Yikes. At least we have the Mavs and Nets coming to town soon.

Looking at the standings though, best case scenario is the Grizz are the 9th best team in the West.

Top tier: Houston, GSW, SA
Next tier: Minnesota, Denver, Portland, OKC, NO
Out and Looking In: Grizz, Lakers, Suns, Jazz
Just bad: Clippers, Kings, Mavs

Just not looking good ...

Weird season.

Winning games with Jarell and Harrison starting. Replace them with better players and now we are losing.

Need one more person that hits enough outside shots to scare defenses, and open up things. And need to get everybody rebounding, especially on the defensive boards.

Stay close to .500 through December, get Mike back, and make a run in January when the schedule is weak. I hope.

Maybe we could play some defense? That might help.

What a difference a couple of weeks makes.

(11-21-2017 07:50 AM)NigelTufnel Wrote:  Yikes. At least we have the Mavs and Nets coming to town soon.

Looking at the standings though, best case scenario is the Grizz are the 9th best team in the West.

Top tier: Houston, GSW, SA
Next tier: Minnesota, Denver, Portland, OKC, NO
Out and Looking In: Grizz, Lakers, Suns, Jazz
Just bad: Clippers, Kings, Mavs

Just not looking good ...

The team is nothing without Mike.

Would be the same with Zbo, and Tony.

(11-21-2017 11:09 AM)FlyingTiger2016 Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 07:50 AM)NigelTufnel Wrote:  Yikes. At least we have the Mavs and Nets coming to town soon.

Looking at the standings though, best case scenario is the Grizz are the 9th best team in the West.

Top tier: Houston, GSW, SA
Next tier: Minnesota, Denver, Portland, OKC, NO
Out and Looking In: Grizz, Lakers, Suns, Jazz
Just bad: Clippers, Kings, Mavs

Just not looking good ...

The team is nothing without Mike.

Would be the same with Zbo, and Tony.

Disagree. We can and will win games with Mike out. Hope he takes his time, a month if needed, to get the achilles and heal recovered as possible.

Indiana, Houston twice and Portland are good teams playing well. We are integrating JMyke and BMac back into the rotation. Building up Chandler's minutes, and Mike is out. We'll be ok.

Goal for this year is to make the playoffs, keep the playoff streak going.

Basically keeping the comatose patient on life support so she can make her 90th birthday.

(11-21-2017 11:26 AM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:09 AM)FlyingTiger2016 Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 07:50 AM)NigelTufnel Wrote:  Yikes. At least we have the Mavs and Nets coming to town soon.

Looking at the standings though, best case scenario is the Grizz are the 9th best team in the West.

Top tier: Houston, GSW, SA
Next tier: Minnesota, Denver, Portland, OKC, NO
Out and Looking In: Grizz, Lakers, Suns, Jazz
Just bad: Clippers, Kings, Mavs

Just not looking good ...

The team is nothing without Mike.

Would be the same with Zbo, and Tony.

Disagree. We can and will win games with Mike out. Hope he takes his time, a month if needed, to get the achilles and heal recovered as possible.

Indiana, Houston twice and Portland are good teams playing well. We are integrating JMyke and BMac back into the rotation. Building up Chandler's minutes, and Mike is out. We'll be ok.

Goal for this year is to make the playoffs, keep the playoff streak going.

Speaking of JaMychal, we are going to need much improved rebounding from him. 3.8/game isn’t gonna cut it. I tend to agree that Zach is not the answer at this point in his career, but he’d average more than 3.8 rebounds at age 50.

(11-21-2017 11:31 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  Basically keeping the comatose patient on life support so she can make her 90th birthday.

Disagree. Just making the playoffs helps us be better in future years.

We aren't getting guys like Tyreke at $3.3M if we don't have a chance to be a playoff team. Mike and Marc weren't re-signing if we were not a winning franchise.

If teams like the Knicks and Lakers, with all the resources and draw they have, can suck for years, it shows you that you stay good for as long as you can. T'Wolves will make the playoffs for first time in in 14 years this year. Kings are similarly inept. Point is, no guarantee that a Grizz rebuild would not take just as long.

(11-21-2017 11:38 AM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:31 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  Basically keeping the comatose patient on life support so she can make her 90th birthday.

