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ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
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WesternBlazer Offline
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Exclamation ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
03-07-2018 08:20 PM
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oldragon Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
Great leadership by business community and foundation.
03-07-2018 09:08 PM
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TheGORILLA Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
John Rogers is 78 years old. He must be out of his mind! He has absolutely no vision, whatsoever, of the huge benefits of economic stimulus that "WILL" be created and established when the new stadium "WILL" be constructed and put in to operation. Oh Gosh! He needs to retire.
03-08-2018 12:59 PM
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CyberBlazer Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
Guess he's pissed b/c his name will not be on it, you know, The John Rogers Stadium to go along with the failed horse racing venture on John Rogers Drive
03-08-2018 01:41 PM
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RB.B Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
What the hell is up with John Rogers. Is it because he want d a dome stadium?
03-09-2018 06:02 AM
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the_blazerman Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
His palms are no longer being greased.
03-09-2018 07:30 AM
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BlazerFromMD Away
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
(03-09-2018 07:30 AM)the_blazerman Wrote:  His palms are no longer being greased.

This.
03-09-2018 07:48 AM
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UABslant Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
There are leaders who want nothing more than to get a handout from the city. When money is being put towards something that doesn't go straight to what they want, they scream empty racism claims because they have no economically logical defense. Either they don't see or can't understand how capital projects can boost tax revenue to benefit their neighborhoods and city long-term. If the check isn't being cut with their name on it, they don't recognize the benefit.

The people who are the racists in this situation are the ones screaming "you're finished" at the rep who voted yes, simply because he has the same skin color as them yet didn't vote the way they wanted. It's sickening.

When economic development happens organically in a neighborhood like Avondale, the same people yelling "racism" are screaming "Gentrification!" At the same time, they want the city to pour hundreds of millions of dollars into Smithfield to artificially develop the community. The problem is that the Smithfield community doesn't have the financial means to support the development independently and the people who do don't want to visit Smithfield unless there is an event there (MCC, UAB games, etc). To make Smithfield attractive for year-round visitors, you would have to raze housing, displace current residents, and create attractive commercial developments, which is THE DEFINITION OF GENTRIFICATION.

The solution is exactly what the business community is pushing right now: new developments in a designated entertainment district that generates new jobs for surrounding communities and increases tax revenue to help the neighborhoods that need it, all without the gentrification the neighborhood leaders don't like.
But these "neighborhood leaders" call this "racism." I have no more words.
(This post was last modified: 03-09-2018 12:22 PM by UABslant.)
03-09-2018 10:43 AM
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BAMANBLAZERFAN Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
There have been two choices for a downtown stadium proposed. The BJCC stadium and the MPF. It is obvious that only one of these can be built. Some legitimately believe the MPF is the best facility for the future of the City of B'ham in that it offers more year round capability for more types of events. At the same time, some point to the limited funding available as a main reason to support the smaller seasonally useful open air BJCC stadium. It appears now that the latter is the choice most likely to be built. We have to hope the best choice for the whole community will be made.

Both sides have some valid points and ascribing demeaning labels to those who disagree is not good debate of issues.
(This post was last modified: 03-09-2018 12:15 PM by BAMANBLAZERFAN.)
03-09-2018 12:10 PM
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UAB Band Dad Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
These things go in cycles. Generally, older areas in accessible locations, often with cool old architecture that has gotten run down, are discovered. People buy into them cheap and start to refurbish them. Others notice that the neighborhood has started to turn for the better and buy in. Property values increase.

My wife's niece bought a home in Crestwood twenty-five years ago, and paid $35k or so. They put in some sweat equity, redid the kitchen, painted, planted. They made it into a nice home that they wound up selling for over $100k. Same thing happened in Avondale.

Often you can look at where the artist's studios are as a marker. They're good at finding good space cheap, and are often the cutting edge of incoming gentrification.

