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AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #21
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-12-2018 11:52 PM)T-Dog Wrote:  Story time.

When App hosted Miami in 2016, the Canes were really paranoid about hotels. Everyone who plays at App State stays at the same hotel, with the exception of NMSU who took a cheaper, but further away, option in Hickory. That hotel has its own catering, enough rooms, meeting space and is basically locked down for the team. Never had an issue . No fire alarms at 3 a.m. or anything like that. When Wake came up in 2017, there was a sign out front saying "Welcome Wake Forest Football!" Nothing happened. It was well know some stAte assistant coaches went out drinking on a Wednesday night in 2015 before the Thursday night game. Nothing happened. Worst thing to happen to a visiting team at that hotel was that some App State co-eds swiped right on several GaSo FB players Tinder accounts in 2015 to talk trash to them.

For Da U, they were so paranoid, they told the media they were staying in Hickory. Didn't say where, though. In reality, they stayed at the same hotel that every other team does, but they didn't allow the welcoming sign or any hints they were going to be there. And guess what? Nothing happened.

So yeah, not surprising they try to take the side door out of the contract.

I'd heard the stories of a few coaches going out drinking the night before. We had a Football ops guy get in trouble soon after that for a public intox. That staff had some interesting characters who had this weird ability to be as unfocused as possible the night before a game, yet turn around the next day and be completely on point.

Anyway, back to Miami.

About a year before they were to visit Jonesboro, they sent a couple football ops guys on a scouting trip to figure out what the lay of the land looks like.

Story goes that they left town convinced that our facilities were terrible, we had no hotel space, and they were too good to play here.

Miami scouts and plans trips like they are Alabama visiting Auburn. They are paranoid about anything that isn't perfect. I'm fairly confident its a Mark Richt thing.
(This post was last modified: 02-13-2018 01:00 AM by chiefsfan.)
02-13-2018 12:55 AM
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gschwendt Offline
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Post: #22
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-13-2018 12:55 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  About a year before they were to visit Jonesboro, they sent a couple football ops guys on a scouting trip to figure out what the lay of the land looks like.

Story goes that they left town convinced that our facilities were terrible, we had no hotel space, and they were too good to play here.
To go along with that story, supposedly they told us that because our visitors locker room was so poor, they would use our home locker room and we were to use the visitors.

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02-13-2018 09:00 AM
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OsageJ Offline
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Post: #23
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-13-2018 09:00 AM)gschwendt Wrote:  
(02-13-2018 12:55 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  About a year before they were to visit Jonesboro, they sent a couple football ops guys on a scouting trip to figure out what the lay of the land looks like.

Story goes that they left town convinced that our facilities were terrible, we had no hotel space, and they were too good to play here.
To go along with that story, supposedly they told us that because our visitors locker room was so poor, they would use our home locker room and we were to use the visitors.

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After our new ops building is done won't the old home dressing room becomes for the visitors? Maybe they would lower themselves to visit then. Nahhh...just take their money!!
02-13-2018 10:46 AM
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cmaxwellgsu Offline
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Post: #24
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
From the UGA alums in my family, Richt's MO is to always stay out of town. The reasoning is that they're away from all the game day atmosphere and partying. Supposedly he learned this from Bobby Bowden (apparently FSU even went to Thomasville, GA for home games.) I can't confirm or deny it, but I've heard that pretty often.
02-13-2018 11:30 AM
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troutbummike Offline
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Post: #25
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
You'll beat them, after all.
02-13-2018 07:03 PM
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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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Post: #26
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
I think a lawsuit is in order here.
02-13-2018 07:48 PM
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Fanof49ASU Offline
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Post: #27
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-13-2018 07:03 PM)troutbummike Wrote:  You'll beat them, after all.

Ha! 04-rock
02-13-2018 08:21 PM
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timber Offline
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Post: #28
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
Hurricane > Ark St....but they should reschedule.
02-13-2018 10:37 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #29
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-13-2018 10:37 PM)timber Wrote:  Hurricane > Ark St....but they should reschedule.

It's not about the hurricane, it's about their complete unwillingness to either schedule within a reasonable time frame, or pay the buyout.