Disagree. Just making the playoffs helps us be better in future years.

We aren't getting guys like Tyreke at $3.3M if we don't have a chance to be a playoff team. Mike and Marc weren't re-signing if we were not a winning franchise.

If teams like the Knicks and Lakers, with all the resources and draw they have, can suck for years, it shows you that you stay good for as long as you can. T'Wolves will make the playoffs for first time in in 14 years this year. Kings are similarly inept. Point is, no guarantee that a Grizz rebuild would not take just as long.

The roster will be hot garbage next year with zero ability to add players.

So far, Memphis has completely lucked out on Tyreke. Maybe once every 20 years you catch a player of his ability, coming off several injury riddled seasons, who has a pre-existing relationship with the city to come here and ball out.

He won't be here next year, so Memphis will be looking to replace a 15-17 ppg scorer on the cheap.

If Memphis finishes 18-22 in the standings, they get another low-chance for success draft pick. Outside of Brooks no other young guy is a starter-in waiting. They are all just mid-level bench guys at best.

And Memphis has no 1st round pick in 2019.

(11-21-2017 11:38 AM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:31 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  Basically keeping the comatose patient on life support so she can make her 90th birthday.

Disagree. Just making the playoffs helps us be better in future years.

We aren't getting guys like Tyreke at $3.3M if we don't have a chance to be a playoff team. Mike and Marc weren't re-signing if we were not a winning franchise.

If teams like the Knicks and Lakers, with all the resources and draw they have, can suck for years, it shows you that you stay good for as long as you can. T'Wolves will make the playoffs for first time in in 14 years this year. Kings are similarly inept. Point is, no guarantee that a Grizz rebuild would not take just as long.

Frankly, who is going to want Marc or Mike at the end of their contracts?

They will both be 35 years old when their current contracts expire.

(11-21-2017 12:27 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:38 AM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:31 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  Basically keeping the comatose patient on life support so she can make her 90th birthday.

Disagree. Just making the playoffs helps us be better in future years.

We aren't getting guys like Tyreke at $3.3M if we don't have a chance to be a playoff team. Mike and Marc weren't re-signing if we were not a winning franchise.

If teams like the Knicks and Lakers, with all the resources and draw they have, can suck for years, it shows you that you stay good for as long as you can. T'Wolves will make the playoffs for first time in in 14 years this year. Kings are similarly inept. Point is, no guarantee that a Grizz rebuild would not take just as long.

Frankly, who is going to want Marc or Mike at the end of their contracts?

They will both be 35 years old when their current contracts expire.

I hate to say it, but it might be time to blow it up. Ride it out until Conley gets back and see if they can make some sort of run I guess, but realistically, if you watch GSW and Houston, Memphis has no shot at beating those teams even if fully healthy and firing on all cylinders. Not to mention Minnesota, who is much younger, with much more talent.

Hell, Phoenix is kind of a hot mess, but at least they have a young Superstar in Booker and some guys with upside (Warren, Bender and Chriss). Honestly, given how much younger the Suns are, I think they are in a much better spot going forward, even though their record will probably be worse than the Grizz this year.

You have got to find a way to get some young talent ...

(11-21-2017 12:27 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:38 AM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:31 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  Basically keeping the comatose patient on life support so she can make her 90th birthday.

Disagree. Just making the playoffs helps us be better in future years.

We aren't getting guys like Tyreke at $3.3M if we don't have a chance to be a playoff team. Mike and Marc weren't re-signing if we were not a winning franchise.

If teams like the Knicks and Lakers, with all the resources and draw they have, can suck for years, it shows you that you stay good for as long as you can. T'Wolves will make the playoffs for first time in in 14 years this year. Kings are similarly inept. Point is, no guarantee that a Grizz rebuild would not take just as long.

Frankly, who is going to want Marc or Mike at the end of their contracts?

They will both be 35 years old when their current contracts expire.

Agree, so you don't blow it up. Keep making playoffs, ride this group as long as you can. These older stars like Carmelo don't get much back in trades anyway, so might as well keep them.

(11-21-2017 01:35 PM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 12:27 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:38 AM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:31 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  Basically keeping the comatose patient on life support so she can make her 90th birthday.

