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B12 Expansion Model
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jaredf29 Offline
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Post: #21
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-14-2018 08:34 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 05:22 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 04:47 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 04:45 PM)jaredf29 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 02:50 PM)joeben69 Wrote:  This Florida politician insists the Big 12 add UCF and USF as a ‘package deal’
The Big 12’s not expanding now, but these two will be frequently discussed if it ever does.
https://www.sbnation.com/college-footbal...-expansion

Contrary to the writer, no we're not packaged deal. One team has one stuff repeatedly and the other has done nothing and can't get 10k people to show up in their rent-a-stadium. The only reason they'd get invited is if they got caught in the gravity of said hypothetical invite.

... Which is which? 03-wink

UCF. They own their own OCS. They actually get REAL attendence.

Average attendance per year (10 year sample size).

2007 - USF 53,170, UCF 44018
2008 - USF 49,690, UCF 39596
2009 - USF 52,553, UCF 38078
2010 - USF 40,849, UCF 39614
2011 - USF 44,550, UCF 34282
2012 - USF 44,130, UCF 34608
2013 - USF 34,702, UCF 42084
2014 - USF 30,694, UCF 37812
2015 - USF 26,578, UCF 30065
2016 - USF 37,539, UCF 35802

10 year average: USF 41,446, UCF 37,596

"It's not a lie if you believe"

In addition, War on I4 football rivalry results

USF 6 wins, UCF 3 wins. Cumulative score: USF 307, UCF 189

Average score of entire series: USF 34, UCF 21

Those attendance numbers are fudged and absolutely no one believes them. The series is 3-2 in favor of UCF since we’ve been in the same conference.
01-14-2018 08:43 PM
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BullsFanInTX Offline
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Post: #22
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-14-2018 08:43 PM)jaredf29 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 08:34 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 05:22 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 04:47 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 04:45 PM)jaredf29 Wrote:  Contrary to the writer, no we're not packaged deal. One team has one stuff repeatedly and the other has done nothing and can't get 10k people to show up in their rent-a-stadium. The only reason they'd get invited is if they got caught in the gravity of said hypothetical invite.

... Which is which? 03-wink

UCF. They own their own OCS. They actually get REAL attendence.

Average attendance per year (10 year sample size).

2007 - USF 53,170, UCF 44018
2008 - USF 49,690, UCF 39596
2009 - USF 52,553, UCF 38078
2010 - USF 40,849, UCF 39614
2011 - USF 44,550, UCF 34282
2012 - USF 44,130, UCF 34608
2013 - USF 34,702, UCF 42084
2014 - USF 30,694, UCF 37812
2015 - USF 26,578, UCF 30065
2016 - USF 37,539, UCF 35802

10 year average: USF 41,446, UCF 37,596

"It's not a lie if you believe"

In addition, War on I4 football rivalry results

USF 6 wins, UCF 3 wins. Cumulative score: USF 307, UCF 189

Average score of entire series: USF 34, UCF 21

Those attendance numbers are fudged and absolutely no one believes them. The series is 3-2 in favor of UCF since we’ve been in the same conference.

I have a news flash for you. Big news, so pay attention. Everyone "fudges" announced attendance numbers, including UCF. Across every sport, professional and college. There are a lot of examples of UCF majorly fudging numbers as well. Heck a couple years ago, you guys announced 30K a game and you might not have had 8-10K in the stands vs. ECU and USF (seriously, you and I both know it - entire sections were empty, go back and watch the highlights).