I mean, everyone else has either paid the buyout or rescheduled. I'm not sure why Miami can't do either.
02-14-2018 12:45 AM
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RedWolfington Offline
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Post: #30
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-13-2018 10:37 PM)timber Wrote:  Hurricane > Ark St....but they should reschedule.

Yeah, hurricane had zero to do with it. It was used as an excuse.
Not many hurricanes around Jonesboro except at JHS
02-14-2018 02:24 PM
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ark30inf Offline
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AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
Most people on social media seem to comprehend it. Notable exceptions being Miami fans, Jonesboro Hog fans, and App State's Black and Gold. I can live with that.

Even non-Jonesboro Hog fans are mostly sympathetic and we even got an unlikely supportive editorial from Wally Hall.

Any other P5 would have just paid the pocket change and moved on.

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02-14-2018 02:32 PM
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msm96wolf Offline
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Post: #32
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-14-2018 02:32 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  Most people on social media seem to comprehend it. Notable exceptions being Miami fans, Jonesboro Hog fans, and App State's Black and Gold. I can live with that.

Even non-Jonesboro Hog fans are mostly sympathetic and we even got an unlikely supportive editorial from Wally Hall.

Any other P5 would have just paid the pocket change and moved on.

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Okay, first I will say, the moral thing to do is pay the 650K. Sadly, moral is not the same as legal.

Now that has been said, I think some points are being missed. Most ACC schools schedule 7 home games which means 1 OOC away game. Miami already has scheduled OOC away games for those years, so 25 & 26 are the legitimate years available. FBS games were canceled that year due to the Hurricane and I believe item 14 is a valid legal point. It will be interesting where they lawsuit should be filed. Since the contract is an ACC letterhead contract, does the lawsuit happen in NC where the ACC is or Arkansas where ASU is? Contract lawyers are welcomed to chime in. Finally, I imagine the ACC will likely deter ACC teams to have any future games with ASU, especially payday games.

My prediction it will be arbitrated with ASU getting 400-500K settlement with lawyer fees eating heavily into the cost.
02-14-2018 09:48 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #33
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-14-2018 09:48 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  
(02-14-2018 02:32 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  Most people on social media seem to comprehend it. Notable exceptions being Miami fans, Jonesboro Hog fans, and App State's Black and Gold. I can live with that.

Even non-Jonesboro Hog fans are mostly sympathetic and we even got an unlikely supportive editorial from Wally Hall.

Any other P5 would have just paid the pocket change and moved on.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Okay, first I will say, the moral thing to do is pay the 650K. Sadly, moral is not the same as legal.

Now that has been said, I think some points are being missed. Most ACC schools schedule 7 home games which means 1 OOC away game. Miami already has scheduled OOC away games for those years, so 25 & 26 are the legitimate years available. FBS games were canceled that year due to the Hurricane and I believe item 14 is a valid legal point. It will be interesting where they lawsuit should be filed. Since the contract is an ACC letterhead contract, does the lawsuit happen in NC where the ACC is or Arkansas where ASU is? Contract lawyers are welcomed to chime in. Finally, I imagine the ACC will likely deter ACC teams to have any future games with ASU, especially payday games.

My prediction it will be arbitrated with ASU getting 400-500K settlement with lawyer fees eating heavily into the cost.

No one cares that Miami thinks it needs 7 home games every year. That's not our problem. It is their responsibility to schedule the game at the earliest possible time. Not to just do it whenever they feel like the shoe fits

In this case, Arkansas State is a public institution, and Miami is private. and the breach of contract occurred in Arkansas, so it will be filed in a Jonesboro court.

3rd: Spare me with the ACC won't schedule us nonsense. Do you have any idea how many games we've played against ACC teams in the last decade? Two. We simply don't schedule ACC teams because the ACC has a bunch of cheap wads for schools that think a payday game is a 1 million dollar check. We value ourselves at 1.9 million dollars, and if a glorious P5 school wants the opportunity to play us, that's what they are paying or no dice.
02-14-2018 10:12 PM
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msm96wolf Offline
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Post: #34
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-14-2018 10:12 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(02-14-2018 09:48 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  
(02-14-2018 02:32 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  Most people on social media seem to comprehend it. Notable exceptions being Miami fans, Jonesboro Hog fans, and App State's Black and Gold. I can live with that.