There are some really nice home in Norwood that can be bought for a song, or you used to be able to anyhow. Hell, there were nice old houses that could have been had for the back taxes. They'd need money to make them right, but after it was done they'd be worth a lot more than the asking price. Yeah, the neighborhood surrounding is a bit rough, but there are a lot of people down there doing exactly this. It's how it works over time.
03-09-2018 12:11 PM
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the_blazerman Offline
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Post: #11
RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
There are a ton of houses that may be torn down north of town by Woodfin as well.
03-09-2018 12:15 PM
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UABslant Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
(03-09-2018 12:11 PM)UAB Band Dad Wrote:  These things go in cycles. Generally, older areas in accessible locations, often with cool old architecture that has gotten run down, are discovered. People buy into them cheap and start to refurbish them. Others notice that the neighborhood has started to turn for the better and buy in. Property values increase.

My wife's niece bought a home in Crestwood twenty-five years ago, and paid $35k or so. They put in some sweat equity, redid the kitchen, painted, planted. They made it into a nice home that they wound up selling for over $100k. Same thing happened in Avondale.

Often you can look at where the artist's studios are as a marker. They're good at finding good space cheap, and are often the cutting edge of incoming gentrification.

There are some really nice home in Norwood that can be bought for a song, or you used to be able to anyhow. Hell, there were nice old houses that could have been had for the back taxes. They'd need money to make them right, but after it was done they'd be worth a lot more than the asking price. Yeah, the neighborhood surrounding is a bit rough, but there are a lot of people down there doing exactly this. It's how it works over time.

Exactly. The problem is there are community leaders that don't want people moving in, restoring old homes and raising property rates. They don't want new businesses like Avondale Brewing setting up shop and Saw's Soul Kitchen selling $10 lunch plates because it's too expensive for the existing residents to enjoy regularly.
This is why I don't understand the vitriol toward a project like the BJCC, which creates a location for development in an area that is already designated for business and entertainment. It will generate tax revenue that can then be used in the neighborhoods to benefit current residents and attract businesses that cater to the existing residents, if that's what they truly want.
03-09-2018 12:56 PM
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BAMANBLAZERFAN Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
As an illustration of your points about neighborhood cycles, many B'ham neighborhoods have demographically changed a lot due to industries coming and going in the area. Did you know that the same Jemison family that designed Fairfield also designed Mountain Brook? That in the 1970s the neighborhood around Legion Field was populated by middle class families among the 32,000+ who worked at US Steel (Ensley High School was originally the "USS School") and Elyton Village was the home of many married medical students at what is now UAB (my present wife lived there while her first husband was a medical student).

Management level employees of US Steel and other industries built many of the fine homes in Norwood and Southside to put distance between their homes and the smoke where they worked. Forest Park, Avondale and Mountain Terrace (Cliff, Redmont and Altamont Roads) were also built up during this time. Beginning in the 1930s, B'ham annexed Ensley, West End, Highland, Woodlawn (its City Hall still stands) and East Lake / Roebuck-Huffman into the city.
(This post was last modified: 03-09-2018 02:04 PM by BAMANBLAZERFAN.)
03-09-2018 02:01 PM
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the_blazerman Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
& Legion Field area either failed to build sufficient businesses around it for the community or else those businesses dried up.
03-09-2018 02:13 PM
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BlazerPhil Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
(03-09-2018 07:48 AM)BlazerFromMD Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 07:30 AM)the_blazerman Wrote:  His palms are no longer being greased.

This.

It would not surprise me in the least if the people against this project are against it solely because they didn't get asked or they don't see a way to get a cut. Or they currently have a hand in Legion Field's pocket somehow and see their trickle drying up.
03-09-2018 02:18 PM
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BAMANBLAZERFAN Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
(03-09-2018 02:13 PM)the_blazerman Wrote:  & Legion Field area either failed to build sufficient businesses around it for the community or else those businesses dried up.

