(02-19-2018 11:47 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Guys there is no gay marriage, there is same sex marriage.

FFS.... Someone broke out the virtue signal!

Same sex marriage... Used to be against now I don't care
Legalizing weed...

Seems there is a lot of legalizing weed and same sex marriage changes here.

Interestingly this heathen of a libertarian never thought weed should be illegal or had a problem with same sex marriages (or unions, or whatever you want to label it as....)

Those positions really used to blow the minds of my more progressive friends about me 35 years ago, now I guess they are pretty much meh..... Guess I have to find another soapbox to freak them out with now....

(02-19-2018 12:49 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 11:47 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Guys there is no gay marriage, there is same sex marriage.

same thing.

2 heterosexual same sex friends can get married. Just like across the pond. I can't think of a legal reason close relatives could not also.
Irish straight best friends marry to 'avoid paying €50,000 inheritance tax' on house
https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-ne...y-11739904

I no longer believe we need federal oversight of education. I used to think that was a good idea. Now I believe the diversity of 50 states' different approaches is more likely to produce the innovation we need over time.

(02-19-2018 02:16 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 12:49 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 11:47 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Guys there is no gay marriage, there is same sex marriage.

same thing.

2 heterosexual same sex friends can get married. Just like across the pond. I can't think of a legal reason close relatives could not also.
Irish straight best friends marry to 'avoid paying €50,000 inheritance tax' on house
https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-ne...y-11739904

That's gaming the system. I'm sure if found out there are penalties. I don't agree with it, but the complex legal situations that arise today necessitate that partners have legal rights when it comes to certain circumstances.

I said gay marriage, you said same-sex marriage. Listed as synonyms in every online dictionary I've checks.

The issue is not whether gay people can get married to one another --- the legal issue is whether people of the same sex can get married to one another.

I would say that the online dictionaries are not terribly precise.

Non-political, but I have changed my mind on how the pyramids were constructed and completely buy into this theory:

Jean-Pierre Houdin Theory

Quote:Ancient Egyptians built the 480-foot-high (146-meter-high) Great Pyramid of Giza from the inside out, according to a French architect.

The 4,500-year-old tomb of Pharaoh Khufu, he concluded, was built using a ramp that spirals around the pyramid's interior 30 to 45 feet (9 to 14 meters) behind the exterior surface (see image at left).

I bring this up because I have never ever had a single example of something so monumental make me go "Yup, that's it."

(02-19-2018 03:00 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  Non-political, but I have changed my mind on how the pyramids were constructed and completely buy into this theory:

Jean-Pierre Houdin Theory

Quote:Ancient Egyptians built the 480-foot-high (146-meter-high) Great Pyramid of Giza from the inside out, according to a French architect.

The 4,500-year-old tomb of Pharaoh Khufu, he concluded, was built using a ramp that spirals around the pyramid's interior 30 to 45 feet (9 to 14 meters) behind the exterior surface (see image at left).

I bring this up because I have never ever had a single example of something so monumental make me go "Yup, that's it."

But how did they get the grain they wanted to store inside?

I am more sympathetic toward the argument that our trade policy has had negative consequences. We have the largest consumer market in the world, but don’t use it to ensure that agreements are reciprocal.

(02-19-2018 01:14 PM)TechRocks Wrote:  Globalism.

Used to be in a huge fan of free trade even though it never was. Once it destroyed much of our manufacturing base, I had to reconsider. If we ever get cross-ways with another country, like China, we'd better damned-well have our manufacturing capabilities back up to snuff. From that perspective, Trump looks like divine intervention at work, because if anyone will make the effort reinvigorate our manufacturing sector, it's His Orangeness.

x2 on this. I used to think that bigger was better and global market and economy was just better. I'm not saying put up the fence but we need to have a way of supporting ourselves if something happens. As of now we are f'd.

I don't think Trump is really that different than others, he just has a different delivery method than the others.

I used to be pro-death penalty, but now I'm essentially against it unless there's no question that the perp is guilty.

(02-19-2018 02:58 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  The issue is not whether gay people can get married to one another --- the legal issue is whether people of the same sex can get married to one another.

I would say that the online dictionaries are not terribly precise.

well blame google cause that's how they have it as well.

its beyond ridiculous that either of you even question what I mean or are trying to imply there is a difference between gay marriage and same-sex marriage. Use common sense people.

(02-19-2018 02:53 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 02:16 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 12:49 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 11:47 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Guys there is no gay marriage, there is same sex marriage.

same thing.

2 heterosexual same sex friends can get married. Just like across the pond. I can't think of a legal reason close relatives could not also.
Irish straight best friends marry to 'avoid paying €50,000 inheritance tax' on house
https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-ne...y-11739904

That's gaming the system. I'm sure if found out there are penalties. I don't agree with it, but the complex legal situations that arise today necessitate that partners have legal rights when it comes to certain circumstances.

I said gay marriage, you said same-sex marriage. Listed as synonyms in every online dictionary I've checks.

Not if it is legal. As best as I know there is no requirement to prove that one is gay to marry another of the same sex.