Even non-Jonesboro Hog fans are mostly sympathetic and we even got an unlikely supportive editorial from Wally Hall.

Any other P5 would have just paid the pocket change and moved on.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Okay, first I will say, the moral thing to do is pay the 650K. Sadly, moral is not the same as legal.

Now that has been said, I think some points are being missed. Most ACC schools schedule 7 home games which means 1 OOC away game. Miami already has scheduled OOC away games for those years, so 25 & 26 are the legitimate years available. FBS games were canceled that year due to the Hurricane and I believe item 14 is a valid legal point. It will be interesting where they lawsuit should be filed. Since the contract is an ACC letterhead contract, does the lawsuit happen in NC where the ACC is or Arkansas where ASU is? Contract lawyers are welcomed to chime in. Finally, I imagine the ACC will likely deter ACC teams to have any future games with ASU, especially payday games.

My prediction it will be arbitrated with ASU getting 400-500K settlement with lawyer fees eating heavily into the cost.

No one cares that Miami thinks it needs 7 home games every year. That's not our problem. It is their responsibility to schedule the game at the earliest possible time. Not to just do it whenever they feel like the shoe fits

In this case, Arkansas State is a public institution, and Miami is private. and the breach of contract occurred in Arkansas, so it will be filed in a Jonesboro court.

3rd: Spare me with the ACC won't schedule us nonsense. Do you have any idea how many games we've played against ACC teams in the last decade? Two. We simply don't schedule ACC teams because the ACC has a bunch of cheap wads for schools that think a payday game is a 1 million dollar check. We value ourselves at 1.9 million dollars, and if a glorious P5 school wants the opportunity to play us, that's what they are paying or no dice.

However if you read the contract, it is an Atlantic Coast Competition agreement, ACC is based in Greensboro, NC. It is not just Miami, it is the Atlantic Coast Conference that will need to be sued per the contract. Look for the ACC to say the suit should be in NC court system, not Florida or Arkansas. Again, not a contract lawyer but would love to hear from a contract lawyer. Really seeing this going to arbitration with Miami paying more than 300K and AKS getting less than 650K. It can be said Miami offered future dates and ASU refused. It all depends on how a judge or arbitrator views this clause. The ACC will be helping Miami since this was a conference contract.

I will say, it should be a drop in the bucket and Miami should have at least offered 450K just to avoid the talk of a lawsuit because neither side will come out a winner.
(This post was last modified: 02-14-2018 11:01 PM by msm96wolf.)
02-14-2018 11:00 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #35
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-14-2018 11:00 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  
(02-14-2018 10:12 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(02-14-2018 09:48 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  
(02-14-2018 02:32 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  Most people on social media seem to comprehend it. Notable exceptions being Miami fans, Jonesboro Hog fans, and App State's Black and Gold. I can live with that.

Even non-Jonesboro Hog fans are mostly sympathetic and we even got an unlikely supportive editorial from Wally Hall.

Any other P5 would have just paid the pocket change and moved on.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Okay, first I will say, the moral thing to do is pay the 650K. Sadly, moral is not the same as legal.

Now that has been said, I think some points are being missed. Most ACC schools schedule 7 home games which means 1 OOC away game. Miami already has scheduled OOC away games for those years, so 25 & 26 are the legitimate years available. FBS games were canceled that year due to the Hurricane and I believe item 14 is a valid legal point. It will be interesting where they lawsuit should be filed. Since the contract is an ACC letterhead contract, does the lawsuit happen in NC where the ACC is or Arkansas where ASU is? Contract lawyers are welcomed to chime in. Finally, I imagine the ACC will likely deter ACC teams to have any future games with ASU, especially payday games.

My prediction it will be arbitrated with ASU getting 400-500K settlement with lawyer fees eating heavily into the cost.

