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Quarterback Development at ODU
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ODUalum78 Offline
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Post: #1
Quarterback Development at ODU
I started to think about this after seeing that TH signed with Houston, and reading another thread about predicting player ability on the field.

Then I started wondering what QBs we have actually "developed" at ODU.
To date, the answer is "only one, David Washington". As a young program, I wouldn't expect many, but I would expect enough development that backups would at least be competent.
Certainly a mitigating factor in all of this has been an under-performing OL since 2013.

Thomas DeMarco was a JUCO.
Taylor Heinicke was sheer luck.
https://pilotonline.com/sports/college/o...c8877.html

That leaves David Washington as the only bona fide QB we have ever developed, and he is arguably the best pure athlete we have ever had.
Additionally , except for DeMarco, we have had little luck with transfers and/or JUCOs
That we started 2017 FBS with an undersized walk-on is a testament to our problems.
That we felt we needed to pull the redshirt off of an awkward 17 year old is further evidence of this.

Below is the list of roster QBs since 2009

2009
Bobby Cooper
Dan Pitts
Thomas DeMarco

2010
Thomas DeMarco
*Dininique Blackman (RS)

2011
Thomas DeMarco
Nate Ong
Taylor Heinicke (RS)

2012
Nate Ong
Taylor Heinicke

2013
David Washington
Taylor Heinicke
Colin McElroy

2014
Shuler Bentley
Taylor Heinicke
David Washington
Scott Brennan
Colin McElroy

2015
Joey Verheagh
Blake LaRussa
Shuler Bentley
Colin McElroy
Blake LaRussa
*David Washington (WR)

2016
Shuler Bentley
Kody Cunningham
Kevin Sheckells
David Washington
Lweis Brennan
Blake LaRussa
Drayton Arnold

2017
Drayton Arnold
Jordan Hoy
Blake LaERussa
Kevin Sheckells
Steven Williams

*DOMINIQUE BLACKMAN

discuss
(This post was last modified: 11-30-2017 12:44 PM by ODUalum78.)
11-30-2017 12:33 PM
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Gilesfan Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
So we didn't develop Heinicke because it was sheer luck and we didn't develop DeMarco because he was a JUCO punter? If that is your basis for the argument, is it even worth arguing?

Prior to 2014, we didn't know who was actually developed or not because we only had 2 starters that were very good. WHo knows if the backups were studs, but never good enough to overcome DeMarco or Heinicke?

Some of the other guys are walk on practice players that have transferred or quit football. How would we even know if they were developed or not?
11-30-2017 12:41 PM
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jumpshooter Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
If you think we didn't develop TH, that he was as good when he entered as when he left . . . sheer nonsense. You think he'd come back every summer to work with Whitcomb if he felt he wasn't getting anything out of it? Jesus, come on.
11-30-2017 12:43 PM
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ODUDrunkard13 Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
Yeah. This is quite a leap..
11-30-2017 12:45 PM
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Old Dominion Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
Come on guys, he's just throwing out an idea for a discussion. No need to act like he's an idiot just for posing a question.
11-30-2017 12:49 PM
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ODUalum78 Offline
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RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
(11-30-2017 12:43 PM)jumpshooter Wrote:  If you think we didn't develop TH, that he was as good when he entered as when he left . . . sheer nonsense. You think he'd come back every summer to work with Whitcomb if he felt he wasn't getting anything out of it? Jesus, come on.
There are 19 discrete names on that list. Only two others have developed, TD as an already established JUCO star, and TH who was so extraordinary he would have developed to where he is now anyway, anywhere. That leaves DW

Of course TH developed and got better as he played, as did DeMarco.
My point is that that TH came to ODU was sheer luck though, not necessarily as a result of superior talent assessment by our coaches.
I submit that TH would have developed and gotten better wherever he landed. DW is the only QB that we went out, got as a freshman, and brought his talent to fruition.

Giles; DeMarco was not a punter. He doubled as a punter in high school - oh wait, didn't TH do a lot of punting for ODU? 05-stirthepot
Quote:AT COLLEGE OF THE DESERT:
Passed for 1,792 yards with 14 touchdowns during the 2008 season... also rushed for eight touchdowns...coached by Dean Dowty...