That said, UCF is a great candidate. I like UCF. If the B12 expands, they'll get in. But USF is also worthy. 20 straight weeks in AP poll (something no in in AAC has done in years) and back to back 10-2 and 11-2 seasons. That's pretty good. So pooh pooh USF all you want, but in the end, if there ever is an expansion (I don't think there will be) rest assured, USF will be right there. The B12 would be stupid not to add both USF and UCF and lock down the huge I4 corridor.
01-14-2018 08:53 PM
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Pervis_Griffith Offline
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Post: #23
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-14-2018 05:22 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 04:47 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 04:45 PM)jaredf29 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 02:50 PM)joeben69 Wrote:  This Florida politician insists the Big 12 add UCF and USF as a ‘package deal’
The Big 12’s not expanding now, but these two will be frequently discussed if it ever does.
https://www.sbnation.com/college-footbal...-expansion

Contrary to the writer, no we're not packaged deal. One team has one stuff repeatedly and the other has done nothing and can't get 10k people to show up in their rent-a-stadium. The only reason they'd get invited is if they got caught in the gravity of said hypothetical invite.

... Which is which? 03-wink

UCF. They own their own OCS. They actually get REAL attendence.


You mean the stadium that is literally falling apart?

Yeah ... that's exactly what the Big XII wants to bring into their conference.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/corros...ll-stadium

... after a decade of exposure to Central Florida's humidity and other corrosive elements, parts of Spectrum Stadium are now beginning to crumble, according to a new report.

In a study commissioned by UCF over the summer, engineers determined that widespread corrosion on the structure's steel framing has caused significant and costly damage.

"Some of these areas presented immediate life safety concerns because of their degradation and/or location," the report stated.

01-14-2018 08:58 PM
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BullsFanInTX Offline
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Post: #24
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-14-2018 08:58 PM)Pervis_Griffith Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 05:22 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 04:47 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 04:45 PM)jaredf29 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 02:50 PM)joeben69 Wrote:  This Florida politician insists the Big 12 add UCF and USF as a ‘package deal’
The Big 12’s not expanding now, but these two will be frequently discussed if it ever does.
https://www.sbnation.com/college-footbal...-expansion

Contrary to the writer, no we're not packaged deal. One team has one stuff repeatedly and the other has done nothing and can't get 10k people to show up in their rent-a-stadium. The only reason they'd get invited is if they got caught in the gravity of said hypothetical invite.

... Which is which? 03-wink

UCF. They own their own OCS. They actually get REAL attendence.


You mean the stadium that is literally falling apart?

Yeah ... that's exactly what the Big XII wants to bring into their conference.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/corros...ll-stadium

... after a decade of exposure to Central Florida's humidity and other corrosive elements, parts of Spectrum Stadium are now beginning to crumble, according to a new report.

In a study commissioned by UCF over the summer, engineers determined that widespread corrosion on the structure's steel framing has caused significant and costly damage.

"Some of these areas presented immediate life safety concerns because of their degradation and/or location," the report stated.


Correct, and to be fair, I believe UCF is fixing this problem, or has at least started to. I actually like their stadium, unlike some others, who knock it for supposedly being a bounce house.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/classifie...story.html

The decade-old University of Central Florida football stadium is rusted and corroded, with some “immediate life safety concerns,” according to an engineering report that says repairs could cost $14 million.

University officials say they have fixed the worst problems and are weighing long-term plans.

According to the report, which was contracted by the university and completed in August, Spectrum Stadium’s rust problems have affected the structural integrity of the 45,000-seat venue at the university’s main campus in east Orange County, Corrosion affects more than 80,000 square feet of the stadium, it said — four stairways had heavily rusted supports and a potential for “significant section loss” at the time, the TLC Engineering report found. Areas of the stadium’s fireproofing were cracked, corroded and graded “failing.”

Left unabated, this presents a significant loss risk of undermining the structural integrity of the stadium framing,” according to the 455-page report. Rust is so pervasive that it has “progressed to structural damage” in some locations. Maps specified corrosion “hot” spots throughout the stadium, with more concentrated in lower-bowl areas.
01-14-2018 09:05 PM
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Pervis_Griffith Offline
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Post: #25
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-14-2018 04:26 PM)Erictelevision Wrote:  Pervis: I say they ignore the East, grab MWC/AAC teams.

