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Tax law changes for sports tix donations
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MOTIAW Offline
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Post: #1
Tax law changes for sports tix donations
Have any of y’all heard much about this? Just saw for first time yesterday.

(Seat licenses and “donation” portions being made non-deductible)

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/story...w-tax-plan
(This post was last modified: 01-27-2018 09:00 AM by MOTIAW.)
01-27-2018 08:57 AM
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mjs Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
Don't see how it won't hurt college sports. Half of my season ticket cost, at UA-Little Rock, was considered a "donation". That made the cost easier to "swallow". Being a 35 year season ticketholder, it won't change my decision to buy tickets. But, I could see it having a big effect on "marginal" fans and businesses, who primarily buy tickets to support the "local team" and get a tax deduction.
01-27-2018 10:53 AM
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MOTIAW Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
Yeah, kinda what I thought too... Individually, sure in my own mind I help “justify” my tix to myself (and my wife, lol) as partly a deduction/charity. It won’t affect me much.

But, those luxury boxes/seats bought (that a lot of times go unused) for entertaining customers, I.e. business, will suddenly impact the bottom line a good bit more. I’m curious to see how much nationally.

The example I saw mentioned $4000 per seat PSLs for Duke basketball. Got a pair of seats? $8000 before tix cost... That’s a big deduction lost.
01-27-2018 11:01 AM
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AppFan82 Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
This has been a big discussion among athletic directors and staff for some weeks now. The language in the law states that no deduction is allowed for contributions made to colleges and universities in exchange for which the contributor receives the right to purchase tickets or seating at an athletic event. This was also the case prior to 1986.

Any excess above the required payment to purchase tickets remains deductible. For example, I have to contribute at least $500 to sit where I sit at App. That $500 is not deductible. If I contribute $2,500, the $2,000 over and above the $500 requirement remains deductible.

How this will play out is still an open issue. Obviously, club and suite sales will be impacted, though it's hard to say to what degree. I would imagine we'll see some clever rewording of premium seating agreements. There will be plenty of discussion and payment of fees to tax attorneys and CPA's before the dust settles.

Until then, know that your student-athletes at whatever school you support still need your contributions. I hope that those of you who already contribute will continue to do so because of your love of your school regardless of what the tax law is.
01-27-2018 11:13 AM
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mjs Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
(01-27-2018 11:13 AM)AppFan82 Wrote:  This has been a big discussion among athletic directors and staff for some weeks now. The language in the law states that no deduction is allowed for contributions made to colleges and universities in exchange for which the contributor receives the right to purchase tickets or seating at an athletic event. This was also the case prior to 1986.

Any excess above the required payment to purchase tickets remains deductible. For example, I have to contribute at least $500 to sit where I sit at App. That $500 is not deductible. If I contribute $2,500, the $2,000 over and above the $500 requirement remains deductible.

How this will play out is still an open issue. Obviously, club and suite sales will be impacted, though it's hard to say to what degree. I would imagine we'll see some clever rewording of premium seating agreements. There will be plenty of discussion and payment of fees to tax attorneys and CPA's before the dust settles.

Until then, know that your student-athletes at whatever school you support still need your contributions. I hope that those of you who already contribute will continue to do so because of your love of your school regardless of what the tax law is.

That's my concern. Most of us that "love our school" will likely continue to contribute. But, the marginal fans and businesses who did it mainly as a deduction may not.
01-27-2018 11:26 AM
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AppFan82 Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
(01-27-2018 11:26 AM)mjs Wrote:  That's my concern. Most of us that "love our school" will likely continue to contribute. But, the marginal fans and businesses who did it mainly as a deduction may not.

Agreed. While I believe the aim was at the largest programs that can command top dollar for purchase rights and still fill the stadium, the impact is going to be quite broad. It may not cost as much to sit in a suite at Kidd Brewer Stadium as it does in Bryant-Denny, but the importance of that suite cost to a school like Appalachian is critical to funding athletic scholarships.

There are other provisions in the new law that eliminate the ability of employers to use tickets to sporting events as employee achievement awards which may limit how some corporations purchase those tickets.