HIGH SCHOOL:
Two-time All-CIF honoree...As a senior pashed for 2,500 yards with 20 touchdowns...Also rushed for 1350 yards...Named MVP of the team and league...CIF Offensive Player of the Year...During junior campaign passed for 2,300 yards and 20 touchdowns...Ran the ball into the end zone seven times...Also averaged 45 yards per punt...Also participated in three seasons of baseball...
(This post was last modified: 11-30-2017 01:08 PM by ODUalum78.)
11-30-2017 12:49 PM
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cmett003 Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
This thread should be titled QB Development at ODU since TH left. If we never had WR issues then we never would have had to move DW to wr in 2015 and he would have been the QB. I would bet my life that if he was the QB in 2015 we would have gone to a bowl game.

It is concerning that we had to go to a 17 year old freshman this year. Not sure what that says about recruiting or development.
11-30-2017 12:59 PM
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JJMonarch Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
I don't know how you can say that Heinicke did not develope at ODU. He wasn't even an FBS recruit in high school and now he is in the NFL. And why would you say that DeMarco did not develope because he was a juco? What difference does that make? For its young existence I think ODU has done pretty well with its QB development.
11-30-2017 01:14 PM
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ODU_NYG Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
I think we definitely got lucky with TH ending up at ODU, but there is a reason that he comes back here to train in the off season and will probably continue to do so.
11-30-2017 01:21 PM
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ODUalum78 Offline
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RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
(11-30-2017 01:14 PM)JJMonarch Wrote:  I don't know how you can say that Heinicke did not develope at ODU. He wasn't even an FBS recruit in high school and now he is in the NFL. And why would you say that DeMarco did not develope because he was a juco? What difference does that make? For its young existence I think ODU has done pretty well with its QB development.

I did not say that they did not develop. In fact in the next post I indeed said the they developed You are missing the point.

My point is that early on we got an already established JUCO star (DeMarco) and TH fell in our lap. Our only beginning-to end player was David Washington...out of 19.

I submit that if our recruitment and development were as they should be we would not have started Shuler Bentley when we did, nor would we have started an undersized walk-on and then pulled the RS off a 17 year old.
11-30-2017 01:25 PM
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Big Bluezilla Online
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Post: #11
RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
I'm not sure that I would classify TD as a JUCO Star. We were lucky to find, recruit, and convince him that ODU was the place for him, but I think calling him a JUCO star is a bit too much. Heck, he didn't win the job until after going back and forth drives for a little while and proving himself the man.

I think we make a little more drama when it helps our argument - labeling someone a star, labeling us completely lucky to find a recruit . . . etc. And then on the other end it's all doom and gloom. Someone found a JUCO punter who wanted to play QB again and it worked out great for both of us. That was good recruiting. When Taylor chose to come to ODU, he most certainly had untapped talent, and the coaches helped mature that talent. David was a HS quarterback that moved to WR (he was developed there by the way) and then back to QB and played well (and developed in the limited amount of time he had).

It sucks to have a not exciting season, but things are pretty good here and I have faith that we will continue to get better over time. Am I satisfied with this year and not disappointed? Heck no! I'm bummed. I also feel strongly that there is a process and things don't necessarily happen linearly. We're on our way up. That's not necessarily a straight line up.

Go Monarchs!
11-30-2017 01:45 PM
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bigblueodu Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
DOMINIQUE BLACKMAN was the best..... just ask him.
11-30-2017 01:58 PM
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Old Dominion Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
I agree. We have not really capitalized on TH or DW's accomplishments. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't they come in at the same time? Since they were recruited we don't seem to have signed anyone anywhere near their caliber. Obviously " Wonder" Williams could eventually prove to be comparable, we just don't know yet.
11-30-2017 02:29 PM
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ODUalum78 Offline
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RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
(11-30-2017 01:45 PM)Big Bluezilla Wrote:  I'm not sure that I would classify TD as a JUCO Star. We were lucky to find, recruit, and convince him that ODU was the place for him, but I think calling him a JUCO star is a bit too much. Heck, he didn't win the job until after going back and forth drives for a little while and proving himself the man.

I think we make a little more drama when it helps our argument - labeling someone a star, labeling us completely lucky to find a recruit . . . etc. And then on the other end it's all doom and gloom. Someone found a JUCO punter who wanted to play QB again and it worked out great for both of us. That was good recruiting. When Taylor chose to come to ODU, he most certainly had untapped talent, and the coaches helped mature that talent. David was a HS quarterback that moved to WR (he was developed there by the way) and then back to QB and played well (and developed in the limited amount of time he had).