Well ... out west I see 3 really solid candidates. Football, facilities, and markets, all would help the Big XII. In no particular order ...

BYU, Boise State and Colorado State


If you go east from the plains states, there are several solid candidates too. Again in no particular order ...

Cincinnati, USF, UCF, Memphis, UConn, East Carolina


And in the "footprint" of the Big XII, there is Houston. There are other possibilities in the footprint too, but Houston is ahead of them all right now.
01-14-2018 09:10 PM
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Erictelevision Offline
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Post: #26
RE: B12 Expansion Model
Grab 2 of: BYU, BSU and CSU and call it a day.
01-14-2018 09:16 PM
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OdinFrigg Offline
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Post: #27
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-11-2018 03:08 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  
(01-11-2018 02:55 PM)YNot Wrote:  The Big 12 expands to the Big 16. The newbies gladly take a financial haircut through the remaining term of the existing B12 media deal, while adding 3-6 games of weekly B12 inventory with brands that have proven the ability to grab good TV ratings over the last 3 years.

Immediately launch a network using Texas' and BYU's broadcast facilities and capabilities with instant primary distribution in four top-20 DMAs in Texas and Florida and ten top-50 DMAs nationwide:
-#5 DFW
-#7 Houston
-#13 Tampa
-#18 Orlando
-#30 Salt Lake City
-#33 Kansas City
-#35 Cincinnati
-#39 Austin
-#41 Oklahoma City
-#50 Memphis

Apply counter-pressure against all other P5 conferences:
- v. SEC with UCF, USF, Houston, Cincinnati, WVU, Memphis
- v. B1G with Cincinnati and WVU
- v. ACC with UCF, USF, Cincinnati, WVU
- v. PAC with BYU and keep out of Texas

The only P5 conference with at least TWO teams in each of Texas and Florida.

Recruiting reach expands to Florida and improves in Texas, Ohio, Tennessee, Utah (which is underrated - as many top recruits as Oklahoma and more than Iowa, Kansas, and West Virginia combined).

I think we just went through all of this last year....the Big12 is not expanding. Waste of time

SMUmustangs, concur. The B12 fairly recently spent months and months looking at those schools, in a beauty pageant way, with their merits and baggage, along with assessing the demographics involved. They have no intention of expanding.

So much focus is on schools aspiring to joining up; rather than the attitudes, conditions, and intentions of member B12 schools, and where they may see themselves five or six years from now. Until they are clear with that, there's nothing to expect.
01-14-2018 09:23 PM
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jaredf29 Offline
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Post: #28
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-14-2018 08:53 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 08:43 PM)jaredf29 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 08:34 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 05:22 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 04:47 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  ... Which is which? 03-wink

UCF. They own their own OCS. They actually get REAL attendence.

Average attendance per year (10 year sample size).

2007 - USF 53,170, UCF 44018
2008 - USF 49,690, UCF 39596
2009 - USF 52,553, UCF 38078
2010 - USF 40,849, UCF 39614
2011 - USF 44,550, UCF 34282
2012 - USF 44,130, UCF 34608
2013 - USF 34,702, UCF 42084
2014 - USF 30,694, UCF 37812
2015 - USF 26,578, UCF 30065
2016 - USF 37,539, UCF 35802

10 year average: USF 41,446, UCF 37,596

"It's not a lie if you believe"

In addition, War on I4 football rivalry results

USF 6 wins, UCF 3 wins. Cumulative score: USF 307, UCF 189

Average score of entire series: USF 34, UCF 21

Those attendance numbers are fudged and absolutely no one believes them. The series is 3-2 in favor of UCF since we’ve been in the same conference.

I have a news flash for you. Big news, so pay attention. Everyone "fudges" announced attendance numbers, including UCF. Across every sport, professional and college. There are a lot of examples of UCF majorly fudging numbers as well. Heck a couple years ago, you guys announced 30K a game and you might not have had 8-10K in the stands vs. ECU and USF (seriously, you and I both know it - entire sections were empty, go back and watch the highlights).