No one cares that Miami thinks it needs 7 home games every year. That's not our problem. It is their responsibility to schedule the game at the earliest possible time. Not to just do it whenever they feel like the shoe fits

In this case, Arkansas State is a public institution, and Miami is private. and the breach of contract occurred in Arkansas, so it will be filed in a Jonesboro court.

3rd: Spare me with the ACC won't schedule us nonsense. Do you have any idea how many games we've played against ACC teams in the last decade? Two. We simply don't schedule ACC teams because the ACC has a bunch of cheap wads for schools that think a payday game is a 1 million dollar check. We value ourselves at 1.9 million dollars, and if a glorious P5 school wants the opportunity to play us, that's what they are paying or no dice.

However if you read the contract, it is an Atlantic Coast Competition agreement, ACC is based in Greensboro, NC. It is not just Miami, it is the Atlantic Coast Conference that will need to be sued per the contract. Look for the ACC to say the suit should be in NC court system, not Florida or Arkansas. Again, not a contract lawyer but would love to hear from a contract lawyer. Really seeing this going to arbitration with Miami paying more than 300K and AKS getting less than 650K. It can be said Miami offered future dates and ASU refused. It all depends on how a judge or arbitrator views this clause. The ACC will be helping Miami since this was a conference contract.

I will say, it should be a drop in the bucket and Miami should have at least offered 450K just to avoid the talk of a lawsuit because neither side will come out a winner.

Yes, but that contract is not an agreement with the ACC, its an agreement with Miami. Just like it's not a contract with the Sun Belt.

One of the biggest conversations we've had about this is whether or not the 11th amendment will allow Miami to try and move the case out of an Arkansas district court and into a Federal Court, and we've actually got some lawyers on our board. We're expecting the suit to be filed Friday Morning in Craighead County District Court. What happens after that will be interesting to watch. The expectation is Miami will try to move it to a Federal Court, and AState will argue against.
02-14-2018 11:25 PM
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msm96wolf Offline
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Post: #36
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
Again, does not matter what you or I think. You have to look at the official contract and it does say Atlantic Coast Conference Competition agreement Again, I am not a lawyer but you have to think that will be brought up. In addition, who do you think the ACC will side with? They would be glad to have it go to Federal or ACC Home State. You have to think it being an Atlantic Coast Conference contract will have to play into this somehow. I would not be surprised if the ACC lawyers show up to help Miami. It is like a mom and pop suing the local Wal-Mart, you know the corporate lawyers are going to show up since it is in their best interests. Again, prediction ASU gets 400-500K no where near the 850K they are wanting. Miami has offered dates, there was a force majeure clause and event and this goes to arbitration. Basically both sides are in a pissing contest and the only thing guaranteed is both will get pissed on.
02-14-2018 11:48 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #37
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-14-2018 11:48 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Again, does not matter what you or I think. You have to look at the official contract and it does say Atlantic Coast Conference Competition agreement Again, I am not a lawyer but you have to think that will be brought up. In addition, who do you think the ACC will side with? They would be glad to have it go to Federal or ACC Home State. You have to think it being an Atlantic Coast Conference contract will have to play into this somehow. I would not be surprised if the ACC lawyers show up to help Miami. It is like a mom and pop suing the local Wal-Mart, you know the corporate lawyers are going to show up since it is in their best interests. Again, prediction ASU gets 400-500K no where near the 850K they are wanting. Miami has offered dates, there was a force majeure clause and event and this goes to arbitration. Basically both sides are in a pissing contest and the only thing guaranteed is both will get pissed on.

Yes, but if you actually read the contract, it says very clearly in there that the agreement is between Arkansas State and Miami. The ACC is not involved. They have certain procedures that schools have to follow within the contracts for OOC games. Hence why it lists them. However, they are not a party to the suit.

We are confident we'll get our money, and I see next to zero chance we back down.