It sucks to have a not exciting season, but things are pretty good here and I have faith that we will continue to get better over time. Am I satisfied with this year and not disappointed? Heck no! I'm bummed. I also feel strongly that there is a process and things don't necessarily happen linearly. We're on our way up. That's not necessarily a straight line up.

Go Monarchs!

My premise is that we have had three bona fide QBs of 19 prospects in our 8 years.

Let's at least use facts.

1. DeMarco went to College of the Desert initially to punt but instead became the QB. He was NOT as JUCO punter but indeed the QB.
As for being a star, I will admit to that being an opinion, However, 1,792 yards passing and 22 total touchdowns in one season makes him a star in my book.

2. David Washington was a high school QB, He was recruited to ODU as a QB He redshirted in 2012 as a QB.
In 2013 he became the backup QB (to Taylor Heinicke) and appeared in 6 games.
In 2014 he was moved to WR
In 2015 he was moved back to QB after the lackluster performance of Shuler Bentley in the Charlotte game.
In 2016 he was the starter at QB

07-coffee3
(This post was last modified: 11-30-2017 02:54 PM by ODUalum78.)
11-30-2017 02:45 PM
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ODUalum78 Offline
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RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
(11-30-2017 02:29 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  I agree. We have not really capitalized on TH or DW's accomplishments. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't they come in at the same time? Since they were recruited we don't seem to have signed anyone anywhere near their caliber. Obviously " Wonder" Williams could eventually prove to be comparable, we just don't know yet.

Yes, both were FCS recruits, and yes we have not, for whatever reason, approached that caliber since.

SW may or may prove comparable, but right now I am concerned that he doesn't show the instincts, and despite exceptional overall athleticism, he seems awkward in his movement. Of course he was only 17 so it is really too soon to make that kind of assessment.
04-cheers
(This post was last modified: 11-30-2017 02:52 PM by ODUalum78.)
11-30-2017 02:50 PM
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Gilesfan Offline
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RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
He was a JUCO punter in the sense that we were the only team interested in him as a QB. He would have punted elsewhere.
11-30-2017 03:00 PM
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odu09 Offline
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RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
An NFL comparison is the Green Bay Packers who got "lucky" with Favre to Rodgers. One would think the organization is good at developing quarterbacks, until you see this guy Hundley playing who has been in the organization for 3 years and he's kind of terrible, so the idea that the Packers have been good at developing QBs goes out the window. Just a random thought.
11-30-2017 03:13 PM
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ODUalum78 Offline
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RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
(11-30-2017 03:00 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  He was a JUCO punter in the sense that we were the only team interested in him as a QB. He would have punted elsewhere.

You're kidding.
11-30-2017 03:17 PM
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Gilesfan Offline
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RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
Do you not know the story?

ODU went to recruit DeMarco because they were scouting the JUCO ranks to find a punter. Demarco said he also played QB but had no offers and wasn't getting any interest from the California FCS schools. Bobby agreed to take him on.
11-30-2017 03:22 PM
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ODU True Blue Offline
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RE: Quarterback Development at ODU
First off yes TH did develop and improve while here. BFD that he fell into our lap. What difference does that make when you are talking about DEVELOPMENT while here? Same with Demarco. He was recruited to come here, he came here and he Developed while here. You cannot exclude them because of the circumstances of their arrival. That does not matter. What matters is their development while here.

Like CMETT said, had we not had WR issues DW is our 2015 & 2016 QB. He did develop. So we have had very good development for our Starters. The problem was we put all our future eggs in a basket called Bentley. That went astray leaving us with nothing in the hopper and had to go to a 17 yr old freshman. Even in that rushed environment you could see SW's improvement by the end of the season.

SW will develop more this winter and spring. Barring injuries to SW we should be fine at QB.

But we'll be just one injury away from using Blake or even again, needing a freshman to lead us. I don't perceive it as a development issue but more as a recruiting/depth issue. We miss fired on Bentley. I am certain subsequent recruiting classes lost out on potential QBs because of our "commitment" to Bentley. You know other schools used that against us. We need to sign at least 1 QB per year, if not 2, knowing full well we might lose some to transfers.
(This post was last modified: 11-30-2017 03:31 PM by ODU True Blue.)
11-30-2017 03:27 PM
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