That area was never intended to be a commercial area and is still mainly residential. Most businesses are service oriented (my former father in law managed the Amoco station on Greymont and Arkadelphia), not manufacturing. Also, many of the homes there are rentals owned by persons who now live elsewhere and maintain them as modestly as possible to maximize profits. One reason the city has to move slowly on the demolition of vacant houses is legal obstacles put up by the property rights of absentee owners.
(This post was last modified: 03-09-2018 02:36 PM by BAMANBLAZERFAN.)
03-09-2018 02:33 PM
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RB.B Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
(03-09-2018 10:43 AM)UABslant Wrote:  There are leaders who want nothing more than to get a handout from the city. When money is being put towards something that doesn't go straight to what they want, they scream empty racism claims because they have no economically logical defense. Either they don't see or can't understand how capital projects can boost tax revenue to benefit their neighborhoods and city long-term. If the check isn't being cut with their name on it, they don't recognize the benefit.

The people who are the racists in this situation are the ones screaming "you're finished" at the rep who voted yes, simply because he has the same skin color as them yet didn't vote the way they wanted. It's sickening.

When economic development happens organically in a neighborhood like Avondale, the same people yelling "racism" are screaming "Gentrification!" At the same time, they want the city to pour hundreds of millions of dollars into Smithfield to artificially develop the community. The problem is that the Smithfield community doesn't have the financial means to support the development independently and the people who do don't want to visit Smithfield unless there is an event there (MCC, UAB games, etc). To make Smithfield attractive for year-round visitors, you would have to raze housing, displace current residents, and create attractive commercial developments, which is THE DEFINITION OF GENTRIFICATION.

The solution is exactly what the business community is pushing right now: new developments in a designated entertainment district that generates new jobs for surrounding communities and increases tax revenue to help the neighborhoods that need it, all without the gentrification the neighborhood leaders don't like.
But these "neighborhood leaders" call this "racism." I have no more words.

What he said...
03-11-2018 06:41 PM
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Blazerstadium Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
Putting money into Legion would have done nothing for that neighborhood, Georgia State thinks that them turning Turner Field into a football field is somehow going to save that neighborhood. Haven't quite figured their logic out yet either.

A building that has 10 events a year will not change an area. It also won't pay for the building. So hopefully Birmingham has plans for utilization of the new stadium more then how they currently use Legion.
03-11-2018 09:18 PM
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mixduptransistor Offline
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
(03-11-2018 09:18 PM)Blazerstadium Wrote:  Putting money into Legion would have done nothing for that neighborhood, Georgia State thinks that them turning Turner Field into a football field is somehow going to save that neighborhood. Haven't quite figured their logic out yet either.

Well, if that's all that they were doing you'd have a point, but they and private developers are putting in something like $300 million in housing and retail development, and MARTA is extending a BRT line to link the area back to downtown and the GSU campus (ironically, transit connectivity was a big thing that the Braves asked for to stay and didn't get)
03-12-2018 05:58 AM
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RE: ABc3340: BJCC stadium bill advances...as Bham business community shows support
(03-12-2018 05:58 AM)mixduptransistor Wrote:  
(03-11-2018 09:18 PM)Blazerstadium Wrote:  Putting money into Legion would have done nothing for that neighborhood, Georgia State thinks that them turning Turner Field into a football field is somehow going to save that neighborhood. Haven't quite figured their logic out yet either.

Well, if that's all that they were doing you'd have a point, but they and private developers are putting in something like $300 million in housing and retail development, and MARTA is extending a BRT line to link the area back to downtown and the GSU campus (ironically, transit connectivity was a big thing that the Braves asked for to stay and didn't get)

The Braves still don't have Marta. And the new stadium is in the worst traffic spot there on 75. I'm in Atlanta a lot and have wanted to go to a game, but can't see getting in that traffic to go to one. I know Atlanta has the street car that run near campus, I hope Birmingham does the same thing with street rail cars running from campus to the BJCC. It would pull a lot of students toward that entertainment area.
03-12-2018 07:00 AM
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