Disagree. Just making the playoffs helps us be better in future years.

We aren't getting guys like Tyreke at $3.3M if we don't have a chance to be a playoff team. Mike and Marc weren't re-signing if we were not a winning franchise.

If teams like the Knicks and Lakers, with all the resources and draw they have, can suck for years, it shows you that you stay good for as long as you can. T'Wolves will make the playoffs for first time in in 14 years this year. Kings are similarly inept. Point is, no guarantee that a Grizz rebuild would not take just as long.

Frankly, who is going to want Marc or Mike at the end of their contracts?

They will both be 35 years old when their current contracts expire.

Agree, so you don't blow it up. Keep making playoffs, ride this group as long as you can. These older stars like Carmelo don't get much back in trades anyway, so might as well keep them.

That doesn't make a lot of sense.

You're saying to ride out some aging ponies who can at best get us to 5th or 6th in the West and then lose in the first round. Maybe miss the playoffs if their nagging injuries nag enough.

Get a 20ish draft pick this year and none next year to complement the one decent young player (with starter potential) on the team.

That doesn't sound like a great plan at all.

(11-21-2017 10:06 AM)cscottl1981 Wrote:  Maybe we could play some defense? That might help.

We have won or lost based on 3 point shooting this year. Defense was once the identity of this team but now it is a run and shoot team without the skill level need to run and shoot.

But if we are honest with ourselves, we are about where everyone picked us to be.

May be a looooong basketball season in the City of Good Abode.

(11-21-2017 03:31 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 01:35 PM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 12:27 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:38 AM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:31 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  Basically keeping the comatose patient on life support so she can make her 90th birthday.

Disagree. Just making the playoffs helps us be better in future years.

We aren't getting guys like Tyreke at $3.3M if we don't have a chance to be a playoff team. Mike and Marc weren't re-signing if we were not a winning franchise.

If teams like the Knicks and Lakers, with all the resources and draw they have, can suck for years, it shows you that you stay good for as long as you can. T'Wolves will make the playoffs for first time in in 14 years this year. Kings are similarly inept. Point is, no guarantee that a Grizz rebuild would not take just as long.

Frankly, who is going to want Marc or Mike at the end of their contracts?

They will both be 35 years old when their current contracts expire.

Agree, so you don't blow it up. Keep making playoffs, ride this group as long as you can. These older stars like Carmelo don't get much back in trades anyway, so might as well keep them.

That doesn't make a lot of sense.

You're saying to ride out some aging ponies who can at best get us to 5th or 6th in the West and then lose in the first round. Maybe miss the playoffs if their nagging injuries nag enough.

Get a 20ish draft pick this year and none next year to complement the one decent young player (with starter potential) on the team.

That doesn't sound like a great plan at all.

I'll take a winning record, 5th or 6th seed in the West, and make the playoffs every year. In a heartbeat. It's great fun. Already beat Golden State and Houston, twice, this season, and they are 2 of the best 3 teams in the NBA.

Much preferable to some dream about getting a top draft pick 3 years from now, and adding more top draft picks in successive years, hoping that in 2-3 years they develop, just to get back to where we have been for the past 7 seasons.

(11-21-2017 03:38 PM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 03:31 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 01:35 PM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 12:27 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 11:38 AM)Tigx Wrote:  Disagree. Just making the playoffs helps us be better in future years.

We aren't getting guys like Tyreke at $3.3M if we don't have a chance to be a playoff team. Mike and Marc weren't re-signing if we were not a winning franchise.

If teams like the Knicks and Lakers, with all the resources and draw they have, can suck for years, it shows you that you stay good for as long as you can. T'Wolves will make the playoffs for first time in in 14 years this year. Kings are similarly inept. Point is, no guarantee that a Grizz rebuild would not take just as long.

Frankly, who is going to want Marc or Mike at the end of their contracts?

They will both be 35 years old when their current contracts expire.

Agree, so you don't blow it up. Keep making playoffs, ride this group as long as you can. These older stars like Carmelo don't get much back in trades anyway, so might as well keep them.

That doesn't make a lot of sense.

