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Bill Connelly's previews
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brovol Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
(03-29-2018 10:58 AM)RunningGame Wrote:  
(03-29-2018 07:13 AM)brovol Wrote:  Here are the numbers from last season, and the offenses ranked from top to bottom. They list the total first down play calls for each team, runs vs passes. Check out the numbers for the best or top offenses as compared to the rest. They pass more often than run. WMU middle of the pack, and clearly run more than pass, by a lot. As noted earlier, numbers are somewhat deceiving, as all teams pass more often if and when they are losing late in a game.

NCAA run/pass first down

Hey, thanks for finding those stats. But those aren't quite the stats we're looking for. Those statistics are for the number of first downs each team got, and whether they were by running, passing, or penalties. Those include any down.

I was about to put them into Excel and run a scatterplot lol.
You are correct of course. I was looking for the actual yards gained on first down, run vs pass. But this does rank the teams based on who got the most first downs, which is a pretty positive statistic, and then how many times they ran on first down compared to how many times they passed. The top offenses clearly passed more than they ran; and this is true with schools that had some of the best running backs and lines in the country. some ran more than they passed, and with some of those big powerful programs (like Alabama), most of their games they could call plays randomly out of a hat and score touchdowns most possessions, but the best offenses are not stuck in old school mode. I wouldn't be against a strict running game offense, as long as we recruit, practice and execute it to perfection (see the academies). Being an Army fan I have come to really appreciate that offense. But when you have a regular diverse run/pass offense, it is stupid to run when the defense knows you are going to run.
03-29-2018 03:20 PM
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brovol Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
(03-29-2018 09:31 AM)gobaseline Wrote:  
(03-29-2018 07:20 AM)brovol Wrote:  ....I looked up NFL stats for first downs, and the most efficient offense was New England. Bill Belichick passes on first down more than twice as much than he runs it. The guy never follows the old-school-coaches-handbook. Always takes advantage of common sense.

You have likened the philosophy you dislike and disagree to the old ‘Skins Hogs and Riggins.

Is this only regarding the play calling or also a likening to WMU’s strength (OL and RB’s)?

I am sorry but I have no idea what you are asking. If you are saying we need to play to our strengths, then certainly I don't disagree. That does not mean that we should call plays predictably, which effectively eliminates our strength. If you have a strong running game, then those linemen and running backs are stronger yet when the defenses can not predict when we are going to run. And when we make a few easy pitch and catches on first down, then the defenses begin to adjust to the pass a bit. Do you thing that may lead to a few holes when we do decide to run the ball? Yep, I do too; because it is common sense. This isn't sophisticated stuff. Its football.
03-29-2018 03:25 PM
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brovol Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
(03-29-2018 07:29 AM)MajorHoople Wrote:  Belichick has one of the greatest passers in NFL history.

Talent always trumps theory.

Yes, I am sure that if Brady had played for the Lions all these years he would have all those rings,. Brilliant analysis!!

Belichick MADE Brady the greatest passer by putting him in a position to be great. Brady took advantage of that; just as our QB's would if we put them in a premium position to be successful.
03-29-2018 03:29 PM
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MajorHoople Offline
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Post: #64
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
Belichick was 5-13 with Patriots before Brady took over at QB (and had gone 36-44 in Cleveland).

You have who "MADE" who bassackwards.
(This post was last modified: 03-29-2018 04:18 PM by MajorHoople.)
03-29-2018 04:16 PM
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flushtheherd Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
(03-29-2018 04:16 PM)MajorHoople Wrote:  Belichick was 5-13 with Patriots before Brady took over at QB (and had gone 36-44 in Cleveland).

You have who "MADE" who bassackwards.

Yeppers!
03-30-2018 12:25 PM
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brovol Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
(03-29-2018 04:16 PM)MajorHoople Wrote:  Belichick was 5-13 with Patriots before Brady took over at QB (and had gone 36-44 in Cleveland).

You have who "MADE" who bassackwards.

So your point is that Belichick is actually a lousy football coach, and he has won all those games because of Brady. The quality of this conclusion at least is consistent with most of your posts lately. So there is that.

