That ref should never officiate another game.

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(12-30-2017 12:21 AM)Almadenmike Wrote:  That ref should never officiate another game.

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The whole crew was awful. The targeting call against the Northwestern defender was equally bad. I think the targeting rule needs a review. I understand the objective, but the current rule is overkill. And the sequence where the Kentucky bench was flagged for trying to call attention to the fact that they had an injured player being treated on the ground about a yard off the field was also absurd. Just an awful, awful crew. None of them should ever work another game.

(12-30-2017 08:20 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 12:21 AM)Almadenmike Wrote:  That ref should never officiate another game.

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The whole crew was awful. The targeting call against the Northwestern defender was equally bad. I think the targeting rule needs a review. I understand the objective, but the current rule is overkill. And the sequence where the Kentucky bench was flagged for trying to call attention to the fact that they had an injured player being treated on the ground about a yard off the field was also absurd. Just an awful, awful crew. None of them should ever work another game.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaafb/...li=BBnb7Kz

(12-30-2017 08:20 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 12:21 AM)Almadenmike Wrote:  That ref should never officiate another game.

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The targeting call against the Northwestern defender was equally bad.

I don't know the football rule. In lacrosse, that hit would not be targeting -- but it would probably be spearing, because the the player lowered and led with his head to make the hit, which is an absurdly reckless play. I knew a player who paralyzed himself (and died a few years later of complications) by making a hit like that. Targeting (of an opponent's head) and spearing (with one's own head) are both dangerous, and in lacrosse they have similar penalties.

(12-29-2017 10:50 PM)seniorowl Wrote:  Just saw that. Terrible call. What was the ref doing? Trying to help him up? Maybe the player was saying, I can help myself up. Terrible. As much as I love to root for the nerd school (which I did in this game), I hate for the entire dynamic of the game to be changed on such a crap call.

Agree completely. It looked totally innocent. Very brief. Non threatening.
Am I missing something? Is there something in the rule book that forbids ANY player-ref physical contact?

(12-30-2017 05:04 PM)greyowl72 Wrote:  

(12-29-2017 10:50 PM)seniorowl Wrote:  Just saw that. Terrible call. What was the ref doing? Trying to help him up? Maybe the player was saying, I can help myself up. Terrible. As much as I love to root for the nerd school (which I did in this game), I hate for the entire dynamic of the game to be changed on such a crap call.

Agree completely. It looked totally innocent. Very brief. Non threatening.
Am I missing something? Is there something in the rule book that forbids ANY player-ref physical contact?

Here's the explanation by the official, Chris Coyte (which was posted in a tweet by Stewart Mandel):

Coyte was also the crew chief in the 2015 New Era Pintstripe Bowl that ended when an Indiana field goal attempt was ruled to have been no good, while a photo posted by ESPN afterward ...



... suggested that it should have been called good.

(The kick was higher than the tops of the uprights, which made the judgement more difficult.)

Maybe Coyte was under a spell:



(Caption: In this Sept. 12, 2015, file photo, Arizona State head coach Todd Graham, right, talks with referee Chris Coyte, left, prior to an NCAA college football game against Cal Poly in Tempe, Ariz. Arizona State was a trendy to pick to make the College Football Playoff headed into the season. After two shaky games, the Sun Devils have been nowhere close to living up to those lofty expectations. (AP Photo/Ross D. Franklin, File))

(12-30-2017 05:04 PM)greyowl72 Wrote:  

(12-29-2017 10:50 PM)seniorowl Wrote:  Just saw that. Terrible call. What was the ref doing? Trying to help him up? Maybe the player was saying, I can help myself up. Terrible. As much as I love to root for the nerd school (which I did in this game), I hate for the entire dynamic of the game to be changed on such a crap call.

Agree completely. It looked totally innocent. Very brief. Non threatening.
Am I missing something? Is there something in the rule book that forbids ANY player-ref physical contact?

Rule 9, Section 2 (Unsportsmanlike Conduct Fouls), Article 4 (Contacting an Official)

NCAA rulebook Wrote:Persons subject to the rules (Rule 1-1-6) shall not intentionally contact a game official forcibly during the game.

Penalty-Administer as a dead-ball foul. 15 yards from the succeeding spot. Automatic first down for fouls by Team B if not in conflict with other rules. Automatic disqualification [S7, S27 and S47].

The official is expected to exercise discretion, but he was within the rules. There are no exceptions like "unless the official initiates contact," and there can't be. Imagine if, instead of pushing off the referee's hands or chest, the player had instead swung a hook at the referee's jaw. The ref had minimal time to make a huge call in an adrenaline-charged situation that he was directly involved in. It's tough to be objective in those circumstances, especially given that, as the head of the officiating crew, the referee doesn't need to confer with anybody else before marking it off. Can you imagine the outrage if the ref discussed with the linejudge before throwing the flag 20 seconds later? I mean, the ref was right there involved in the situation. He shouldn't have to talk to anybody to know what needs to be done even though doing so would be excellent technique (emphasis to mark a hypothetical argument).

I think he made a mistake, but I understand how he came to it. I would hope that if he had some leeway to enforce a weaker penalty and/or forego the disqualification, he would have, but the only space football officials have to do that are holding vs pass interference, personal fouls with or without targeting, and roughing vs running into the kicker. Everything else, this foul included, is just a yes/no question in the rules, and they try their hardest to make those three situations binary as well.

In 2011, Coyte won the John McDonnough Memorial Sportsmanship Award, which has been awarded annually since 1979 to the official who has contributed to the Orange County (Calif.) Football Officials Association above and beyond the normal officiating duties required for membership.

In January, he was named president and managing director of Lee & Associates, the 6th largest commercial real estate broker in Orange County.

Chris Coyte and the rest of that crew should never work another game. They were horrible all night. And they clearly disrupted the game.

Coyte initiated the contact with the player.