That said, UCF is a great candidate. I like UCF. If the B12 expands, they'll get in. But USF is also worthy. 20 straight weeks in AP poll (something no in in AAC has done in years) and back to back 10-2 and 11-2 seasons. That's pretty good. So pooh pooh USF all you want, but in the end, if there ever is an expansion (I don't think there will be) rest assured, USF will be right there. The B12 would be stupid not to add both USF and UCF and lock down the huge I4 corridor.

Maybe don’t be so sanctimonious. You’ve still won nothing. Usf is deadweight and if we ever got an invite rest assured if they asked us if we wanted you, we’d pass. Much rather have Memphis/Houston/UC.
https://goo.gl/images/wLGq6V

https://twitter.com/USFAttendance/status...twterm%5E0

https://twitter.com/USFAttendance/status...twterm%5E0
https://twitter.com/USFAttendance/status...twterm%5E0
01-14-2018 10:21 PM
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BullsFanInTX Offline
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Post: #29
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-14-2018 10:21 PM)jaredf29 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 08:53 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 08:43 PM)jaredf29 Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 08:34 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  
(01-14-2018 05:22 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  UCF. They own their own OCS. They actually get REAL attendence.

Average attendance per year (10 year sample size).

2007 - USF 53,170, UCF 44018
2008 - USF 49,690, UCF 39596
2009 - USF 52,553, UCF 38078
2010 - USF 40,849, UCF 39614
2011 - USF 44,550, UCF 34282
2012 - USF 44,130, UCF 34608
2013 - USF 34,702, UCF 42084
2014 - USF 30,694, UCF 37812
2015 - USF 26,578, UCF 30065
2016 - USF 37,539, UCF 35802

10 year average: USF 41,446, UCF 37,596

"It's not a lie if you believe"

In addition, War on I4 football rivalry results

USF 6 wins, UCF 3 wins. Cumulative score: USF 307, UCF 189

Average score of entire series: USF 34, UCF 21

Those attendance numbers are fudged and absolutely no one believes them. The series is 3-2 in favor of UCF since we’ve been in the same conference.

I have a news flash for you. Big news, so pay attention. Everyone "fudges" announced attendance numbers, including UCF. Across every sport, professional and college. There are a lot of examples of UCF majorly fudging numbers as well. Heck a couple years ago, you guys announced 30K a game and you might not have had 8-10K in the stands vs. ECU and USF (seriously, you and I both know it - entire sections were empty, go back and watch the highlights).

That said, UCF is a great candidate. I like UCF. If the B12 expands, they'll get in. But USF is also worthy. 20 straight weeks in AP poll (something no in in AAC has done in years) and back to back 10-2 and 11-2 seasons. That's pretty good. So pooh pooh USF all you want, but in the end, if there ever is an expansion (I don't think there will be) rest assured, USF will be right there. The B12 would be stupid not to add both USF and UCF and lock down the huge I4 corridor.

Maybe don’t be so sanctimonious. You’ve still won nothing. Usf is deadweight and if we ever got an invite rest assured if they asked us if we wanted you, we’d pass. Much rather have Memphis/Houston/UC.
https://goo.gl/images/wLGq6V

https://twitter.com/USFAttendance/status...twterm%5E0

https://twitter.com/USFAttendance/status...twterm%5E0
https://twitter.com/USFAttendance/status...twterm%5E0

And I could post just as many UCF games with virtually no one in the stands, but won't bother. What's the point.

As I already said, UCF is a good candidate. Congrats on the great season. Seriously. 04-cheers
01-15-2018 12:37 PM
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Nerdlinger Offline
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Post: #30
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-14-2018 10:21 PM)jaredf29 Wrote:  Maybe don’t be so sanctimonious. You’ve still won nothing. Usf is deadweight and if we ever got an invite rest assured if they asked us if we wanted you, we’d pass. Much rather have Memphis/Houston/UC.