You're saying to ride out some aging ponies who can at best get us to 5th or 6th in the West and then lose in the first round. Maybe miss the playoffs if their nagging injuries nag enough.

Get a 20ish draft pick this year and none next year to complement the one decent young player (with starter potential) on the team.

That doesn't sound like a great plan at all.

I'll take a winning record, 5th or 6th seed in the West, and make the playoffs every year. In a heartbeat. It's great fun. Already beat Golden State and Houston, twice, this season, and they are 2 of the best 3 teams in the NBA.

Much preferable to some dream about getting a top draft pick 3 years from now, and adding more top draft picks in successive years, hoping that in 2-3 years they develop, just to get back to where we have been for the past 7 seasons.

But the writing is on the wall that it is coming to an end.

They might not make the playoffs this year and then (another year older Conley and Marc) they lose Tyrke and still have a $100MM+ payroll--it's not like they will improve.

The Grizz salaries for next year already put them over the cap and perilously close to the luxury tax, so it's not like the Grizz can go out and get an MLE next year (in addition to their 1st round pick).

Then the team is completely unprepared to go forward in three years when Marc and Mike are done.

Mike just turned 30. Marc is 32. Chandler just turned 29. JaMychal is 27. We aren't that old. We've played either the 4th or 2nd toughest schedule so far this season. Don't agree with this writing on the wall stuff. In the NBA, to generalize, veteran teams win and young teams lose. If Mike tears his achilles, then the outlook changes, but you could say that about any team that loses its star. Look at Utah now without Rudy Gobert.

And the cap situation is not that bad as I have tried to outline several times. Many, many teams are in worse cap situations than us. Because of the cap restrictions that about 20-25 teams face next summer, there will be plenty of veteran FAs like Tyreke, who are forced to play on a contract below market value and don't want to play for a losing franchise.

And I just don't know why anyone would be concerned about 3 years from now. Look how much rosters, including ours, change from year to year. I'll worry about the '21-'22 season later.

(11-21-2017 04:11 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 03:38 PM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 03:31 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 01:35 PM)Tigx Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 12:27 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  Frankly, who is going to want Marc or Mike at the end of their contracts?

They will both be 35 years old when their current contracts expire.

Agree, so you don't blow it up. Keep making playoffs, ride this group as long as you can. These older stars like Carmelo don't get much back in trades anyway, so might as well keep them.

That doesn't make a lot of sense.

You're saying to ride out some aging ponies who can at best get us to 5th or 6th in the West and then lose in the first round. Maybe miss the playoffs if their nagging injuries nag enough.

Get a 20ish draft pick this year and none next year to complement the one decent young player (with starter potential) on the team.

That doesn't sound like a great plan at all.

I'll take a winning record, 5th or 6th seed in the West, and make the playoffs every year. In a heartbeat. It's great fun. Already beat Golden State and Houston, twice, this season, and they are 2 of the best 3 teams in the NBA.

Much preferable to some dream about getting a top draft pick 3 years from now, and adding more top draft picks in successive years, hoping that in 2-3 years they develop, just to get back to where we have been for the past 7 seasons.

But the writing is on the wall that it is coming to an end.

They might not make the playoffs this year and then (another year older Conley and Marc) they lose Tyrke and still have a $100MM+ payroll--it's not like they will improve.

The Grizz salaries for next year already put them over the cap and perilously close to the luxury tax, so it's not like the Grizz can go out and get an MLE next year (in addition to their 1st round pick).

Then the team is completely unprepared to go forward in three years when Marc and Mike are done.

I guess we’ll see who wants to come here, but we will have some cash to throw around if and when Mike, Marc and Chandler come off the books.

Here's another reason you don't tank. We are not the only one who will have injuries. Denver paying Millsap $31.3M this year, and is projected to finish above us.

Shams Charania ‏Verified account ShamsCharania 2m2 minutes ago

Denver All-Star forward Paul Millsap will undergo surgery on his left wrist and be sidelined indefinitely, league sources say.

Utah and the Clippers also picked in our tier or above us, and they both are struggling. We need to right the ship, get the back from injury guys like JMyke and BMac playing close to 100%, get Brandan and Selden playing, and we'll be ok. Then, get Mike back in a few more weeks, and see what happens.