Belichick does what other coaches don't do, and that is why he does it. You, on the other hand, have always been a good old-school, establish the run, stay conservative, advocate, so it is no surprise that you object to anything which exposes the ridiculousness of that way of thinking.
03-30-2018 06:05 PM
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MajorHoople Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
You are so easy.

At four of the schools I was HC we set the passing and-or receiving records despite my being an "old school, establish the run, stay conservative" coach.

The mouse takes the cheese yet again.
03-30-2018 07:22 PM
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Stampede your face!! Offline
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Post: #68
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
(03-30-2018 07:22 PM)MajorHoople Wrote:  You are so easy.

At four of the schools I was HC we set the passing and-or receiving records despite my being an "old school, establish the run, stay conservative" coach.

The mouse takes the cheese yet again.

Zing!!!! You really got him there....

Brovol should just leave in shame. 01-wingedeagle
03-30-2018 08:03 PM
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brovol Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
(03-30-2018 07:22 PM)MajorHoople Wrote:  You are so easy.

At four of the schools I was HC we set the passing and-or receiving records despite my being an "old school, establish the run, stay conservative" coach.

The mouse takes the cheese yet again.

I care not about your self perceived prowess on the gridiron. You are very quick to challenge the suggestion that throwing when defenses are playing for a run is a wise thing to do. And that is just silly. Frankly, I have thought for awhile that you don't really disagree with things I say, but rather you are antagonistic to who said it. Regardless, despite the legend I am sure you are to some, what you say doesn't come from a burning bush; and indeed, frequently is simply ridiculous.
03-30-2018 08:39 PM
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MajorHoople Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
Please post quote from the post where I "challenge(d) the suggestion that throwing when defenses are playing for the run is a wise thing to do."
03-31-2018 05:40 AM
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brovol Offline
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Post: #71
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
(03-31-2018 05:40 AM)MajorHoople Wrote:  Please post quote from the post where I "challenge(d) the suggestion that throwing when defenses are playing for the run is a wise thing to do."

We can do the tit-for-tat, and spend hours more on this, but when I argue that it is a better strategy generally to avoid the consistent pattern of running the ball on first down as a default, because it becomes predictable enough that it gives the defense and advantage, and that passing the ball is far more advantageous on first down, you argue with me as if it is stupid to suggest the same. But, as I said in my last post, I have come to the conclusion that actually disagreeing with the things I say on this board is not a prerequisite for you arguing with ME, but your threshold for arguing with my post is, rather, that I said something. The quality (or lack thereof) in the substance of what you say in those responses serves as evidence for that conclusion.
03-31-2018 05:58 AM
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MajorHoople Offline
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Post: #72
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
"Substance" such as you attempting to pass off our 2017 season-long 1st Downs Made statistics in an attempt to show we should pass more on 1st Down?

Perhaps you would like to quibble with the FACTS I posted (Belichick's NFL head coaching record before Brady becoming his starting QB)?
03-31-2018 06:20 AM
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brovol Offline
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Post: #73
RE: Bill Connelly's previews
(03-31-2018 06:20 AM)MajorHoople Wrote:  "Substance" such as you attempting to pass off our 2017 season-long 1st Downs Made statistics in an attempt to show we should pass more on 1st Down?

Perhaps you would like to quibble with the FACTS I posted (Belichick's NFL head coaching record before Brady becoming his starting QB)?

I wont quibble with the Belichick record you posted, if those are factual. But here is the thing about folks like you major. In an attempt to make your argument, or actual more often attempting to refute someone else's position, you cite "facts" like the Belichick "record" you posted to prove that Belichick isn't a great coach, but your "facts" or "proof" is a distortion, because it provides a small part of his coaching career in the NFL. He is 250-118, with a 676% win rate in the regular season, and 28-11, with a 718% win rate in the playoffs. And you argue that is all because of Brady, but remember that Brady was the 199 pick. And who was the new head coach who saw something that nobody else did? That's right; the same dummy you are arguing isn't all that good, Bill Belichick.

You don't really like arguing with facts and substance major. You use them only as they may be convenient to promote your antagonism.

Respectfully, I submit that the quality of your position on whether Belichick is a good coach is about the same as the quality of your position on most other things around here. So at least you maintain a certain level of consistency.
03-31-2018 07:47 AM
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