The toughest change for businesses is the repeal of the meals and entertainment deduction connected to the "active conduct" of the taxpayer's trade or business at a facility or portion of a facility organized for entertainment, recreation, pleasure, amusement, etc. (think of having a "business" meeting then attending a Braves game or conducting "business" while playing a round of golf). This last change will hit much more than just college athletics.
01-27-2018 01:20 PM
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ark30inf Offline
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Tax law changes for sports tix donations
Its going to hurt, I don't like it. But if we are ever going to have a simpler tax code we must all accept that some of our own favorite oxen are going to have to be gored.

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01-27-2018 03:11 PM
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Saint3333 Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
If we’re being honest with ourselves getting a tax deduction for premium seating seems strange.
01-27-2018 04:48 PM
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mjs Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
(01-27-2018 04:48 PM)Saint3333 Wrote:  If we’re being honest with ourselves getting a tax deduction for premium seating seems strange.

Not if the money is going to a college, where donations are tax deductible. Obviously, it doing the same thing for a professional team.
01-27-2018 05:05 PM
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msm96wolf Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
Yes, most schools sent out notices to get their 2018 donations in Dec 17 to write it off this year. Basically giving the schools a year to figure it out the loopholes in 2019. The main thing it hurt schools that trying to do PSLs, did my 20 years ago so already got my write off so I have minimal impact.
01-27-2018 06:55 PM
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Saint3333 Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
(01-27-2018 05:05 PM)mjs Wrote:  
(01-27-2018 04:48 PM)Saint3333 Wrote:  If we’re being honest with ourselves getting a tax deduction for premium seating seems strange.

Not if the money is going to a college, where donations are tax deductible. Obviously, it doing the same thing for a professional team.

Should parking fees on a college campus be tax deductible?
01-28-2018 09:09 AM
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Tealblood Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
This will be a big deal I was talking to a big hitter who is on the athletic foundation at UNC-Chapel Hill-Rams Club???

And he was saying how the school is in a billion dollar capital campaign and this has them in borderline panic mode
01-28-2018 10:43 AM
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Attackcoog Online
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Post: #13
RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
Many who can, will move thier tickets to thier business and use them as a business write off under entertainment or marketing expenses. I also wonder if club memberships might be charged separately from tickets to avoid falling under the law. So, buying in the club section gives you the option for a club membership—but the donation required to exercise that option for the club membership is a completely independent transaction and is not actually part of the seat purchase.
(This post was last modified: 01-28-2018 12:06 PM by Attackcoog.)
01-28-2018 12:04 PM
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Tealblood Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
Don’t think it will that simple
01-28-2018 12:31 PM
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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
I actually think this is going to hurt the P5 a lot more than its going to hurt most Belt schools. Most of our school don't charge extra fees for seating anyway (or you really don't have to pay a premium for decent seats - just buy them for face value). So my guess is this...just buy the tickets separately and then donate to your athletic foundation.

The real issue are the schools where they expect you to donate 3 or 4 grand to purchase two seats. This would be a big problem at schools where the sell out games anyway.

And its not just the impact of the tax code change disallowing the write off of the tickets, but also the expanded standard deduction, which makes charitable contributions effectively without a deduction for most taxpayers.

Yes, the Belt teams will take a hit, but its not going to be anywhere near as bad as it will for some of the P5 teams.
(This post was last modified: 01-28-2018 02:42 PM by Tom in Lazybrook.)
01-28-2018 02:37 PM
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OsageJ Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
It cost me 300 dollars a year to buy my seats. 75 bucks a seat. We have seats that cost considerably more to buy. Not only that but stAte is currently building more premium seats with a higher licence. That will have to be rethought (if that's a word) on how to charge for those seats. We usually know by now on our ticket prices. Haven't heard a peep yet. Like Tom I think the P5' s will be hit harder just because they have more seats. I bet they figure it out though.
(This post was last modified: 01-28-2018 05:48 PM by OsageJ.)
01-28-2018 05:47 PM
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mjs Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
(01-28-2018 02:37 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  I actually think this is going to hurt the P5 a lot more than its going to hurt most Belt schools. Most of our school don't charge extra fees for seating anyway (or you really don't have to pay a premium for decent seats - just buy them for face value). So my guess is this...just buy the tickets separately and then donate to your athletic foundation.