(02-19-2018 03:18 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 02:58 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  The issue is not whether gay people can get married to one another --- the legal issue is whether people of the same sex can get married to one another.

I would say that the online dictionaries are not terribly precise.

well blame google cause that's how they have it as well.

its beyond ridiculous that either of you even question what I mean or are trying to imply there is a difference between gay marriage and same-sex marriage. Use common sense people.

A platonic same sex marriage, as far as I can tell, has not been reported in the media in the USA. But this arrangement would very very logical relative to where you are at in life regarding estate, probate, family matters etc.

(02-19-2018 03:18 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 02:58 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  The issue is not whether gay people can get married to one another --- the legal issue is whether people of the same sex can get married to one another.

I would say that the online dictionaries are not terribly precise.

well blame google cause that's how they have it as well.

its beyond ridiculous that either of you even question what I mean or are trying to imply there is a difference between gay marriage and same-sex marriage. Use common sense people.

The fundamental legal issue is same sex marriage -- not gay marriage. In fact, every single statute was worded as a prohibition of marriage between same sex partners, not one statute used the term 'gay partners'.

The *specific* issue *is* same sex marriage, not gay marriage. The dictionaries (and Google) is horribly imprecise. But, I don't think I would ever use a Google definition as a source.....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obergefell_v._Hodges

If you want to term it gay marriage, have fun and do it all you want. If you want to conflate the terms, again, its a free country. Still doesnt make it accurate or precise, though.

(02-19-2018 03:23 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 03:18 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 02:58 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  The issue is not whether gay people can get married to one another --- the legal issue is whether people of the same sex can get married to one another.

I would say that the online dictionaries are not terribly precise.

well blame google cause that's how they have it as well.

its beyond ridiculous that either of you even question what I mean or are trying to imply there is a difference between gay marriage and same-sex marriage. Use common sense people.

A platonic same sex marriage, as far as I can tell, has not been reported in the media in the USA. But this arrangement would very very logical relative to where you are at in life regarding estate, probate, family matters etc.

Platonic opposite sex marriages happen all the time; I've known a number of 'green-card' marriages over the years. We would be fooling ourselves if we believed that that magically stopped with same sex pairings.

(02-19-2018 11:25 AM)Bull_Is_Back Wrote:  I used to be pro death penalty, now I am again' it

Even though I don't think it's a moral evil I have come to believe that a society with the resources to incarcerate for life should accept that they could be wrong every now and again.

I’m not necessarily “against” it, if certain States want to still have the DP, I have no real contention with that.
But, far from the advocate I used to be.

Main reason? It’s not applied consistently, at ALL.

When a monster like that woman, Susan Smith I think it was, rolls her two babies into a lake so she can go party, strapped into their car seats and just walks away? If she ain’t getting the death penalty, who’s more deserving?

This murdering weirdo in Fl may well not get the DP, what does one have to do to “qualify”, if not this?

Also, I’ve tempered on abortion. Not that I like it, condone it or can even generally stomach the idea. But I also know it’s not going anywhere, and for some it may well be necessary (though I also know that’s the rarest of reasons they are sought out).

I go with Bubba on this one

Safe
Legal
Rare

Now, nobody feel the need to moralize on me, I don’t like anything about the idea. I just know it’s a thing, and best to make it a safe thing. Need to change hearts and minds, not try to lock up otherwise law-abiding, responsible persons.

(02-19-2018 03:32 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 03:23 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 03:18 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 02:58 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  The issue is not whether gay people can get married to one another --- the legal issue is whether people of the same sex can get married to one another.

I would say that the online dictionaries are not terribly precise.

well blame google cause that's how they have it as well.

its beyond ridiculous that either of you even question what I mean or are trying to imply there is a difference between gay marriage and same-sex marriage. Use common sense people.

A platonic same sex marriage, as far as I can tell, has not been reported in the media in the USA. But this arrangement would very very logical relative to where you are at in life regarding estate, probate, family matters etc.

Platonic opposite sex marriages happen all the time; I've known a number of 'green-card' marriages over the years. We would be fooling ourselves if we believed that that magically stopped with same sex pairings.

That is a very good point.

(02-19-2018 11:34 AM)Crebman Wrote:  

(02-19-2018 11:13 AM)NCeagle Wrote:  It seems like there is always a ton of back and forth on this forum, but you never see anybody admitting to be wrong, or changing their mind.

So I ask all of you on here, what political stances are you know for or against, that you used to hold the opposite belief, and what changed your mind?

Okay.

Gay Marriage.

I originally believed that marriage was a religious institution and that no religion should be forced to recognize a union of same sex individuals and I still largely believe this.

However, if the state wants to recognize it - I guess I'm okay with that, particularly for property rights, hospital visitation, etc. types of reasons.

Initially, I wasn't for gay marriage at all - now I really don't care.

I’ll go with this one as well. Had many a gay friend, roommate, co-worker etc over the years. All generally good people, often very troubled, but decent folks. No need to unnecessarily pile on to their already *ahem* challenging lives/lifestyle.

What they do behind the closed door of their own bedrooms...