive under-skilled teams to records that exceed what they should be on paper (see his first couple of seasons, the post-brawl team with multiple suspended players, and SK's senior year). We are too many seasons into Mick's tenure at UC to continue being the scrappy little underdog.
 
03-27-2018 01:09 PM
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-27-2018 12:37 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(03-27-2018 04:45 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(03-26-2018 06:45 PM)Not Duane Wrote:  
(03-26-2018 06:35 PM)doss2 Wrote:  
(03-22-2018 11:42 PM)Loco Bearcat Wrote:  If Cronin was a great coach UC would be playing Kansas St in the Elite 8 on Saturday, however Sweet 16 and Elite 8 don't matter to him!!

If Cronin were great others would have approached him. Oh UNLV was, as we say in takeovers, a take under.

I think we may have the first ever tenured MBB coach in DI...Find me another coach that has lasted this long at a DI school with only one deep run in almost a decade and a half...I don't think there are any!

Putting aside the “low majors”, the only other two are Fran Dunphy (Temple) and Dave Rose (BYU).

Expanding on my post this morning, attached are all D1 coaches who have coached at least 12 years at the same school and have just one Sweet 16 or less:

Lewis Jackson (Alabama State)
Will Brown (Albany)
Rick Byrd (Belmont)
Dave Rose (BYU) * One S16
Barclay Radebaugh (Charleston Southern)
Mick Cronin (Cincinnati) * One S16
Bill Herrion (New Hampshire)
Brian Jones (North Dakota State)
Ben Jacobson (Northern Iowa) * One S16
Mike McConathy (Northwestern State)
Greg Kampe (Oakland)
Chris Mooney (Richmond) * One S16
Randy Bennett (Saint Mary's) *One S16
John Dunne (Saint Peter's)
Horace Broadnax (Savannah State)
Fran Dunphy (Temple)
Randy Rahe (Weber State)
Steve Hawkins (Western Michigan)
Tony Shaver (William & Mary)
Mike Young (Wofford)
James Jones (Yale)

Oof... reading that list is a kick to the short ones.
 
03-27-2018 01:22 PM
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Former Lurker Offline
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Post: #76
RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
Since the S16 team, the program has been on a plateau, which is where I expect it to remain as long as Mick is the coach. How long will that be? That is for the major donors and fanbase to decide. There are surely revenue projections to be met, and Mick will either make the grade, or fall short. It is a business, and these decisions are not made on emotion.
 
03-27-2018 01:22 PM
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levydl Offline
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-27-2018 01:22 PM)Former Lurker Wrote:  Since the S16 team, the program has been on a plateau, which is where I expect it to remain as long as Mick is the coach.

Is this just your feeling? Like, if this year's team won 25 games and came in 3rd in the league and got a 7 seed and lost in the second round, to you, that's about the same as what they accomplished this season?
 
03-27-2018 01:57 PM
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DownOnRohs Offline
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
(03-27-2018 01:09 PM)cpawfan Wrote:  If the Nevada game doesn't force some changes in Mick, then I fear this past season was the best team we will ever see under him. While most of the following comments are about the (lack of) offense, I also want to see huge changes in how he deals with the media. I'm beyond tired of the whining and idiotic statements after a loss. What happened to the version of Mick who dealt with the media after the brawl?

All 4 regular season losses were extremely disappointing, but not unexpected based upon Mick's track record. While watching the Nevada game with friends, I continually said that I wasn't comfortable with the lead because Nevada has shooters and UC will start playing stupid and tight.

It got to the point this season, despite how many individual players on this team I enjoy watching, I couldn't stomach watching this team play. I even stopped recording the games when I would be busy with volleyball. I either listened on the radio while in the car or checked the final score (often receiving the score and a rant about how crappy the team looked from my best friend).

This was a team on paper with real offensive balance and depth that was still easy for good teams to shut down. I've long been a believer that offensive efficiency is more important than points per game, so a slow pace never bothered me. I also self-justified the ugly offensive basketball in the years past because of the lack of offensive talent. (Side note, Troy Caupain looks so much better in the G league than he ever did under Cronin)

This program needs a top down review of everything it does and Mick needs to be open to change. Like most of you, I find Rick Pitino to be a scumbag, but recruiting with hookers aside, he does understand what a winning program should look like. I'd be fine with Mick hiring Rick as a consultant to review the entire program because Rick is one of the few people Mick would actually listen to.

One of the old sayings in sports is that it is about the Jimmys and the Joes. This was a season where UC had the Jimmys and Joes to stack up with any team in the country. Mick has proven in the past that he coach and drive under-skilled teams to records that exceed what they should be on paper (see his first couple of seasons, the post-brawl team with multiple suspended players, and SK's senior year). We are too many seasons into Mick's tenure at UC to continue being the scrappy little underdog.

It's either this or we are cursed. And I would rather believe this so I'm going to say I agree, and yes, a team that finished 31-5 should have been so much better.
 
03-27-2018 02:12 PM
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Bruce Monnin Offline
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
Actually, I appear to be more optimistic than many here. I see Cronin slowly getting better as a coach and recruiter (which can't be easy at a non-power 5 school) every year. We took a shot in the NCAA's, but but could easily have a Final Four team this year and then everyone across the country would be singing Cronin's praises.

If Jacob Evans comes back next year, we have a team that is looking a single digit NCAA seed again with another chance to make an NCAA run. And if it happens, no one will be questioning Cronin.
 
03-27-2018 02:21 PM
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Marcus Offline
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RE: Realistic Expectations for BB going forward (next 10 years)
I don't see recruiting improving at all, but maybe that is just me. We've become virtual total non factors the last few classes for Top 100 guys. We beat Buffalo for our latest commitment and just got left out of the Top 4 for a kid in favor of freaking USF, UAB, Florida Gulf Coast and Ole Miss, that the staff has spent a lot of time on over the last month or two. Our best bet at attracting legitimate talent going forward is pretty clearly the transfer route IMO.
 
(This post was last modified: 03-27-2018 02:26 PM by Marcus.)
03-27-2018 02:25 PM
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