The real issue are the schools where they expect you to donate 3 or 4 grand to purchase two seats. This would be a big problem at schools where the sell out games anyway.

And its not just the impact of the tax code change disallowing the write off of the tickets, but also the expanded standard deduction, which makes charitable contributions effectively without a deduction for most taxpayers.

Yes, the Belt teams will take a hit, but its not going to be anywhere near as bad as it will for some of the P5 teams.

That's where I am and probably most taxpayers. Was already in the back of my mind when I went to a silent auction for the baseball program the other night. Passed on a $250 dinner coupon (which was almost at face value already), which I probably would have bid on if I could have told myself "What the heck, it's tax deduction".
01-28-2018 06:42 PM
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msm96wolf Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
(01-28-2018 05:47 PM)OsageJ Wrote:  It cost me 300 dollars a year to buy my seats. 75 bucks a seat. We have seats that cost considerably more to buy. Not only that but stAte is currently building more premium seats with a higher licence. That will have to be rethought (if that's a word) on how to charge for those seats. We usually know by now on our ticket prices. Haven't heard a peep yet. Like Tom I think the P5' s will be hit harder just because they have more seats. I bet they figure it out though.

It will be interesting. NCSU did Life Time Rights (Similar to PSL) back in the late 90's and did similar campaigns. The majority of them were bought, it has been parking that has driven the need for donations. I already have seen one loophole, allowing people to keep their seats at the ticket prices but base the parking on donations. The law really didn't cover that. As stated earlier, many schools encouraged donors to donate for 2018 in 2017. Get the tax write off now and it gives the schools until 2019 to find loopholes in the law. One thing I imagine many P5s schools are already looking into. 04-cheers
01-28-2018 10:39 PM
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OsageJ Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
(01-28-2018 10:39 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  
(01-28-2018 05:47 PM)OsageJ Wrote:  It cost me 300 dollars a year to buy my seats. 75 bucks a seat. We have seats that cost considerably more to buy. Not only that but stAte is currently building more premium seats with a higher licence. That will have to be rethought (if that's a word) on how to charge for those seats. We usually know by now on our ticket prices. Haven't heard a peep yet. Like Tom I think the P5' s will be hit harder just because they have more seats. I bet they figure it out though.

It will be interesting. NCSU did Life Time Rights (Similar to PSL) back in the late 90's and did similar campaigns. The majority of them were bought, it has been parking that has driven the need for donations. I already have seen one loophole, allowing people to keep their seats at the ticket prices but base the parking on donations. The law really didn't cover that. As stated earlier, many schools encouraged donors to donate for 2018 in 2017. Get the tax write off now and it gives the schools until 2019 to find loopholes in the law. One thing I imagine many P5s schools are already looking into. 04-cheers

Our parking is already tied into what we give.
01-29-2018 05:24 AM
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mturn017 Offline
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RE: Tax law changes for sports tix donations
(01-27-2018 11:13 AM)AppFan82 Wrote:  This has been a big discussion among athletic directors and staff for some weeks now. The language in the law states that no deduction is allowed for contributions made to colleges and universities in exchange for which the contributor receives the right to purchase tickets or seating at an athletic event. This was also the case prior to 1986.

Any excess above the required payment to purchase tickets remains deductible. For example, I have to contribute at least $500 to sit where I sit at App. That $500 is not deductible. If I contribute $2,500, the $2,000 over and above the $500 requirement remains deductible.

How this will play out is still an open issue. Obviously, club and suite sales will be impacted, though it's hard to say to what degree. I would imagine we'll see some clever rewording of premium seating agreements. There will be plenty of discussion and payment of fees to tax attorneys and CPA's before the dust settles.

Until then, know that your student-athletes at whatever school you support still need your contributions. I hope that those of you who already contribute will continue to do so because of your love of your school regardless of what the tax law is.

The way I was reading the new law was that any contribution you give that gives you the right or priority in picking seats would be disallowed. So in your example, the $500 is required for purchasing a certain level of tickets is clearly not deductible but if the additional 2000 gives you "points" in your schools athletic club which are typically used in determining the order in which people pick their seats then that would also be nondeductible. For it to be deductible there would have to be no incentive.
01-29-2018 08:46 AM
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