Also keep in mind that in the American Legal System, the plantiff decides the venue. Only a judge can move it.
(This post was last modified: 02-14-2018 11:54 PM by chiefsfan.)
02-14-2018 11:51 PM
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Attackcoog Offline
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Post: #38
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-14-2018 11:48 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Again, does not matter what you or I think. You have to look at the official contract and it does say Atlantic Coast Conference Competition agreement Again, I am not a lawyer but you have to think that will be brought up. In addition, who do you think the ACC will side with? They would be glad to have it go to Federal or ACC Home State. You have to think it being an Atlantic Coast Conference contract will have to play into this somehow. I would not be surprised if the ACC lawyers show up to help Miami. It is like a mom and pop suing the local Wal-Mart, you know the corporate lawyers are going to show up since it is in their best interests. Again, prediction ASU gets 400-500K no where near the 850K they are wanting. Miami has offered dates, there was a force majeure clause and event and this goes to arbitration. Basically both sides are in a pissing contest and the only thing guaranteed is both will get pissed on.

One of the biggest advantages to being a plantiff is you get to decide where you are going to file your law suit. I guarantee it will be where they feel they have the best chance to win. Not much Miami can do about it. They can try to get it moved...but that would probably just be a waste of time and money.

Btw--The ACC is irrelevant in this action. My guess is the ACC name appears on the contract because it is a form contract promulgated for use by all ACC teams. For example, the Texas Real Estate Commission promulgates a contract for use by all real estate agents in Texas (even homeowners selling their home on their own can use it). Because of that, The Texas Real Estate Commission name appears at the top of almost every residential real estate contract in Texas. That doesnt mean the Texas Real Estate Commission is a party to those transactions.

https://www.trec.texas.gov/sites/default.../20-13.pdf
(This post was last modified: 02-15-2018 12:15 AM by Attackcoog.)
02-15-2018 12:02 AM
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airtroop Offline
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Post: #39
RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
I've owned four businesses and have signed probably a hundred contracts over the years, and every single one of them stipulated clearly which state's laws and jurisdictions any disagreement would be settled in. I'm sure this agreement is no different.
02-15-2018 03:31 PM
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GoAppsGo92 Offline
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RE: AState preparing to file Lawsuit against Miami
(02-14-2018 10:12 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(02-14-2018 09:48 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  
(02-14-2018 02:32 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  Most people on social media seem to comprehend it. Notable exceptions being Miami fans, Jonesboro Hog fans, and App State's Black and Gold. I can live with that.

Even non-Jonesboro Hog fans are mostly sympathetic and we even got an unlikely supportive editorial from Wally Hall.

Any other P5 would have just paid the pocket change and moved on.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Okay, first I will say, the moral thing to do is pay the 650K. Sadly, moral is not the same as legal.

Now that has been said, I think some points are being missed. Most ACC schools schedule 7 home games which means 1 OOC away game. Miami already has scheduled OOC away games for those years, so 25 & 26 are the legitimate years available. FBS games were canceled that year due to the Hurricane and I believe item 14 is a valid legal point. It will be interesting where they lawsuit should be filed. Since the contract is an ACC letterhead contract, does the lawsuit happen in NC where the ACC is or Arkansas where ASU is? Contract lawyers are welcomed to chime in. Finally, I imagine the ACC will likely deter ACC teams to have any future games with ASU, especially payday games.

My prediction it will be arbitrated with ASU getting 400-500K settlement with lawyer fees eating heavily into the cost.

No one cares that Miami thinks it needs 7 home games every year. That's not our problem. It is their responsibility to schedule the game at the earliest possible time. Not to just do it whenever they feel like the shoe fits

In this case, Arkansas State is a public institution, and Miami is private. and the breach of contract occurred in Arkansas, so it will be filed in a Jonesboro court.

3rd: Spare me with the ACC won't schedule us nonsense. Do you have any idea how many games we've played against ACC teams in the last decade? Two. We simply don't schedule ACC teams because the ACC has a bunch of cheap wads for schools that think a payday game is a 1 million dollar check. We value ourselves at 1.9 million dollars, and if a glorious P5 school wants the opportunity to play us, that's what they are paying or no dice.

The only concern I would have as stAte is that taking Miami to court or arbitration will lead to a reluctance in other teams scheduling them. If you guys think the risk is minor and that it won’t hurt them then go for it. That’s obviously the calculation they are making.
02-15-2018 04:11 PM
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