Not that the Big 12 would ask for UCF's input in an expansion situation, but I would think having USF join too would be beneficial for UCF not just from a rivalry standpoint but from a practical travel standpoint. Given how far away Florida is from the core of the conference, having a travel partner would be very helpful.
01-15-2018 12:43 PM
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Erictelevision Offline
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Post: #31
RE: B12 Expansion Model
Nerdinger: the fact that they're "far from the footprint of the rest of the conference" is EXACTLY why they SHOULD NOT add them!
01-15-2018 01:19 PM
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Nerdlinger Offline
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Post: #32
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-15-2018 01:19 PM)Erictelevision Wrote:  Nerdinger: the fact that they're "far from the footprint of the rest of the conference" is EXACTLY why they SHOULD NOT add them!

I didn't comment on that. It's just that if they're adding one, it's smart to add the other too.
01-15-2018 01:24 PM
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Erictelevision Offline
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Post: #33
RE: B12 Expansion Model
Yes you did! It was literally the last sentence of the post I was responding to!
01-15-2018 01:46 PM
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Pervis_Griffith Offline
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Post: #34
RE: B12 Expansion Model
I don't think just one of UCF or USF gets in the Big XII.

If either gets the nod, they both will. It'd be stupid to do just one.

And frankly, based on that, I think it's more likely that neither get in. I could see a scenario where Cincinnati and Memphis get added in the "east", and two of these 3 get added in the "west" ... BYU, Boise State or Colorado State.
(This post was last modified: 01-15-2018 04:32 PM by Pervis_Griffith.)
01-15-2018 04:30 PM
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HawaiiMongoose Offline
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Post: #35
RE: B12 Expansion Model
This thread is so 2016.
01-15-2018 04:31 PM
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Hokie Mark Offline
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Post: #36
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-14-2018 03:56 PM)vandiver49 Wrote:  ESPN isn’t able WILLING to offer the money necessary to convince UT and OU to commit to an expanded B12

If the Big XII were going to do something like this, they should've done it last year, when both Fox and ESPN were contractually obligated to pay for new teams. IIRC, the reason ESPN ponied up more money was to get OUT of that clause (Fox called the Big XII's bluff, as I recall). At any rate, if they expanded now, Fox would have to pay the current rate, but ESPN would have the option to say "that's nice - more tier 3 inventory for you guys, but we're not interested". So being willing to "take a haircut" would mean nothing if there was NO NEW HAIR to cut!
01-15-2018 04:44 PM
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Nerdlinger Offline
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Post: #37
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-15-2018 01:46 PM)Erictelevision Wrote:  Yes you did! It was literally the last sentence of the post I was responding to!

I mean that I wasn't making a judgment on whether their distance to the rest of the league should be held against them. A gutted Big 12 is going to have to expand AAC-style in order to remain the dominant non-power conference.
01-15-2018 05:13 PM
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eltigre Offline
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Post: #38
RE: B12 Expansion Model
(01-15-2018 04:31 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  This thread is so 2016.

04-cheers
That conference will implode before they expand.
01-15-2018 05:14 PM
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Erictelevision Offline
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Post: #39
RE: B12 Expansion Model
Nerd: I would jettison WVU, add:

CSU
BYU
USU
BSU
SMU
HOUSTON
WYOMING
TULANE/RICE/TULSA
01-15-2018 05:21 PM
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GE and MTS Offline
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Post: #40
RE: B12 Expansion Model
Individually, UCF and USF make good candidates. Together they are excellent as travel partners since neither are near a current Big 12 member. West Virginia needs a travel partner for the rest of the members and Cincinnati makes the most sense.

What wouldn't make sense is adding another school on an island such as BYU or UConn. Another Texas school like Houston would help fortify the state in a location the conference is currently lacking in and where the SEC has a strong foothold. Despite a fifth Texas school, the percentage of Texas schools would go down in the conference.
01-15-2018 05:39 PM
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